The Energon Pub

*sigh*

Everyone's talking, but no one wants to listen...

optimus423 wrote:I do agree with you diligence and patince are the way to beat the scalpers. Since I've been collecting, I've seen the peaks and lows of product in the past. As a collector I personally say just wait it out- items wil come available later at better prices.

I don't agree with your view of morality though, it is true that we cannot force a moral on an individual but that does not make the individual right, and we should not put up with just because.

Diligence and patience are easily trumped by people who buy an entire case of the product, thereby robbing you and everyone else of a chance. (If they bought only one, perhaps two, that still leaves the rest of the case and gives others a chance.)

I've been to stores at 8:00 AM, waiting for the doors to open. I've sat on the phone with customer service (or the department associate) for over thirty minutes, waiting for any assistance possible. (Why didn't I just drive over, you ask? Because I was strictly told to call, not come back until I call and they tell me they have the item) I've used UPCs, DPCIs, I've made trips to local stores, stores out of town (50+ miles we're talkin' here!) and I still come home empty handed. I've been diligent, I've watched the shelves like a hawk. I did what I was supposed to, I followed the oh so precious and special sightings forums on all the boards (hell, I just posted some info this evening)...and I still come away empty handed nine times out of ten.

These reasons are why:
1.) They don't have the item in stock on the shelves, or in the back. (This happens all the time, and it's understandable, so I try again later.)

2.) They did get the items, but for some reason I dropped the ball (sometimes beyond my control. Appointments, etc...) and couldn't make it, so someone beat me to it. (This happens too. Don't like it, but it happens. I can live with it.)

3.) They did get the items, but they never even hit the shelves because the scalpers got there first. (This happens a lot as well. I don't know the exact percentage, but it does happen, and quite a bit.)

I once spoke to a Hot Wheels collector/scalper and as much as it sickened me, I asked him for advice. Standing there in his sorta nice clothes, he was in his early to mid fifties, sucking on a toothpick, hair parted off to the side, kinda overweight, unmarried (no ring, and no indentation on his ring finger either) and generally a sleazy guy. You could see it in his eyes....
Once he got past his pissy phase and realized I wasn't encroaching on his territory. Once he realized it was TFs and wouldn't put a dent in his plans....he was all too eager to tell me.

He said:

"Son, you gotta have a battle plan. You gotta be ready. If you see an item on the shelves, there's a market for it. That market is always willing to pay, sooner or later. You just gotta find the people who are willing to pay. First, though...you have to get your hands on the product. You can do that in a few ways. For example, be here when the pallets come out, grab the case when no one's lookin' and head for the register. Or, you can be here bright and early when the store opens and clean the pegs before anyone else can. Or, you make a friend with someone in the department. You'd be amazed what these people will do for a quick buck. Yeah, you'll spend twenty to fifty, easy. However, you're gonna make ten times that if you know what you're doin'. I make more money on eBay than I ever did at my last job. And there's no taxes to pay! So, just remember what I told ya, and you'll do just fine. Good luck kid, someone like you could make a literal fortune off of this stuff." I nodded all along and thanked him for his advice. I turned around with a disgusted look and stormed out of the aisle. I didn't even try and bring up the moral or ethical part of the issue...it wouldn't even register with him. I never (*NEVER*) forgot what he taught me there. Shrewd businessman? Hardly. Scumbag working all the angles and screwing taxes, when the rest of us do it all on the up and up? YES.

I told the people greeter all about it (we're friends and we both know of the scalper) and he said "Oh yeah, the department manager's in his back pocket. He gets first dibs on everything in the department if he wants. The manager's been reported by another employee twice, the second time...they suspended her without pay for two days."

So the stores do not support this practice, and you know why? (I learned this in working for Wal-Mart, but it applies to any business) If the product keeps disappearing all at once and the pegs remain bare, or the people can't find what they're looking for....the store will eventually lose business as those customers go to the competition looking for their wares.

In fact, a scalper getting the case loses them sales. (Before you tell me I'm crazy, listen to this) When several people come to the store to buy a product (even if it's just one of that product) they're more likely to end up buying another of the same item, or an entirely different item to go along with it.

A generally upbeat customer is a spending mood. A generally unhappy customer will be so disappointed, they won't even spend any money in the store and just walk out. (Hell, I've been there!) So, by letting the case sit out on the pegs as a free for all, they stand a better chance of selling other items to go with it, thus making a bigger profit than they had originally.

