The Energon Pub

Mkall wrote:How exactly do you come to that conclusion? Surely the ability to attend college is not a direct result of these rough men willing to fight? If anything, as I see it, guys like you exist because there are those out there who seek to attack our privileges, but the fact that you exist does not give us those privileges.

I don't provide the ability to attend college. I secure and maintain it.

Wow, that's hypocrisy right there if I ever saw it. You first say that students are the most pompous and ignorant people, and then you say that you have done the most important thing here? I find that to be insulting.

Meh, fair enough.

Here's a counter argument. Nothing you will ever do will be as important as what I do. I assist in maintaining a part of The Internet. If something happens and servers go offline, companies start losing money. In the worst case scenario 1/4 of the Internet could go offline if something were to screw up in my company. Data could be lost, and considering that my company has data for several of the big credit card companies not to mention government data and other companies (youtube, myspace, verizon), chaos could ensue. Now please tell me how what you are doing is more important than what I do.

Are you really saying that corporate server maintenance is actually of equal worth to someone who will kill and/or be killed to ensure the security of all your freedoms and your entire way of life? lol, k.

Also, how exactly do you (I'm assuming I = the military) provide freedom?

I maintain your freedom. I'm the guy who straps on two hundred pounds of gear, grabs a machine gun, jumps out of a helicopter, and actually engages other human beings in battle. These are things the huge majority of any people in any civilization shrink from because they don't possess any significant amount of personal courage.

As for the actual provision of freedom I could just point out that in the past six years the U.S. has toppled two brutal governments and installed western style democracies in their stead. I know that the women of Afghanistan probably enjoy education or y'know, being able to own land. Plus I'm pretty sure the Kurds are rather satisfied with the knowledge that they won't be gassed or be the victims of mass killings.

What exactly do you do for the military that's so blasted important?

lkavadas wrote:Are you really saying that corporate server maintenance is actually of equal worth to someone who will kill and/or be killed to ensure the security of all your freedoms and your entire way of life? lol, k.

I didn't say corperate server maintenance, I said The Internet. It might not be a big difference to you, but The Internet runs the economy these days. If it goes down then that heralds in an era of depression that could make the 30's look profitable from what reports I've seen, and no amount of guns or soldiers can prevent that catastrophe. I'm protecting our "freedom" just as much as you are, minus the risk of dying that is.

I maintain your freedom. I'm the guy who straps on two hundred pounds of gear, grabs a machine gun, jumps out of a helicopter, and actually engages other human beings in battle. These are things the huge majority of any people in any civilization shrink from because they don't possess any significant amount of personal courage.

I just love how the word freedom is now always combined with tools of violence after 9/11

As for the actual provision of freedom I could just point out that in the past six years the U.S. has toppled two brutal governments and installed western style democracies in their stead.

Ah the West = Best argument. Imposing our values on them because we see them as primitive or unrefined. By the way, did we ever find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, or Bin Laden in Afganistan? Those were the original objectives after all. Ridding them of evil governments was just a bonus. Maybe we should go after North Korea next, no wait we can't do that otherwise they'll launch nukes. How about Iran, we don't think they have nukes yet.

I know that the women of Afghanistan probably enjoy education or y'know, being able to own land.

I won't dispute that

Plus I'm pretty sure the Kurds are rather satisfied with the knowledge that they won't be gassed or be the victims of mass killings.

Indeed, because suicide bombers are so much better.

Professor Smooth wrote:What exactly do you do for the military that's so blasted important?

He assists in demolishing a country's way of life in order to protect ours apparently.

lkavadas wrote:

Fender Bender wrote:Granted, I'm not a soldier, I'm a student. I learn from mistakes made in the past to avoid making them in the future. If we had more students in this world than soldiers, then perhaps peace across the globe could occur.

This is a really poopy comment to be honest. The only reason you even have the privilege to attend college is because rough men stand ready to do violence on your behalf.

Anyways, your insinuation that soldiers are less intelligent than students, who are arguably the most pompous and ignorant group of people I've ever met (I'm currently taking classes at the University of Colorado and have half of my B.A. knocked out), is **** insulting.

Enjoy the freedom I provide for you and don't insult me for doing it. Without me you would not take pleasure in the luxuries you have. Don't forget that. Nothing you do in your entire life will ever be as important as the four years I've given to my nation and it's citizens. Nothing.

You completely missed the meaning of my statement. The point is, if people around the world weren't so eager to kill each other through use of force, world peace could occur.

In order for that to happen, we need fewer guns, and more enlightened individiuals. That is what I was referring to when saying we need more students instead of soldiers.

I can understand why you would think that I was insulting the armed forces, but really, it was more of a dig against imperialism and "Cowboy Diplomacy".

I'll be the first to admit, I respect the military and the people who work for it, but I maintain that in the 21st Century, the peak of our civilization, we should not even need one.

Now with that little misunderstanding out of the way, I will say I'm offended by your retalitory comments.

