The Energon Pub

First PLEASE KEEP IT CIVIL. No name calling PERIOD. I am interested in getting fellow collectors opinions on scalping

I have been collecting toys for well over 20 years and it was not until the early 90's that I noticed something different.Sections for toy lines were substantially smaller than they used to be.
My observations (not opinion)..

I remember walking into a TRU, Children's Palace, Lionel Playworld, etc in the early to mid 80's.. and the action figure isles were MONSTROUS.. I distinctly remember in 83 when ROTJ came out a literal wall of the new Star Wars figures. You did not have to worry about driving from store to store to find the latest figures. I even remember this for Transformers, Gi Joes, MOTU etc..

Fast Forward to 1991.. This was around the time that they started making certain variant Batman figures (the square jawed Batman vs the Michael Keaton).. Not to mention the release of the Toy Biz X-men line.
I worked at Kaybee toys and saw young boys look for certain figures to sell to one of the local toy shops and even the owners come in, rummage around through the figure bins.

Second it was the "hard to find" female figures that were intentionally "shortpacked" (all what I had red in various toy collecting mags and by word of mouth) because they did not think that kids would want female figs (I never understood this because in the Gi joe and MOTU line there were women figs and they were out there just as much as the guys). Flea market vendors s and comic shop owners picked up their Lees Action figure guide and Toyfair magazines, went out and scooped up all the Rogues, Storms and Spirals and jacked their prices since they were "rare"..
This practice continued until something called ebay came about, now people actually had a way to see what people would actually pay for these so called rare figs.

Through the years I have heard all the reasons why people buy collectables, then turn around slap "rare" on them and sell them on ebay.
The one reason that always rubbed me the wrong way is:
"I sell the extra to pay for my toy collecting habit"
I say this, you want to pay for your habit, then get another job to support it. I have worked ONE job and still manage to swing by with what I want to buy. Do not rob other collectors the joy of waling into a store and finding the new latest and greatest toys.

Another one is "oh I am helping out fellow collectors"
No. Sorry but this does not work, you want to "help" then sell them for what it cost you to pick them up. Don't factor gas because to be honest it does not matter if gas is $4 a gallon or $2, you went to the store to pick up something for yourself and just so happened to picked up extras. If gas it too much for you then simply stop collecting and you won't waste gas driving around to look for toys.

I know of local scalpers that drive around in the morning and try to hit all the stores, I love being in a store and seeing one of them walk in, then see me and realize that I bought the "hot" toy for my own personal collection and not to sell to someone else for a kidney.

Please discuss this and keep it civil as I am interested in others views on the subject.

I know there is one scalper in my area. He runs a local vintage toy store and I've seen him in TRU on truck morning going down the aisles will his shopping list cherry picking certain "hot" toys to resell in his shop. I know this for a fact, because I've seen those same toys on his pegs. I would like to hate the guy, but he gives me good deals on vintage stuff.

It wouldn't bother me so badly if children weren't actually effected. I mean, if you're gonna play an adult game like that, go for oil barrels, go for precious metals, but I mean, at the end of the day, these are childrens toys. You wanna scalp high level exclusives to pay for your family to go to Cali? Thats cool, its not rocket science to figure out how to pull that off, and the target market for those figs aren't really kids anyways. Ill drop the extra cash. I don't want to see Cali. But retail releases? Thats weak. People will bleed for their kids, and some kids don't understand thats whats going on. We can all agree that it could be WAY worse. Remember when Wii came out before christmas a few years back?

Tomahawks and orphan tears.

Its not illegal, but it just disappoints me that collectors cut each others throats. When it comes to grabbing extras for collectors, Im fine with that. Gas extras? Sure, call it a finders fee. There isn't a safe house for these figs to go to in order to keep them off of Ebay. So for one person to grab a few up and regulate it, is kind of cool, but once again, children probably aren't gonna get those figures they want. Classics isn't as big to them, probably, but like Prime or Animated? Those are gonna hit big.

How do we solve this?

Bear traps. All throughout the kids isles. I mean, they've got to be big enough to catch a man. And there needs to be bait, like some sort of childrens toy, to catch the adult in mid-sleaze.

Or we could use a direct order link to Hasbro warehouses. Major retailers get the link to the warehouse, and essentially, using a site to store order, you get what you want, when you want. And do away with the order by the case bullshit. I want paint on my taillights and hubcaps. Im willing to pay the extra dollar and sixteen cents because Im not taking them to the gravel pit or mud pile. So, make figs individual like they do in Japan.

