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You guys are beating a horse that's been dead and buried for a long time. Lena is not selling knock offs, but rather "factory" versions, which are akin Lunchtime Specials. In other words, the factory is still producing toys long after the contract with the manufacturer has been fulfilled. The toys are made with the exact same licensed molds the retail toys come from, unlike the Knock Offs which come from different molds and invariably have molding differences beyond defects (MP Ratbat comes to mind as the most obvious I've seen). Here's a Chinese thread discussing MP05 Factory version way back in 2014: http://bbs.actoys.net/read.php?tid-1998210-page-1.html. There are many other threads on that forum various Factory Goods versions vs retail vs KO.

Also, Pilgrim76 thread sussing out KO vs original fails to notice that the authentic Frenzy RocketPunchArmy uses as an example for comparison has the same tampo'd number and unpainted rivets as the knock off, so those points aren't helpful in IDing the KO. I wish I could find a thread on TFW2005 from 1-2 months ago where authenticity was disputed over someone's figure (can't remember which TF it was either) that had two tiny holes completely filled by paint while other examples didn't. Ultimately it was shown both were authentic, and once again paint is a bad method to decide authenticity.

@Tortious, I BELIEVE the KO MP Grimlock has hollow toes on the underside, compared with flat, filled-in ones on the authentic figure.

I do agree the case could be made for the packaging to be knock off, given the obvious differences (that ACToys thread has some MP05 examples), and relative ease packaging can conceivably be reproduced. If you're concerned about packaging being authentic you have a legitimate concern IMO.

Hi RoboticPlanet and thanks for your input

You guys are beating a horse that's been dead and buried for a long time. Lena is not selling knock offs, but rather "factory" versions, which are akin Lunchtime Specials. In other words, the factory is still producing toys long after the contract with the manufacturer has been fulfilled. The toys are made with the exact same licensed molds the retail toys come from, unlike the Knock Offs which come from different molds and invariably have molding differences beyond defects (MP Ratbat comes to mind as the most obvious I've seen). Here's a Chinese thread discussing MP05 Factory version way back in 2014: http://bbs.actoys.net/read.php?tid-1998210-page-1.html. There are many other threads on that forum various Factory Goods versions vs retail vs KO.

Most of us cannot read chinese, and even using google translate, this thread cannot be clearly understood, so we have to trust you on this.

Anyway, as you state yourself, in the best case, the factory is illegally producing unlicensed toys using the original molds. Thus they are not legit, and should not be sold as original Takara Tomy Toys.

Also, Pilgrim76 thread sussing out KO vs original fails to notice that the authentic Frenzy RocketPunchArmy uses as an example for comparison has the same tampo'd number and unpainted rivets as the knock off, so those points aren't helpful in IDing the KO. I wish I could find a thread on TFW2005 from 1-2 months ago where authenticity was disputed over someone's figure (can't remember which TF it was either) that had two tiny holes completely filled by paint while other examples didn't. Ultimately it was shown both were authentic, and once again paint is a bad method to decide authenticity.

If you carefully read my thread comparing MP-15s frome Lena and BBTS, I specifically wrote that : "To be honest, most of the legit MP-15 that have been reviewed on youtube do not have these painted pins, so my MP-15 is maybe from an improved second rund (according to the date stamp, it has been produced in 2014, while the figure was first released in 2013). That means that the pin painting is not exactly a give away for the KO."

Thus, I agree with you, the painting of the pins and holes is not the best way to determine if a toy is authentic or not. However I highlight other differences in my thread when comparing with a legit MP-15. For example, if the same molds were used for what you call "factory goods", how the texture differences (rough vs smooth surfaces) in the cassette cases could be explained ?

Now, your comment about the date stamp is an interesting comment, and thank you for noticing this. Someone else may confirm, it seems that the date stamp is an indicator of the production batch. The last 2 digits always seems to indicate the year of production (at least, it is the case for all my MPs).

Given that RocketPunchArmy did his video on 2013, it is likely that they had the first production run of MP-15, with the date stamp A2113. So, it would make sens that the KOers would use the same date stamp, and that's why in this video the date stamps are the same.

