The Energon Pub

... wow...i smell Beast Machines already.

If they do go with animation then PLEASE dont use that god awful flash style that seems to be everywhere at the moment. Proper hand drawn by people who love what they are doing.

Rated X wrote:TF Prime was very kid oriented in my opinion. I’m old school and don’t judge it by today’s parents standards. If you’re one of those new wave parents who censors everything your kids watch just because it’s not the care bears, then maybe it’s not kid oriented. Society’s changed so much in 30 years, parents these days have ruined the joy of being a kid.

How exactly are extreme violence and an obsession with death and murder "kid-oriented"? The creators have gone on record of stating that all that was put in for the older audiences, not for the kids.

The only kids who love that kind of stuff are the messed up ones.

Rated X wrote:No actually it would make it more like the G1 cartoon. All the cartoons back in the days were like this. GI Joe, He-Man, TMNT, Gargoyles, etc. Every episode doesn’t need to be part of a 3 month saga. It’s not a comic book, it’s a cartoon.

Good quality cartoons these days actually bother to tell a story and develop its characters long term. It's called letting a show grow and enhance over time. The only cartoons that don't do that these days are the kiddie comedy shows like Spongebob and such, and those cartoon are already the dominant variety of childrens cartoons on television. Action cartoons, or cartoons that at least have a good vs. evil setup, are becoming more and more scarce as fewer and fewer people are willing to do them these days.

Also, of your examples, Gargoyles totally had ongoing plots and development.

Rated X wrote:CG graphics cartoons are not all that awesome to me. I didn’t like them in Beast Wars either. It really limits the cartoon especially with characters. CG graphics are great if you are going to drop a 2 hour movie with a 100 million dollar budget. But the cost and time needed outweighs it’s value in a cartoon series in my opinion. Call me 2D if you want, but maybe my lack of interest in CG graphics stems from the fact that I don’t like or care about today’s video games either. Give me NES or Super Nintendo and I’m good. Once again, I’m old school. I don’t need no damn CG graphics. Give me 100 characters in regular animation instead.

Like I said, 2D animation is a go, so you do at least have that to look forward to.

Mechastrike wrote:... wow...i smell Beast Machines already.

That doesn't make any sense. They said they wanted to make the next one lighter toned. Beast Machines was a darker tone from its predecessor.

Rated X wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:

Rated X wrote:"will be more geared toward a younger audience"

Can you get any more "younger" than TF Prime without it being Rescue bots or Animated ???

Uh, yeah.

TF: Prime was barely kid-friendly.

Rated X wrote:How about you just give us G1 using the classics line as the animation models with all new stories ? No more sagas, just a full season of 30 minute adventures that aren't really linked to each other so you can watch them in any order.

In other words, Spongebob with Transformers.

Rated X wrote:And screw CG graphics ! Go with regular animation so we can get 50 characters instead of 15.

Don't worry, 2D animation is a go.

TF Prime was very kid oriented in my opinion. I’m old school and don’t judge it by today’s parents standards. If you’re one of those new wave parents who censors everything your kids watch just because it’s not the care bears, then maybe it’s not kid oriented. Society’s changed so much in 30 years, parents these days have ruined the joy of being a kid.

No actually it would make it more like the G1 cartoon. All the cartoons back in the days were like this. GI Joe, He-Man, TMNT, Gargoyles, etc. Every episode doesn’t need to be part of a 3 month saga. It’s not a comic book, it’s a cartoon.

CG graphics cartoons are not all that awesome to me. I didn’t like them in Beast Wars either. It really limits the cartoon especially with characters. CG graphics are great if you are going to drop a 2 hour movie with a 100 million dollar budget. But the cost and time needed outweighs it’s value in a cartoon series in my opinion. Call me 2D if you want, but maybe my lack of interest in CG graphics stems from the fact that I don’t like or care about today’s video games either. Give me NES or Super Nintendo and I’m good. Once again, I’m old school. I don’t need no damn CG graphics. Give me 100 characters in regular animation instead.

Oh man, I totally agree, Rated X. In my opinion CG is crap, 2D's better. Plus we've seen enough Bay-inspired Transformers these last years, so I'd like a G1-esque cartoon again.

And yea, Sabrblade, I know: "2D is a go!".

Definitely some curious and interesting responses about this. What I'm wondering is how many of you giving feed-back DON'T have children? From my way of thinking, those that don't have no justification for your reactions or input on this and since I'm quite sure that NONE of you fall within the demographic that these shows are originally intended for, your complaints are even less valid.