If a scalper gets the item constantly and all of it, the customers will do what we all do: "Eh. I'm not going there today. They never have the stuff in anyway, so it's just not worth my gas or my time to make the stop." And it happens a hell of a lot more than you think. And you know what? I've skipped on stores in the past because of that very thing, and sure enough I didn't miss jack squat. They never got to the shelves.

I got desperate with Bumblebee and went around the clock...and still nothing hit the shelves (and this was before the shortage was widespread, so the figures were still out there!)

Why would you, me, or anyone else continue to go to a store that doesn't have the product we're looking for? Why would we continue to waste the time, money, and gas going to a place that has nothing that we're looking for? We wouldn't, and that's why we stop going to those stores. Their sales will eventually drop.

Supporting scalpers ends up hurting us all in the end. When sales drop, the product doesn't have much in the way of a need anymore, stores won't stock the items (or not as much of the next line, trying to beat the trend of last year's mistake) and we all lose out because of it. How ridiculous is that? Sure, there are other circumstances that screw with our chances, but as it stands....it's already difficult to find a Bumblebee figure, especially with the shortage. You throw a scalper in the mix and you've got an instant recipe for a sh*tstorm.

Sportimus Prime wrote:*sigh*

Everyone's talking, but no one wants to listen...

Of course not. Morality issues aside for a moment, both sides think they're right, or at least more right than the other.

Then you throw in the morality issues, and it turns into a tornado of opinions and insults.

Neither side wants to listen to the other's point of view anyway. One side says that it's okay to use these tactics. The other side says it isn't and they're vehemently against the practices contained within.

Neither side will win this one, you can go 'round and 'round and circle the drain, but at the end of the day...this thread will turn into a flamefest, people will taunt with their scalped wares, and the naysayers will stand on principle and continue to fight the good fight and nothing is done except endless bickering.

Well...throw in a few warnings, bannings, hurt feelings, etc.

Yeah, normally I don't do this, but I have to agree with the people here (regardless of their stance on the main issue)...this thread needs closed. Earlier I was pissed when it was locked, but after seeing what it's turned into (and then gotten worse) I realize my initial feeling on the locking was incorrect.

The thread should've died and stayed dead.

EDIT: Before anyone says anything. I accept full responsibility for my part in helping to continue to inject life into this disaster of a thread. It was stupid and I should've just left well enough, alone.

Well, I'm a little late to this one. However, I think most of us can agree on a few points here.

1) A lot of the time, scalper prices are better than online retailers and do provide a convenient service to those of us who would rather spend an extra 5-10 bucks on ebay rather than the same amount in gas driving around.

2) The current shortage is not all scalpers. A large chunk of the blame lies with Hasbro who did drop the ball. However, it takes a littel while for a ship to get over here from China and then hit distribution chanels. I think a little patience would go a long way. In about 6 weeks, I think everyone will have all the figs they want.

3) Scalpers are smart. I can't imagine they make more than their last job doing this, unless they were making some minimum wage gig. However, it is atleast a little extra cash and like it or not, they are working for it legitmately. And yes, putting items on ebay and shipping them out is work.

4) If we did not buy from them, there would be no scalpers!!!

Really, like it, hate it, condone it, whatever your stance, scalpers are part of the collecting game and are not nearly the same rip off as trying to get sporting event tickets. Why bother aggravating yourselves with this issue. It is a small inconvenience. If scalpers are the biggest issue in your life, consider yourself lucky and move on. If they aren't the biggest issue, don't even fret it.

Wow, this thread has really shown peoples true colors. Im amazed at how many of you are shameless and proud of it. The morality of this world really has gone downhill. It's amazing that this online "community" is still around.

I normally think people are good. But alot of you have sure proven me wrong. You're just as bad as the star wars collectors or the hotwheels guys. Im sure some of you are those guys!

Toyotus Superion wrote:Wow, this thread has really shown peoples true colors. Im amazed at how many of you are shameless and proud of it. The morality of this world really has gone downhill. It's amazing that this online "community" is still around.

I normally think people are good. But alot of you have sure proven me wrong. You're just as bad as the star wars collectors or the hotwheels guys. Im sure some of you are those guys!

Toyotus Superion wrote:Wow, this thread has really shown peoples true colors. Im amazed at how many of you are shameless and proud of it. The morality of this world really has gone downhill. It's amazing that this online "community" is still around.

I normally think people are good. But alot of you have sure proven me wrong. You're just as bad as the star wars collectors or the hotwheels guys. Im sure some of you are those guys!