Yet, I had a second production batch when purchasing my MP-15 from BBTS (date stamp C2414, so made in 2014 ?). Given these infos, I can only see two explanations for Lena's date stamps:

-Lena sells KO MP-15s with the "old" date stamp from 2013 (or currently produces unlicensed MP-15 using the old molds, whith same consequences for MP collectors who end up with non legit toys)
-Lena has access to hundreds of original MP-15 overruns from 2013.

But I wonder why Takara Tomy would produce a second batch in 2014 if so much MP-15 from 2013 were left... so obviously the second hypothesis is unlikely.

I do agree the case could be made for the packaging to be knock off, given the obvious differences (that ACToys thread has some MP05 examples), and relative ease packaging can conceivably be reproduced. If you're concerned about packaging being authentic you have a legitimate concern IMO.

That sums up the problem : my MP-15 and (specifically) MP-5 have very obvious packaging issues. It has been shown that MP-5 received 2 years ago from Lena have packaging issues. So basically, anyone buying these items expecting to receive a lgeit Takara Tomy toy should be concerned.

That is very interesting information roboticplanet.

All of the pictures of MP authentic Grimlocks have hollow dinosaur toes. It is certainly possible that KO ones have toes that are more hollow, however. The only information I could ever find about regular sized KO Grimlocks was about Wukong WK-01, which apparently bears a Wukong copyright on it rather than a Tomy one. Obviously, it would be trivial to make some Wukong WK-01s with a Tomy copyright if they wanted to pass them off as authentic.

I think the knockoff versus lunchtime special issue is a bit of a moot point. I suppose it makes Lena's "NOT KO!!" description literally true, but the items are still counterfeit. I assumed, as it seems other people did, that Lena was selling some sort of factory rejects. Lena seems to be able to command premium prices over others who sell counterfeits, presumably because buyers believe the items are more authentic. Presumably, if they had known the truth, buyers would have bought cheaper counterfeits or paid more for authentic ones. Regardless of the quality of the lunchtime specials, they violate eBay's listing policies, even if there are countless other Masterpiece sellers that admit they are selling KOs.

In my case, I bought from Lena because I would be willing to accept a few defects at a significant discount. I would not want to buy a counterfeit, however. Buying counterfeits is not illegal in the US and most other countries, but selling them is. While I would have the option of selling a factory reject and disclosing its defects, I could not lawfully sell a counterfeit. This distinction would matter if I was not happy with the figure I received or needed to free up space.

Firstly, ignore my MP Grimlock comments. Looking into it further, it was an unproven claim that I then repeated incorrectly. In fact, after reading more about MP Grimlocks KOs, I don't see any proof KO HasTak Grimlock exists beyond the speculation in this thread.


Lena's aren't counterfeit just like they aren't knock offs, as both terms deal with copies or imitations. Takasa Tony MPs, including those before Takasa Tony marked the packages as such, are true KOs/counterfeits as they do copy and imitate authentic figures, made from different injection molds, evident in a final product never 100% identical to the real deal. I have to say too the term 'factory reject' is one of the most ridiculous fan inventions. Considering every single MP release earns a thread somewhere devoted to all the defects found on retail figures, yet supposed "reject" versions will turn up in massive quantities without issues, it doesn't make sense. Remember when early Takasa Tony MPs were thought to be rejects too? *facepalm*

Anyway, regardless of what they're called (I've also seen Bulk Editions, Factory Seconds), these figures Lena is selling can be made before, during and after retail production using the same mold. Lena has sold figures months before release suggesting she has access to figures before official production and of course well after. As an example, I bought an unpainted, unchromed Platinum Edition G1 Kickback from her prior to the PE Insecticons being announced, and prior to release by upward of 6 months. She sold more of those and final versions for months after I bought mine too. Also, consider this hypothetical: Let's say TT orders some number of MP05s, and Lena takes the first one off the assembly line, then several more in the middle of TT production, then another few hundred after TT's order is fulfilled. Which are any less authentic? Disregarding diminishing quality control over time after official production, it's the same factory, same mold, same assembly line, same manufacturing process. Of course it complicates things even more when HasTak brings the mold back into production for a reissue. Who knows, maybe some Factory Goods versions will end up in HasTak packaging since they were already made when official production starts. It's a gray area for sure, but the figures aren't counterfeits/KOs.