Not trying to be a total jerk about this ( I never try, it just comes naturally) but I'm simply hoping to get some folks to step back and think for a moment about where Hasbro is coming from. You may not understand their approach and it may piss you off, but it's being done for a reason and as a parent I have no problems with the "Why" of their actions and I can totally see where Prime and Prime:BH would be too intense for the age group that falls between Rescue Bots and the low end of the Prime demographic. Those who can't step out of the "adult" mindset or who aren't parents can't possibly grasp that concept.
Yes, I'm a fan but I harbor no illusions that the adult Fandom has the influence that many of you seem to think it does so you may as well not bitch about the changes and just roll with it. It's not like you can do anything about it anyways. You'll be a lot happier with yourselves and the show though if you at least take the time to understand WHY it's happening instead of wallowing in selfish misery.

Guys, calm down. This is doen by the exact same people that did Prime, remember what they said about TFPrime back when it was first announced?
Remember what all the promo-material said and what the show looked like based on it?

TF Prime was sold to us as another dumb kids show, in fact it sounded like something from the AEC era of shows with all that talk of "special bonds" and each kid having a "guardian they're linked to". And how the show focused on Bumblebee, what it means to be a Prime and all the lessons children would learn at the end of each episode.

Part of why Prime was so surprising, shocking and dark to us was because we were expecting a cross over between a neutered Digimon and the freaking Care bears.

This time next year they'll show us a teaser scene using crappy unfinished horrid looking animation of Bumblebee doing something silly, just to then have the first episode open with Wheeljack getting ripped apart and eaten. You'll see.

Dead Metal wrote:This time next year they'll show us a teaser scene using crappy unfinished horrid looking animation of Bumblebee doing something silly, just to then have the first episode open with Wheeljack getting ripped apart and eaten. You'll see.

Love this!

How can I get involved in the show? I have a BA in film/video with a concentration in traditional animation. I grew up with generation 1. I can help with voice acting too. Who do I contact?

T-Macksimus wrote:Definitely some curious and interesting responses about this. What I'm wondering is how many of you giving feed-back DON'T have children? From my way of thinking, those that don't have no justification for your reactions or input on this and since I'm quite sure that NONE of you fall within the demographic that these shows are originally intended for, your complaints are even less valid.

Not trying to be a total jerk about this ( I never try, it just comes naturally) but I'm simply hoping to get some folks to step back and think for a moment about where Hasbro is coming from. You may not understand their approach and it may piss you off, but it's being done for a reason and as a parent I have no problems with the "Why" of their actions and I can totally see where Prime and Prime:BH would be too intense for the age group that falls between Rescue Bots and the low end of the Prime demographic. Those who can't step out of the "adult" mindset or who aren't parents can't possibly grasp that concept.
Yes, I'm a fan but I harbor no illusions that the adult Fandom has the influence that many of you seem to think it does so you may as well not bitch about the changes and just roll with it. It's not like you can do anything about it anyways. You'll be a lot happier with yourselves and the show though if you at least take the time to understand WHY it's happening instead of wallowing in selfish misery.

I dont have kids by choice. But if I did, I would raise them by the standards when I grew up. Screw what society has embraced over the last decade. It's like people are scared to see their kids grow up. So TF Prime has killing, big deal. There are ruthless killers in real life like Zimmerman and OJ. Life isnt all Roses. We dont need any more rescue bots. Todays parents need to stop raising their sons to be sissys.

Rated X wrote:We dont need any more rescue bots.

Maybe YOU don't need any more Rescue Bots, but I sure do. And the fandom sure does.

How do you expect the fandom to replenish itself unless you attract more kids that can grow up with the hobby, just like we did?

Have you ever watched Rescue Bots? It's a solid show, even with the kids gloves. Plus, Steve Blum!

Rated X wrote:

T-Macksimus wrote:Definitely some curious and interesting responses about this. What I'm wondering is how many of you giving feed-back DON'T have children? From my way of thinking, those that don't have no justification for your reactions or input on this and since I'm quite sure that NONE of you fall within the demographic that these shows are originally intended for, your complaints are even less valid.

Not trying to be a total jerk about this ( I never try, it just comes naturally) but I'm simply hoping to get some folks to step back and think for a moment about where Hasbro is coming from. You may not understand their approach and it may piss you off, but it's being done for a reason and as a parent I have no problems with the "Why" of their actions and I can totally see where Prime and Prime:BH would be too intense for the age group that falls between Rescue Bots and the low end of the Prime demographic. Those who can't step out of the "adult" mindset or who aren't parents can't possibly grasp that concept.
Yes, I'm a fan but I harbor no illusions that the adult Fandom has the influence that many of you seem to think it does so you may as well not bitch about the changes and just roll with it. It's not like you can do anything about it anyways. You'll be a lot happier with yourselves and the show though if you at least take the time to understand WHY it's happening instead of wallowing in selfish misery.

