The Energon Pub

Continued from here.

What are your views on reporting drug dealing? Personally, I think people who deal drugs should be locked up, and never seen again.

As I said in the aforementioned thread, PCP, heroin, cocaine, those all make people die from overdose. And for what? For one person's quick, pointless rush, and another person's profit.

People die from legal drugs like tobacco and alcohol too. Nobody is forcing these people to use drugs. If they are willing to pay good money to get themselves high, then so be it. If a few of them wind up dead afterwards, well, no big loss.

Professor Smooth wrote:People die from legal drugs like tobacco and alcohol too. Nobody is forcing these people to use drugs. If they are willing to pay good money to get themselves high, then so be it. If a few of them wind up dead afterwards, well, no big loss.

Lives are ruined and children grow up thinking it's okay to do whatever to survive on mean streets they don't even need to be on.

A good movie to watch is Menace II Society. It's mostly about gang violence, but what's so good about it drug-wise is the way it shows the main character's early childhood, with a violent druggie dad.

If there was some way we could designate certain drugs, like heroin, cocaine, and meth, as off limits and then move in and track down and seize it, and even the people that supply it, it would be only one step toward a cleaner society, but also a police state.

Poverty is the problem. It's the problem to drugs, prostitution, gang violence, and victimizing crimes of all kinds. As long as people are poor, and ignorant of the world, they are angry and desperate.

An attitude of "well, let them get high, it's their bodies" is dangerous, because it's not just them, and it's not just in controled and stable circumstances. I won't even do weed unless I know it's super, super, super smooth sailing for a long time, and only in envioronments that are within my control or my peers' control.

Dark Zarak wrote:

Professor Smooth wrote:People die from legal drugs like tobacco and alcohol too. Nobody is forcing these people to use drugs. If they are willing to pay good money to get themselves high, then so be it. If a few of them wind up dead afterwards, well, no big loss.

Lives are ruined and children grow up thinking it's okay to do whatever to survive on mean streets they don't even need to be on.

A good movie to watch is Menace II Society. It's mostly about gang violence, but what's so good about it drug-wise is the way it shows the main character's early childhood, with a violent druggie dad.

If there was some way we could designate certain drugs, like heroin, cocaine, and meth, as off limits and then move in and track down and seize it, and even the people that supply it, it would be only one step toward a cleaner society, but also a police state.

Poverty is the problem. It's the problem to drugs, prostitution, gang violence, and victimizing crimes of all kinds. As long as people are poor, and ignorant of the world, they are angry and desperate.

An attitude of "well, let them get high, it's their bodies" is dangerous, because it's not just them, and it's not just in controled and stable circumstances. I won't even do weed unless I know it's super, super, super smooth sailing for a long time, and only in envioronments that are within my control or my peers' control.

Yep. Drugs seem to be a lot of risk just for a quick thrill. So are skydiving and bungee jumping.

Poverty definitely plays a factor. But what would you do, since you are in a position to judge people's morals? Some guy lives in the ghetto and is trying to raise three kids. He can't get a job because of some mistakes he made earlier in life. So either he can live on the street and have his kids taken away from him (and believe me, the US adoption system is NOT a great place to be) or he can sell drugs to somebody who is more than willing to pay him and at least try to provide for his family.

It's a terribly sad situation that has no easy answers. You want to get rid of drugs? Take a look at the root problem. People don't really like reality. They come from all over the monetary scale. The dirt poor use drugs to escape the reality that they are dirt poor and life will probably suck for them forever. The spoiled high school brat in the suburbs is bored so he uses coke to get high. The super rich feel like they've done everything there is to do so they use drugs just to try something new.

As for ratting out people I did it for fun.

Back at my parents house in Michigan, I was up late one night, being a night owl, being up late tends to happen, anyway, down the road there is a crack house, the cops have been there numerous times, drug bust, all that stuff.

Anyway, I'm up late, and someone knocks on the door, I answer it, and it's the lady from the crack house, she talks about how her boyfriend hit her, and how she needs a place to stay, and that she didn't want the cops involved, you could see the track-marks in her arm. So being the nice guy that I am, I didn't want to let some crack-head in the house so she could steal my N64. So I told her to hang on a minute, and called the cops.

They came, arrested her for possession, arrested her boyfriend for assault and possession, and I got the best nights sleep of my life.

Edit: Normally, so long as it doesn't affect me or anyone I care about, I don't give a crap if you decide to use drugs. However, once I, or someone I know becomes effected by it, then I turn into an ass.

It needs to be done in some cases.

Infact, I got another better example that I'm currently dealing with.

Since I moved to Fort Wayne, my roommate has gotten a girlfriend, they're like a brother and sister to me. His girlfriend has a niece that usually comes over every now and again, so shes become my niece by proxy.

