Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:Tramp wrote:Excuse me? How do you get two life forms of the same speices (in this case, Transformers), a male and a female, engaged in a romantic relationship and engaged in courtship being for the purpose of "understanding other cultures"? That makes absolutely no sense! If this were after they had been to Earth, that might make some modicum of sense, but not relationships that have been going on for millions of years before they ever encounterd humans, and between individualts who have never been to Earth. They do not need to specifically mention sexual activity among TransFormers to make it possible. You don't need a magic bullet. All you need to do is piece the evidence together.
Well, going back to the Star Trek sci-fi stuff, Data engaged in several activities that served him no other purpose other than to better understand other life forms...including having a girl friend...it's not so much a stretch to think that given their ability of space travels & being known to interact with several different life forms, some of which that might not be human but still go through similar mating rituals....it's possible it could have been an older customs they picked up from some long-forgotten friendly relations they were trying to better understand.
...not to mention, Victory is meant to take place quite a while after first contact with humans. In fact the first few episodes show Star Saber dropping their series' kid off at school.
Data is a very special case. He was
designed and built by humans. His goal was to better integrate with them and become
more human. As Jonathan Frakes liked to call him
"Pinnochio". The TransFormers are a completely different case. They were created as males and females, and some time in the past, the females were all taken, resulting in a single-gender society until Arcee came along. The relationships between Optimus and Elita-1, Ironhide and Chromia, Inferno and Firestar, and Powerglide and Moonracer all began
long before Humans even existed. It was perfectly natural for them to engage in romantic relationships. It isn't something they did to better relate with humans or organic races. They did it becuase it was part of their very biology to do so. Hot Rod's and Springer's interest in Arcee had nothing to do with understanding people either. It wasn't something they "played at". The interest is purely romantic and very real. The boys are vying for Arcee's romantic affections. As far as I know, Black Arachnia and Silverbolt necver encounterd Humans either, and the Beats Wars themselves take place long before there are Humans on Earth, ye they still fall in love and engage in a forbidden love-affair. It is romantic love that turns Black Arachnia iaway from the Predicons, and it is her romantic love for her mate, Silverbolt which later frees him from Megatron's control in
Beast machines. Once again, there is no "trying to understand other races" here. It is purely natural for them to fall in love with menbers of the opposite sex.
Secondly, no asking if you expect the chibis—the child TransFormers—to remain small children forever is not putting square pegs into round holes, nor is it a sign of a weak argument or lack of evidence. The children of the DinoForce look like chibi versions of their parents. They are child TransFormers. This was specifically stated. They are smaller, cuter versions of theit parents' forms with childish proportions, just like a baby wolf or baby human is a smaller, cuter version of their parents, with "child-like" proportions.
I was referring to your argument about TFs having sex on the whole with the peg/hole comment. But the fact that your best argument
for them not growing is "why shouldn't they?" still shows that your filling in gaps in you argument with nothing other than "I want it to fit together this way, so it can't be anything else."
No, it isn't, in either case. The TransFormers being robotic does not make them incapable of sexual reproduction. The exact method, could be similar to ours, or not, but would definately have major differences. As Thunder Thruster put it, their Interfaces would look quite different to our organs, and definately more mechanical. Probably nothing more than a nozzel and a receptical, both hidden under a panel. They wouldn't need to "get naked" like we do (though
Cybertron Thunderblast having actual breasts popping out from under her armor definately suggests that she could.
).
On top of that, all research is "fulling in the gaps". It is looking at the evidence from every source, and piecing the pieces of the puzzel together, then coming up with the most logical conclusion based upon that
cumulative evidence. The only thing we don't see is them engaged in sexual intercourse, and that is the one thing we will not see. We don't ned to.
In all of the TF series, except for the Marvel runs, we see:
•TransFormers originally created with both males and females, which only serves a reproductive function in life forms, and that one of these genders dissappeared some time long ago—apparently abducted by the Quintessans—forcing a single gender society requiring artifical means to reproduce.
•only just recently have females returned (Arcee, and shortly thereafter, Elita-1 and her "extraction team").
•We see members of opposite sexes engage in flirting, vying for the romantic affections of the opposite sex, romantic rivalries, courtship, marriage—all of which serves strictly a reproductive function in a species—and (according to at least two sources, and supported by a second) having children and the raising of these families.
•We have confirmation that the use of protoforms imbued with a spark in some manner, is not the only possible method of creating new TransFormer life.
•We have evidence that they have a genetic structure–a genetic code. In other words, a DNA analog. They heal through "regenerative circuitry" [nanites], which could also very well serve a reproductive purpose as well.
We also have the fact that they are life forms, not just robots, like on Earth. Because of that, we have seven scientific criteria that all life must meet in order to not only be considered life,
but also to survive and thrive. Among these criteria, and one of the most important, is the need to be able to reproduce through
autopoietic processes via either sexual or asexual means. Unless a being is immortal—and no life form is, not even TransFormers—they need to be capable of passing on their genes to a new generation.
When you add up all that data, all that evidence, there is only one conclusion—that TransFormers are
capable of reproducing through some sexual process. The
possibility exists for them to sexually reproduce.