Lena's aren't counterfeit just like they aren't knock offs, as both terms deal with copies or imitations.

Do you have facts to back-up this affirmation ? Because I have shown, with actual pictures of the MP-5 box I received from Lena, that this specific item is obviously not legit at all. Lena's MP-15 is also very different on several key points from a legit one I own, and actually MUCH closer to the KO described in the video I mention earlier.

Anyway, regardless of what they're called (I've also seen Bulk Editions, Factory Seconds), these figures Lena is selling can be made before, during and after retail production using the same mold.

Besides speculations about where and when the items sold by Lena COULD have been made, let's focus on facts, and facts tells that Lena is selling some counterfeit items (KOs, unlicensed, or whatever you call them).

Lena has sold figures months before release suggesting she has access to figures before official production and of course well after. As an example, I bought an unpainted, unchromed Platinum Edition G1 Kickback from her prior to the PE Insecticons being announced, and prior to release by upward of 6 months. She sold more of those and final versions for months after I bought mine too. Also, consider this hypothetical: Let's say TT orders some number of MP05s, and Lena takes the first one off the assembly line, then several more in the middle of TT production, then another few hundred after TT's order is fulfilled. Which are any less authentic? Disregarding diminishing quality control over time after official production, it's the same factory, same mold, same assembly line, same manufacturing process. Of course it complicates things even more when HasTak brings the mold back into production for a reissue. Who knows, maybe some Factory Goods versions will end up in HasTak packaging since they were already made when official production starts. It's a gray area for sure, but the figures aren't counterfeits/KOs.

Nobody said that Lena is only selling fake items, I am just saying that some of us received KOs from her. She has consistently sold fake MP-5 for over 2 years now. It is impossible that her MP-15 could be so far from a legit one (and so close to the MP-15 KO) without being a KO, and Lena's MP-16 has the same characteritics as her MP-15 (the cassette cases pink hue and clearness, the box colors and slight blurryness).

As I said earlier, Lena is casting severe doubts on herself by selling counterfeit items. Therefore, I strongly advise anyone purchasing from her to double check what they receive. William-James88 himself strongly believed he received an original TT MP-5 until he looked carefully at its box.

roboticplanet wrote:Firstly, ignore my MP Grimlock comments. Looking into it further, it was an unproven claim that I then repeated incorrectly. In fact, after reading more about MP Grimlocks KOs, I don't see any proof KO HasTak Grimlock exists beyond the speculation in this thread.


Lena's aren't counterfeit just like they aren't knock offs, as both terms deal with copies or imitations. Takasa Tony MPs, including those before Takasa Tony marked the packages as such, are true KOs/counterfeits as they do copy and imitate authentic figures, made from different injection molds, evident in a final product never 100% identical to the real deal. I have to say too the term 'factory reject' is one of the most ridiculous fan inventions. Considering every single MP release earns a thread somewhere devoted to all the defects found on retail figures, yet supposed "reject" versions will turn up in massive quantities without issues, it doesn't make sense. Remember when early Takasa Tony MPs were thought to be rejects too? *facepalm*

Anyway, regardless of what they're called (I've also seen Bulk Editions, Factory Seconds), these figures Lena is selling can be made before, during and after retail production using the same mold. Lena has sold figures months before release suggesting she has access to figures before official production and of course well after. As an example, I bought an unpainted, unchromed Platinum Edition G1 Kickback from her prior to the PE Insecticons being announced, and prior to release by upward of 6 months. She sold more of those and final versions for months after I bought mine too. Also, consider this hypothetical: Let's say TT orders some number of MP05s, and Lena takes the first one off the assembly line, then several more in the middle of TT production, then another few hundred after TT's order is fulfilled. Which are any less authentic? Disregarding diminishing quality control over time after official production, it's the same factory, same mold, same assembly line, same manufacturing process. Of course it complicates things even more when HasTak brings the mold back into production for a reissue. Who knows, maybe some Factory Goods versions will end up in HasTak packaging since they were already made when official production starts. It's a gray area for sure, but the figures aren't counterfeits/KOs.