Or go with the bear traps. For the kids.

Cyber Bishop wrote:I remember walking into a TRU, Children's Palace, Lionel Playworld, etc in the early to mid 80's.. and the action figure isles were MONSTROUS.. I distinctly remember in 83 when ROTJ came out a literal wall of the new Star Wars figures. You did not have to worry about driving from store to store to find the latest figures. I even remember this for Transformers, Gi Joes, MOTU etc..

I dunno, there were certain GI Joe figures that were incredibly hard to find back in the day. I had to search for months to find the first Storm Shadow, for instance. The 2nd Snake Eyes was pretty hard to find as well. And I never did find Firefly.

Transformers, I saw the original Jetfire in the store once, but was just a kid with no money and couldn't get it right way, then it was a long time before I ever managed to find another one. Fortunately by that time, I'd saved up my money.

It wasn't near as bad as it is today, no, but that's because now we have entire lines that are done in a year or less, compared to GI Joe and TF back then where they'd keep selling them for up to 2 years (or more for a few) while new toys coming in were still part of the same line. When the toys are only around for a few months, if you can't find it right away, you're likely screwed. If it's around 2 years, you've got a lot more chance of eventually coming across it.

None of which has much if anything to do with the actual topic of scalping, sorry about that.

I have turned scalper.

I buy every G1 I come across, if its cheap. I nearly always make a profit when I sell, and drive the money back into my own collection.

In the past year, I've lost my job and had to sell a good chunk of my G1 collection - if I hadn't scalped some stuff, I'd never have made up the money I needed.

I've paid well over the odds for figures before and sometimes let them slip away because the price was too high. People only pay what they are willing to.

Last year, I drove around the entire country buying up every single HA Mudflap I could find. From California all the way to Michigan, I hit thousands of TJ Maxx stores just so little children couldn't have them. Do I need a better reason? Making the trip of a lifetime just so I can see kids weep? No, I don't.

Good topic. CB, you bring up several good points, as well as "excuses" to feed one's own justification for what they do.

I don't like scalping. I want to buy a newly released figure for retail price. I don't think it's fair that certain figures get short-packed (even though the industry certainly has no problem with it). This makes stumbling across that figure much harder, because the ones who are lucky or connected enough to find them buy them all up and create a further shortage. And now you have to pay THEM for the PRIVILEGE of owning the figure, and this helps feed the scalper to continue their practice.

The industry should really consider addressing these issues better. Currently I can preorder a case of figures from the likes of BBTS, I can pay more than MSRP for a single figure in the set because of expected demand/short-packing, or I can start "The Hunt" again. And of course, I can pay twice as much or more due to auctions and shipping.

Well, I preordered the last two RTS and Generations sets which screwed me for the Generations revision with Warpath. I didn't need more of the other figures, and I sure didn't want to preorder for $20 - 25. Plus shipping.

I wish HasbroToyShop would do a better service to customers with how they keep stock. Maybe even allow us to order new figures as a Wave (they do this with Marvel Universe, I haven't seen them offer TFs like this yet).

So, without going into anymore of a rant or speaking about my own experiences - the industry should evaluate their product distribution systems and give others less incentive to scalp brand new figures. Until then, I'll try to preorder figures I want that might present a problem to get upon release.

Amelie wrote:I have turned scalper.

I buy every G1 I come across, if its cheap. I nearly always make a profit when I sell, and drive the money back into my own collection.

In the past year, I've lost my job and had to sell a good chunk of my G1 collection - if I hadn't scalped some stuff, I'd never have made up the money I needed.

I've paid well over the odds for figures before and sometimes let them slip away because the price was too high. People only pay what they are willing to.

I don't have a problem with this. You are buying figures that are on the secondary market now and getting deals on them, possibly making profit off of them later. My problem is with new figures that should be readily available to the public upon release. Sure, they may sell out quickly, but then the store would hopefully replenish.

Unless you're saying you picked up all 8 Commemorative Edition Perceptors when they came out, preventing others to get them at MSRP... which I don't think you are.

necr0blivion wrote:

Amelie wrote:I have turned scalper.

I buy every G1 I come across, if its cheap. I nearly always make a profit when I sell, and drive the money back into my own collection.

In the past year, I've lost my job and had to sell a good chunk of my G1 collection - if I hadn't scalped some stuff, I'd never have made up the money I needed.

