Transformers and More @ The Seibertron Store
![Visit shop.seibertron.com to buy "THE TRANSFORMERS #33 Marvel Comics 1987 (W) Parkhouse (CA) Vess 231222T"](https://www.seibertron.com/images/ebay/comic-books/marvel/transformers/the-transformers/33-231222T/t-DSC07617.jpg)
![Visit shop.seibertron.com to buy "GI JOE Real American Hero #298 Cvr A IDW Comics 2022 JUL221612 298A (CA)Gallant"](https://www.seibertron.com/images/ebay/comic-books/idw/gijoe/a-real-american-hero/298A/t-DSC09026.jpg)
![Visit shop.seibertron.com to buy "THE TRANSFORMERS #21 Marvel Comics 1986 (CA) Trimpe (W) Budiansky 231010Y"](https://www.seibertron.com/images/ebay/comic-books/marvel/transformers/the-transformers/21-231010Y/t-DSC06022.jpg)
![Visit shop.seibertron.com to buy "GI JOE Real American Hero #298 Cvr B IDW Comics 2022 JUL221613 298B (CA)Sullivan"](https://www.seibertron.com/images/ebay/comic-books/idw/gijoe/a-real-american-hero/298B/t-DSC09023.jpg)
Gauntlet101010 wrote:Ever since I got Deathsaurus came in the mail it's really been bothering me that I bought the guy without really knowing who he is properly. It's all just visuals. TBH, even though I've been a Transformers fan for ages there's a whole lot of Transformers shows I just haven't seen. Like at all.
JG1
JBeast Wars
Car Robots / RID
Unicron Trilogy
Rescue Bots
Go!
Robots in Disguise (2015)
Cyberverse
War for Cybertron Trilogy
BotBots
EarthSpark
Gauntlet101010 wrote:Beast Wars II
Just finished with Ep 10 of Beast Wars II. So far way, WAY, better than JG1. Galvatron getting hammered on oil is very reminiscent of G1 proper.
But why are the Insectrons another good guy force? Didn't the production team get look at the Predacon symbol? It's right there!
So far the plots are more diverse than the previous shows. Very different from proper Beast Wars. Very much a kid's show. But I like it so far.
Yeah. Takara evidently cared more about advertising the new 1987 toy characters at the expense of really doing anything with the old guard.Gauntlet101010 wrote:This series just can't be bothered with it's legacy characters. Everyone is either reduced to cartoonish buffoons or bland carboard. Optimus Prime is here to do absolutely nothing and then die in vain because Cybertron is destroyed shortly after. You'd think that would bother the TFs. You'd think. But it's never mentioned. In fact they have a base on Athenia.
To underscore the lack of care Rodimus, Kup, and Blur fly off to search for a new home for the Autobots. No, not in Skylynx or a shuttle. No, they fly like Superman! Arcee ... the less said about Arcee the better.
Two, actually. The Beastformers episode and the episode with the girl Papika.Gauntlet101010 wrote:The Monsterbots were in all of one episode.
It actually is brought up again in the final episode, but every single English subtitled release of the episode (as of this typing) has completely overlooked part of the Japanese dialogue where Fortress says that the Autobots are going to rebuild Mars after they depart from Earth.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Mars is destroyed! MARS! And, despite it being played up the episode prior, it never gets referenced afterwards.
Yeah, it's basically presented as like a soft reboot that wants to have its cake and eat it too, being written as a standalone series but also wanting to be part of the preexisting greater JG1 continuity. Like, in Ginrai's second episode, Hawk, Diver, and Lander have to show him old newspaper clippings of Decepticon attacks from decades ago in order to explain to him who and what the Decepticons even are. Huh?Gauntlet101010 wrote:Masterforce. I think it's best to just pretend it's in it's own little continuity when watching it.
Despite there being an Autobot City (maybe three depending on how you count) nobody seems to remember the Autobots. Chromedome makes a cameo, but that's about it.