Takara/Hasbro sure got lot'sa cash to throw with all these "overruns". Will they ever turn in a profit that way?

Pilgrim76 wrote:As I said earlier, Lena is casting severe doubts on herself by selling counterfeit items. Therefore, I strongly advise anyone purchasing from her to double check what they receive. William-James88 himself strongly believed he received an original TT MP-5 until he looked carefully at its box.

But with the evidence presented forth that these are using the same molds, I am now thinking that it is more likely that the toy is authentic but that the box isnt.

And also, there are definitely factory rejects like the MP sideswipe stickersheet that made an error and wrote Tigertrack instead. Thats an error made at the factory which was of course not sold to the public. But Lena sold it.

But with the evidence presented forth that these are using the same molds, I am now thinking that it is more likely that the toy is authentic but that the box isnt.

There is actually no evidence presented, just possibilities and speculation about Lena's toys being produced unlicensed with the official molds. I am ready to believe it, but I'll need solid evidence explaining how a legit toy came in a fake box...

The only actual evidence you got is the front box of Lena's MP-5 : 3 reports (so far) show that these boxes are not official. Also, an ebayer selling MP-5 with the exact same box has confirmed it is a KO. Believing the toy is a legit one is really wishful thinking.

From this point, once you accept that the MP-5 sold by Lena is a fake, you can extend the logic to the rest she is selling : which toy is legit ? Which one is fake ?

We can see from her listings that for several of the MP toys she sells, she usually has the packaged version and the loose/unpainted version. Her KO MP-5 is sold in both versions and I highly suspect that all MPs sold as loose and packaged may be fakes. This is the case of MP-15, 16 (which are also fakes according to my observations). For MP-8, I am unable to judge (although I believe there is more chance it is fake than legit). On the other hand, Lena is also selling Red Bumblebee, and I believe this is the legit toy (no report so far of KO for this toy, and Lena doesn't sell the loose version).

Thats an error made at the factory which was of course not sold to the public. But Lena sold it.

Is this a theory or has it been confirmed somewhere ? How do you know this is not simply another KO ?

Pilgrim76 wrote:Is this a theory or has it been confirmed somewhere ? How do you know this is not simply another KO ?

We have been told a few posts above that it was confirmed in a chinese forum.

william-james88 wrote:

Pilgrim76 wrote:Is this a theory or has it been confirmed somewhere ? How do you know this is not simply another KO ?

We have been told a few posts above that it was confirmed in a chinese forum.

I don't read chinese, and I only believe direct evidences (especially since trusting Lena's reputation rewarded me with fake toys).

So I tried a google translate and they are basically talking about MP-5 (not Sideswipe). And from what I caught of the (poor) google english translation, these chinese guys are debating (the same as we do) if their MP-5 could be fake or not.

Pilgrim76 wrote:

william-james88 wrote:

Pilgrim76 wrote:Is this a theory or has it been confirmed somewhere ? How do you know this is not simply another KO ?

We have been told a few posts above that it was confirmed in a chinese forum.

I don't read chinese, and I only believe direct evidences (especially since trusting Lena's reputation rewarded me with fake toys).

So I tried a google translate and they are basically talking about MP-5 (not Sideswipe). And from what I caught of the (poor) google english translation, these chinese guys are debating (the same as we do) if their MP-5 could be fake or not.

The way I see it, there is no evidence pointing one way or another. But I can definitely concede that the box is not authentic for MP05

The way I see it, there is no evidence pointing one way or another. But I can definitely concede that the box is not authentic for MP05

Anyway, the point is not to convince you, but to give enough evidence to help anyone make his own mind about Lena's toys.

roboticplanet wrote:Firstly, ignore my MP Grimlock comments. Looking into it further, it was an unproven claim that I then repeated incorrectly. In fact, after reading more about MP Gridlocks KOs, I don't see any proof KO HasTak Grimlock exists beyond the speculation in this thread.

