The Energon Pub

So the way things are going in the 3rdp world soon enough it's gonna be that every main classics g1 hasbro release will have it's counter part , personally i find my self thinking i'm content with certain hasbro figures but always end up on the fence deciding if i should get rid and give in to the next best thing that comes my way .

Recently i've been asking myself how far am i willing to go , would i get rid of most/all! of the hasbro figures i have collected over the past five years the ones i waited patiently for at times months or mabey a year to get a hold of and those i paid a little too much for impo to only pay twice or tripple the amount for the same size figure from another company.

I guess i'm just at a point were hasbro doesn't matter anymore if they pull out a good classics figure i'll buy it but i don't see hasbro as the official transformers anymore and i don't care what "real" transformers make my collection as long as i'm content but that's exactly what the 3rdp is all about giving what we don't have or making things better than hasbro , I don't think i can think of a transformer by hasbro that hasn't been upgraded in some fashion in my collection now there is a couple molds i wouldn't part with at the moment but i guess that's because of the upgrades or there is nothing better .

My question is could you totally give up on hasbro for 3rdp figures ?

Nope. 3rd Party figures are nice, but it's few and far between that are hands down better than most Hasbro options. For example, Generations Springer is far and away the better option between he and FP Defender. Much 3rd Party engineering is great, but I prefer not to cringe when transforming and worry about breaking my figures because of the better quality plastics that hold crisper details but lacks the give of Hasbro's.

Most times, given an option, I'll choose Hasbro and not just for price.

No, not a chance. Most times, I go with Hasbro or Takara. Cost alone dictates that. Sure, there are times I go with third-party over the 'official' stuff. But those are few and far between.

The way I collect is I don't care who does the figure, as long as it is (what I feel) the best representation of the character. For example, I have no need for a 3rd party Optimus Prime, as the Takara Voyager Classics Prime is just about a perfect representation ... the same as I feel that FP Defender is my Springer (even though some people love the Classics ... which I do own as Sandstorm and feel no need to replace that figure).

I don't think I would ever stop collecting Hasbro/Takara releases ... unless they either stopped making Classics styled figures or the QC got to a point it wasn't worth spending the money on. As awesome as most 3rd party figures are, there are plenty of Hasbro releases I wait swoon over just as much.

I agree, that I don't particularly care who makes the figure, as long as it is the "best" representation of the character IMO.

I prefer when I can get a Hasbro release, it is easier on the wallet, but I'd rather pay more for a figure I actually want vs less for a figure I feel is a POS.

With the $#!++y plastic and crap designs (I'm literally looking at you FoC Sideswipe) Hasbro has put out recently, I have little faith in them.

I tend to feel designs like Springer are fewer and farther between from them. I'm pleased when they "do it right", but I no longer expect it.

I'm massively disappointed in Trailcutter Turdcutter Trailbreaker, and hope a 3P will do him and Hoist justice. Right now, we have the add on kits coming, and they are vast improvements, but I want to see whole new figures that do these characters justice.

Personally, I think third party manufacturers are way overdoing things lately, and a big sign of that is doing figures Hasbro has already done. Perceptor? Hasbro aready did him. Blurr? Hasbro already did him. I'll give Hegamon some leeway as the Classics figure is rather a departure for such an iconic figure, but for me personally I'll still stick with the Hasbro release.

To me, third party figure should be to augment existing figures (such as with City Commander for Ultra Magnus or the Crossfire figures for Bruticus) or to fill gaps it looks like Hasbro is in no hurry to fill themselves (such as Reflector or Gears).

We're here because we're fans of Transformers. Now I won't try to say that Hasbro is perfect, or never makes any mistakes, but their products are what we are supposed to be fans of. Third party products are great, but they really should be augmentative to a collection, not a complete and total replacement.

Yotsuyasan wrote:Third party products are great, but they really should be augmentative to a collection, not a complete and total replacement.

Basically this.

I love some of my 3rd Party figures - Hercules, Hexatron & FP Insecticons, just to name a few - but most of my 3rd Party items are add-on kits or upgrades. That, to me, is the spirit of 3rd Party: we love the Transformers brand, and here are some things to make that brand better for the fans. And that's all well and good, but there's no way that those 3rd Party companies can supplant the official brand in my mind.