Gauntlet101010 wrote:The proper Decepticons are monsters most of the time who initially use zombies (of all things) while the Autobots pretend to be human and talk about going on dates. And then there are the proper humans who all get more attention.
There's definitely some heavy Tokusatsu influence going on with this show, with those Destroid zombies, the Seacons, and the Sparkdash all taking inspiration from the various foot-soldier enemy grunts of Super Sentai and the like, while the main Decepticons serve as both the generals and "monsters-of-the-week" to the main "great ruler" boss of the villains, a common hierarchy of tokusatsu villain factions.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Did you know the Firecons are in this show? As disposable fodder in a couple episodes? Such a waste! And, speaking of waste, Pirranacon is a real paper tiger. Ginrai literally tears through the Seacons every episode and hands the guy his ass. I thought this show was supposed to sell us toys! Where is the menace? They could have has 7 unique characters, but we barely get ONE in Turtler. And he mostly just growls angrily as he flees. Geez. They wasted Doubledealer too. Are they unable to plan these things out?
By this point, the Japanese G1 toyline was getting smaller. Unlike the US toyline, there were no Micromasters sold in the 1989 portion of the Japanese toyline, despite some of them featuring in Victory. All of them would be held off from release in Japan until the following year in 1990, and all but one Micromaster team would be sold as Autobots instead of a more even split between both factions. So Victory didn't have a lot of toy characters to work with for that year, hence the smaller cast.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Victory is where I think they remembered they had to sell toys. It's a pity there's not much to work with here. Late era G1 ... Victory Saber and Deathsaurus are great, but you don't have that variety of product any more. I never liked Micromasters to start with (may be why the UT just didn't grab me).
Sadly, this lack of depth and insightfulness seems to be a result of a certain mindset in Japan when it comes to anime about robots. To the Japanese, if it's a show where the robots are alive and characters in their own right, the show is for younger audiences and don't need to be too deep or complex. But if it's a show where the robots are non-living and operate through human pilots who are the show's characters instead of the robots (like with most Gundam series), then it's a show for older audiences and can be more mature and thought-provoking.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Victory was pretty good, as children's shows go. But, like Masterforce and Headmasters, it doesn't get inventive. We do get one episode where the base egts infiltrated and where the Deceticons try to use bugs to kill Star Saber. That's good. But it's all "steal energy, steal energy, steal energy!" Remember when Megatron decided to make New York into a new Cybertron because he didn't think he could get back to Cybertron? Or when the Autobots brainwashed Devestator to be an Autobot?
So, all in all, JG1 (minus Zone) has an increase in quality in terms of storytelling and animation. But it never got truly inventive. I wish it has asked some questions of itself.
Like it would have been good to know how much Ginrai identified himself with the human Ginrai. Have the human make a guest star in one episode maybe? Masterforce ends abruptly so we never know exactly how much the human minds are echoed into their former Transtectors. The Decepticon ones turn on their humans pretty quickly.
Sky Byte isn't in the Unicron Trilogy.Gauntlet101010 wrote:I want to get to the UT. I feel like I missed out. I plan to watch it subbed (all of the Japanese stuff, so I'll miss out on Haiku Skybite).
Masterforce is my favorite of the three.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Masterforce is good too, but be prepared for a very weird take on TFs.
Basically, the single episode of Zone was a short story set during the first-third of the larger Zone storyline, which was primarily told in the form of 12 story pages published in TV Magazine. The episode is set between the third and fourth story page (though, it wasn't released until three months after), with Victory Saber still leading the Autobots in the first three chapters, which served as a lead-up to the passing of the torch to Dai Atlas. So the episode isn't the proper beginning of the story.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Zone
WTF was this? Honestly, what was this???