My suspicion at this point is that what I received is a Grimlock made using an authentic mold, with a sword from an American release (since the point is rounded), and instructions that are a sloppy imitation of the authentic ones (since certain parts are pixelated), much like the MP-5 box.

roboticplanet wrote: Lena's aren't counterfeit just like they aren't knock offs, as both terms deal with copies or imitations.

Whether something is a counterfeit, in the sense that I used the term in my post, is a legal question. The answer may vary depending on country, but in the US items with "spurious marks" are counterfeit under 18 U.S. Code § 2320. Boxes bearing the words Takara Tomy or figures with a similar stamp on them have spurious marks when they aren't produced under license from Hasbro/Takara. Obviously I have not read the contracts between Takara and the factories it uses, but I imagine they only permit placing Takara marks on the products the factories are producing for Takara/Hasbro. When the factories, or their workers, produce products using Takara's molds or packaging designs to sell themselves, the products produced are outside the scope of Takara's license given to the factories and are therefore spurious. They are falsely implying that the particular product was authorized by Takara.

A factory reject, in contrast, would be a different scenario. Takara presumably authorizes the production of factory rejects, since it likely knows that a certain percentage of products produced by its molds will have problems for whatever reason. Its contracts with the factories likely require that these rejects be destroyed, but the creation of the rejects was permitted.

None of this reflects on the quality of the products Lena is selling, whatever one wants to call them. If someone just wants products made from official molds and likely using the same materials as an official release, then buying from Lena may still make sense. However, by using obviously fake packaging on MP-5, and in my case for Grimlock fake instructions and a sword that appears to come from a different release, there is a specter of doubt over whether any given product Lena sells is a KO, unauthorized use of a factory mold, factory reject, or assembled from all three.

I'd like to add my opinion here. Just to add some context I have owned the KO versions of the cassettebots and the ones Lena was selling a year or so ago, the ones I got from Lena at the time were absolutly flawless, there was no doubt on my mind that they were the real deal, as good as the KO's were (and there were very good) the difference between those and the Lena ones were day and night.

Having seen the posts above I thought I'd order another set and see what all the fuss was about. First impressions from opening the box was "someting aint right" the box colours were all washed out and there was bluring and pixelisation all ofer the place, the pront on my old KO's were better. Upon onpening the box things looked a little better, the blaster fit without any issues the tempos were crisp and clear and metallic paint on the visors. Then came transformation, for the most part it was fine however there were some very tight joints that had me worried. That said they dont feel like KO's or at least not the KO's I had previously owned, however they also did not feel the same as the initial ones I had bought from Lena over a year ago.

My best guess would be that these are official, but cobbled together using various regected runs, much like those loose MP-09's that were doing the rounds a while back, the packaging is clearly not to the official standard and probably is bootleg.

It's a shame this has happened as I had bought many figures off Lena over the years and I have never been dissapointed. After this last purchase I'll have second thoughts before buying from them again.

I'd like to add my opinion here. Just to add some context I have owned the KO versions of the cassettebots and the ones Lena was selling a year or so ago, the ones I got from Lena at the time were absolutly flawless, there was no doubt on my mind that they were the real deal, as good as the KO's were (and there were very good) the difference between those and the Lena ones were day and night.

Having seen the posts above I thought I'd order another set and see what all the fuss was about. First impressions from opening the box was "someting aint right" the box colours were all washed out and there was bluring and pixelisation all ofer the place, the pront on my old KO's were better. Upon onpening the box things looked a little better, the blaster fit without any issues the tempos were crisp and clear and metallic paint on the visors. Then came transformation, for the most part it was fine however there were some very tight joints that had me worried. That said they dont feel like KO's or at least not the KO's I had previously owned, however they also did not feel the same as the initial ones I had bought from Lena over a year ago.

My best guess would be that these are official, but cobbled together using various regected runs, much like those loose MP-09's that were doing the rounds a while back, the packaging is clearly not to the official standard and probably is bootleg.

It's a shame this has happened as I had bought many figures off Lena over the years and I have never been dissapointed. After this last purchase I'll have second thoughts before buying from them again.

