The Energon Pub

After seeing the movies a few times, there are some issues that need to be cleared up. First, if Cybertron needed the energy of a sun, why didn't they just go to another planet and build one. Second, they almost made Optimus seem against his own kind by showing how the Decepticons in the Nemesis were worried about the "hatchlings" where as Prime didn't care about baby Transformers.

What I suspect they can do is introduce Unicron as a sort of deactivated planet like Cybertron that happends to be one of the moons of Saturn, which is why they needed earth as it's proximity to the sun and to the moon of Saturn would make sense. Unicron doesn't have to be a robot, it could just be a planet where they can grow the Decepticon armies. This way Prime doesn't seem to be against his own kind and why they can't build one of those machines some place else.

Any thoughts?

Possible solution to the first one.

Perhaps Decepticons reproduce differently than Autobots. We saw female Autobots this one, but no female Decepticons--maybe (IF females are needed for reproduction which is a can of worms I choose not to open at the moment....) the females are essential for the different way they reproduce--hatchlings vs...something else. If the Autobots and Decepticons have been culturally separated for a long enough period of time, they could have developed entirely different cultures and survival strategies, the same way that animal species on different islands are so different. Since the hatchlings looked to me pretty doggone identical, they could quite easily be clones--that is, produced without any genetic variation and thus without females.

Or, Prime didn't worry about hatchlings because the hatchling issue is really an energon issue--I got the feel that the Decepticons were running low on the stuff--endangering the hatchlings, which isn't something the Autobots worried about.

I kind of gathered from Reign of Starscream that Decepticons evolve--drones eventually get personality and/or sentience. For some reason (mainly 'freedom is the right of all sentient beings', I don't think that's how Autobots do it.

I suspect the Decepticon energon shortage is going to play big in the next movie. Or it should, if anything about the third movie is to make any bloody sense with the others. Not really holding my breath for *that* to happen.

HK, of course, I deal with all of this nonsense in my fanfic. Because I'm so bloody *canon*.

I think the harvester on Earth was the last one built. All the other ones were most likely activated and are now useless. The details of making them was probably lost with the ancient Primes.

Optimus knows Megatron, and he knows he's only interested in saving their race so he can use them to conquer the universe. Optimus is protecting the humans first and won't sacrifice them to save Cybertron.

For the 3rd movie I'd like to see what became of all the knowledge Sam got from the Allspark sliver. The Fallen said it could never be destroyed so it must still exist in some way. If they could harness it somehow, they could find a way to restore Cybertron.

In Optimus's defense, I doubt he knew about the hatchlings in the first place.

Evil_the_Nub wrote:For the 3rd movie I'd like to see what became of all the knowledge Sam got from the Allspark sliver. The Fallen said it could never be destroyed so it must still exist in some way. If they could harness it somehow, they could find a way to restore Cybertron.

Not attempting to be rude in anyway here, but I thought it was clear in the movie that when Sam put the Matrix into Prime, all of the power and knowledge passed to Prime.

Counterpunch wrote:

Evil_the_Nub wrote:For the 3rd movie I'd like to see what became of all the knowledge Sam got from the Allspark sliver. The Fallen said it could never be destroyed so it must still exist in some way. If they could harness it somehow, they could find a way to restore Cybertron.

Not attempting to be rude in anyway here, but I thought it was clear in the movie that when Sam put the Matrix into Prime, all of the power and knowledge passed to Prime.

Really? I didn't pick that up, it looked like he just came back to life. I do like the idea though.

One thing that is driving me crazy, is where did these hatchlings come from anyways?

If the allspark gave birth to their race and creates transformers, where did these hatchling come from?

I apologize if it's in the Reign of Starscream, but I haven't read it yet and they don't mention it in the prequel novel so maybe i'm just naive.

well i wouldnt put to much thought in this franchise making any sense or having any kind of coherent story arc... i mean the Fallen came out of nowhere- not even being mentioned in the first one... kind of a big detail if the Fallen is Megatron's sith master.. in this regard Unicron would make more sense coming out of "nowhere" better than the Fallen did... (easy to explain away if he has been in another quadrant of space all this time)

Problem with the third one will be how do they top the 2nd? ANOTHER fight between Prime and Megs to the death?