This is where problems from the 1990 toyline came into play. While the US would get a line full of Action Masters and more Micromasters filling out the Autobot and Decepticon ranks, Japan would get a line full of just Micromasters, the three Powered Masters, and Metrotitan. And out of all of those, only Metrotitan and a single Micromaster team were Decepticons, meaning the rest of the line was made up of entirely Autobots.Gauntlet101010 wrote:One day a alien being decided he wants to take over the universe, but the new Decepticon toys are all too lame to use (or maybe not made yet?) so he raids his older bro's old toy box in the basement and breaks out all his best toys. And then, because he's a very amateur customizer, slaps some new armor on them to make them "cooler". In the process he gets glue everywhere and they no longer transform.
He was. The name of this group of Decepticon generals is the "Nine Great Demon Generals", with the "demon" part implying that Violengiguar resurrected all of the ones that died previously. Black Zarak's official title in this group is "Evil Spirit General", further denoting his previously-dead nature.Gauntlet101010 wrote:I thought Black Zarak was dead!
Because he be pirate-themed, matey! He has a mighty hook for a right hand, too, arrgh!Gauntlet101010 wrote:Why bother with an eyepatch?
I don't. Because the larger Zone storyline established that every planet has its own Zodiac piece. Zodiac is basically the power of the cosmos itself, able to create entire celestial bodies.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Devestator finds the Zodiac energy deep within the Earth that was always there (don't question it!).
I always just figured he was told where to find it by Violengiguar.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Did he know where it was because he nearly drilled to the center of the planet that one time? That's what went through my mind when I watched this.
By this point, the JG1 manga and story pages pretty much became the primary JG1 fiction, in lieu of any further animated works. The Zone episode was a direct-to-video OVA in the vein of Scramble City, rather than a proper televised program. So Return of Convoy and Operation Combination are kinda shared by both the JG1 cartoon continuity and the separate JG1 manga continuity.Gauntlet101010 wrote:But I also know there's nothing more coming. And also there's not really any new Decepticons.
Gauntlet101010 wrote:But why are the Insectrons another good guy force? Didn't the production team get look at the Predacon symbol? It's right there!
Gauntlet101010 wrote:Edit:
How are the Jointrons Maximals!? They have Insectrons as a third "neutral" faction. This is a show actively fighting against the changes Beast Wars introduced to the franchise, I think. They certainly didn't go with the flow.
Answering these three together: Basically, Takara wanted all of the organic beast toys in this series to be good guys, while the bad guys are all either vehicles, mechanical beasts, or cyborg beasts. The main theme of Beast Wars Second is "Beasts vs. Machines", with the Predacons constantly building fortresses and industrial facilities to exploit Planet Gaia of its energy, and the Maximals trying to stop them and preserve the planet's natural beauty. So all 'bots with organic beast modes, no matter what critter they are (mammal, insect, or reptile) are on the side of justice in Beast Wars Second.Gauntlet101010 wrote:[b]So this whole era was defined by Maximals VS Predacons. There was a bunch of new toys. New faction symbols. Not only does the show say "naw" to all that, but it make some changes that are bizarre.
The Predacon symbol is in the show. Not prominently, but it's there. And it's a bug head. But all the bugs? Neutral good guys or, later, the fun loving, goofy Tripredacus! There's only ONE actual bug on the Destron team! Weird choice.
The relationship between JBW and the two American Beast Era cartoons is... complicated, to say the least.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Looking it up on the wiki shows it to be set on a post apocalyptic Earth set thousands of years after Beast Machines. Minor spoilers for on on BWII, I guess.
So far ... I guess it could fit. I mean they make no mention of the Maximal Elders or the Tripredacus Council and I don't expect them to. Also no mention of the Maximals and Predacons being, at least technically, at peace. HOWEVER, I also know Beast Wars was butchered in translation. I don't know if any of that survived.
I already know Lio Convoy meets Optimus Primal. Viewing it I think the show's intention is that it's supposed to fit, being another team comprised of another set of Maximals fighting another set of Predacons.