I personally dont care what people do with their own money. Yeah it makes it harder to find a collectible- but thats the fun part of a hobby. I will not judge people who choose to make a small profit selling hard to find toys. Now, some of the other people who feel this is a moral issue, well that is a matter of opinion and maybe if you feel so strongly you should call hasbro and buy a huge shipment of TFS and sell it to us all at cost. I doubt any of you self absorbed...so called righteous people will do that. You might as well not buy from hasbro either...since they are making a profit. Its all semantics, but how many people have truly donated toys, found certain impossible to find items for families all out of the kindness of your heart-- I have done all of the above and I could care less if Joe Schmoe is making $5 bucks off each TF he is selling. If ebay didnt exist we would be paying through the roof to private toy stores who would control the inventory, b/c there would be no way for Joe Schmoe to get his item out to the masses.

Autobot032 wrote:

Toyotus Superion wrote:Wow, this thread has really shown peoples true colors. Im amazed at how many of you are shameless and proud of it. The morality of this world really has gone downhill. It's amazing that this online "community" is still around.

I normally think people are good. But alot of you have sure proven me wrong. You're just as bad as the star wars collectors or the hotwheels guys. Im sure some of you are those guys!

Whats the face for? It's true. Alot of these guys are assholes and they have no shame in admitting it so I have no shame in saying it! Autobot032, I tend to see eye to eye with you. So i'm sure you know how I feel.

Working at Target, I do all I can to screw over the scalpers. And I do all I can to help the kids who ask me if we have "such and such" figure.

Toyotus Superion wrote:

Autobot032 wrote:

Toyotus Superion wrote:Wow, this thread has really shown peoples true colors. Im amazed at how many of you are shameless and proud of it. The morality of this world really has gone downhill. It's amazing that this online "community" is still around.

I normally think people are good. But alot of you have sure proven me wrong. You're just as bad as the star wars collectors or the hotwheels guys. Im sure some of you are those guys!

Whats the face for? It's true. Alot of these guys are assholes and they have no shame in admitting it so I have no shame in saying it! Autobot032, I tend to see eye to eye with you. So i'm sure you know how I feel.

Working at Target, I do all I can to screw over the scalpers. And I do all I can to help the kids who ask me if we have "such and such" figure.

I think it's really cool of you to help out where you can. More people should do their job like you do.

I will say though, Hot Wheels and Star Wars collectors/scalpers are in a league of their own...TF collectors/scalpers aren't that bad...yet.

Toyotus Superion wrote:Wow, this thread has really shown peoples true colors. Im amazed at how many of you are shameless and proud of it. The morality of this world really has gone downhill. It's amazing that this online "community" is still around.

I normally think people are good. But alot of you have sure proven me wrong. You're just as bad as the star wars collectors or the hotwheels guys. Im sure some of you are those guys!

You are the first person I have ever seen other than myself who talks about morals, and I agree with you on what you say about it going downhill. It's sad, but it's true. The world is going more and more on the "me-me-me" mentality, and everyone seems fine with it because rules, morals, and values are seen as inconveniences. It is nice to see that there is some one other than myself who values morals openly.

I normally think people are good too. But I get proven wrong almost 99% of the time in life, and online. But there are many good good members here, many. One of them sold me a Titanium RiD Optimus Prime for just $15 which is more than reasonable and fair, it was mighty good of him and I appreciate that. As often as I am tempted to do so myself at times in life, I wouldn't be so quick to write people off. There are diamonds in the rough, and you'll find them when you least expect it.

Autobot032 wrote:

Toyotus Superion wrote:

Autobot032 wrote:

Toyotus Superion wrote:Wow, this thread has really shown peoples true colors. Im amazed at how many of you are shameless and proud of it. The morality of this world really has gone downhill. It's amazing that this online "community" is still around.

I normally think people are good. But alot of you have sure proven me wrong. You're just as bad as the star wars collectors or the hotwheels guys. Im sure some of you are those guys!

Whats the face for? It's true. Alot of these guys are assholes and they have no shame in admitting it so I have no shame in saying it! Autobot032, I tend to see eye to eye with you. So i'm sure you know how I feel.

Working at Target, I do all I can to screw over the scalpers. And I do all I can to help the kids who ask me if we have "such and such" figure.

I think it's really cool of you to help out where you can. More people should do their job like you do.

I will say though, Hot Wheels and Star Wars collectors/scalpers are in a league of their own...TF collectors/scalpers aren't that bad...yet.

