The Energon Pub

My turn to speak.

While I do admit that these two have indeed played an important role in TF history, I would think inducting these two so soon seems kinda hasty. I mean, I'd think that someone like Simon Furman (who's worked on TF material for nearly all 26+ years) or Frank Welker (who's voiced a large chunk of iconic G1 characters plus many recent ones) would have gotten in before these two. It's like, these are getting in so quickly for their recent efforts before some of those who have been with the franchise for a lot longer.

I'm not saying that these two shouldn't get in. Just that they should... wait their turn.

The following, IMHO, should be inducted before Bay/Spielberg (in no particular order, though):

• Frank Welker - voiced the majority of the G1 cast (including Megatron, Galvatron, and Soundwave)
• Simon Furman - penned probably more TF stories than anyone else, and created the Primus & Unicron god concept
• Bob Forward & Larry DiTillio - head writers of Beast Wars, which shaped all future fiction to come after it
• David Kaye - voiced more Megatrons than anyone else, as well as voicing an Optimus Prime (and a Grimlock), and more
• Flint Dille - one of the story editors for the G1 cartoon
• Susan Blu - voiced G1 Arcee and a few other G1 females, but more importantly, voice director for Beast Wars, Beast Machines, and Animated
• Nelson Shin - producer of the G1 cartoon and director of the G1 movie
• Wally Burr - voice director for the G1 cartoon
• Stan Bush - performer of iconic Transformers songs such as "The Touch"
• Scott McNeil - voiced numerous character roles in all of the Beast Era and all of the Unicron Trilogy
• Shōhei Kohara & Floro Dery - designed the original animation models of the many G1 characters (yes, I know about the infamy surrounding Dery's history in the fandom, but he still played an important role in the franchise's origin -- the dude designed Unicron and the Matrix!)
• Margaret Loesch - formers president and CEO of Marvel Productions during the time of the G1 cartoon, in which she served as a producer of it, and is currently the head of the Hub television network.

And, regarding the debate with Mkall, I gotta comment on one thing:

Mkall wrote:If you want to thank anyone for keeping Transformers alive it would be the Japanese who kept Transformers going for 15 years while the US just imported it and dubbed over top of it and re-used the toy molds.

That has only been done for one series thus far: RiD.

If you are referring to the Unicron Trilogy, those three series were not simply "Japanese creations that the U.S. imported and recycled the toy molds". The Unicron Trilogy (and I do mean ALL of it) was a joint venture between both Hasbro and TakaraTomy working together. Hasbro designed the toys while Takara created the molds. The cartoons' overall plots were conceived by Hasbro, while the Japanese were given the reigns in the execution of each show's specifics. Though, there were a few cases of miscommunication between the two parties, such as when Galaxy Force was made as a another reboot instead of another sequel like Hasbro had intended it to be. In fact, the U.S. got the Armada cartoon before Japan ever got Micron Densetsu. The comics were done primarily by Dreamwave and Fun Publications, both of which were/are American companies.

So, no, Hasbro didn't simply import a bunch of anime that they had no ties to to be used as placeholders for their next big plan. At that time, the Unicron Trilogy was Hasbro's big plan.

How are we, five years later, still at the point where people are saying their childhoods are being ruined? It's not like Michael Bay and Spielberg jumped in a time machine, busted down your front door, taped over your precious f.h.e. copy of S.O.S. Dinobots with episodes of Gemm or Care Bears, blew up your house, filmed it, and then CGI'd a clip of Bumblebee taking a piss on your family photo albums.

The franchise has evolved. If you don't like it, don't buy into it. You can still get old G1 episodes, and Beast Wars will be readily available again soon.

It Is Him wrote:How are we, five years later, still at the point where people are saying their childhoods are being ruined?

We're not. No one has said that about their own childhoods. Here's your strawman back. Enjoy him, scare off some crows.

Noideaforaname wrote:To quote someone from TFW

Fonecrusher wrote:The ironic thing is for every childhood that apparently got ruined, many more were made, how many kids would of got into Transformers soley based on the movies?

Jaynz wrote:

It Is Him wrote:How are we, five years later, still at the point where people are saying their childhoods are being ruined?

We're not. No one has said that about their own childhoods. Here's your strawman back. Enjoy him, scare off some crows.