Bloodlust wrote:One thing that is driving me crazy, is where did these hatchlings come from anyways?

If the allspark gave birth to their race and creates transformers, where did these hatchlings come from?

I apologize if it's in the Reign of Starscream, but I haven't read it yet and they don't mention it in the prequel novel so maybe i'm just naive.

I haven't read the comic either, but I can give a guess:

The Allspark does create TFs, but I think it also gives these TFs the ability to reproduce in order to create a viable, self-sustaining lifeform. That way they have the ability to spread and act like true life, instead of being totally dependant on the Allspark for new individuals.

1. HOW did The Fallen get released from his entrapment!?

2. Why did the Autobots not know about "The Fallen"?

3. What happened to The Matrix.?

4. Where did the hatchlings come from?

5. What exactly is the All Spark, where did it come from?

nikeprime wrote:1. HOW did The Fallen get released from his entrapment!?

2. Why did the Autobots not know about "The Fallen"?

3. What happened to The Matrix.?

4. Where did the hatchlings come from?

5. What exactly is the All Spark, where did it come from?

1. When Megatron killed prime on earth

2. Maybe since he had commid such a heinous act, all record and knowledge of him had been stricken from record

3. I guess when the Fallen Inserted it into the Harvester and Optimus destroyed it, it to was destroyed.

4. The decepticon Stork

5. According to Optimus in the first movie opening scene, Optimus states that "We do not know where it comes from, only that it has the power to create worlds"

I have seen the secd movie a bunch of times now and I have to say that everytime I watch it I start to find more and more wrong things with it. I still love it for what it is but I defintly see some glaring wholes.. I think they need to seriously rethink the human cast and minimize their actual involvement in the movie or at least sharpen it dramatically. As for the Transformer element, I honestly don't who or what I would want to see in it , since if Bay is still attached the cast could be totally out of left field.. I just think they need to have a slightly decreased human element and cut back on the trsformers simply in the vehicle mode" chillin in the background"..That was so irritating

LiKwid wrote:

nikeprime wrote:1. HOW did The Fallen get released from his entrapment!?

2. Why did the Autobots not know about "The Fallen"?

3. What happened to The Matrix.?

4. Where did the hatchlings come from?

5. What exactly is the All Spark, where did it come from?

1. When Megatron killed prime on earth

2. Maybe since he had commid such a heinous act, all record and knowledge of him had been stricken from record

3. I guess when the Fallen Inserted it into the Harvester and Optimus destroyed it, it to was destroyed.

4. The decepticon Stork

5. According to Optimus in the first movie opening scene, Optimus states that "We do not know where it comes from, only that it has the power to create worlds"

I have seen the secd movie a bunch of times now and I have to say that everytime I watch it I start to find more and more wrong things with it. I still love it for what it is but I defintly see some glaring wholes.. I think they need to seriously rethink the human cast and minimize their actual involvement in the movie or at least sharpen it dramatically. As for the Transformer element, I honestly don't who or what I would want to see in it , since if Bay is still attached the cast could be totally out of left field.. I just think they need to have a slightly decreased human element and cut back on the trsformers simply in the vehicle mode" chillin in the background"..That was so irritating

Thanks for some clarification but the answer for the first question is not right. If you read the IDW movie prequels, it shows how Megatron became evil. Megatron got his hands on a excavated stone relic, and the Fallen used it to communicate with Megatron. The Fallen revealed that was TRAPPED in another dimension. The only way he could be freed from his entrapment from this other dimension was for Megatron to find the All Spark. Megatron then goes on to become insane, create his army, and the Great War starts. When megatron is about to get the All Spark, Prime shoots it into space. Megatron follows, gets lost, crashes on earth, gets frozen, and now the first movie starts....so now, HOW DID THE FALLEN GET ON THE SPACE SHIP??