Also, not to say there isn't anything else to criticize HasTak about, but this is one of the best times to be a collector in years (I haven't felt this way since ROTF). Masterpiece is hit after hit (Prowl should be arriving soon, folks!), TF: Prime has had a very good run (especially with First Editions showing up at discounters), and the new Generations voyagers are great. I don't care what people say about Blitzwing - I love him, and he'll be even better with the SXS upgrade (to reinforce my point in the first paragraph). Plus, new Beast Wars figures are coming soon, and the Collector's Club Subscription Service is in full swing (hey, it's not everyone's favorite thing, but it's nice the have those options).

And did I mention Metroplex? METROPLEX!!??

All I'm saying, I guess, is that as much as I love some 3rd Party offerings, there's so much going on with Hasbro right now that it's hard to imagine 3rd Party groups ever replacing my officially branded & cheaper Transformers products.

I think my way of thinking about this comes from me being a toy collector of sorts and not purely a transformers collector which makes me feel no need to play the hasbro is official card and makes me easily want other products and not care about what figures i buy to make my collection .

The first thing that makes me want to collect 3rdp as a whole is each figure has it's own mold and is it's own stand alone figure i can look at my shelf now and see Sunstreaker Red Alert and Sideswipe and it bores me as collector to see so many characters using the same mold and the same can be said for the smokescreen mold (although i love reprolabled prowl) and the same can be said for certain neca prodcts and why i had to stop.

I don't think i can buy any more hasbro repaints i'm just wasting money for a character who just isn't that character the perfect example being DoubleDealer the only exception lately has been Sandstorm , and don't get me wrong as good as the MP line is looking it's all repaints one after another and that's the only reason i can't jump in with the line .

I know hasbro have to get use out of the mold and so on but i guess i'm just passed that point now.

Autobot Genocide wrote:and don't get me wrong as good as the MP line is looking it's all repaints one after another and that's the only reason i can't jump in with the line.

You do realize that the MP redecos exist because the characters share the same, identical character model?

Autobot Genocide wrote:I think my way of thinking about this comes from me being a toy collector of sorts and not purely a transformers collector which makes me feel no need to play the hasbro is official card and makes me easily want other products and not care about what figures i buy to make my collection .

The first thing that makes me want to collect 3rdp as a whole is each figure has it's own mold and is it's own stand alone figure i can look at my shelf now and see Sunstreaker Red Alert and Sideswipe and it bores me as collector to see so many characters using the same mold and the same can be said for the smokescreen mold (although i love reprolabled prowl) and the same can be said for certain neca prodcts and why i had to stop.

I don't think i can buy any more hasbro repaints i'm just wasting money for a character who just isn't that character the perfect example being DoubleDealer the only exception lately has been Sandstorm , and don't get me wrong as good as the MP line is looking it's all repaints one after another and that's the only reason i can't jump in with the line .

I know hasbro have to get use out of the mold and so on but i guess i'm just passed that point now.

I'll agree that Double Dealer is a dumb reuse of the Blitzwing mold... One could have hoped that they could have at least done some major retooling like they did between Springer and Sandstorm to make Double Dealer more unique. I'm hoping a third party might augment him at some point.

As for some of the other figures you mentioned... I think a lot of those were smart mold reuses, and wouldn't have had it any other way. In a lot of those cases, they were figures that shared molds in G1. So if Classics is supposed to be those characters updated, why not use the same molds once again? In the case of Sunstreaker, in G1 he was a different mold from Sideswipe, but they were both Lamborghinis. For the updated figures, they designed the mold to have two different transformations for two unique robot modes. I found that rather smart. I also found it smart in the case of Tracks and Wheeljack, who didn't share a mold in G1 but do now... and yet still manage to have individuality between their modern toys.

You say you're not attached to Hasbro toys as you are a "toy" collector and not a "Transformers" collector. Fine. I can say the same. The majority of my collection is Transfomers (augmented with some third party stuff), but I have other toys as well. I have a plethora of plush penguins. And just to really mess with your seeming dislike of toys that share molds, I love my seven 1/60 scale Macross Vakyries!