I've paid well over the odds for figures before and sometimes let them slip away because the price was too high. People only pay what they are willing to.

I don't have a problem with this. You are buying figures that are on the secondary market now and getting deals on them, possibly making profit off of them later. My problem is with new figures that should be readily available to the public upon release. Sure, they may sell out quickly, but then the store would hopefully replenish.

Unless you're saying you picked up all 8 Commemorative Edition Perceptors when they came out, preventing others to get them at MSRP... which I don't think you are.

I don't have a problem with this scenario (especially with the job), G1 figs are tough to come by and so many want them that the demand is there.

Dark Optimum Supreme where do you hail from? I am curious because of the problems that you say you had finding those figs. I honestly never had a problem finding things back then.

Not long ago I looked on youtube for old Lionel Playworld commercials and flipped at the glimpses of the action figure isles, just like I remember them, stacked full of toys.

It Is Him wrote:Last year, I drove around the entire country buying up every single HA Mudflap I could find. From California all the way to Michigan, I hit thousands of TJ Maxx stores just so little children couldn't have them. Do I need a better reason? Making the trip of a lifetime just so I can see kids weep? No, I don't.

You're like reverse Santa Claus!

Honestly, you did the children a favor for this particular one.

I don' like it. DVDs, books, comics, CDs, video games, etc...you get one product per description. If I run a shop and want 10 copies of Grey-Brown FPS for X-Box 360, or 20 issues of the latest Ultimate Crisis comic, that's what I order. I don't have to take 5 other games that none of my customers want, or a dozen other comics per each one of the individual product that people are ordering. I can't think of another product that's sold the way toys are. It's quite random. Now, by all means offer cases to larger stores, but allow collector stores to order specific toys, so that if 50 people come into a shop and ask for Transforminator X, they'd all get one. I wouldn't even be against a 3-6month wait for delivery once pre-orders were in.

But that's not how it works. Blah! As it is, we have toy companies padding out their new figures with repaints, retools and re-releases. I personally am not against these thins in principle. TF-wise there's more than a few repaints and retools I've waited for over buying the original, and as many times where I've kicked myself for not waiting. However, it can lead to situations like that of Gen Warpath, where the majority are after the one figure in a box, leaving retailers with either a lot of extra stock no-one wants, or a lot of customer's who are disappointed at not getting what they're after because it's sold out.

This situation lets people be scalpers. I remember being in a shop, one I'd bought from in the past, and always liked going into. Sure, they charged a little more for shortpackaged figures, but with many collector shops that is the case. Then I heard the owner on the phone, to someone in Toys R Us, who was actually seeing what figures they had, buying them to sell in their store. I heard him say something about one particular figure that retailed at £7.99 or so "Oh yeah, I can sell that for £15, no problem, get all of them." It was the last time I was in that shop.

I am all for helping another person out. I'd buy stuff for people if I could, if there was ever anything in my area that was in demand. But I'd sell for cost+postage. Unless it is something I've already bought and am selling on, and even then it's actually less likely, I won't take a profit. If I happen to have something that people value, and I decide to sell it at a later date, for whatever reason, I don't feel that is wrong, but buying with intent to supply that's just wrong, unless, you're not making anything off it. In the case of these kids toys as well...I always like to leave some on the shelf so that if a youngster does happen to come across the things, they can get what they want as well. I have passed up toys before because kids have been looking at them. (I've also gone back later to check if they'd bought them or not)

i honestly dont like it when it comes to newer figs. When it comes to older figures i dont really mind because fellow fans are usually willing to help out a fellow fan. (like on this site) I just dont like that just because a toy is popular scalpers have to go and buy them and sell them for double the price.

I also feel bad for the kids. I mean these are children's toys. I mean i never saw generations thundercracker, wheeljack, or warpath. I've only seen dotm shockwave once since may 16. I remember when the 25th anniversary g.i. joe line line came out, i literally did not find a single figure save for duke and storm shadow. Yet some "vintage" seller still has them all in his store for 25 bucks each. and dont even get me started on the pursuit of cobra line. but that's a different line.

since it's not against the law, there's nothing we can really do. it just makes me upset sometimes. no offense to anyone.

it's not against the law, but it makes plastic fairies cry

Unlike a lot of people, I really have no hate for scalpers. If you can make some cash, I say do it! Who am I to look down on someone for creatively making money?

But, with that said, it's really not a problem up here. I swear, I'm the ONLY TF collector in my area. I don't have any problems finding the figures I want. I guess if I could never find the figures I want because someone bought them all to put on Ebay, my opinion would be different.