Of course, he also isn't the same person as his G1 namesake. He's a different character.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Galvatron is one of my faves and it's interesting to see how he evolved from his G1 self. Because there are some traits that carry over. Namely that he's super powerful compared to other Decepticons and that he easily presents a threat to both sides when he gets out of control, especially early on. The best chaarcetr moment he has is waking up from an several-episodes-long-sleep and getting drunk on too-strong oil - attacking everyone in his path. I felt this was very true to TFs and the Galvatron name. But he isn't insane like G1, nor as happy.
I liked Starscream, and I also liked Scuba. Being this super-competent guy among a team of misfits who just goes with the flow and is a little introverted. It was kinda funny how he acted like this guy who tended to stick to the background but also got things done when no one else could. And he wasn't arrogant about it either. He kinda reminded me a bit of Animated Prowl, only not as fleshed out.Gauntlet101010 wrote:The best character is Starscream. He's given the most to do out of everyone. It was actually really great seeing his backstabbing nature screw over the cons more than anything else.
Beast Wars Second was designed to be a filler line. Takara only made four new molds for the toyline (Lio Convoy, Galvatron, Moon, and the Tako Tank), while the rest were all recycled from preexisting lines. And since Takara wanted only the good guys to have organic beast modes, they needed to pull from G1, G2, and Machine Wars to have molds with mechanical altmodes for the bad guys, to go with the aforementioned "Beasts vs. Machines" theme of the line.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Odder still are the inclusion of ancient molds here. Why are the G2 mold here as main bad guys? What is with the Seacons being here? Tripticon!? I get that Japan didn't get some of these molds before, but geez. It really fights against the entire brand refresh when the main bad guys are all G1-2 holdovers. They really are more Decepticons than Predacons (and the faction names do not change here either).
This is another reason both Second and Neo were placed after Beast Machines instead of before it. The Japanese dub of Beast Wars kept all references to the Maximals and Predacons being at peace with each other that were given in the original English version, so with the two being in direct conflict with each other in Second and Neo, those two shows had to be moved away from that peacetime to a different, post-peace, renewed wartime era.Gauntlet101010 wrote:And, while Beast Wars had this whole post-G1 narrative about peace between Autobot and Decepticon where Maximals rules, BWII has none of that. It feels like the whole war never ended and this is just the latest chapter.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Got it. But I think the decision to name him "Galvatron" was based more on something much simpler: the fact that the name "Megatron" had already been reused for the main villain of BW, and they needed another name for BWII's villain, so they just took the name of the next G1 leader after Megatron (even though, yes, those two were the same guy).Gauntlet101010 wrote:Now, for the record, I do know BWII Galvy is not the same guy as G1 Galvy. When I'm talking about his evolution I'm talking about the meta. To see how the Galvatron character was looked at and updated by the writers, not how the G1 character evolved into the BWII character. As I'm doing these writeups I'll probably use language like that - how a character evolves - but I mean that strictly in terms of how it evolves in terms of how he's depicted or reinterpreted.
Yeah, it really illustrates the different mindsets that were had about Transformers between Hasbro and Takara at the time. On Hasbro's side, G2 was such a failure that they basically let Kenner go wild with completely reinventing the brand into something wholly new and different from what all had come before. Whereas Takara just treated BW as simply the next iteration of the same brand that Transformers had always been.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Some of these points are already known to me, but others aren't so much. Ok, I can see how BWII is "beasts VS machines" ... although, IMO, it still feels out of place. BW reinvents so much and the response - even out of a filler line - is to go right back to some old molds. I feel like I could understand it more if they had, at least, used more mechanical beasts like the Dinobots or the inner robots for the Beast Pretenders.
Yeah, for that, I got nothing.Gauntlet101010 wrote:And the cyborgs ... like, they don't make sense. How does the plane become a cyborg wolf that flies? You know? It seems random in a bad way. It seems like the more natural evolution would have been a wolf character that was remade.
