Burn wrote:robofreak doesn't joke. He's all about the serious business of the internet.
ItIsHim wrote:My closet is filled to the brim with plastic children's toys. For myself
robofreak wrote:Well, the story gets rebooted all the time. Quintessons went from being the originators, to Primus. Now we have another continuity.
At this point, the G1 story arc is so mixed and muddled, that I've chosen to piecemeal my own version of the G1 story arc together.
Don't think of it as ruined, but as stuff you had not thought of.
burning_sirius wrote:For one I was always under the impression that Liege Maximo was the originator of the Decepticons. Now, they have the Fallen as the 'creator or originator' of the Decepticons.
Predaprince wrote:I am very thankful to have posters like sto_vo_kor_2000 who is so energetic about improving others' understanding and enjoyment of the TF universe
Stormrider wrote:You often add interesting insights to conversations that makes the fledglings think and challenges even the sharpest minds
T-Macksimus wrote:I consider you and editor to be amongst the most "scholarly" in terms of your knowledge, demeanor and general approach
burning_sirius wrote:For one I was always under the impression that Liege Maximo was the originator of the Decepticons. Now, they have the Fallen as the 'creator or originator' of the Decepticons.
Wigglez wrote:Just remember. The sword is an extension of your arm. Use it as if you're going to karate chop someone with your really long sharp ass hand.
Janus Prime wrote:Well, I think we´ll always have our personal canon, the things each of us choose as the "real story". Yes, it´s annoying when you don´t like the current continuity, but nothing really stops you from creating your own.
Wigglez wrote:Just remember. The sword is an extension of your arm. Use it as if you're going to karate chop someone with your really long sharp ass hand.
Shadowman wrote:I never had a personal canon, and I never really saw the need for one. The real story is whatever official sources cite is the real story.
In the Marvel comics, yes. Not anywhere else.burning_sirius wrote:For one I was always under the impression that Liege Maximo was the originator of the Decepticons.
In just the movies, yes.burning_sirius wrote:Now, they have the Fallen as the 'creator or originator' of the Decepticons.
What has The Fallen to do with Marvel G1?burning_sirius wrote:I always thought that the Fallen hijacked the legitimate Decepticon movement. According to Grimlock at the end of the G1 Marvel run, Primus used the Decepticons and Autobots as a form of competition so that this conflict would bring out the best in the Transformer race.
Ermm... personal canons and fanons can get pretty nasty sometimes when collided with canon.robofreak wrote:At this point, the G1 story arc is so mixed and muddled, that I've chosen to piecemeal my own version of the G1 story arc together.
There has yet to be a solid retcon of Primus ever existing in the English-language G1 cartoon (the Japanese have and the Beast Era fiction has, but those aren't exactly the same thing as the English-language G1 cartoon).burning_sirius wrote:Possibly, though the Quintesson and Primus origins were explained nearly at the same time period.
Episode 24 of Prime showed most of the Thirteen on screen. One of them was possibly the Liege Maximo.burning_sirius wrote:I am just disappointed that Maximo does not get any screen time.
That movie left a distaste in my mouth, period!burning_sirius wrote:Though Furman created both Maximo and the Fallen, Revenge of the Fallen really left a distaste about the Fallen in my mouth.
Toy-wise. The fiction (to my knowledge) never made a connection between the and Soundwave's face. And for The Fallen's face being the source of the , again, that's just the movies. Even though his Aligned design was described as having a face shaped like the , it hasn't been shown to have had any such significance in the aligned fiction yet.burning_sirius wrote:The whole face of the Fallen = Decepticon symbol is funny since the Decepticon symbol is based on Soundwave's face.
Because The Fallen promised Megatron he'd make Megs a Prime and so Megatron started the Decepticon faction. Plus, it was the name of The Fallen's original resistance army against the other Primes that included the original Seekers and Constructicons. Megatron simply recycled the term. But again, this is only in the movies.burning_sirius wrote:Maximo is legit evil who, from what I can tell, would ally with Primus to defeat Unicron. He is the true constant of evil. The Fallen is the traitor. Why would the Decepticons love Cyberton and be pro-Cyberton if they were a faction descended from the Fallen?
Not much, true. But enough to get the gist of him.sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Liege Maximo only had 2 official appearances and neither revealed much about him.
But didn't the Military Hardware bots who predated Megatron use the term "Decepticon" during the Second Cybertronian War in the cartoon?Shadowman wrote:In G1 cartoon, it started because the Military Goods wanted to pick a fight with the Consumer Goods, eventually becoming the Decepticons and Autobots. In The G2 comics they revealed that it may have been because of Liege Maximo, and then the G2 comics ended. In pretty much every other continuity, especially Aligned, the war and the Decepticons started because Megatron really wanted power.