Do you have facts to back-up this affirmation ? Because I have shown, with actual pictures of the MP-5 box I received from Lena

Everything I've said deals strictly with the figure itself, not with the paperwork, box, inserts, etc. In fact, I would be surprised if those weren't imitations, since a company manufacturing and assembling a product doesn't necessarily have the packaging materials, die-cutting equipment, printer for artwork, or vacuum forming equipment, so they're usually outsourced to another company. Trying to copy packaging is relatively easy but will never be the same without the original source materials (cardboard, plastic) and digital image files. This is why early Takasa Tony counterfeits were always given away by the boxes. If Takasa Tony was capable of acquiring perfect packaging reproductions, Lena and similar sellers would too.

The evidence of Lena's source is in the final toy itself. Replicating a mold on the other hand is nearly impossible without including minor yet obvious molding differences, exactly what we see in the Takasa Tony KOs, who by anyone's best guess, likely starts with some version of the original TT CAD files. Molds are expensive to produce, but can last up to 1 million runs, so manufacturing factories keep the molds on hand for their customer (ie, Hasbro, TakaraTomy) who, as we know, will reuse them. The molds are large, heavy and made for the exact machine to do the injections so they do not move around to other factories. If Lena has a source that can perfectly reproduce the machining of existing complex molds with low enough overhead allowing the products to be sold cheaply in such an unofficial capacity, she should probably share this magic with the rest of the world. A lot of makers of KO products, not just toys, would love to hear from her.

There's strong circumstantial evidence to Lena's official factory source given her usual sales pattern. She wasn't selling when the original MP05 was released, but was for MP21 Bumblebee, among many others. It usually goes like so:
(1) Gray model and/or painted mock-up revealed by HasTak.
(2/3) Lena sells loose painted and unpainted toys, AND final version revealed by HasTak (order of these steps can change)
(4) Retail product released
(5) If Lena's auction prices don't die off (from retail competition?), she continues to sell loose and/or boxed toys.
(6) If a reissue or repaint occurs, the cycle starts again at step (2/3).

This process has been going on for years and is easily reconstructed from online news, discussion and Lena's own eBay feedback. There really isn't any other possible way for Lena to obtain the items she sells considering the timeline besides connections to the original factory.

Nobody said that Lena is only selling fake items, I am just saying that some of us received KOs from her.

Besides boxes, which I agree are copies due to overwhelming physical evidence, issues regarding paint details, parts assembly, or even absensce of parts (ie, missing MP05 fingers) aren't evidence of a KO. The only slightly damning "fact" is the off-hue cassette cover, that again has identical molding, correct? First, any slight variations in production will be more obvious in light and transluscent colors. Second, from Takasa Tony comparisons, it doesn't look identical in hue to those either. Finally, variation could be caused by many manufacturing reasons such as slightly different input plastic, or a diffrent curing time, to name a couple. Hardly enough to conclude knock off. Show me backward-molded vent lines, as on Takasa Tony's Ratbat or a different nose like, Takasa Tony's Prowl, or even a slightly different placed or sized injection point (gate) as many Takasa Tony KOs have, then you'd unquestionably have a KO.

Takara/Hasbro sure got lot'sa cash to throw with all these "overruns". Will they ever turn in a profit that way?

To be perfectly clear, HasTak does not own the factories that do the actual manufacturing. They just contract them for the work.

None of this reflects on the quality of the products Lena is selling, whatever one wants to call them. If someone just wants products made from official molds and likely using the same materials as an official release, then buying from Lena may still make sense. However, by using obviously fake packaging on MP-5, and in my case for Grimlock fake instructions and a sword that appears to come from a different release, there is a specter of doubt over whether any given product Lena sells is a KO, unauthorized use of a factory mold, factory reject, or assembled from all three.

Pretty much agreed. This is why call it a gray area product. It's not really official, but the toy itself (I personally don't care about packaging and would discard anything I received from her anyway) is still a continuation of the official product.


Also, despite putting myself in a position as an apologist for Lena's toys, I do recommend avoiding them, and instead supporting TakaraTomy and Hasbro, and the retailers of their goods. If a figure isn't available now, it will inevitably be reissued.

