The Energon Pub

ok, so i have been watching beast wars second the movie as well as a few of the episodes. lio convoy starts of as just plain convoy but when he gets his lion form he reconfigures himself and is renamed "lioconvoy" so he started of as convoy....yes? well any how in the movey they summon optimus primal who is in th japanes version refered to as "the legendary commander" "Convoy" does that mean they are the same maximal? and what is to be said about Big Convoy in besat wars neo? are they all the same maximal? or not?....i do know the answer because i have done the research and just want to see if anyone else knows, well have fun with that one gents!


aslo check out beastwars neo if you havent yet, the leaders of the maximals are known as the convoy council so there is annother hint for you.

Namesakes my dear boy.

Convoy (aka Optimus Primal) and Lioconvoy (aka Leo Prime) share the same name, at least in the beginning, but they're different characters altogether. In the Japanese continuities, it seems that "Convoy" is a name given to great leaders, in homage to the original Convoy, or Optimus Prime. Look at Rodimus Convoy (Rodimus Convoy) or even the leaders in Galaxy Force!

Besides, the Japanese have a knack on taking liberties with storytelling

they have no more in common than George bush, george washington, george jefferson, and curious george. There is more than 1 george, jon, jim, sue, mary, ect. in the world. Convoy could just be a name

(same how in animated prime was a rank)

ok i officially love this site now because other people actually know this stuff, thanx to you guys i am officially hooked

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:Besides, the Japanese have a knack on taking liberties with storytelling

and everybody else doesn't?

Just to add this one thing:

Primal was called "The legendary Commander Convoy" because at the time the movie and the show it belonged to was made, Optimus Primal was in fact Optimus Prime as in the big red truck guy. As you can Imagen, that went tits up once the real Optimus made an appearance in season 3 of Beast Wars.

Dead Metal wrote:Just to add this one thing:

Primal was called "The legendary Commander Convoy" because at the time the movie and the show it belonged to was made, Optimus Primal was in fact Optimus Prime as in the big red truck guy. As you can Imagen, that went tits up once the real Optimus made an appearance in season 3 of Beast Wars.

That was the original idea for the US toy line as well, with Bat Primal and Gator Megs. But Mainframe, the creators of the show decided to start fresh by making Primal and Megatron separate characters. Best decision in all of TF history.

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:

Dead Metal wrote:Just to add this one thing:

Primal was called "The legendary Commander Convoy" because at the time the movie and the show it belonged to was made, Optimus Primal was in fact Optimus Prime as in the big red truck guy. As you can Imagen, that went tits up once the real Optimus made an appearance in season 3 of Beast Wars.

That was the original idea for the US toy line as well, with Bat Primal and Gator Megs. But Mainframe, the creators of the show decided to start fresh by making Primal and Megatron separate characters. Best decision in all of TF history.

Not just those toys, also the larger Gorilla and T-Rex versions bios make that very apparent, but the difference is that Japan had them as the G1 characters up until they boarded the ark in season 3 of the show, long after they where established as separate characters in the original version of the show and later toys.

Dead Metal wrote:

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:

Dead Metal wrote:Just to add this one thing:

Primal was called "The legendary Commander Convoy" because at the time the movie and the show it belonged to was made, Optimus Primal was in fact Optimus Prime as in the big red truck guy. As you can Imagen, that went tits up once the real Optimus made an appearance in season 3 of Beast Wars.

That was the original idea for the US toy line as well, with Bat Primal and Gator Megs. But Mainframe, the creators of the show decided to start fresh by making Primal and Megatron separate characters. Best decision in all of TF history.

Not just those toys, also the larger Gorilla and T-Rex versions bios make that very apparent, but the difference is that Japan had them as the G1 characters up until they boarded the ark in season 3 of the show, long after they where established as separate characters in the original version of the show and later toys.