As it turns out, the Japanese did get an official release of the original English version of Beast Wars. When the show was released on DVD in Japan, the English version was included as a second audio track, complete with Japanese subtitles included for the English version. So the Japanese got both their version and our version officially in dual-audio. And the same thing later happened again for the Japanese DVD release of Beast Machines (Beast Wars Returns).Gauntlet101010 wrote:I really wonder how Japanese fans would feel if they encounter a faithful translation of BW and Prime. Do you know if there's a blog or a reddit post or something? I searched, but couldn't find any. During all of this I did hear it was made into a self-parody. Which must work for them! I mean it's still going on strong over there. And BW led right into the Japan-led UT. But I can't really imagine getting as drawn into TFs if they were all so kiddified as what I've heard BW was. It's one reason I just couldn't get into RiD or the UT back in the day.
Good luck. Neo was a slog for me to get through on my first watch, up until the final arc that was like a much-needed shot in the arm.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Anyway, I'm into Beast Wars Neo. So far so good right now! I've heard it was better than II and the rumors were true.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Then again, I thought Victory was boring in its first half, and you seemed to enjoy it just fine. Likewise, you liked BWII a lot, and that one took me a bit to get into as well, since its first half was divided into mini-arcs that advertised different character groups, but which didn't move the plot forward in any way until Lio Junior showed up. So, who knows? You might enjoy Neo in ways that I didn't.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Oh no! That doesn't bode well. Well, I have a pretty high tolerance for nonsense, so I hope I like it well enough.
Yeah, it's mostly the toy bios that insinuated that they were the same guys as their G1 namesakes. Like I said, the Japanese dub of BW Season 1 remained ambiguous on that matter, and that ambiguity saved them when it came time to finally dub Seasons 2-3 and reveal the G1 Optimus and Megatron sleeping aboard the Ark as separate characters.Gauntlet101010 wrote:I didn't know that Japan thought that OP and Megs were the same as their G1 counterparts, even in the show. I guess the toy bios must have really confused them .... or they didn't care too much. That explains their attitude towards Primal in BWII's movie.
From what I've heard, Japanese kids who grew up with the BW dub LOVED it and thought it was hilarious. When the later War For Cybertron Trilogy cartoon was released on Netflix, the Japanese dub of that show actually brought back the original Japanese voices of Primal and Megatron, Takehito Koyasu and Shigeru Chiba, respectively. And Japanese kids who grew up with the Japanese dub of Beast Wars were actually saddened that Primal and Megatron didn't adlib and make jokey dialogue like they did in the BW dub.Gauntlet101010 wrote:On the DVDs having English tracks - It's good they get to experience these shows as they were meant to be experienced. While dubbing can produce some interesting results I feel like it can be taken WAY too far. But that still leaves me wondering what the Japanese fans think of the original if they grew up with the dubbed version.
To be fair, the DiC dub music was pretty good, if also very repetitive. But Crystal's music is completely unlike the original anime's Japanese music, so it's not really a fair comparison.Gauntlet101010 wrote:I can only compare it with my experience with Sailor Moon - when you find out how much was censored it makes you really curious to watch the original. However my wife actually prefers the original dub (!!!) because she's so attached to the music (although we only watched Crystal, not the original anime).
Out of just The Headmasters, Masterforce, Victory, Second, Neo, and Car Robots... Masterforce and Car Robots are my favorites.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Of the Japanese-only TF shows what would your ranking be? It seems like they've only gotten better to me. Except Zone, but that one's an anomaly.
Yeah, Masterforce really wanted to lean into the theme of "Man, Gods, and Devils", using as many of the 1988 animalistic Decepticon toys as possible as more like demons instead of persons, to make them feel more inhuman and otherworldly, as if they were literal monsters from Hell. Their master's even a self-styled "Destron god" named "Devil Z", giving him a kind of Satan-esque vibe.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Masterforce has some good ideas, but it fails to capitalize on them. I understood that the Seacons were meant to be their mindless drones, and it makes sense that they're "Putties", but they never even transform on their own. And, even if they're treated better in Neo, the same is true there too. Kinda weird, TBH. And the Firecons are the same. They don't have that many villains, so it seems wasteful to just toss them in as disposable trash baddies. Even if I know that they're meant to be foot soldiers I still think their overall treatment was a mistake. I would have liked it more if Turtler were put on a more even footing on his own - could transform and hold his own - before merging with his team. I just feel the whole thing could have been done better even while keeping the footsoldier / drone concept.