I have been selling some figures lately, but I have my own "ethics" about it. If you're a fellow member, you get it at retail. If I have extra figures beyond that - I'm making some money on Ebay.

Oh, I have added a couple bucks for gas and travel on some of my Crankcase sales. I have literally searched all of Middle and Eastern Maine looking for him!

EDIT: You know what? I'm not going to charge for gas anymore. That's just lame. I said I like hooking other members up, so that means I drive all that distance by my own decision...

the middle east? terrorist!

craggy wrote:the middle east? terrorist!

Hahahaha, no no no. Eastern Maine...MAINE!

I don't have a very high opinion of scalpers. However, I think think if people are willing to buy the stuff at an inflated rate, then so be. If I can't get a current figure for retail, then screw it. I don't need it that badly. I admit that it truly pisses me off to have not even seen a single Warpath, but whatever. Oh well.

Galvatron X wrote:

craggy wrote:the middle east? terrorist!

Hahahaha, no no no. Eastern Maine...MAINE!

Middle East Coast, then!

On a different note, maybe someone should make one of those "Downfall" videos with Hitler ranting about getting RTS figures in the US.

i would love to find a warpath or a HA mudflap when they were out, but nooooo. my view is that scalpers are annoying. you have to realize that other collectors are trying so hard to find a toy for their collection. i know there are a few around in NE ohio......also tons of collectors go out hunting and when they go to a store they realize it was a waste of gas, time and money. thanks a lot. i cant tell you how long i spent looking for a HA mudflap, warpath, kup and scourge(saw them once and bought on sight) . i never did find RTS grapple or windcharger but they were rare to begin with. i have not seen any wave 2 voyagers in my area or anywhere near my area. most of the toys are not rare, scalpers make them rare.

nuke em from orbit, it's the only way to be sure.

Prime Riblet wrote:I admit that it truly pisses me off to have not even seen a single Warpath, but whatever. Oh well.

Doubledealer25 wrote:i would love to find a warpath or a HA mudflap when they were out, but nooooo. my view is that scalpers are annoying. you have to realize that other collectors are trying so hard to find a toy for their collection.

I've never seen a Warpath in stores either. But that's just poopy Hasbro distribution - not scalpers, right?

Cyber Bishop wrote:Dark Optimum Supreme where do you hail from? I am curious because of the problems that you say you had finding those figs. I honestly never had a problem finding things back then.

Michigan, Detroit metro area.

craggy wrote:nuke em from orbit, it's the only way to be sure.

Hold on a second. This installation has a substantial dollar value attached to it.

If I see something in a store that I can resell for twice as much, I'm going to do it as many times as I can. $$$$!

1.) You cannot tell me scalping doesn't exist.
2.) It does affect kids, and collectors.
3.) I know of a scalper, I spoke to him, went to his store and personally saw him purchase items at TRU.

There are so many apologists making excuses, and it makes me sick. Amelie flipping them to make ends meet is one thing. Outright buying these up in multiples and selling them for a disgusting profit is another.

Now, as for the scalper I know? Here's his website:

http://actiontoyman.com/index.html

He seems like a nice guy, in general, but when I went to TRU on the 16th of May to net me some figs, he and his son came into the store, carrying a plastic tote (no, I'm not kidding), and he just started pulling figures off the pegs and shelves. I got one of the last Powerglides before he got his mitts on the rest.

His prices are astronomical. A Snaptrap, missing all accessories, and his right arm? $25.00
The Star Wars figures were even worse. And only some of his Beast Wars prices were in the realm of the okay, but most of them were off the charts.

So, yes...

Scalpers do exist.
I've met and spoken to one.
I've been to his store and I've seen him clean a competing one out.

And it's disgusting. It really is.

In fact, I went to TRU today and found ONE, the only one, Laserbeak in the entire store. There Nitro Bumblebees all over the place, several Thundercrackers, and quite a few Mudflaps. Yet...only ONE Laserbeak. Was it him? I don't know. Would I doubt it? No.

I don't think he's a bad guy, in fact he was rather nice when I spoke to him, but it's still scalping.

Lapse Of Reason wrote:If I see something in a store that I can resell for twice as much, I'm going to do it as many times as I can. $$$$!

And that's precisely the type of thinking that makes us vilify scalpers. It's greed, plain and simple, and it ruins the hobby for others. Especially children.