O, those silly Japanese

Dead Metal wrote:Just to add this one thing:

Primal was called "The legendary Commander Convoy" because at the time the movie and the show it belonged to was made, Optimus Primal was in fact Optimus Prime as in the big red truck guy. As you can Imagen, that went tits up once the real Optimus made an appearance in season 3 of Beast Wars.

This is not entirely correct. While the Japanese Beast Wars dub does seem to imply that Optimus Primal/Convoy and BW Megatron were the same bots as G1 Optimus Prime/Convoy and G1 Megatron, it was never explicitly stated as such in the series itself. While the implications were still present, the exact answer as to whether or not that were the same inidividuals as the G1 leaders ultimately remained ambiguous. It was this ambiguity that saved them in the end, when the Ark appeared in Beast Wars Metals.

Still, Primal refered to as a "Legendary Supreme Commander" in Lio Convoy Kiki Ippatsu doesn't seem farfetched these days. Because the current reality is that Beast Wars II and Neo take place "tens of thousands of years" in the future, well beyond the time of Beast Machines/Beast Wars Returns. With this, Primal can be viewed as a legendary leader by Lio Convoy's team because he existed at a much earlier time period than they did.

Sabrblade wrote:

Dead Metal wrote:Just to add this one thing:

Primal was called "The legendary Commander Convoy" because at the time the movie and the show it belonged to was made, Optimus Primal was in fact Optimus Prime as in the big red truck guy. As you can Imagen, that went tits up once the real Optimus made an appearance in season 3 of Beast Wars.

This is not entirely correct. While the Japanese Beast Wars dub does seem to imply that Optimus Primal/Convoy and BW Megatron were the same bots as G1 Optimus Prime/Convoy and G1 Megatron, it was never explicitly stated as such in the series itself. While the implications were still present, the exact answer as to whether or not that were the same inidividuals as the G1 leaders ultimately remained ambiguous. It was this ambiguity that saved them in the end, when the Ark appeared in Beast Wars Metals.

Still, Primal refered to as a "Legendary Supreme Commander" in Lio Convoy Kiki Ippatsu doesn't seem farfetched these days. Because the current reality is that Beast Wars II and Neo take place "tens of thousands of years" in the future, well beyond the time of Beast Machines/Beast Wars Returns. With this, Primal can be viewed as a legendary leader by Lio Convoy's team because he existed at a much earlier time period than they did.

The current time line does make that possible, while the original idea back then was that they take place at around the same time I believe.
The thing of Primal and Megs being their G1 originals seems to be supported by their toy bios. I think the original Japanese toy bios for them mentioned that Convoy used to turn into a red and blue truck while Megatron turned into a gun. Now I don't know if that's true as I can't really recall where I read that about the toy bios so I'm not really presenting this as fact.


But then again the retcon of Neo and II taking place tens of thousands of years in the future doesn't make too much sense considering the fact that they are shown to be superiors to Primal in the idw comic and from the same time as them.

Dead Metal wrote:But then again the retcon of Neo and II taking place tens of thousands of years in the future doesn't make too much sense considering the fact that they are shown to be superiors to Primal in the idw comic and from the same time as them.

One could always say that the IDW Beast Wars comics don't follow the BWII and Neo cartoons to the letter. After all, they do differ from them in certain key aspects such as the removal of Artemis as Moon's buddy and Hardhead not being dumb as toast.

Though, there is still a way for Lio Convoy and Galvatron to be the successors of Primal and Megatron. The Beast Wars Reborn fiction resurrected Primal and Megs in their old beast bodies after Beast Machines. If they were to stay alive afterwards, they could be succeeded by Lio Convoy and Galvatron all those years later. And the BWII catalog fiction shows Primal and Megs in their old beast bodies interacting with Lio Convoy and Galvatron (Primal names Lio his successor, while Megs and Galvy argue and fight with each other over differing opinions on how to conquer Cybertron - note that this does not say what Megatron's opinion was, nor does it mention any of his pre-BW plans like stealing the Golden Disk, so this could occur after Beast Machines with Megatron wanting to conquer Cybertron "again" and disagreeing with Galvatron on how to do so).