I dont have kids by choice. But if I did, I would raise them by the standards when I grew up. Screw what society has embraced over the last decade. It's like people are scared to see their kids grow up. So TF Prime has killing, big deal. There are ruthless killers in real life like Zimmerman and OJ. Life isnt all Roses. We dont need any more rescue bots. Todays parents need to stop raising their sons to be sissys.

Yawn. What have you done in your life to make you such a "man" that you feel justified in judging others? By the way, it's nice to see you dismiss all of the female fandom.

I don't think parents have changed that much but rather the spectrum of caring for the kid has widened. The thing is that parents who really really really care will actually write in and complain to the tv shows, and it seems these days that shows are way more cognisant of what parents think for something like Transformers since the parents are the ones buying the tv channels and the toys.

So, we need more collectors writing in pretending to be parents, saying they love the dark stuff

I was gone for 2 days and all of this happened

Anyway I don't mind it being more 'kid' friendly, I really love the CGI though. I'm hoping they don't make the series be super bad and silly like Armada. To summarize I would like it to be CGI again despite its limits, and I don't want it to be too kiddy. Like how it was in Animated and Cybertron in terms of maturity is a fine balance IMO.

Sabrblade wrote:

Mechastrike wrote:... wow...i smell Beast Machines already.

That doesn't make any sense. They said they wanted to make the next one lighter toned. Beast Machines was a darker tone from its predecessor.

i meant to say that there's gonna be a fluctuation in the script. Beast Machines, far as I can remember, was set in the G1 universe but it looked like a completely new story with Beast Wars as a prequel. This is what i'm seeing right now.

Mechastrike wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:

Mechastrike wrote:... wow...i smell Beast Machines already.

That doesn't make any sense. They said they wanted to make the next one lighter toned. Beast Machines was a darker tone from its predecessor.

i meant to say that there's gonna be a fluctuation in the script. Beast Machines, far as I can remember, was set in the G1 universe but it looked like a completely new story with Beast Wars as a prequel. This is what i'm seeing right now.

Beast Machines was created to be the direct sequel to Beast Wars.

The whole Beast Era exists in the G1 continuity family. Not necessarily in the G1 cartoon continuity, but at least in "A" G1 continuity of some sort.

I don't see what the problem is.

Am I the only one who actually really liked the use of cgi?
It allowed for scenes to show off a lot more, particularly in transformations and fights, and just made everything feel a lot more professional and neat.
And really, I don't mind that it meant less characters-I'd far rather have a few well developed well rounded characters, with their own fleshed out personalities and oddities, than just throwing more in left right and centre. Admittedly season 1 felt kinda bare at first but with breakdown and knockout being added in fairly early that was rectified.

ArmadaPrime wrote:Am I the only one who actually really liked the use of cgi?
It allowed for scenes to show off a lot more, particularly in transformations and fights, and just made everything feel a lot more professional and neat.
And really, I don't mind that it meant less characters-I'd far rather have a few well developed well rounded characters, with their own fleshed out personalities and oddities, than just throwing more in left right and centre. Admittedly season 1 felt kinda bare at first but with breakdown and knockout being added in fairly early that was rectified.

There isn't anything wrong with that, it was wonderful in beast wars. However I'm not sure I cared about any of the characters in tfp like I did in bw. That being said I'm also ready for a more epic in scale show. I wanna see the armies of the two sides fight not just the shell shocked remnants.

Behold! The next Transformers cartoon!
























I kid I kid.

njb902 wrote:

ArmadaPrime wrote:Am I the only one who actually really liked the use of cgi?
It allowed for scenes to show off a lot more, particularly in transformations and fights, and just made everything feel a lot more professional and neat.
And really, I don't mind that it meant less characters-I'd far rather have a few well developed well rounded characters, with their own fleshed out personalities and oddities, than just throwing more in left right and centre. Admittedly season 1 felt kinda bare at first but with breakdown and knockout being added in fairly early that was rectified.

There isn't anything wrong with that, it was wonderful in beast wars. However I'm not sure I cared about any of the characters in tfp like I did in bw. That being said I'm also ready for a more epic in scale show. I wanna see the armies of the two sides fight not just the shell shocked remnants.

Well, I can't say I've watched a whole lot of beast wars, so I'm not terribly attached to the characters-but I do really like some of the prime characters. Knockout, for instance, with his narcissism and arrogance, has great chemistry with starscream, another always working for himself. Also the fact that they managed to get a solid character out of soundwave, who shows no facial expressions nor speaks (for the most part) was again I felt very impressive.
And yes, large armies would be intense, so long as they didn't go the route of trying to introduce each and every soldier, and thus giving them a nanosecond of development each.

