Optimus Prime's son?

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Postby Scaleface » Thu Oct 25, 2007 7:24 am

Yes. Some other sources also refer to Frenzy and Rumble as brothers (Marvel comics mentioned it), and the bios for Topspin and Trin Twist mention "brothers". In Beast Wars Second there are the Jointron Brothers. Also, the Clones from season 4 are brothers to each other. in RiD Optimus Prime and Ultra Magnus are brothers, as well as there being the "Autobot Brothers", and in Transformers there are actually 3 Autobot Sisters! There are many more examples.

It's never really well defined well in the TF lore outside Dreamwave comics article on spark splitting, which says brothers are made when a spark occasionally splits during creation of a Protoform, making 2 Transformers instead of 1.
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Postby Sledge » Thu Oct 25, 2007 8:00 am

Actually, Sunstreaker and Sideswipe are twins. How or what this means is never addressed. Oh, and where does it say Topspin and Twin Twist are brothers? I can't find it on their tech specs.
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Postby sto_vo_kor_2000 » Thu Oct 25, 2007 8:17 am

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Sledge wrote:Actually, Sunstreaker and Sideswipe are twins. How or what this means is never addressed. Oh, and where does it say Topspin and Twin Twist are brothers? I can't find it on their tech specs.


Its in the Marvel universe bio of Topspin.
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Postby Sledge » Thu Oct 25, 2007 8:45 am

Ah, cool beans. Hadn't read that, could only find their tech specs on TFU.
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Postby Sire Hate » Thu Oct 25, 2007 9:48 am

Scaleface wrote:It's never really well defined well in the TF lore outside Dreamwave comics article on spark splitting, which says brothers are made when a spark occasionally splits during creation of a Protoform, making 2 Transformers instead of 1.


Thanx for the info. So Transformers can be siblings but not father son?
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Postby Scaleface » Thu Oct 25, 2007 9:52 am

Depends on how you define "father" of course. You could mean builder, like Wheeljack building Dinobots in the TV series. Additionally Star Saber had an adopted human son, Jan.
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Postby Bartmanhomer » Thu Oct 25, 2007 10:12 am

God Magnus wrote:
Zombie Starscream wrote:
Ramrider wrote:This is a nice simple one.

No. :grin:

<edit> To expand a bit... Transformers don't have children (or if they do, we've never had any definite evidence of it in the last twenty-odd years).
And there was a few debates on that which would go on for twenty odd pages..

Can Tfs Have Babies?
Where do the Babies Grow Inside Them?
Do Tfs have Genders?
How do Tfs Reproduce?

Not the titles exactly, but you get the idea. Basically, the threads are interesting, but after a while they have a tendancy to get heated and some members getting temp banned.

I don't know if they can or can't have babies. All I know is that Transformer sex would be extremely loud.


It's impossible. Transformers can't have babies because they're robots.
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Postby Scaleface » Thu Oct 25, 2007 10:21 am

Didn't the Decepticon Breastmasters in Transformers: Victory have wives and babies back home depicted in the manga adaption?

http://transformers.wikia.com/wiki/Esmeryl

There you go, a wife and kids.
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Postby Damolisher » Thu Oct 25, 2007 1:59 pm

Bartmanhomer wrote:
It's impossible. Transformers can't have babies because they're robots.


Thank God Tramp's banned, or that comment alone would've led to Tramp's version of the I Have a Dream Speech, only his dream involves Nightbird and Airazor naked.

But in all seriousness, you would've been treated to a wonderful thousand word essay in randomly bolded text about how it's irrelevant that they're robots, and that they're lifeforms, because they'd have to follow the 7 criteria of life, and yadda, yadda, yadda. (Never mind the fact they can't breathe, or the fact that Fire and clouds meet the 7 criteria and aren't lifeforms.) I mean, I personally would think the fact they're robots would be the most important thing, but Tramp's a moron, and if you beat him into a corner to the point he can't argue a point, he'll either edit his post, or ignore the part he can't argue with.

My general main argument was that they're robots. Tramp showed my logic no respect, so I started flaming the arsehole.

OH, and Scaleface, the whole "Wives and kids" thing is generally scorned by fandom. Those manga aren't canon anyways. And those kids are probably built by whoever they were meant to have been built by.
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Postby Bartmanhomer » Fri Oct 26, 2007 7:14 am

Damolisher wrote:
Bartmanhomer wrote:
It's impossible. Transformers can't have babies because they're robots.