Anyway, her mother is a meth head, her father(my roommates girlfriend's brother) was a former druggie, he's cleaned up his act and all that stuff. Anyway, she still does drugs, cooks the **** in the kitchen while the niece is there, shes 6 mind you.

Now, due to all this crap, she pulls the most retarded ****, basically she said that the father was touching the niece, so all this crap ensues. Investigation is done, the mother was lying. But the courts are still doing stuff about it, all the while, the entire family on the mothers side is talking about how the mother is still doing meth and all that crap.

So it pisses me off. You hear about how the stuff happens to kids, and you get disgusted by how the parents could do that. It's even more so when it's someone you know, tripled if it's a child.

My take:

The Avatar of Man wrote:I know quite a few guys that deal in marijanna that really just stay in their normal circle and are perfectly nice guys. If they were in a gang and had a violent agenda, then sure I'd rat, but they're not-- they're just a few perfectly respectable people that like to get high now and then. The mode of right transcends law, and, in my code, if you keep peacefully to your own, then so be it. I'd personally feel like **** if I ever ratted on any of them.

I personally don't believe in the banning of any substance or the outlawing of an entire species of organism because of the holucenagenic effects it has on people-- regulation and education, probably, but incarceration no-- when you consider we now have 2 million people in our prison systems, half of which there for drug violations, you realize something isn't working.

EDIT: If you want to end most of the 'drug epidemic' in ten years, make everything legal and start pulling money from the prisons and into rehab and education. The tobacco companies cash in and pump the stuff out cheap so there's no more mystique or 'cool factor' or massive profit gain for dealing, and people soon realize for themselves it's no big deal.

Professor Smooth wrote:Poverty definitely plays a factor. But what would you do, since you are in a position to judge people's morals? Some guy lives in the ghetto and is trying to raise three kids. He can't get a job because of some mistakes he made earlier in life. So either he can live on the street and have his kids taken away from him (and believe me, the US adoption system is NOT a great place to be) or he can sell drugs to somebody who is more than willing to pay him and at least try to provide for his family.

It's a terribly sad situation that has no easy answers. You want to get rid of drugs? Take a look at the root problem. People don't really like reality. They come from all over the monetary scale. The dirt poor use drugs to escape the reality that they are dirt poor and life will probably suck for them forever. The spoiled high school brat in the suburbs is bored so he uses coke to get high. The super rich feel like they've done everything there is to do so they use drugs just to try something new.

I'm in the position to judge people's morals who show less sense than I do.

Such as the subject of this:

Senor Hugo wrote:Since I moved to Fort Wayne, my roommate has gotten a girlfriend, they're like a brother and sister to me. His girlfriend has a niece that usually comes over every now and again, so shes become my niece by proxy.

Anyway, her mother is a meth head, her father(my roommates girlfriend's brother) was a former druggie, he's cleaned up his act and all that stuff. Anyway, she still does drugs, cooks the **** in the kitchen while the niece is there, shes 6 mind you.

Now, due to all this crap, she pulls the most retarded ****, basically she said that the father was touching the niece, so all this crap ensues. Investigation is done, the mother was lying. But the courts are still doing stuff about it, all the while, the entire family on the mothers side is talking about how the mother is still doing meth and all that crap.

So it pisses me off. You hear about how the stuff happens to kids, and you get disgusted by how the parents could do that. It's even more so when it's someone you know, tripled if it's a child.

Children are around it. Adults who can't get away easily or practically are around it. Therefore it's bad and a stop should be put to it. It's that simple. Can the same case be made for marijuana and tobacco? Alchohol? Perhaps so. That's why I don't smoke either one. I've just eaten a few weed brownies, when I was around none but my own age, who were doing worse, so no one got hurt from my actions at least. I also don't drink around people who aren't drinking.

Professor Smooth wrote:Yep. Drugs seem to be a lot of risk just for a quick thrill. So are skydiving and bungee jumping.

Do you drag your kids skydiving with you?

u do the crime u do the time. if ur gonna be stupid and do/sell drugs then u deserve to be punished to the full extent of the law.

Bombus distinguendus wrote:u do the crime u do the time. if ur gonna be stupid and do/sell drugs then u deserve to be punished to the full extent of the law.

But is the law making it a crime just?

The Avatar of Man wrote:

Bombus distinguendus wrote:u do the crime u do the time. if ur gonna be stupid and do/sell drugs then u deserve to be punished to the full extent of the law.

But is the law making it a crime just?