To be fair, Clouder did get the Autobot Base completely blown up by the Decepticons in his first appearance. That's no small feat.Gauntlet101010 wrote:And you have Doubledealer, a potentially interesting character who is just utterly wasted. All the potential of a spy, or even a double agent, just gone in his first appearance. Even Punch got to milk his spy potential more.
Chōkon Power was pretty magical, and both the Godmasters and Devil Z kept using that all the way up to the end of the series.Gauntlet101010 wrote:And then you have the early magical influence that just disappears. It was odd, don't get me wrong. But it could have been the Decepticon Pretender's thing in the show itself.
Still could have used more insert song variety than just playing the same theme song over and over again during every episode.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Ironically that's why I liked Victory more. Less story overall ... less story to get wrong! Fewer characters overall ... fewer characters to get wrong! The simple tone helps narrow down the focus to what the show's actually good at rather than aiming high and missing because they haven't thought things through.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Interestingly, the nature of Chokon Power was later explored a little more in the Legends manga, wherein it was revealed that Tenchokon (the power of the heavens) is actually Zodiac, and Chichokon (the power of the Earth) is actually... well, Angolmois Energy, as per its original depiction in BWII as the divine life energy of Planet Gaia. But... *sigh* that complicates some things that will later be brought up in Beast Wars Neo, but I'll let you get through that series first before I say anything more on the matter (again, I don't wanna spoil anything for ya).Gauntlet101010 wrote:Chōkon Power is more like Ki from Dragonball than magic which can animate the dead or do any number of other things. If it's counted as a form of magic we can chalk it up there with the series just not being inventive enough. I mean there's so much you can do if you open that door. But they open the door with summoning an army of the dead and, I guess, a literal devil and then it just is this energy power they use to power up. And that's it.
There was one thing that both Masterforce and Victory did go into a bit on the disadvantage of Godmasters becoming fully robotic and losing their human element. When Devil Z made Hydra and Buster full robotic, and when the other Godmaster transtectors all became living robots no longer bonded to humans, they all lost their ability to tap into and utilize Jinchokon. When in the case of least Hydra and Buster their Jinchokon was replaced by Devil Z's own Devil Power, God Ginrai's loss of Jinchokon is what contributed to his fatal defeat by Deathsaurus that led to his being rebuilt into Victory Leo. Without the human aspect, Godmasters are made one-third weaker.Gauntlet101010 wrote:I mean if Devil Z can turn humans into robots what if the Pretenders actually wanted to be real humans? What if the Decepticons of this series lost what made them robots and became true demons - where would that leave them? But the series doesn't broach these questions. And I feel frustrated because even Seaspray did become human for one episode. It's a question a less serialised series probably would have asked. But even at the end they all just peace out. And Ginrai (the human) doesn't even cameo in Victoy to say goodbye to Ginrai (the robot). So I feel frustrated. There are storytelling opportunities they just let slip through their fingers.
Tripledacus (pronounced like "Triple Ducks").Gauntlet101010 wrote:For me, what can win me over a somewhat flawed story are character moments. That's why I can appreciate BWII even though Lio Convoy could have probably organized a strike force to beat up the Decepticons after Tripredacus joined the group.
Hehe, he's basically like "What if the Ninja Turtles had no other expressions besides the ones of their toys?"Gauntlet101010 wrote:Galvatron looks so weird with some other expression on his face after seeing him with a perpertual growl. Better! But weird.
Yeah, finding out that it also happened to that show frustrated me upon first learning about it.Gauntlet101010 wrote:I guess I can understand missing the comedy of JBW if that's what sucked you in as a kid. I didn't know that J X-Men was also redubbed as a comedy. I woulda hated that as that was my intro to the X-Men in general, lol!