I've said this before about TF: Prime, and with all the negativity of this thread, I feel the need to restate it.

It seems to me that the very "epic-by-default" look and feel of this show's animation, art style, and its BGM score have blinded its most loyal viewers into thinking that it's somehow the best written and best acted TF cartoon series ever made, when not only do the animation, look, and music have little to do with the writing and/or acting quality, but the writing and acting are no better than/on par with Animated, Rescue Bots, and even the two Canadian-made Beast Era series from ten years ago.

I honestly question if anyone would think so highly of this show if it had been made with the animation, art style, and (English) musical score of the Robots in Disguise cartoon. Imagine it, same writing quality, same acting quality, same story and characters, same everything... except for it being in 2D cel-shaded anime animation and scored by Saban. Would it still be as loved in that case, or would its loss of prettiness shy people away?

In other words, the cake would be the same, but the icing would be vanilla instead of double chocolate fudge with sprinkles and strawberries.

njb902 wrote:

Rated X wrote:

T-Macksimus wrote:Definitely some curious and interesting responses about this. What I'm wondering is how many of you giving feed-back DON'T have children? From my way of thinking, those that don't have no justification for your reactions or input on this and since I'm quite sure that NONE of you fall within the demographic that these shows are originally intended for, your complaints are even less valid.

Not trying to be a total jerk about this ( I never try, it just comes naturally) but I'm simply hoping to get some folks to step back and think for a moment about where Hasbro is coming from. You may not understand their approach and it may piss you off, but it's being done for a reason and as a parent I have no problems with the "Why" of their actions and I can totally see where Prime and Prime:BH would be too intense for the age group that falls between Rescue Bots and the low end of the Prime demographic. Those who can't step out of the "adult" mindset or who aren't parents can't possibly grasp that concept.
Yes, I'm a fan but I harbor no illusions that the adult Fandom has the influence that many of you seem to think it does so you may as well not bitch about the changes and just roll with it. It's not like you can do anything about it anyways. You'll be a lot happier with yourselves and the show though if you at least take the time to understand WHY it's happening instead of wallowing in selfish misery.

I dont have kids by choice. But if I did, I would raise them by the standards when I grew up. Screw what society has embraced over the last decade. It's like people are scared to see their kids grow up. So TF Prime has killing, big deal. There are ruthless killers in real life like Zimmerman and OJ. Life isnt all Roses. We dont need any more rescue bots. Todays parents need to stop raising their sons to be sissys.

Yawn. What have you done in your life to make you such a "man" that you feel justified in judging others? By the way, it's nice to see you dismiss all of the female fandom.

What you call “judging” I call keeping it real.

I actually had cool parents when I was a kid. I watched what I wanted. I watched The A-Team. I watched Tales From the Darkside. I watched Child’s Play. I didn’t have a soccer mom that kept me trapped in a bubble. So the bottom line is I think TF Prime is at a child’s level. I can’t advocate the dumbed down standards that are the norm because of today’s generation of parents. It’s like saying Tom and Jerry promote violence so they should be rated PG-13. And I’m not dismissing any female fans. I’m just dismissing over sensitive, insecure parents, male or female.

Sabrblade wrote:I've said this before about TF: Prime, and with all the negativity of this thread, I feel the need to restate it.

It seems to me that the very "epic-by-default" look and feel of this show's animation, art style, and its BGM score have blinded its most loyal viewers into thinking that it's somehow the best written and best acted TF cartoon series ever made, when not only do the animation, look, and music have little to do with the writing and/or acting quality, but the writing and acting are no better than/on par with Animated, Rescue Bots, and even the two Canadian-made Beast Era series from ten years ago.

I honestly question if anyone would think so highly of this show if it had been made with the animation, art style, and (English) musical score of the Robots in Disguise cartoon. Imagine it, same writing quality, same acting quality, same story and characters, same everything... except for it being in 2D cel-shaded anime animation and scored by Saban. Would it still be as loved in that case, or would its loss of prettiness shy people away?

In other words, the cake would be the same, but the icing would be vanilla instead of double chocolate fudge with sprinkles and strawberries.

I hate it when you make a good point such as this Sabrblade, I really do.

The stubborn side of me will say yes I will love just as much. However the logical side of me will say no I won't like it as much, but I would probably still enjoy it. On a side note I never knew that the Beast Series were made by my fellow Canadians, I feel proud.

At X

How is that different than judging? What part of anything you were allowed to do as a child makes you any better than anyone else? Because I knew a lot of young men and women who grew up on sponge bob and the like, and I'd take any of them in a fox hole over the likes of you. Also what is up with the negativity towards women? Do only boys watch transformers? Are the only over bearing parents soccer moms?

Why are people questioning he animation? I don't remember them saying the animation would be different.