The Energon Pub

[Kurona]

It's supposed to be an establishing shot and a pan to show us the scale of the war.
The problem is it's way too long for a five-minute video, and since the animation is bad - whatever excuses they may or may not have - it's not very nice to look at. If you have bad animation you need a good story or dialogue to distract from that, so when you have a full 1/5th of your episode be nothing but that animation... yyyyyyeah. Not impressive.

[william-james88]

Given the weak animation models and all, is Rodimus supposed to be Hot Rod or actually Rodimus Prime

Neither, he is just Rodimus. Just like in the IDW comics.

Starscream's Prelude called him "Rodimus Prime", around the 1:10 mark:

Schooled again!

Though that makes it one more big deviation from the comics.

Wait, does this mean he would have the matrix of leadership?

This was my take away as well. Why are we wasting so much time watching Starscream enter?

To save money on animation, which is the most expensive part.

Reminds me of that scene in ROTF where Optimus Transforming is covered by a tarp flapping around to save on that costly CG.

[Sabrblade]

Given the weak animation models and all, is Rodimus supposed to be Hot Rod or actually Rodimus Prime

Neither, he is just Rodimus. Just like in the IDW comics.

Starscream's Prelude called him "Rodimus Prime", around the 1:10 mark:

Schooled again!

Though that makes it one more big deviation from the comics.

Wait, does this mean he would have the matrix of leadership?

One would wonder, but his face is his younger Hot Rod face instead of his wrinkled Rodimus Prime face. So, who knows what's up.

[william-james88]

So, who knows what's up.

Sounds like the perfect review for this seriesso far

[Windsweeper]

I think you could completely ignore episode 1 and this would work as the first episode.

My only issues so far are the voices of Menasor and Starscream and the inclusion of Windblade. I'm sick of her getting forced down our throats all the time.

It's nice to see a G1 cartoon after all this time. However it really doesn't feel like it's aimed at an older audience.

[Sabrblade]

It's nice to see a G1 cartoon after all this time. However it really doesn't feel like it's aimed at an older audience.

Ah, but don't you see? Older audiences need things like uber violence, death, murder, vengeance, politics, bureaucracy, agony, and all those other "gritty and mature" things that are totally not kiddie and childish, for realz yo!

Things like joy, fun, and comedy are for babies! Adult stuff is hardcore SERIOUS BUSINESS!

[william-james88]

I think you could completely ignore episode 1 and this would work as the first episode.

My only issues so far are the voices of Menasor and Starscream and the inclusion of Windblade. I'm sick of her getting forced down our throats all the time.

It's nice to see a G1 cartoon after all this time. However it really doesn't feel like it's aimed at an older audience.

I think older just means 10+, which is the age range Hasbro has given to the definition of an "older" fan in the past. Hence why it doesnt feel more mature. But then again, we dont need anything "adult" when it comes to Transformers. As a mater of fact, I would rather the Michael Bay films be less "adult" and stray away from bodily fluid jokes and ass shots (which thankfully AOE conceded in a way).

[o.supreme]

It's nice to see a G1 cartoon after all this time. However it really doesn't feel like it's aimed at an older audience.

Ah, but don't you see? Older audiences need things like uber violence, death, murder, vengeance, politics, bureaucracy, agony, and all those other "gritty and mature" things that are totally not kiddie and childish, for realz yo!

Things like joy, fun, and comedy are for babies! Adult stuff is hardcore SERIOUS BUSINESS!

I know you are saying all this in jest Sabrblade but honestly...I think there has to be a balance. Its almost like the Teen Titans Go! episode "Serious Business". There are a contingent of fans that think everything should be dark & gritty. The only problem is...when TTG poked fun at those fans, it unfortunately bled over to those like myself. I loved the Young Justice animated series, because it had quite bit of serious drama for an action cartoon, but it had lighter moments as well. Ones that played in naturally, not just for the sake of adding comedy just because.

The problem now is most series are just flat out dumb, because they think kids are dumb. And the adult fans react often honestly with "we want a serious show"...so we get TF:CW.