But if you throw out all of your Has/Tak toys, don't call it a Transformers collection because that is no longer what it is. Even if it is a collection of toys that are vehicles that turn into robots. I don't consider my Macross Vakyries part of my Transformers collection. And I only consider something like Maketoys Giant Type-61 part of my Transformers collection because it has a large number of official Transformers toys to supply context to the collection they are in.

Otherwise, you're just a collector of converting toys. Which if that is what you want, cool for you and enjoy that. But it isn't a Transformers collection.

I don't think there will ever be a time when third parties replace ALL my TFs. The Pwol bros, Seekers, Sidewipe bros ... there's a lot of official toys that likely won't be replaced by 3rd party figures. And I'm sure there'll be more, although we've gotten to a point where it's getting outside my own area of interest. There's just too many TFs overall for someone to say that 3rd party products will replace everything, especially since they compete directly with each other.

But I'm definitely down for ones that replace official products I don't think are done particularly effectively, especially repaints. Blurr is a great example. Yes, United Blurr does a great job of being Blurr. But I think the new 3rd party offering is even better. It brings something else to the table too - his natural Cybertronian look as opposed to an Earth mode. There's so many you can say something similar about. FP's Stunicons, Top Spin / Twin Twist, Brawn, Beachcomber, Powerglide, Megatron, Superion ... every 3rd party product brings something new to the table that the Hasbro version does not. And that's how it should be, IMO.

As for whether a heave 3rd party collection counts as a TF collection; that's up for debate, I guess. Strictly speaking I guess it doesn't, but the spirit behind it is that of a love for the Transformers franchise and characters. Sort of like buying fan art at a con as opposed to buying official posters. Buying the fan art doesn't make it less a part of your own collection. It just wouldn't be an OFFICIAL Transformers collection.

So i was redoing my classics con and bot shelves and i was taking notice of a few mold/characters i probably wouldn't change and that would be Wheeljack(infact this is the only mold i like reused multiple times Tracks & Battle chargers) , Prowl , bee/cj , springer , Kup , Hound and Cyclonus .

If me having a full 3rdp collection isn't proper then i guess having a few 3rdp figures isn't official either and @ Yotsuyasan, i don't get the excuse to have giant in your collection? .

As for the MP i line know exactly what there about and why they are repaints/tool and in the G1 toy line that was fine but for me now i can't justify buying the same figure again at that price.

Autobot Genocide wrote:@ Yotsuyasan, i don't get the excuse to have giant in your collection?

What part don't you get? Do you not get what I meant by a collection of only third party items couldn't be called a Transformers collection, but third party items within the context of a greater collection of official toys (in my opinion) could be called a Transformers collection? It seemed pretty self explanatory to me.

Only third party ≠ a "Transformers" collection.
Mostly official item augmented with some third party items = good enough for me.

Or did you not get why I would have Giant in the first place?

That seems rather simple, too. Some people may just think Constructicon = Devastator, but to me his six individual components are just as important. So the official alleged Classics Constructicons would be a member short.

Nor would just repuposing another random robot with a construction vehicle alt mode to hang out with them when they aren't combined work. It is important to me that all six members contribute to the gestalt. Heck, Micromaster Devastator was a better update then Classics Devastaor, even with one of his component members only getting to proclaim, "And I'll form the ass!"

So if, in order to have Classics style Constructicons, I need a team of six members, who all combine to form Devastator, there isn't really an official option. It was only Giant or Hercules, and I liked what I saw in Giant better, and thus went with him.

Do I prefer official toys? Whevever possible. A, they're usually less expensive, which is always a plus. B, I like supporting Hasbro (or, on occasion, Takara) as without them we wouldn't have Transformers. And C., I reiterate that, "only third party ≠ a "Transformers" collection." (My opinion, perhaps, but that makes it the most important one in defining my own collection.) But it is important that the toy fits the character.*

Nice to know we at least agree that the Wheeljack / Tracks mold is freakin' awesome, however. If you haven't already gotten them, I'd really recommend the Reprolabels for these two. Really makes them shine.



*Fitting the character does not necessarially mean, "The toy is better!" The iGear Cosmos, for example, is likely a much better toy then the Hasbro Legends one. But the Legends one is official, and fits the character just fine. So he is my Classics Cosmos. (Of course, there is another official one coming out soon, who may soon supplant him...)