Thank God Tramp's banned, or that comment alone would've led to Tramp's version of the I Have a Dream Speech, only his dream involves Nightbird and Airazor naked.

But in all seriousness, you would've been treated to a wonderful thousand word essay in randomly bolded text about how it's irrelevant that they're robots, and that they're lifeforms, because they'd have to follow the 7 criteria of life, and yadda, yadda, yadda. (Never mind the fact they can't breathe, or the fact that Fire and clouds meet the 7 criteria and aren't lifeforms.) I mean, I personally would think the fact they're robots would be the most important thing, but Tramp's a moron, and if you beat him into a corner to the point he can't argue a point, he'll either edit his post, or ignore the part he can't argue with.

My general main argument was that they're robots. Tramp showed my logic no respect, so I started flaming the arsehole.

OH, and Scaleface, the whole "Wives and kids" thing is generally scorned by fandom. Those manga aren't canon anyways. And those kids are probably built by whoever they were meant to have been built by.


I see what you mean.
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Postby Scaleface » Fri Oct 26, 2007 7:19 am

I hate arguements about that's "canon". Anything licensed is official, it's just not part of the official story you may follow. There is some seriously mixed up stuff coming out of the TF fiction in Japan (kiss players, Airazor as a guy, Transformers babies), but it's official too.

Remember thought hat they are not just machines, they have life. The sparks are living things. Can one spark make another, split, or reproduce in any way?

If I can take this in another direction though, what about Technorganic Transformers from Beast Machines? Can they reproduce in an organic manner? What about beings like Nobel/Savage? He's 100% organic and sparkless by the end of the series. Could he reproduce if they had a female version of his species avaiilable? Was he the "son" of Megatron?
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Postby Leonardo » Fri Oct 26, 2007 7:28 am

I'd wager Savage could if he was totally organic. He'd just need an organic mate.
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Postby Scaleface » Fri Oct 26, 2007 9:52 am

The Technorganic trees had seeds, so they reproduced. So I wonder if two technorganic Maximals, perhaps of the same animal species, could reproduce.
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Postby AxiomScion » Fri Oct 26, 2007 9:54 am

Scaleface wrote:If I can take this in another direction though, what about Technorganic Transformers from Beast Machines? Can they reproduce in an organic manner? What about beings like Savage/Noble? He's 100% organic and sparkless by the end of the series. Could he reproduce if they had a female version of his species available? Was he the "son" of Megatron?


I'm thinking that technically the BM cast, if they encountered another of similar beast species but opposite gender, could reproduce. I'm not sure how the spark part would work though...

Savage/Noble, being fully organic, would have a better chance than the regular cast but again the spark issue would come up again. The G2 'budding' created a spark and a new body.

Savage/Noble was, I'll see if I can verify this but, initially meant to be Megatron's beast mode and the wolf part of Silverbolt's fuzor beast mode shhtuff. Megatron's spark wasn't meant to be transferred, well story wise it was but, so he would still need to reclaim it from savage/noble. Seeing as the organic is two beast modes and a spark, but not a created new spark or new beast modes based from the parent's, I'm thinking it's more of a humuculas fullmetal style rather than an offspring. He's also the only show BeastWar's mutant, ironicly seen in the BM line.
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Postby Down_Shift » Fri Oct 26, 2007 10:26 am

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Postby ThunderThruster » Fri Oct 26, 2007 11:53 am

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Damolisher wrote:
Bartmanhomer wrote:
It's impossible. Transformers can't have babies because they're robots.


Thank God Tramp's banned, or that comment alone would've led to Tramp's version of the I Have a Dream Speech, only his dream involves Nightbird and Airazor naked.

But in all seriousness, you would've been treated to a wonderful thousand word essay in randomly bolded text about how it's irrelevant that they're robots, and that they're lifeforms, because they'd have to follow the 7 criteria of life, and yadda, yadda, yadda. (Never mind the fact they can't breathe, or the fact that Fire and clouds meet the 7 criteria and aren't lifeforms.) I mean, I personally would think the fact they're robots would be the most important thing, but Tramp's a moron, and if you beat him into a corner to the point he can't argue a point, he'll either edit his post, or ignore the part he can't argue with.

My general main argument was that they're robots. Tramp showed my logic no respect, so I started flaming the arsehole.