There has to be a balance, and responding to complaints with insults in your work is not the way to go. (referring to TTG) To me Young Justice represents the pinnacle of a well written action animated series that has not been seen since Batman: TAS. I know we should not expect much from a low budget web micro-series, but one of the most frustrating things I have always said about being a Transformers fan is...things change, even when they are successful. Since the Original Series ended, the brand has changed consistently about every 3 years or so (give or take) whether the results were great, horrible or indifferent. If something is working...why not keep it going for 4, 5 or more years? I still say GI:Joe Resolute is a shining example of what an adult oriented Micro-series can be, as it is the single best animated incarnation of GI Joe ever, and yes it tends to be on the violent side at times, but not JUST for the sake of being violent. Before CW started I was in high anticipation of it, and I still am, but some of the naysayers make some good points. It will be truly unfortunate if Hasbro responds to criticism with..."well we tried that...and it failed... so were not going to do that anymore" because you know what ...no they REALLY didn't...not in the way I believe many of us wanted it to be.

[Tyrannacon]

Do what you guys want here of course, but I think the time for venturing forth an actual honest to goodness in-depth critique aimed at the series, other than the "too short" argument, probably should be after the entirety of this series has been shown and we watched it all in one sitting. I've always felt like that's how web series like this should best be viewed or so. 5 minutes can tell you a lot of course, but with a web series it is vastly different in some ways too from a television show and that kind of audience.

Also, yeah, I do have a fear of if there's too much "non-nonsensical griping, moaning, complaining" about it Hasbro will never again make an attempt to placate a bit to the older fans in terms of animation stuff.

On the other hand, I could be vastly wrong and all that. I accept that as well.

[Sabrblade]

At least we've got Rescue Bots to give us our current fill of an intelligently and cleverly-written TF cartoon.

[Kurona]

At least we've got a ton of other fiction outside of Transformers that's good to enjoy

Honestly if this is crap - which it is - I'm not really losing sleep over it. It's a real shame, but at least I have IDW which to me is of consistent quality. ... even if some parts - ironically, Combiner Wars - were pretty bad.

And hey, RiD (2015) isn't bad either. I mean, it's not amazing - and it's certainly a lot less shy than TFP and Animated about advertising new toys - but it's still relatively entertaining.

Heck, if anything, we're currently in a period where we almost universally have good Transformers Fiction. IDW is amazing, Rescue Bots is surprisingly great, and RiD... err... is pretty good. And then the whole Power of the Titan Masters booklet thing was adorably cute and cheesy. Combiner Wars is just that one little smear on an otherwise incredible track record until movie 5 hits us next year

[william-james88]

a web series it is vastly different in some ways too from a television show and that kind of audience.

I dont watch series on the interwebs much so I dont know how they are supposed to go but I assumed that when you only have 5 minutes, you make the most of it. Like not spend one fifth with nothing happening and establishing that that events are taking place on a place you already knew it took place in (ie Cybertron).

So tell me Tyrannacon, am I right in assuming that, or do other web series also spend a lot of time with not much going on during their 5 minutes of material?

[Sabrblade]

a web series it is vastly different in some ways too from a television show and that kind of audience.

I dont watch series on the interwebs much so I dont know how they are supposed to go but I assumed that when you only have 5 minutes, you make the most of it. Like not spend one fifth with nothing happening and establishing that that events are taking place on a place you already knew it took place in (ie Cybertron).

Yeah, even something like Thomas the Tank Engine could tell an endearing and intelligent enough story within its original 5-minute time constraint back in its early seasons (can't comment on the later CG seasons, only grew up on the early seasons and haven't seen as much of the later ones), and it barely ever even had any interconnected plots across multiple episodes.

When your supposedly high grade expensive and serious adult cartoon is outdone by a simplistic preschool show of the same time length from over 30 years ago, Machinima, you might want to start re-evaluating which aspects you prioritize in your product.

[frogbat]

This episode, I think, was slightly better than the last if only because we understand more about the context of the setting. Again, though the pacing and priorities of the directions are just strange. In a five minute long episode why, again, do we spend almost a minute and a half of the episode, almost a quarter of the run time, on establishing shots and Starscream in an elevator. These shots don't correspond to anything Starscream says about the situation getting worse, and are borderline filler.

