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Insurgent wrote:Precisly why they should have used ships, instead of dropping out of the sky and landing on their heads. The energy alone needed to travel that distance would put strain on their systems.


And why would they all have 'rock mode' on Cybertron? What kind of transformer species are they when they turn into flying rocks? What kind of war could they fight when they turn into rocks?

Grrr, I hate protoforms. Except for BW protoforms. They went about it the right way.

I dont think that the rock form is their true Cybertroinen altf form.I think that the rock looking form is just for space travel.

Briggs wrote:
Megatron is part God, so who knows what he's actually made out of that allows for long range interstellar flight.

And you heard this where???????I'm not looking to start anything...its just that I've never heard this from any offical source.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Briggs wrote:
Megatron is part God, so who knows what he's actually made out of that allows for long range interstellar flight.

And you heard this where???????I'm not looking to start anything...its just that I've never heard this from any offical source.

Me neither, sounds like balls to me.

Yours AK

i don't know if this has been said or not:

how about the barricade/bumblebee fight starting in the morning, and ending at night in about 5 minutes time?

Bumblebee-otch wrote:i don't know if this has been said or not:

how about the barricade/bumblebee fight starting in the morning, and ending at night in about 5 minutes time?

You mean the chase right????the way I see it the chase could have taken all day and all we saw was 5 minutes.

Bumblebee-otch wrote:i don't know if this has been said or not:

how about the barricade/bumblebee fight starting in the morning, and ending at night in about 5 minutes time?

I just figured it was late afternoon when Satan's Camaro started the chase, and it had just gone dark when the fight got it on properly. Why would Mikaela be sitting at a Burger King with her friends on a morning when they had to scuttle off to school in the morning.

I dont think that the rock form is their true Cybertroinen altf form.I think that the rock looking form is just for space travel.

This makes sense. Which then means they have one of these things hanging around for them to scan everytime they want to leave the planet. And also features the 'scan and change' style, which I also don't like in tf's. But that's just personal prefereance. I have never liked the idea that they can change their alt modes at will.

Insurgent wrote:

I dont think that the rock form is their true Cybertroinen altf form.I think that the rock looking form is just for space travel.

This makes sense. Which then means they have one of these things hanging around for them to scan everytime they want to leave the planet. And also features the 'scan and change' style, which I also don't like in tf's. But that's just personal prefereance. I have never liked the idea that they can change their alt modes at will.

Not nesessarly.........they could retain the spec of the space modes in their memory banks.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Insurgent wrote:

I dont think that the rock form is their true Cybertroinen altf form.I think that the rock looking form is just for space travel.

This makes sense. Which then means they have one of these things hanging around for them to scan everytime they want to leave the planet. And also features the 'scan and change' style, which I also don't like in tf's. But that's just personal prefereance. I have never liked the idea that they can change their alt modes at will.

Not nesessarly.........they could retain the spec of the space modes in their memory banks.

True. And most likely.

I agree, this coldness of space vs. liquid nitrogen is quite a puzzler. May I ask, though, as I'm no Dr. Scientist, why don't our Earth shuttles or astronaut suits freeze in space? Is it that they're still close to the sun? Do they generate their own heat?

Leonardo wrote:I agree, this coldness of space vs. liquid nitrogen is quite a puzzler. May I ask, though, as I'm no Dr. Scientist, why don't our Earth shuttles or astronaut suits freeze in space? Is it that they're still close to the sun? Do they generate their own heat?

The difference is, our spacesuits are a fabric that cover us. I think they have a small heat generator in them to stop us freezing, but I could be wrong on that, whereas the tf's are travelling in their own skin. It would be like us spacewalking butt naked. We would freeze instantly without our suits. The tf's should be unable to travel through space unaided (unless they have a spaceship alt mode like Cosmos) and in that case, be impervious to freezing or they need ships and they would freeze.

Unless the tf's developed some kind of shell around them that protected them from direct exposure to the outside vacuum, much like our shuttles protect us. But this clearly wasn't the case in the movie.

Insurgent wrote:

Leonardo wrote:I agree, this coldness of space vs. liquid nitrogen is quite a puzzler. May I ask, though, as I'm no Dr. Scientist, why don't our Earth shuttles or astronaut suits freeze in space? Is it that they're still close to the sun? Do they generate their own heat?

The difference is, our spacesuits are a fabric that cover us. I think they have a small heat generator in them to stop us freezing, but I could be wrong on that, whereas the tf's are travelling in their own skin. It would be like us spacewalking butt naked. We would freeze instantly without our suits. The tf's should be unable to travel through space unaided (unless they have a spaceship alt mode like Cosmos) and in that case, be impervious to freezing or they need ships and they would freeze.

Unless the tf's developed some kind of shell around them that protected them from direct exposure to the outside vacuum, much like our shuttles protect us. But this clearly wasn't the case in the movie.

True, but the reason we have spacesuits is because we can't generate enough heat ourselves to stop the coldness of space from freezing us. That's why they have heat generators (if, as you say, they do - I myself have no clue). Presumably the same can be said for our space shuttles. I'm just thinking that if the Transformers have built-in heat generators like our technology, it might prevent them from freezing. I'd imagine that, even without specific heat generators, the Transformers probably generate more heat than our space suits. Of course, I'm only imagining. I've got no idea how our space-tech works.

I'm not sure if the space suits do or not, or if they are simply insulated, but they need some protection.