It's an old charge by critics, but fair enough.

The point is people are over-reacting to this news. Michael Bay and Steven Spielberg are being honored for their work on the franchise. They deserve it.

It Is Him wrote:

Noideaforaname wrote:To quote someone from TFW

Fonecrusher wrote:The ironic thing is for every childhood that apparently got ruined, many more were made, how many kids would of got into Transformers soley based on the movies?

Jaynz wrote:

It Is Him wrote:How are we, five years later, still at the point where people are saying their childhoods are being ruined?

We're not. No one has said that about their own childhoods. Here's your strawman back. Enjoy him, scare off some crows.

It's an old charge by critics, but fair enough.

The point is people are over-reacting to this news. Michael Bay and Steven Spielberg are being honored for their work on the franchise. They deserve it.

Very, very true. Regardless of my preference, or yours, or anyone elses, they've more than established a continuity of their own within TFs. But the issue most are holding is the recognition of these two over longer involved names that made TFs what it is.

That said, I wasn't aware having an honest, non-insultive, logical opinion qualified as over-reacting. Sometimes I wonder what DISCUSSION boards are for when a simple and rightly held view gets nothing but strawmen thrown at it. Its as though your not suppose to say anything, discuss, or debate and all forums are for now should be yes-men posts of AWESOME and little else.

Covenant wrote:That said, I wasn't aware having an honest, non-insultive, logical opinion qualified as over-reacting. Sometimes I wonder what DISCUSSION boards are for when a simple and rightly held view gets nothing but strawmen thrown at it. Its as though your not suppose to say anything, discuss, or debate and all forums are for now should be yes-men posts of AWESOME and little else.

Discussion is great! But, are we reading the same thread?

Jaynz wrote:Filthy whoring.

Master Renegade wrote:Michael Bay's movies are so horribly bad that I feel he should be executed for war crimes.

Energon wrote:Michael Bay (spit) and Spielberg, NO NO NO NO NO NO

Fact is because of Bay and Speilberg our beloved franchise was brought out of the convention centers and put on display for the world to see. Their contributions racked up over $1.5 billion worldwide at the box-office. They introduced a new generation to Transformers, like my godson who liked my old G1 DVDs but LOVED everything Bay has done. They made is possible for things like Botcon to get to the levels they're at today.

Don't get me wrong, I love Simon Furman, Frank Welker and everyone else that should be put into the hall of fame but this is probably Bay and Speilbergs last project with Transformers. It's their year. Their are far worse things to have happened to this franchise. I just feel bad for the butt hurt fanboys that cant enjoy this new wave of popularity the Transformers brand is enjoying right now.

Come on guys, give Bay some credit!
He's not this total evil guy you may think him to be. After all, a majority of the public wouldnt know what Transformers are if it wernt for the live action movies. And the live action movies are pretty stunning thanks to him. I guess you can say he is helping keep the franchise alive right now. So congrats Michael Bay and Steven Spielberg!! Be looking forward to seeing Bay in person.

Seriously? Most Americans would have never heard of Transformers if it weren't for Bay? That may be the most absurd statement I've EVER heard on a Transformers board.

It Is Him wrote:

Covenant wrote:That said, I wasn't aware having an honest, non-insultive, logical opinion qualified as over-reacting. Sometimes I wonder what DISCUSSION boards are for when a simple and rightly held view gets nothing but strawmen thrown at it. Its as though your not suppose to say anything, discuss, or debate and all forums are for now should be yes-men posts of AWESOME and little else.

Discussion is great! But, are we reading the same thread?

Jaynz wrote:Filthy whoring.

Master Renegade wrote:Michael Bay's movies are so horribly bad that I feel he should be executed for war crimes.

Energon wrote:Michael Bay (spit) and Spielberg, NO NO NO NO NO NO

Soooo three one-liners hand-picked equals state-of-a-seven-page-thread? Oversell much?

It Is Him wrote:Discussion is great! But, are we reading the same thread?

Master Renegade wrote:Michael Bay's movies are so horribly bad that I feel he should be executed for war crimes.

Allow me to point out that I endorsed his inclusion in the HoF, and I did not specify simply his work on this series. I was referring to ALL of his movies when I said watching one was torture.