I couldn't agree more with this.. same with the first episode fight - takes up too much time of a 5 minute episode.

Also yea re your point about the toy ads - it has felt for a while that hasbro didn't realise how well the combiner line would turn out. Since the generations line started, from combiners onwards I've felt that the line could've has easily crossed over from collectors to new child fans as the transformations were simple and fun, and the combining gimmick is always cool. They could've throne more behind the line in marketing and maybe succeeded where prime failed.

[Bumblevivisector]

a web series it is vastly different in some ways too from a television show and that kind of audience.

I dont watch series on the interwebs much so I dont know how they are supposed to go but I assumed that when you only have 5 minutes, you make the most of it. Like not spend one fifth with nothing happening and establishing that that events are taking place on a place you already knew it took place in (ie Cybertron).

Yeah, even something like Thomas the Tank Engine could tell an endearing and intelligent enough story within its original 5-minute time constraint back in its early seasons (can't comment on the later CG seasons, only grew up on the early seasons and haven't seen as much of the later ones), and it barely ever even had any interconnected plots across multiple episodes.

When your supposedly high grade expensive and serious adult cartoon is outdone by a simplistic preschool show of the same time length from over 30 years ago, Machinima, you might want to start re-evaluating which aspects you prioritize in your product.

Since we're talking about how to do an action cartoon for an established property properly despite a short run-time for each installment, the first one that springs to my mind is Genndy Tartakovsky's Clone Wars, which several Star Wars fans my age still prefer over over the CG Clone Wars. Of course, that series followed Samurai Jack's tack of keeping stories simple enough to be understood regardless of cultural and language barriers, resulting in several episodes with no dialogue at all. Yet that was doable largely because viewers could be presumed familiar with the setup and most of the characters from SW Episode 2, an advantage you can't have when the tiny episodes have to set up a new universe, something this series is still struggling with even after 2 installments. Even the characters fans should be most familiar with are acting a tad unusual, and this is probably the most complex political situation we've had in TF cartoon to date...

I guess I'm saying the format may have doomed this from the start; I like where Machinima's trying to go, but they bit off way more than they could chew in 5-minute bites.

[o.supreme]

At least we've got Rescue Bots to give us our current fill of an intelligently and cleverly-written TF cartoon.

The only problem is, despite all that... it is written for small children, and satisfies the entertainment values of them. My son loved it from ages 6-9, now that he is 10, he is pretty much over it, but I encouraged him to see it through to the end whenever season 4 hits Netflix. It is not a bad series, as an adult fan however, it just offers nothing for me.

[Tyrannacon]

a web series it is vastly different in some ways too from a television show and that kind of audience.

I dont watch series on the interwebs much so I dont know how they are supposed to go but I assumed that when you only have 5 minutes, you make the most of it. Like not spend one fifth with nothing happening and establishing that that events are taking place on a place you already knew it took place in (ie Cybertron).

So tell me Tyrannacon, am I right in assuming that, or do other web series also spend a lot of time with not much going on during their 5 minutes of material?

Yeah, you're correct absolutely. My main point I was personally trying to drive here is that the expectations are and can be different say, versus a big budget cartoon series airing on television in some ways. Even though, yes, that is not always the case. I don't know what Machima's budget with this was or what organ they had to sell to get the rights and okay from Hasbro to do it. So I'm trying to be "fair" as much as I can manage here.

That's the difference with this series, but I think that might be because someone is intending it all to be "seen at once" instead of "an episode at a time". From the other web series I've watched (before was like Mortal Kombat Legacy Season 1 actually and a few others) they did make use of the time rather efficiently with some exposition and what not. Season 2 of MK: Legacy, all sorts of meh to me, but to each their own on that one I guess.

CW I do feel is not adequately using their time effectively and that's kind of my issue with it in some ways, but I guess I'm working with lower expectations here due to the fact of it being a web series and not as big budget as a full 13-20 episode run of a bigger-budget cartoon series. I mean with the run time of the episodes being what they are and how they're snail's pace I'd rather judge it from the finished product instead of the little scraps we're getting right now. I think that's how the creators intend it to be viewed anyways, but that's a massive assumption on my part given the length of episodes and how slow it is.