OH, and Scaleface, the whole "Wives and kids" thing is generally scorned by fandom. Those manga aren't canon anyways. And those kids are probably built by whoever they were meant to have been built by.


awww, does somebody miss Tramp?! (jk)
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Postby Scaleface » Fri Oct 26, 2007 11:59 am

I'm not taking any position that that they can have babies, I'm just thinking of all the possibilities. I know they are just kids cartoon robots after all.
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Postby AxiomScion » Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:16 pm

Scaleface wrote:The Technorganic trees had seeds, so they reproduced. So I wonder if two technorganic Maximals, perhaps of the same animal species, could reproduce.
I guess it all depends if some canon writter wants to state they are fully functional... down there :oops:

The transformation sequences could be problematic for incubation, and the spark issue would still need to be reconned/resolved. There is also the possibility that there beast modes are simply steral.

As a kid's cartoon, I'm thinking it ain't gonna happen. The closest to a talk about the bird and the bees would be a fight between Airrazor and Busssaw or more likely Silverbolt and Waspinator.
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Postby Damolisher » Fri Oct 26, 2007 4:53 pm

Well, Scaleface, I will say you're a lot more flexable and have a lot more credibility than Tramp.
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Postby Scaleface » Fri Oct 26, 2007 5:23 pm

um, thanks? I guess.

Thing is the answer "No, they are just robots, they can't reproduce" is rather boring. We did see robot babies in the Victory series. SO what are they? Did Dezarus' wife BUILD them? Was it like the movie Heartbeeps or Robots where they get parts and make a son? Or was it a technological mimicry of biology, like say what we saw in the movie "Batteries Not Included", where the female gets "pregnant", and actually delivers a baby robot? Sadly the only official source to brooch the subject is some obscure japanese exclusive comic that is written more as a joke than as a story.
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Postby Damolisher » Sat Oct 27, 2007 4:53 pm

Yeah, but the thing is, we're shown HOW Transformers are made, and no transformer ever references being born. The only signs of any "Birth" are, as you said, that manga which was generally a comedy manga with a very questionable effect on canon, and the rest is general fanwank, such as our old annoying buddy Tramp choosing to interpret the presence of females (Which is bloody stupid, IMO, to call evidence, when you're considering how PC everyone is, and females were only added in transformers to avoid lawsuits from pissed off chicks,) and some throwaway line from the More than Obsoletes The Eye, which says something about other means of creation other than the known ones in the G1 universe, which I personally would assume to mean the Oracle, I mean, it IS BW Megatron 'reading' the things in the first place.
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Postby sto_vo_kor_2000 » Sat Oct 27, 2007 7:01 pm

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Damolisher wrote:Yeah, but the thing is, we're shown HOW Transformers are made, and no transformer ever references being born. The only signs of any "Birth" are, as you said, that manga which was generally a comedy manga with a very questionable effect on canon, and the rest is general fanwank, such as our old annoying buddy Tramp choosing to interpret the presence of females (Which is bloody stupid, IMO, to call evidence, when you're considering how PC everyone is, and females were only added in transformers to avoid lawsuits from pissed off chicks,) and some throwaway line from the More than Obsoletes The Eye, which says something about other means of creation other than the known ones in the G1 universe, which I personally would assume to mean the Oracle, I mean, it IS BW Megatron 'reading' the things in the first place.


Hey Damolisher I hate to do this to you....But there is a reference to Transformers being Born.In the 2nd or 3rd episode of 5 Faces of Darkness when Rodimus is talking to the old leaders in the Matrix on says "Megatron Was Born".Now I beleave they were saying born as a metaphor for creation and we never see a birth.But they did make a reference about Transformers being Born. :P
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Postby Scaleface » Sat Oct 27, 2007 7:13 pm

Brawl's mottos is "I was built to be wild". Build is clearly a TF word for born.
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Postby Damolisher » Sat Oct 27, 2007 8:16 pm

Or built could be the Transformer word for built.

and Sto_Vo, I'll give you that one :P But it's not really in the traditional "Squeezed from a robo-Gina" sense, is it? :P lol.
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Postby sto_vo_kor_2000 » Sat Oct 27, 2007 9:21 pm

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Damolisher wrote:Or built could be the Transformer word for built.

and Sto_Vo, I'll give you that one :P But it's not really in the traditional "Squeezed from a robo-Gina" sense, is it? :P lol.


Yeah I was just busten your B@ll$ :grin:
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