It may not make a difference, but I do want the clarity.

Covenant wrote:Soooo three one-liners hand-picked equals state-of-a-seven-page-thread? Oversell much?

Those aren't one-liners. Use dictionaries much?

jacksonspade wrote:I just feel bad for the butt hurt fanboys that cant enjoy this new wave of popularity the Transformers brand is enjoying right now.

Yeah, I feel the same way.

That's pretty cool. Good for them, better for those going to BotCon if those two actually make an appearance.

oh yea, why is everyone all salty? I go away from the forums for a day or two and come back to a shower of Morton's.

Counterpunch wrote:That's pretty cool. Good for them, better for those going to BotCon if those two actually make an appearance.

oh yea, why is everyone all salty? I go away from the forums for a day or two and come back to a shower of Morton's.

Why so salty? Because I once had some respect for Hasbro and their toy line. Bay's movies were full of stuff that I know associate with Hasbro and Michael Bay. If I have a choice of two brands of toys, I now choose the other brand based on the morals held by Hasbro.

Making a parody of buck teeth and blacks. (African Americans to be politically correct)
Dumbing down the movies with Wrecking Balls, Leaking Lubricants on a dude, and trying to pass poor casting an adult off as a teenager with Masturbation comments (c'mon, in no way did anyone even think that La Beouf remotely passed off as a teenager) as well as drug references.
The overt way they make it a car commercial.
Explosions that just became doldrum after a while.
Characters were shoehorned into General Motors brands while using competing brands for the enemies to portray them as evil.

The movies were supposed to be written for adult or pre-adult audience not the age group that finds poop and pee jokes funny. A good movie doesn't need any of that. It wasn't funny in the movie and now it is linked with Hasbro and Bay movies. Hasbro stated several times in their annual report that children are getting older younger. Than why all the degenerate stuff in the movie? Bay is responsible for the direction and content in the movie. Hasbro approved the script.

As I said before. The Hasbro marketing team was responsible for the millions in profit. Look at the prequal comic that made it to New York Times Best seller. The author had not ever written a comic before and it became on the best seller list before it had been read by an audience. I tell you , it was all the marketing team that did their job and not Michael Bay or Spielberg. On technical merit, Transformers had good special effects but nothing that stands out for Spielberg. His work has been quality but nothing out of the ordinary for Transformers.

It is way too soon for either of them to be in a hall of fame. Give it 20 more years and a couple of directors later. Firsts are not always "bests".

There are a ton of people who worked long and hard deserve an award long before any movie related people get one.

Sabrblade wrote:--Best post of the thread, as usual.

I agree with Sabrblades' list. It's a "shoulders of giants" thing here, not a Geewuner arguement. Had Dille and Furman and Welker and errbody not done the work that they did, Speilberg/Bay wouldn't have done their TF work. We all know that these guys sort of must get in now with DOTM looming, so ultimately this is an alright choice at a poor time because it needs to align with the launch of the movie. All of the other important people will most likely get inducted eventually, but in all reality, if they don't get these guys in now, the chances of their work being "influential and groundbreaking" will diminish, mainly due to the permanently advancing TF universe.
Now, if Shai LeBouf gets in before the others on Sabrblade's list, then there'll be some shouting.

It Is Him wrote:

Covenant wrote:Soooo three one-liners hand-picked equals state-of-a-seven-page-thread? Oversell much?

Those aren't one-liners. Use dictionaries much?

Yes, quite often. I'll use one now. One-liners as in jokes, perhaps but probably not. One-liners as in witty remark, I'm sure those that said them think so. One-liners as in riposte, abso-freakin-lutely. Think before posting next time.

I am kind of new to this but I am desperately trying to find pictures, (coloring book type) of as many transformer faces as I can for my 5 year olds birthday this coming Sunday. This is a group of 5 year olds and so I am really looking for the old style 1980's images. I have a new "Revenge of the Fallen" coloring book but the images are not what I consider 5 year old friendly. Plus my son loves all the old original cartoons that play on boomerrang and my husband is giving him his old original Optimus Prime (still in the box) for his birthday gift. PLEASE HELP. Are these images still out there? Does anyone have some or can you point me in the write direction. Thank you!!!