But if something can operate in space, then surely it can operate in subzero temperatures.

I wonder if anyone has measured how cold space actually is.

They say its around 3Kelvin or was that .3Kelvin, but the explanation goes, that even though there is not heat, there is still thermal energy from radiation, so its not quite absolute cold.

Just like how a dog or bear can be outside in the winter because of their natural coats and be fine I think of the transformers in the same way. Its that same shell from the entry mode they disguise as their alt mode which is thermally insulated protect them from the elements and they are generating heat internally ... so I still don't understand how bumblee was frozen, and if he had a force field like Blackout did, then it makes even less sense that he was

Real Gear Question

They are all armed and dangerous when they are created.
I comprehend the dangerous; I just have a difficult time with the armed.

In BW Protoforms aren't armed.
In G1 armament and transformation only is developed as a political necessity. Original TF weren't armed nor could they transform.

However if all Bayformers are created (evil)armed they are in fact created for WAR. This would suggest the ALSPARK is actually an Instrument of WAR (A Weapon OF Mass Destruction)
Furthermore MEGATRON can be considered rational in sync with his destiny. He is racially aware whereas OPTIMUS PRIME should be viewed as a deluded Hippie.

Hail MEGATRON
DECEPTICONS 4 EVER

Insurgent wrote:But if something can operate in space, then surely it can operate in subzero temperatures.

I quite agree.

Insurgent wrote:I'm not sure if the space suits do or not, or if they are simply insulated, but they need some protection.

But if something can operate in space, then surely it can operate in subzero temperatures.

I wonder if anyone has measured how cold space actually is.

In Megatrons case it just wasnt the cold that was keeping him in check.Megs when from the bitter cold of space to a free fall entree into earths atmosphere witch rose his body tem very high........only to land and then crase trew an ice glacier into the who know how mant degrees below zero water.It was the rapid temp change that did him in.

If he's an Intergalactic space ship wouldn't those things be taken into account, after all he is a spaceship

syphonn wrote:If he's an Intergalactic space ship wouldn't those things be taken into account, after all he is a spaceship

In the pre-quil comic its showen that Megs had ran his Energon reserves to low to use his heat sheilds durring earth entree...........living his body to heat up way to fast and then to crash trew the artic floor into the blow zero water caused him to shut down because of the massive change of body temp.

Insurgent wrote:

Bumblebee-otch wrote:i don't know if this has been said or not:

how about the barricade/bumblebee fight starting in the morning, and ending at night in about 5 minutes time?

I just figured it was late afternoon when Satan's Camaro started the chase, and it had just gone dark when the fight got it on properly. Why would Mikaela be sitting at a Burger King with her friends on a morning when they had to scuttle off to school in the morning.

if they had school, then why did sam just wake up?

Bumblebee-otch wrote:

Insurgent wrote:

Bumblebee-otch wrote:i don't know if this has been said or not:

how about the barricade/bumblebee fight starting in the morning, and ending at night in about 5 minutes time?

I just figured it was late afternoon when Satan's Camaro started the chase, and it had just gone dark when the fight got it on properly. Why would Mikaela be sitting at a Burger King with her friends on a morning when they had to scuttle off to school in the morning.

if they had school, then why did sam just wake up?

Good point. Maybe he skipped school or had just taken a nap.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

syphonn wrote:If he's an Intergalactic space ship wouldn't those things be taken into account, after all he is a spaceship

In the pre-quil comic its showen that Megs had ran his Energon reserves to low to use his heat sheilds durring earth entree...........living his body to heat up way to fast and then to crash trew the artic floor into the blow zero water caused him to shut down because of the massive change of body temp.

That seems plausible. Given that they never delved into the workings of a Cybertronian it would be hard to disprove. The only thing is it relies on the prequel comic to explain it and not the film itself.

Concerning the freezing issue is it not entirely plausible that the protoform modes are specially configured to insulated the Transformer inside a bit like a space suit of a furry coat on a dog? However when transformed into robot mode the outer shell is broken and folded away to allow for maneuverability and the inner robot is exposed and therefore susceptible to the extremes in temperature? Otherwise why have a protoform mode at all? why not free fall to earth in robot mode, on close inspection the protoform modes were hardly a good disguise?

Yours AK

That goes back to a point I was making earlier, and why I have issues with the designs, not just from an aesthetic point of view but functionally. If the Entry mode does insulate/protect them because of that shell then why not have a robot mode that functions the same way, protect them rather than leaving everything exposed. I suppose if they get caught out in a blizzard for too long they will freeze over also?

syphonn wrote:That goes back to a point I was making earlier, and why I have issues with the designs, not just from an aesthetic point of view but functionally. If the Entry mode does insulate/protect them because of that shell then why not have a robot mode that functions the same way, protect them rather than leaving everything exposed. I suppose if they get caught out in a blizzard for too long they will freeze over also?

Unless transforming into alt-mode would protect them better? You would have thought that besides disguise and transportation they would have other uses for alt-modes, surely when at peace on Cybertron they would have had no need for disguise so why bother with alt-modes? Why not just fly in robot-mode or zip around on robot roller skates?

Yours AK

assuming that they were created without alt. modes and that they eventually developed them because of a need for better transportation, protection or firepower then yes I would agree that they do server an additional purpose besides disguise ... but when you look at some alt modes, like the mountain dew machine or the xbox, unless the allspark plates them with a layer of armor (alt. mode), I cant see that protecting them anymore than the robot mode will.