Nothing to be ashamed off. If you got some fakes from lena, that's done. No sense in trying to justify their not being "K.O's". It happens in life when somebody sucker punches you. Back then, your thoughts were based on the spin that they were "overruns". Well, that was years ago and Takara/Hasbro is still having a large stock of overruns? Hb must be made of money to allow such "loses" to their bottom line.

http://www.aliexpress.com/store/group/T ... 92868.html

http://www.aliexpress.com/store/group/L ... 34997.html

fine examples of KOs and "loose" items. At least this guy advertises them as such. KOs I mean.

Here is the real deal.

http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product ... 37517.html

Leakin'lubricant testimony adds another rock to the wall, and confirms the faded colors and blurry pictures on the MP-15 & 16 packages. This is important as these are backed-up facts.

In summary, packages of Lena's MP-5, 15 and 15 are faked. From this starting point, everyone will make his own mind about the legitimacy of the toys themselves (official, KO, or made from overrun parts...). But I emphasize the fact that besides speculations about how these toys are produced, nothing establish that these items are made using original parts.

In any case, these toys are non legit, and should never be sold as "original Takara".

The only slightly damning "fact" is the off-hue cassette cover, that again has identical molding, correct?

And also the Transformers Logo, which is rough/rugged on the original, and flat on Lena's. This could not come from the same mold. I also have to check again, but in my mind, the two pins that attach to the hole of the cassettes are also slightly different. I'll have a look this evening and take a picture.

Pilgrim76 wrote:In any case, these toys are non legit, and should never be sold as "original Takara".

Yeah I think thats fair.

Ok so feedback on recent purchases. I bought some casettes again and the quality wasnt great. I know because I also ought a YOTG soundwave and those casettes felt tighter. The plastic is ok, but the joints arent tight.Plus, my buzzsaw from lena was missing an eye (it wasnt painted) so I asked for a refund and got a complete one.

I also bought an AD 31 Armour knight prime and he is in prime shape. Doesnt look or feel like a ko, everything is there and it looks great.

Also, for anyone who cares, Lena now has MP Ironhide up for auctions. http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Takara-Transform ... SwepJXYf48

william-james88 wrote:I also bought an AD 31 Armour knight prime and he is in prime shape. Doesnt look or feel like a ko, everything is there and it looks great.

Hoo boy, thanks for clearing my chest there. I recently bid on AD-31 from Lena, then spent a good ten minutes scouring the web in a panicked frenzy to affirm it wasn't a KO/something else. Hopefully mine comes out to be the same quality as yours! I'll post here again when I receive it.

Some news about the MP-5 box. Yesterday I was at the French Japan Expo event, and found a MP-5 for sale.

I was surprised that the box front illustration had a similar (very dark) red fabric background as the one I received from Lena. I immediately told the seller that I suspected his MP-5 to be a bootleg, but he insisted it was an original. I had a closer look to the box, but didn't find the other discrepancies I found on Lena's MP-5 : the box back illustrations were crisp, colors were contrasted, and most importantly the front white border did not overlap with the black outline of Meg's canon.

So I am again confused.

About Lena's MP-5 I am still convinced it is not an official product (too many inaccuracies + blurry picture), but 'it seems' that a version of MP-5 box exists with a darker red fabric background (If we assume that the seller was honest, and was selling an official product...).

If anyone possesses an original 2nd run MP-5, purchased from a trusted reseller, I believe that having a picture of its front illustration would be much appreciated.

Also, another information about MP-15 : I purchased another one on ebay from a chinese reseller (toy_story_world). I received the exact same MP-15 as the one I previously purchased from BBTS : same date stamp, same box colors (NOT faded), same asian additional sticker on the back of the box, same CE sticker. Inside, eveything was ok : the pink hue of the cassette cases match the one from BBTS, and every other elements were EXACTLY the same as BBTS MP-15.

To me, this seller is okay, and sells original Masterpieces (He has some other MP-15 listed if anyone is interested).

Just got Armor Knight Optimus in the mail today. The figure is solid as can be; if it's a KO, it's a darn good one. Overall very satisfied with the price, quality, and shipping, and I'd recommend the seller if this figure is anything to go off of.