TransformerMom wrote:I am kind of new to this but I am desperately trying to find pictures, (coloring book type) of as many transformer faces as I can for my 5 year olds birthday this coming Sunday. This is a group of 5 year olds and so I am really looking for the old style 1980's images. I have a new "Revenge of the Fallen" coloring book but the images are not what I consider 5 year old friendly. Plus my son loves all the old original cartoons that play on boomerrang and my husband is giving him is old original Optimus Prime (still in the box) for his birthday gift. PLEASE HELP. Are these images still out there? Does anyone have some or can you point me in the write direction. Thank you!!!

Have you tried a google image search? I came up with a few images. Maybe you can pick and choose a few good ones. Or, an alternative is always going on ebay. I've seen a few listed on there in the past, and it definitely won't run you as much as an original Optimus Prime in the box. Good luck!

Counterpunch wrote:That's pretty cool. Good for them, better for those going to BotCon if those two actually make an appearance.

oh yea, why is everyone all salty? I go away from the forums for a day or two and come back to a shower of Morton's.

I dunno, but if this thread is anything like the movie forums, it's no wonder why I avoid popping in there.

I'm really excited that these two are going to be at the hall of fame dinner, which is probably the reason for the extra price tag. I'm definitely envious of the people attending

Covenant wrote:

It Is Him wrote:

Covenant wrote:Soooo three one-liners hand-picked equals state-of-a-seven-page-thread? Oversell much?

Those aren't one-liners. Use dictionaries much?

Yes, quite often. I'll use one now. One-liners as in jokes, perhaps but probably not. One-liners as in witty remark, I'm sure those that said them think so. One-liners as in riposte, abso-freakin-lutely. Think before posting next time.

Uh-oh, I had no idea you knew how to use a thesaurus. I better stop trading barbs with you before you intimidate me with big, foreign words that my pea-size brain can't handle.

It Is Him wrote:

Covenant wrote:

It Is Him wrote:

Covenant wrote:Soooo three one-liners hand-picked equals state-of-a-seven-page-thread? Oversell much?

Those aren't one-liners. Use dictionaries much?

Yes, quite often. I'll use one now. One-liners as in jokes, perhaps but probably not. One-liners as in witty remark, I'm sure those that said them think so. One-liners as in riposte, abso-freakin-lutely. Think before posting next time.

Uh-oh, I had no idea you knew how to use a Thesaurus. I better stop trading barbs with you before you intimidate me with big words that my pea-size brain can't handle.

Dictionary, not Thesaurus, remember? And you can kindly cram the sarcasm. You've done nothing but drift into pointless insulting of intelligence for the sake of not liking someone not liking Bay getting into an earned Hall of Fame spot ahead of longer established Transformer contributors. So yes, please stop. I'm done with you. And I will say meaningless jabs like yours are the reason message boards suck.

Out.

Covenant wrote:

It Is Him wrote:

Covenant wrote:

It Is Him wrote:

Covenant wrote:Soooo three one-liners hand-picked equals state-of-a-seven-page-thread? Oversell much?

Those aren't one-liners. Use dictionaries much?

Yes, quite often. I'll use one now. One-liners as in jokes, perhaps but probably not. One-liners as in witty remark, I'm sure those that said them think so. One-liners as in riposte, abso-freakin-lutely. Think before posting next time.

Uh-oh, I had no idea you knew how to use a Thesaurus. I better stop trading barbs with you before you intimidate me with big words that my pea-size brain can't handle.

Dictionary, not Thesaurus, remember? And you can kindly cram the sarcasm. You've done nothing but drift into pointless insulting of intelligence for the sake of not liking someone not liking Bay getting into an earned Hall of Fame spot ahead of longer established Transformer contributors. So yes, please stop. I'm done with you. And I will say meaningless jabs like yours are the reason message boards suck.

Out.

I know what you are, but am I?

Sabrblade wrote:*snip*

I couldn't agree more with your post. I'm a fan of the live-action films, as I am of just about every iteration of the franchise (save for Kiss Players, obviously). I think Bay and Spielberg deserve the honor, I just question the timing of it. Obviously drumming up additional support for the upcoming film is obvious, but it does seem somewhat unfortunate to see the likes of those you mentioned as being put on the back-burner in favor of Bay and Spielberg. I'd love to see Beast Wars get it's first inductee(s), since it remains my all time favorite series and the one that introduced me to the brand. So here's hoping that in future years (after all, the HoF is only 2 years old) Beast Wars, the Comics, and all the other brands that have helped shape the franchise over the years get their much deserved recognition. That said, I still respect the work done by Bay and Spielberg for keeping Transformers a relevant brand and helping it achieve new levels of success and popularity.