To my knowledge, the Iraqi's did not invade America and impose a dictatorship on us. So I do not understand how invading another country gives me freedom (especially since I had it since the day I was born).

Hell, I respect the veterans from WWI and WWII, but none of them have the right to say that I owe them thanks either. Sure, the majority of Europe probably owes them gratitude for freeing them from a crazed dictator, but that changed nothing in the USA. We were free before those wars, we were free after.

The only people I owe thanks to for freedom were the original American soldiers, from the Revolutionary War. That's the bottom line. No other war that we have been involved in jeopardized our Freedom, it was always somebody else's ass on the line.

As for my importance on the grand scale of things, I'm currently earning my Bachelor's in Homeland Security and Public Safety. I may opt for a government office, or I may just become an officer.

Regardless my career decision, I would think what I do here in the states would matter more than what some one does out in the desert.

Mkall: Unfortunately, freedom has to be associated with tools of violence these days. 9/11 proved that there are evil people in the world who cheer and dance when innocents die. In order to prevent these scumbags from harming more innocents, we have to fight. If we had sat there and done nothing after 9/11, the scumbags would have been emboldened by our passiveness and struck harder and harder, killing more and more innocents like you, me, and the other members on this forum. By fighting back, by utterly annihilating them (deposing Saddam within a few months is definitely an utter a**-kicking), we prevent them from striking on our soil again.

Mkall: Unfortunately, freedom has to be associated with tools of violence these days. 9/11 proved that there are evil people in the world who cheer and dance when innocents die. In order to prevent these scumbags from harming more innocents, we have to fight. If we had sat there and done nothing after 9/11, the scumbags would have been emboldened by our passiveness and struck harder and harder, killing more and more innocents like you, me, and the other members on this forum. By fighting back, by utterly annihilating them (deposing Saddam within a few months is definitely an utter a**-kicking), we prevent them from striking on our soil again.

No more terrorists = No more terrorism! (For a while, until some retard tries it again, and we smoke them too. Then maybe they will get the idea?)

Seriously, i don't understand why would god tell me to blow myself up whit dinamite...

Apparently they believe that by "martyring" themselves, they can go to heaven and "meet" 72 virgins. Of course, their definition of martyrdom involves the slaughter of innocents. It's the little differences like that that cause the friction between cultures.

lkavadas wrote:

Professor Smooth wrote:Interesting opinion. How, exactly, would the US go about "dealing" with these people? Assuming, of course, they were not restricted by a lack of a "pair?"

Complete and appropriate subjugation with an escalation of violence to keep the populace in line. The same way we've subjugated every other nation in the wars we've actually won.

But like I said, we're pussies and it's high time to admit it. To compare us to Ancient Rome we hit 200 A.D. in 1945 and are currently on a very quick decline. If I had to put us in a Roman year I'd say we're sitting somewhere around 250 A.D. We have a few good years left so enjoy'em while ya can. Our political and military triumphs are tales of the past and there won't be any new ones. Ever.

How do I know we're pussies? Here's an awesome quick fact:

Volume 1 of the Census of 1900 says the population was estimated to be 76,212,168. According to the History Channel special on the Spanish American War 1,000,000 men volunteered the day the government put the call to raise expeditionary force with which to invade Cuba.

That means 7.6% of our entire population showed up to fight that war. According to the 2000 census our population was 281,421,906. 7.6% of the 2000 census estimate is 21,388,065.

I didn't see twenty one million people lining up to join the military after 9/11, did you?

And 9/11 was a much more barbaric attack as well as much larger in scale. Like I said, we're a nation filled with and controlled by pussies and folks, we ain't going to find our balls anytime soon.

Pretty sad considering America is basically the last, best hope out there. Europe is even worse then we are (by quite a margin actually).

Western civilization is ****.

Excellent post. This generation of pussies couldn't hold our grandpa's jock strap.

Some of you are starting to sound like you think that the worth of a nation is judged by the size of its penis. I'm not so sure that is how you wish to come off, so I'm just pointing that out.

Nico wrote:Seriously, i don't understand why would god tell me to blow myself up whit dinamite...

Because god had promised you with 72 beautiful angels waiting at the end of your life if you can kill those infidels along with you.

I havent been bothered to read through this whole topic so if this has been said already then so be it.

They see western civilisation as an affront to life. Evil.
I too, think that America in particular is just too out of control. How many gun related deaths do you have each year again? here in Aus i think its like 100-300 maybe, in america its like 30,000......In 2003 alone, 30,136 Americans died by gunfire: 16,907 in firearm suicides, 11,920 in firearm homicides, 730 in unintentional shootings, and 232 in firearm deaths of unknown intent.....wow. Your country is so rapt up in itself that it cares very little about the outside world for one thing, but thats just my problem, not that Im going to fly a plane into a tower to prove my point.

In short, who knows, they know its suicide, they arent stupid. But one thing I said to a friend awhile ago pretty much tell what I think "Its funny isnt it, the sun rises in the east and sets in the west, kind of like how human life began in the east and how it will most probably end in the west"