Also, what gets me mad is how they turned the Matrix into a "key". The Matrix is a very important element in Transformers Folklore, it is the essence of Primus himself. I swear they better fix how they screwed it up. If the Matrix did get destroyed, hopefully all its energy and wisdom has been given to prime..... I don't see how you can have the story progress without such a important part of Transformers history.

nikeprime wrote:Also, what gets me mad is how they turned the Matrix into a "key". The Matrix is a very important element in Transformers Folklore, it is the essence of Primus himself. I swear they better fix how they screwed it up. If the Matrix did get destroyed, hopefully all its energy and wisdom has been given to prime..... I don't see how you can have the story progress without such a important part of Transformers history.

I think it's more than a key, the Primes used it as one because it's an important artifact that belongs to them. Therefore no one else could activate the sun harvester without them. It's like a retina scanner, you need your eye to open it, but it doesn't make your eye a key.

The Matrix of leadership is the Key cause potentially killing an entire solar systems lifeforms was a serious decision so they didnt want them getting made and started all willy nilly. I mean snuffing out suns can kill trillions of lifeforms in you have a system with multiple planets with life on them.

Plus it seems emmitt energy that nothing else does, so that has a hand in why The Fallen could just rig the Starharvester to work with out it as it was one part of the machine he couldnt just replicate himself. Otherwise he'd just left and came back once everyone headed out and killed our planet then.

The Fallen was originally supposed be trapped somewhere, which I wish they d kept that angle as the story would made more sense that way. Whether it was a secret tomb in a different part of the desert or another dimension or whatever it atleast explains why he isnt leading the decepticons and megatron is for moment. It might been more cliche have had the trapped ultimate bad guy released, but having the fallen sitting on his butt for last couple 1000 years just makes him look useless.

The cybertronian race needs something to keep it alive, cause as it stands right now the Primes, including optimus have painted themselves into a corner with their well intended but badly done plans that seem be leading them to extinction. While the decepticons unwillingness to be patient and cooperative is the intial blame, though who joined their cause later are almost justified atm the moment. If faced with death of my entire race , I might be desiring kick who ever's butt was responsible for it too. Not say I dont like the bad guys being right on some level in their minds,but the autobots simply hanging out on earth till their time is up and not looking for a solution to their survival just silly.

There needs be some means of saving their race, which can be multiple answers. I thought be a fun way bring in Shockwave is for him decide start harvesting the sparks of autobots as a means converting them into energon. Which there be then decepticons unwilling resort to this or not as some likely would want to live but find the act of eatting their own too vile even for them. Like Starscream and Megatron despite their ruthless nature seem want to keep their own race around(if only to have someone weaker to push around.) as that only be a temporary solution to a long term probelm.

I think it be cool have them bring in another autobot leader like Ultra Magus, Sentinel Prime, Or Prowl. Someone whos been ruling awhile in their own group with in the autobots, and has little attachment to humans, and is more focused on saving their own than being protecting the humans. They came to Earth since they were called, like they be a autobot city settlement (with optional mountain side crash landing.) though only major characters be named, as most of them be defenseless refugees. (perfect for decepticon slaughter.) They question where Primes priorities lie then, as theirs are with cybertron, and the Prime made choices that have damned their race. They are begining lose faith in them, as they are too willing make sacerfices for the greater good of humans not themselves.

So basically I feel third movie should be themed around allegiances as sides will question everything, as I think humans should too. I thought that might be a cool way resolve barricades fate too. He'd be badly damaged Prime in first film. He intially force a human to work on him, which the human does somewhat out of fear, but out of curiousity, as this person would be a sciencist. While barricade begins sees humans as more than insects and doesnt return to decepticons, but wouldnt be caught dead on the autobots side either, but is eventually found by both sides, and forced make choices.