That's another thing. Japanese G1 Galvatron was basically voiced exactly the same as Japanese G1 Megatron. Unlike how Welker switched up his voice in the English version to a higher pitched maniacal one, Kato didn't change his voice at all. So Galvatron's insanity was less pronounced in the Japanese version, coming across as just an increased temper than not.Gauntlet101010 wrote:I didn't consider the personality switch from J G1 Mega to J BW Megs. Leftover Galvatron mania maybe? He got blown up as Something Megatron after merging with Dark Nova or something. Can't have been good for the poor guy.
Of the Transformers shows? Well, each dub is in a different continuity. The Japanese dub of Beast Wars and Beast Machines (goofy rewrites and all) are part of the larger Japanese G1 cartoon continuity, but not the English versions.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Does this mean the English versions of these properties are the canon ones?
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
But he's not a cool character, he's a racist silly character.Gauntlet101010 wrote:I know it's TriPledacus, but I'm calling him TriPredacus because it sounds way cooler. Don't care if I'm wrong!![]()
You'll see.Gauntlet101010 wrote:It's cool that they expanded on their Ki energy idea a bit more in Legends, even if it's rather late in the game and definitely a retcon. Chichokon being Angolmois energy which is the power of the Earth makes sense I guess. You know they never put that back after the end of II. Guess EarthGaia is ****.
RobotMasters's primarily fiction was the online manga and catalog manga. Its two-episode OVAs were like brief advertisements for the main fiction, hyper-abridged adaptations of only some of the manga's events.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Maybe I ought to make a brief stop be Robot Masters before checking out the UT. It's a little out of viewing order, but their depiction of BW Megatron has to line up more with J BW Megatron and I'm not gonna dive into watching that whole show just to experience that (if I can even find it online).
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Sabrblade wrote:Good luck. Neo was a slog for me to get through on my first watch, up until the final arc that was like a much-needed shot in the arm.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Anyway, I'm into Beast Wars Neo. So far so good right now! I've heard it was better than II and the rumors were true.
Yes. And it came and went a whopping three whole years before Armada ever began in Japan. There's no real relation there. It's the Beast Era's epilogue.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Car Robots is sort of midway between Beast and the return of vehicles. I mean ... the main bad guys are the Predacons, so. Kinda counts?
Archadis was the standout one for me, simply because he was the only competent Predacon among Magmatron's minions, being the smartest and most charismatic one of them all. I kept hearing Tony Todd or Blu Mankuma voice coming out of his mouth every time he was onscreen. Compared to his bumbling comrades, he was a breath of fresh air.Gauntlet101010 wrote:But in some ways it's worse. I don't think there's any real standouts in terms of characters. And that's where TF shows shine.
Twice, even. Both in the Encore line. The first was a show-accurate redeco of the original, meant to act as a stand-in MP to go with the MPs of Optimus Primal and Lio Convoy (both of which were scaled to match the height of the original Big Convoy mold in robot mode), and the second release was a toy-accurate version but with a new Matrix Buster accessory cannon and a retooled Energon Matrix that could fold up and fit inside the new weapon. The latter also included a new NAVI accessory.Gauntlet101010 wrote:I think they even re-released Big Convoy at the time, right?
Huh? Get along? Maybe by the end, but in the first half, Break and Colada were always being jerks, no one would listen to Longrack, and Stampy was getting bullied for his cowardice. These guys were all a bunch of misfits.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Mach Kick is also a breath of fresh air bringing a much needed note of discord in the Maximal camp. Everyone just gets along too much! But he shows up and rocks the boat. At least for a few episodes.
He did at least get his whole revenge plot with the Blentrons since he loathed and despised Unicron more than anything else (for destroying the homeworld of his ancestors) and was even willing to sacrifice his own minions to stop the Blentrons and prevent Unicron's return.Gauntlet101010 wrote:Magmatron was disappointing. We never get a good fight between him and Big Convoy. He's just another armchair general. Ironically he seems the same personality-wise as BW Galvatron, except he's given even less to do! I kinda understand where the writers were coming from - not wanting to ruin his mystique, but they really just wasted him.