OFF TOPIC/BEFORE THE LOCKDOWN:

i am interested - please somebody elaborate on the SW & Hotweels scalpers, please. i know someone close who sells a lot of Hotwheels on eBay, but since i have no regular contact with him nor have any inkling of what is he REALLY doing, i'd like to find it if he/she fits these kinds of scalpers that you have referred to, to a T.

if this thread gets locked before someone posts an answer, kindly PM me. but please, some do enlighten me on why these SW/HW scalpers are a league on their own. i thought we TF fans had it hard already. anyone? [/u]

Autobot032 wrote:

Toyotus Superion wrote:

Autobot032 wrote:

Toyotus Superion wrote:Wow, this thread has really shown peoples true colors. Im amazed at how many of you are shameless and proud of it. The morality of this world really has gone downhill. It's amazing that this online "community" is still around.

I normally think people are good. But alot of you have sure proven me wrong. You're just as bad as the star wars collectors or the hotwheels guys. Im sure some of you are those guys!

Whats the face for? It's true. Alot of these guys are assholes and they have no shame in admitting it so I have no shame in saying it! Autobot032, I tend to see eye to eye with you. So i'm sure you know how I feel.

Working at Target, I do all I can to screw over the scalpers. And I do all I can to help the kids who ask me if we have "such and such" figure.

I think it's really cool of you to help out where you can. More people should do their job like you do.

I will say though, Hot Wheels and Star Wars collectors/scalpers are in a league of their own...TF collectors/scalpers aren't that bad...yet.

Ha ha! Not as bad as the star wars guys you say? At my target, We stopped putting TF out in the mornings because some scalper hurt a little kid over a 08 bumblebee!

And now, anyone seen in the morning running to the hot wheels is escorted out of the store.

I've been there 3 years. And I've seen numerous fights over TF and SW.

Toyotus Superion wrote:

Autobot032 wrote:

Toyotus Superion wrote:

Autobot032 wrote:

Toyotus Superion wrote:Wow, this thread has really shown peoples true colors. Im amazed at how many of you are shameless and proud of it. The morality of this world really has gone downhill. It's amazing that this online "community" is still around.

I normally think people are good. But alot of you have sure proven me wrong. You're just as bad as the star wars collectors or the hotwheels guys. Im sure some of you are those guys!

Whats the face for? It's true. Alot of these guys are assholes and they have no shame in admitting it so I have no shame in saying it! Autobot032, I tend to see eye to eye with you. So i'm sure you know how I feel.

Working at Target, I do all I can to screw over the scalpers. And I do all I can to help the kids who ask me if we have "such and such" figure.

I think it's really cool of you to help out where you can. More people should do their job like you do.

I will say though, Hot Wheels and Star Wars collectors/scalpers are in a league of their own...TF collectors/scalpers aren't that bad...yet.

Ha ha! Not as bad as the star wars guys you say? At my target, We stopped putting TF out in the mornings because some scalper hurt a little kid over a 08 bumblebee!

And now, anyone seen in the morning running to the hot wheels is escorted out of the store.

I've been there 3 years. And I've seen numerous fights over TF and SW.

Oh I can imagine fist fights starting. After the Elmo shooting...anything's possible.

Still...they're slightly worse than TF fans. Slightly.

zemper wrote:OFF TOPIC/BEFORE THE LOCKDOWN:

i am interested - please somebody elaborate on the SW & Hotweels scalpers, please. i know someone close who sells a lot of Hotwheels on eBay, but since i have no regular contact with him nor have any inkling of what is he REALLY doing, i'd like to find it if he/she fits these kinds of scalpers that you have referred to, to a T.

if this thread gets locked before someone posts an answer, kindly PM me. but please, some do enlighten me on why these SW/HW scalpers are a league on their own. i thought we TF fans had it hard already. anyone? :Cool:

Star Wars fans...well they're fanatical. They tend to actually follow the religion in the film. They change their names to the characters names. They have Jedi/Sith weddings. ('Nuff said.)

Hot Wheels people...some of the cars are super, duper rare. Like one per 5 cases (not per case!) rare. They'll buy up entire pegs, cases, playsets, etc and run (I mean *RUN*) with cardboard boxes in their hands, to the registers. They look like they're rabid as they literally *TEAR* through the aisle. You see the toys sitting on the floor? That's not the work of the kids, that's the work of the scalpers.