Master Renegade wrote:My initial knee-jerk reaction was that this was a horrible decision and that neither of them deserved this. Michael Bay's movies are so horribly bad that I feel he should be executed for war crimes. (Watching one of his movies is torture.) I've also lost all respect for Steven Spielberg since he keeps saying that these films are actually good. How can someone deserve to be in a Hall of Fame when their work is garbage?

After thinking about it, it's simple: They're famous, and this is a Hall of FAME. Looked at that way, I can't argue that their inclusion isn't justified, regardless of the obviously marketing-based timing.

War crimes... oh, you silly goose! That's one of the most pathetic statements I've read on these boards!

As for Ratchet... the guy saved the Autobots at least three times in Marvel comics and was a mainstay of G1 for the first two seasons of the cartoon. He is an icon, like it or not. And I like it.

One thing... why only these two? Why couldn't Furman and Welker be inducted too?

RK_Striker_JK_5 wrote:One thing... why only these two? Why couldn't Furman and Welker be inducted too?

I think this is the question we should be asking.

I'm afraid I agree with the meager three other posters I could find who mentioned thoughts that express right now is really the only time these two (Bay and Spielberg) <i>could</i> be inducted.

jacksonspade wrote:Fact is because of Bay and Speilberg our beloved franchise was brought out of the convention centers and put on display for the world to see. Their contributions racked up over $1.5 billion worldwide at the box-office. They introduced a new generation to Transformers, like my godson who liked my old G1 DVDs but LOVED everything Bay has done. They made is possible for things like Botcon to get to the levels they're at today.

Don't get me wrong, I love Simon Furman, Frank Welker and everyone else that should be put into the hall of fame but this is probably Bay and Speilbergs last project with Transformers. It's their year. Their are far worse things to have happened to this franchise. I just feel bad for the butt hurt fanboys that cant enjoy this new wave of popularity the Transformers brand is enjoying right now.

Dagon wrote:I agree with Sabrblades' list. It's a "shoulders of giants" thing here, not a Geewuner arguement. Had Dille and Furman and Welker and errbody not done the work that they did, Speilberg/Bay wouldn't have done their TF work. We all know that these guys sort of must get in now with DOTM looming, so ultimately this is an alright choice at a poor time because it needs to align with the launch of the movie. All of the other important people will most likely get inducted eventually, but in all reality, if they don't get these guys in now, the chances of their work being "influential and groundbreaking" will diminish, mainly due to the permanently advancing TF universe.
Now, if Shai LeBouf gets in before the others on Sabrblade's list, then there'll be some shouting.

And those're also my thoughts on the timing of it. It obviously wasn't wholly based on these reasons (I think some of the reasons given that would be considered negative were, arguably, also contributors). In the end it comes down to hype, and I don't fault them for taking advantage of it. But again I go back to the top of my post - did we HAVE to have only these two? Couldn't they have dropped it down to two inductees next year?
But I guess we have to ask ourselves, did they possibly try to get them and maybe plans didn't work out? I imagine they may base inductions based partially on who can attend - after all, a good portion of the HoF dinner's appeal, at least to me, is actually SEEING the nominees in person. Not just getting more factual information that they could've given over the web, which we haunt the rest of the year (or I do, don't want to lump anybody else with me, ha ha). Thoughts?

Joker'sRequiem wrote: I'd love to see Beast Wars get it's first inductee(s),

Beast War HAS its first inductee: Dinobot got in last year(the first year of the HoF) over the more worthy(IMO, but I never liked Beast Wars) Soundwave.

Midnight_Fox wrote:

Joker'sRequiem wrote: I'd love to see Beast Wars get it's first inductee(s),

Beast War HAS its first inductee: Dinobot got in last year(the first year of the HoF) over the more worthy(IMO, but I never liked Beast Wars) Soundwave.

He meant person-wise not character-wise.