The whole deal with that is this: Unicron was revived in an energy body that he can shapeshift into whatever form he wants. He initially chose to appear as Galvatron into order to catch Magmatron off guard and make him think he was Galvatron instead of Unicron. But then Unicron let slip his true identity and dropped the ruse right before he sent Magmatron into that portal (of doom!).Gauntlet101010 wrote:And now. Galvatron. The return of the king. Or not?
I have to admit, the show itself makes it unclear. At first they talk about Galvatron disappearing. And then insinuate Unicron has inhabited his body. Gotcha. He did get drunk off Anglomois energy after all. Buuuuuuut then they said Unicron's Galvatron body was made up of energy. So I guess it's a copy.
The red glow right after he said "Commendable indeed, Lio Convoy...", that was Galvatron exploding along with Nemesis. This is Unicron impersonating Galvatron's likeness.Gauntlet101010 wrote:So what happened to Galvatron at the end of II!? He doesn't seem to show up at the end credits, unless I missed him. The wiki said he died, but I looked at the last episode of II just now and he shouts "I'm still here!" at the very end. Or maybe that wasn't him? Or maybe he died immediately after that? I dunno; whatever.
It's eventually clarified by Guildart that Dinosaur isn't these particular Predacons' homeworld, but that of their ancestors. So it would have been a Decepticon colony planet like Chaar.Gauntlet101010 wrote:The Predacons having a homeworld called Dinosaur works for this show only. Maybe the original Beast Wars if you forget the opening where they choose new forms based on local wildlife and fossils. But not II, the show this immediately follows. Not G1 either.
At least they showed up for the end credits of the finale, helping to rebuild Cybertron.Gauntlet101010 wrote:I would have liked to see the cast of II return in an episode rather than in cutscenes as well. Maybe with Gigastorm mistaking Unicron for Galvatron. A passing of the torch episode. Or something. Instead I feel like their hamfisting Unicron into the show wasn't well researched. I mean, it's a fine idea. But ... how?
Oh, it's a little more complicated than that. While Rodimus did find a new world, that world was Planet Micro, the home of the Micromasters in Victory, which later got upgraded and renamed Planet Zone by the time of Zone.Gauntlet101010 wrote:I guess Seibertron and Vector Sigma got better after Scorpinok blew it up? I think the wiki says Rodimus found a new planet for them to colonize. That's convenient. The writers should have never blown it up in the first place.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Cuz he had a new Unite Warriors toy at the time, too.Gauntlet101010 wrote:- While I'm glad they decided to clear up the rebuilding of Cybertron it's a retcon coming decades later - I still hold it against the show. I maintain that it being blown up in Headmasters was an unnessasary excess. And shouldn't Ironhide be long dead, why is he in that panel?
I guess it was eaten before Unicron's destruction in TFTM. Maybe its destruction was originally a mystery to Megatron until after Unicron made his appearance in 2005, and then further investigation into the matter now with knowledge of Unicron in mind made the Decepticons realize that he was one responsible.Gauntlet101010 wrote:- But even if they came from a particular colony world, when was it eaten by Unicron? Nobody heard of him in TFTM, so when was it established and when was it eaten and why did no Cybertronian act like they knew of Unicron in TFTM?
It's a good thing Hasbro actually made the Legacy one. It's the only toy of Copy Convoy to actually use his original cartoon deco (black mane, gray further) instead of the inverted deco used by all of his Takara toys (silver mane, black fur).Gauntlet101010 wrote:I did decide I wanted Black Lio Convoy after watching II, though, to go with him.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Return to Transformers Cartoons and Comics Forum
Registered users: Bing [Bot], Emerje, Google [Bot], Google Adsense [Bot], Google Feedfetcher, Majestic-12 [Bot], MSN [Bot], MSNbot Media, Yahoo [Bot]