I mostly agree. Though I have thought of some fan stories that I've tried to work into canon stories without contradicting them (with not much success, that is), and have come up with some fan theories to explain some of the continuity errors of some official canons. And, I kinda liek to think of The One as God.Shadowman wrote:Janus Prime wrote:Well, I think we´ll always have our personal canon, the things each of us choose as the "real story". Yes, it´s annoying when you don´t like the current continuity, but nothing really stops you from creating your own.
I never had a personal canon, and I never really saw the need for one. The real story is whatever official sources cite is the real story.
Official canon will and does disagree with you.Rodimus Prime wrote:As far as I'm concerned, the G1 comics is the real story. Everything else works around it. This is because it was my first introduction to Transformers and because the writing is very good, especially when Furman took over, as opposed to the cartoon, or even later comics from IDW. WFC and War Within can also be put in front of the G1 comics, it works well enough. Yeah, I know it's not "official" but it's as close to original as it gets. Other stuff, like Prime and Bayverse are extras. I know Prime is working on being hooked up with WFC, and that's fine. We'll see how it continues and what the story is for Fall of Cybertron.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Silverwing wrote:Also, I feel compelled to give the obligatory:
One for each year of the Movieverse's decade strong tenure. Here's to a few more explosive years!
In the movies, but nowhere else.TulioDude wrote:Think on The Fallen,not as the originator of the Decepticons,but as Megatron mentor.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Sabrblade wrote:Official canon will and does disagree with you.Rodimus Prime wrote:As far as I'm concerned, the G1 comics is the real story. Everything else works around it. This is because it was my first introduction to Transformers and because the writing is very good, especially when Furman took over, as opposed to the cartoon, or even later comics from IDW. WFC and War Within can also be put in front of the G1 comics, it works well enough. Yeah, I know it's not "official" but it's as close to original as it gets. Other stuff, like Prime and Bayverse are extras. I know Prime is working on being hooked up with WFC, and that's fine. We'll see how it continues and what the story is for Fall of Cybertron.
Regardless, canon can, will, and does always trump fanon in the long run.Rodimus Prime wrote:Sabrblade wrote:Official canon will and does disagree with you.Rodimus Prime wrote:As far as I'm concerned, the G1 comics is the real story. Everything else works around it. This is because it was my first introduction to Transformers and because the writing is very good, especially when Furman took over, as opposed to the cartoon, or even later comics from IDW. WFC and War Within can also be put in front of the G1 comics, it works well enough. Yeah, I know it's not "official" but it's as close to original as it gets. Other stuff, like Prime and Bayverse are extras. I know Prime is working on being hooked up with WFC, and that's fine. We'll see how it continues and what the story is for Fall of Cybertron.
Official canon can do that. I still like my version better. But it's just for me, the way I view the TF Universe. Official canon cannot and will not change that. Now, if I was an "authority" on the matter, I would definitely change it.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Sabrblade wrote:Regardless, canon can, will, and does always trump fanon in the long run.
Predaprince wrote:I am very thankful to have posters like sto_vo_kor_2000 who is so energetic about improving others' understanding and enjoyment of the TF universe
Stormrider wrote:You often add interesting insights to conversations that makes the fledglings think and challenges even the sharpest minds
T-Macksimus wrote:I consider you and editor to be amongst the most "scholarly" in terms of your knowledge, demeanor and general approach
In terms of precedence and canonicity.sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Sabrblade wrote:Regardless, canon can, will, and does always trump fanon in the long run.
Isint that really a matter of personal opinion
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Sabrblade wrote:In terms of precedence and canonicity.sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Sabrblade wrote:Regardless, canon can, will, and does always trump fanon in the long run.
Isint that really a matter of personal opinion
Predaprince wrote:I am very thankful to have posters like sto_vo_kor_2000 who is so energetic about improving others' understanding and enjoyment of the TF universe
Stormrider wrote:You often add interesting insights to conversations that makes the fledglings think and challenges even the sharpest minds
T-Macksimus wrote:I consider you and editor to be amongst the most "scholarly" in terms of your knowledge, demeanor and general approach
I'm saying that something official matters more to canon than something fanmade.sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Sabrblade wrote:In terms of precedence and canonicity.sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Sabrblade wrote:Regardless, canon can, will, and does always trump fanon in the long run.
Isint that really a matter of personal opinion
well, its always a measuring game isint it???.Whats important to 1 person may not be to the next.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Sabrblade wrote:I'm saying that something official matters more to canon than something fanmade.sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Sabrblade wrote:In terms of precedence and canonicity.sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Sabrblade wrote:Regardless, canon can, will, and does always trump fanon in the long run.