Then again, admittedly, I can be totally wrong and I'm fine with that. Especially if it's how I'm wrapping my head around it all. I just figured I'd put it all forth in case of a "food for thought" kind of deal. It very well can resolve itself to being a big giant pile of excrement once it is over.

Yeah, even something like Thomas the Tank Engine could tell an endearing and intelligent enough story within its original 5-minute time constraint back in its early seasons (can't comment on the later CG seasons, only grew up on the early seasons and haven't seen as much of the later ones), and it barely ever even had any interconnected plots across multiple episodes.

When your supposedly high grade expensive and serious adult cartoon is outdone by a simplistic preschool show of the same time length from over 30 years ago, Machinima, you might want to start re-evaluating which aspects you prioritize in your product.

Can't comment on that, but I'll take your word for it. At least you weren't into Teletubbies, those things are just a bunch of no and EVIL! Kind of like clowns for me.

Since we're talking about how to do an action cartoon for an established property properly despite a short run-time for each installment, the first one that springs to my mind is Genndy Tartakovsky's Clone Wars, which several Star Wars fans my age still prefer over over the CG Clone Wars. Of course, that series followed Samurai Jack's tack of keeping stories simple enough to be understood regardless of cultural and language barriers, resulting in several episodes with no dialogue at all. Yet that was doable largely because viewers could be presumed familiar with the setup and most of the characters from SW Episode 2, an advantage you can't have when the tiny episodes have to set up a new universe, something this series is still struggling with even after 2 installments. Even the characters fans should be most familiar with are acting a tad unusual, and this is probably the most complex political situation we've had in TF cartoon to date...

I guess I'm saying the format may have doomed this from the start; I like where Machinima's trying to go, but they bit off way more than they could chew in 5-minute bites.

Tartakovsky's Clone Wars I had the same issue with that I have with this, run time, but it did use time more efficiently than what Machima's doing right here and right now though. I'll gladly concede that point. It's kind of where I appreciate the CG series for CW more. Even though I am in the older crowd actually.

On the other hand here, Machima is making references to IDW G1 with the aim of this series, but it's very much different from the comic. I don't know and can't recognize if other G1 sources are being used here possibly? Puzzled on this one because I never read all the Marvel comics myself. Sabr you seem to know more than me here actually, so you can correct me if I'm wrong here, I'll happily yield to you here. Not a problem at all. Where Machima is having weak sauce is where they've changed characters like Windblade and have wooden/common tropes for others (Mistress of Flame) of these established characters that are nothing like their IDW G1 counterparts with no exposition. Starscream is somewhat different, Rodimus not so much. It makes me wonder how they're going to handle Optimus or Megatron in the end.

I'll gladly eat my own words if I'm totally wrong on this though. I'm definitely aiming to be humble here and try to stay reasonable (or my definition of).

[Galactic Prime]

I've seriously never been disappointed by Transformers this much before it's strange for me.

it is isn't it. But don't worry I've had my fair share of disappointments (Beast Machines, Armada, Animated). they come and go. If you are patient, while another spectrum of the fandom is being catered to, it will come back around to what you like, just might take a few years. Combiner Wars was definitely not what I was expecting but I am enjoying it whilst all other parts of the medium aren't really "my thing" right now. Prime was amazing, and I don't expect to see another series as great, at least as far as what I'm looking for, for another decade or so. So, while CW is far form perfect, I'll take what little scraps I can get until Transformers decides to do something again mainstream more to my liking.

Btw what's wrong with Armada? if it wasn't for Armada....we finally wouldn't have gotten a Unicron toy! nor a Tidal Wave one either! nor would we have got the Armada videogame that everyone....well....almost everyone....seemed to love at the time....& maybe there's a few that still love it today as well).

It was a terrible show with a terrible toyline. Not much else to say.

hey armada was amazing, it was beast wars and armada that was the reason I grew up liking transformers.

Armada, like the rest of the Unicron Trilogy was total garbage animation wise. The lines had some cool toys, but the cartoons were terrible.