Are the laws against drinking and driving just?

personally I couldn't give a crap if someone gets high. there's alot of pot and mushrooms in my town, they really don't bother me, aside from the ones that sit outside the coffee shops and ask for money (and they're often times not poor or homeless either)

I still stand by what I originally said. What good ever came from snitching? Theres nothing wrong with knowing people who do drugs. Don't go assuming Im siding with druggies because "I've probably done drugs before, etc, etc" Im straight edge, I dont do drugs or drink but tons of my friends do and I really dont see why people get their panties in a bunch over what someone else does. Im not trying to start ****, I just think people should worry less about other peoples business / lives and focus on themselves for a change. Nothing pisses me off more than someone whose too caught up with other peoples lives than their own.

Loose lips sink ships, nuff said.

Prowl20 wrote:I still stand by what I originally said. What good ever came from snitching? Theres nothing wrong with knowing people who do drugs. Don't go assuming Im siding with druggies because "I've probably done drugs before, etc, etc" Im straight edge, I dont do drugs or drink but tons of my friends do and I really dont see why people get their panties in a bunch over what someone else does. Im not trying to start ****, I just think people should worry less about other peoples business / lives and focus on themselves for a change. Nothing pisses me off more than someone whose too caught up with other peoples lives than their own.

Loose lips sink ships, nuff said.

Yes yes, and you can slap a jap by buying war bonds. This isn't WW2.

Also, what you're saying is, if a friend of yours is doing drugs around a child, you would just do nothing.

Prowl20 wrote:I still stand by what I originally said. What good ever came from snitching? Theres nothing wrong with knowing people who do drugs. Don't go assuming Im siding with druggies because "I've probably done drugs before, etc, etc" Im straight edge, I dont do drugs or drink but tons of my friends do and I really dont see why people get their panties in a bunch over what someone else does. Im not trying to start ****, I just think people should worry less about other peoples business / lives and focus on themselves for a change. Nothing pisses me off more than someone whose too caught up with other peoples lives than their own.

Loose lips sink ships, nuff said.

Tell me that after you've watched a dopehead intentionaly stick his hand into a running grinder and realised that he could have gotten someone else hurt just as easily.

Jar Axel wrote:

The Avatar of Man wrote:

Bombus distinguendus wrote:u do the crime u do the time. if ur gonna be stupid and do/sell drugs then u deserve to be punished to the full extent of the law.

But is the law making it a crime just?

Are the laws against drinking and driving just?

Depends on where you go. In such case, it's to keep the public safe...

But the point I'm making is that Bombus distinguendus is saying that by breaking a given law the punishment is deserved, but such case is no plain cut-- laws have been wrong in the past, and to blindly say 'he broke the law, so he should go to jail' is unsensible. First question for what purpose the law was made and what it fulfills before deciding whether someone should be punished for breaking it.

As long as something is used by a single person making a personal choice, and with consequences that doesn't cross into an issue of public safety, then I fail to see why the total banning of certain substances is reasonable. Regulation.

One word Avatar responsability, or in the case of the vast majority of users it's the lack there of.

I hate to say it, but this is what the entire issue boils down to:

Helen Lovejoy wrote:Won't somebody please think of the children???

Jar Axel wrote:One word Avatar responsability, or in the case of the vast majority of users it's the lack there of.

Might you be a bit more descript? I'd agree outside a personal sphere, but if this is getting stoned alone in your basement and passing out for a few hours, then who cares. Doesn't appeal to me, but I don't see why the 'keep to yourself and I'll leave you alone' mentality doesn't work here.

Senor Hugo wrote:

Prowl20 wrote:I still stand by what I originally said. What good ever came from snitching? Theres nothing wrong with knowing people who do drugs. Don't go assuming Im siding with druggies because "I've probably done drugs before, etc, etc" Im straight edge, I dont do drugs or drink but tons of my friends do and I really dont see why people get their panties in a bunch over what someone else does. Im not trying to start ****, I just think people should worry less about other peoples business / lives and focus on themselves for a change. Nothing pisses me off more than someone whose too caught up with other peoples lives than their own.

Loose lips sink ships, nuff said.

Yes yes, and you can slap a jap by buying war bonds. This isn't WW2.

Also, what you're saying is, if a friend of yours is doing drugs around a child, you would just do nothing.

I'm pretty sure he meant in the context of knowing someone who does drugs for recreation, as opposed to knowing an individual consumed by a habit that takes a horrendous toll on loved ones, friends and family. Then again, I could be wrong..

My general opinion, as far as people and partaking in illegal narcotic consumption goes, is a bit varied depending on the particular situation. Obviously my mindset on the matter would differ from a person who regularly enjoys smoking marijuana (which I tend to view as generally harmless, and can be labeled as a "it's their body" scenerio) to a person who has set down a self-destructive path of cocaine or heroin addiction which will only snowball into catastrophy, especially when the person isn't simply destroying themselves but causing anguish for the people around them. Certainly the situations Senor Hugo has experienced would merit, even downright benefit the alerting of law enforcement. Nothing is sadder than a child being in an unhealthy environment where one or both parents are addicts.