Isint that really a matter of personal opinion
well, its always a measuring game isint it???.Whats important to 1 person may not be to the next.
Predaprince wrote:I am very thankful to have posters like sto_vo_kor_2000 who is so energetic about improving others' understanding and enjoyment of the TF universe
Stormrider wrote:You often add interesting insights to conversations that makes the fledglings think and challenges even the sharpest minds
T-Macksimus wrote:I consider you and editor to be amongst the most "scholarly" in terms of your knowledge, demeanor and general approach
Sabrblade wrote:Regardless, canon can, will, and does always trump fanon in the long run.Rodimus Prime wrote:Sabrblade wrote:Official canon will and does disagree with you.Rodimus Prime wrote:As far as I'm concerned, the G1 comics is the real story. Everything else works around it. This is because it was my first introduction to Transformers and because the writing is very good, especially when Furman took over, as opposed to the cartoon, or even later comics from IDW. WFC and War Within can also be put in front of the G1 comics, it works well enough. Yeah, I know it's not "official" but it's as close to original as it gets. Other stuff, like Prime and Bayverse are extras. I know Prime is working on being hooked up with WFC, and that's fine. We'll see how it continues and what the story is for Fall of Cybertron.
Official canon can do that. I still like my version better. But it's just for me, the way I view the TF Universe. Official canon cannot and will not change that. Now, if I was an "authority" on the matter, I would definitely change it.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Sabrblade wrote:Okay, here's what I'm trying to get across. If it's not something that was released under the license of Hasbro and/or Takara, then it's not canon. If it's not canon, then it doesn't effect the canonicity of the official Transformers fiction. Fanfics are not canon. Fan theories are not canon. Unless something is officialized by Hasbro, Takara, or an official person/persons working under the license of at least one of the two, then it is not part of the Transformers canon. And what isn't part of the TF canon holds a lower regard below what is canon, in reference to the overall TF canon.
In reality, there is no main transformers canon, since there are numerous TF canons that mostly all hold the same regard as each other without one dominating over the other (notice that I used the word "mostly", as there very well may be some canons that do take precedence over other canons).
Predaprince wrote:I am very thankful to have posters like sto_vo_kor_2000 who is so energetic about improving others' understanding and enjoyment of the TF universe
Stormrider wrote:You often add interesting insights to conversations that makes the fledglings think and challenges even the sharpest minds
T-Macksimus wrote:I consider you and editor to be amongst the most "scholarly" in terms of your knowledge, demeanor and general approach
The bottomline is, fanon is not canon (until made official), and that's what matters.sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Sabrblade wrote:Okay, here's what I'm trying to get across. If it's not something that was released under the license of Hasbro and/or Takara, then it's not canon. If it's not canon, then it doesn't effect the canonicity of the official Transformers fiction. Fanfics are not canon. Fan theories are not canon. Unless something is officialized by Hasbro, Takara, or an official person/persons working under the license of at least one of the two, then it is not part of the Transformers canon. And what isn't part of the TF canon holds a lower regard below what is canon, in reference to the overall TF canon.
...and what I'm trying to get across to you is that ,canon, may not matter 1 bit to some people.Some things and maybe everything released under the license of Hasbro and/or Takara may amount to "squat" in the view of some people.
What canon is worth is a matter of personal taste.
For you,and I, canon trumps everything.For others, it anint word didly.
Yeah, the terms are often used interchangeably, but couldn't one see each individual continuity as an individual canon?sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:In reality, there is no main transformers canon, since there are numerous TF canons that mostly all hold the same regard as each other without one dominating over the other (notice that I used the word "mostly", as there very well may be some canons that do take precedence over other canons).
actually thats not correct.The problem here is that many mis-use the word Canon as if it can be used as the word CONTINUITY.
There are NOT numerous TF canons, there are numerous TF "CONTINUITIES", but they are all EQUALLY canon.
Continuity referes to a continuum of events
Canon refers to a body of works sanction and/or authorized
So, everything from Hasbro/Takara is canon, but not everything is in the same continuity
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Its no problemSabrblade wrote:And this is a problem
The bottomline is, fanon is not canon (until made official), and that's what matters.
]Yeah, the terms are often used interchangeably, but couldn't one see each individual continuity as an individual canon?
Predaprince wrote:I am very thankful to have posters like sto_vo_kor_2000 who is so energetic about improving others' understanding and enjoyment of the TF universe
Stormrider wrote:You often add interesting insights to conversations that makes the fledglings think and challenges even the sharpest minds
T-Macksimus wrote:I consider you and editor to be amongst the most "scholarly" in terms of your knowledge, demeanor and general approach
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