[Sabrblade]

Clone Wars is another very good example to compare this to. Someone on another board brought up the same show and wrote this really good write up abouth ow Clone Wars's first episode had done more in its five minutes than both of these two episodes so far have done:

A minute and 30 seconds. That's how long the establishing shot was in episode 2. In that minute and a half, Starscream flies to a building and lands. That's it. For comparison, I watched the first 5 minutes of the old Clone Wars cartoon (the Tartakovsky one, aka the best thing to come from the prequels). In those 5 minutes, there was a similar scene that ends the first episode. It took 30 seconds and was filled with establishing moments for multiple characters. Anakin is taking off in his Jedi Fighter for his mission. Anakin throws his robe and it flies into C-3PO's face establishing him as comic relief. Anakin then gets into the fighter and takes off, but pauses when he sees Padme in a window. They have a moment of farewell establishing that they care about each other.

My point is, putting aside the quality of the rest of the show, Machinima is wasting it's very short runtime on long and boring establishing shots that has no importance or character to it.

On the other hand here, Machima is making references to IDW G1 with the aim of this series, but it's very much different from the comic. I don't know and can't recognize if other G1 sources are being used here possibly? Puzzled on this one because I never read all the Marvel comics myself. Sabr you seem to know more than me here actually, so you can correct me if I'm wrong here, I'll happily yield to you here. Not a problem at all.

Aside from IDW G1, the only direct references to other TF media I see are the way Computron speaks being like how he spoke in the G1 cartoon (right down to his particular use of the word "Datum"), and how Optimus has just one Autobot symbol only on his left shoulder (as opposed to him having a pair of symbols with one on each shoulder), which was a design feature popularized by his G1 cartoon character model (whenever it wasn't mis-animated off-model).

[Sunstar]

I think the reason for the long Starscream flight intro is, because it's Starscream.

Starscream's vanity is actually captured in the way he flies. It screams his manner of showing off simply that he would use that entrance as opposed to flying in where the shot came in. It does convey his nature. Or at least that is how I view it.

The fact Prime did not say anything is more powerful than him actually speaking at that point.

[Tyrannacon]

Thanks Sabr, I knew I was missing something there.

I think the reason for the long Starscream flight intro is, because it's Starscream.

Starscream's vanity is actually captured in the way he flies. It screams his manner of showing off simply that he would use that entrance as opposed to flying in where the shot came in. It does convey his nature. Or at least that is how I view it.

The fact Prime did not say anything is more powerful than him actually speaking at that point.

This is true, Actually the ego is so much portrayed in those shots that it's probably why it didn't bother me like it has with others. Thanks for voicing something I just kept to myself and otherwise didn't think too much of and just accepted as part of the character and creative choice.

[Sabrblade]

Saw this and thought it was funny:

[Tyrannacon]

Those comics are hilarious to me. Heh. Accurate too as well sadly.

[BattleConvoy]

It's nice to see a G1 cartoon after all this time. However it really doesn't feel like it's aimed at an older audience.

Ah, but don't you see? Older audiences need things like uber violence, death, murder, vengeance, politics, bureaucracy, agony, and all those other "gritty and mature" things that are totally not kiddie and childish, for realz yo!

Things like joy, fun, and comedy are for babies! Adult stuff is hardcore SERIOUS BUSINESS!

I wonder what the rating will be......

[Tyrannacon]

It's nice to see a G1 cartoon after all this time. However it really doesn't feel like it's aimed at an older audience.

Ah, but don't you see? Older audiences need things like uber violence, death, murder, vengeance, politics, bureaucracy, agony, and all those other "gritty and mature" things that are totally not kiddie and childish, for realz yo!

Things like joy, fun, and comedy are for babies! Adult stuff is hardcore SERIOUS BUSINESS!

I wonder what the rating will be......

Actually, I kind of hate when things are "over dramatized" with the mature series. Like take The Walking Dead and the newer Battlestar Galactica. Both really annoyed me due to it being "too much" of the drama where it feels very ridiculous, but also subsequently stupid in some ways too. So I am kinda glad that's not been the case with TF media at least so far. That may be my own personal taste though. I love a little bit of camp and cheese to go around in ridiculous situations sometimes.