There are true collectors in SW, HW, and TF. There are also scalpers and the numbers are growing. Some of them use the guise of collectors to get to the goodies.

HW collectors resell on eBay and in Flea Markets...for exorbitant amounts that are insane, and they make a gigantic, massive profit on something that cost them between $.80-$4.00 a piece. It's not the same kind of money, but the same idea....what we'd pay (and the market demands) for Fortress Maximus, they pay for a simple car. No, I don't mean $1,000.00 a piece like Max, but that type of overall inflation, for something that's just about to hit store shelves. (if you're lucky.)

EDIT: I was seriously incorrect about the prices. *facepalms*
http://toys.search.ebay.com/Hot-Wheels_ ... QQsbrsrtZd

zemper wrote:

Autobot032 wrote:

Toyotus Superion wrote:

Autobot032 wrote:

Toyotus Superion wrote:Wow, this thread has really shown peoples true colors. Im amazed at how many of you are shameless and proud of it. The morality of this world really has gone downhill. It's amazing that this online "community" is still around.

I normally think people are good. But alot of you have sure proven me wrong. You're just as bad as the star wars collectors or the hotwheels guys. Im sure some of you are those guys!

Whats the face for? It's true. Alot of these guys are assholes and they have no shame in admitting it so I have no shame in saying it! Autobot032, I tend to see eye to eye with you. So i'm sure you know how I feel.

Working at Target, I do all I can to screw over the scalpers. And I do all I can to help the kids who ask me if we have "such and such" figure.

I think it's really cool of you to help out where you can. More people should do their job like you do.

I will say though, Hot Wheels and Star Wars collectors/scalpers are in a league of their own...TF collectors/scalpers aren't that bad...yet.

OFF TOPIC/BEFORE THE LOCKDOWN:

i am interested - please somebody elaborate on the SW & Hotweels scalpers, please. i know someone close who sells a lot of Hotwheels on eBay, but since i have no regular contact with him nor have any inkling of what is he REALLY doing, i'd like to find it if he/she fits these kinds of scalpers that you have referred to, to a T.

if this thread gets locked before someone posts an answer, kindly PM me. but please, some do enlighten me on why these SW/HW scalpers are a league on their own. i thought we TF fans had it hard already. anyone? [/u]

Star wars and Hotwheels scalpers have been around since the begining of time. They are easily more ruthless than TF scalpers. They will buy entire cases and return what they dont want, clogging shelves and pegs with stuff no one wants. SW figures tend to be 2 to a box unless the figure is highly sought after, in which case there is only one in the box. The SW Scalper will open several cases and take only that figure from each case. If they can't buy them, Ive seen them damage figures.

The Hot wheels scalper is no different. He will take all the "treasure hunts" from each case he can get his hands on and will even purposely damage other hot wheels to make them undesirable to other collectors.

A collector takes what he needs, a scalper takes all he can find.

Autobot032, Toyotus Superion:

thanks for the enlightening responses. all i can say is -

OH MY. wow. i can't imagine someone paying big bucks over a matchbox-sized (pun intended heh heh) car, even if some of its parts are die-cast. i mean, what gives? i really don't understand people's interest in these tiny machines. sure, i had a few boxes of Matchbox cars when i was young, but they never really interested me that much unlike TFs. can you call rolling on wheels a comparable GIMMICK to TFs? LOL.

and star wars... man, i never thought hardcore collectors were like that. i mean, i consider myself a "hardcore" SW fan too (grew up on ROTJ), played the games esp. KOTOR, collected comics, watched the films... but collecting figures - this i never did. and i guess i am glad for it. i already have a hard time balancing finances for TFs, i can't afford to let SW figure collecting into my budget considerations every month. hahaha.

since this is on scalpers (on-topic, mods ) albeit not on TFs, can you guys give me examples of the most scalped SW/HW figures, and links if ever? also, the going prices, if possible.

zemper wrote:Autobot032, Toyotus Superion:

thanks for the enlightening responses. all i can say is -

OH MY. wow. i can't imagine someone paying big bucks over a matchbox-sized (pun intended heh heh) car, even if some of its parts are die-cast. i mean, what gives? i really don't understand people's interest in these tiny machines. sure, i had a few boxes of Matchbox cars when i was young, but they never really interested me that much unlike TFs. can you call rolling on wheels a comparable GIMMICK to TFs? LOL.

and star wars... man, i never thought hardcore collectors were like that. i mean, i consider myself a "hardcore" SW fan too (grew up on ROTJ), played the games esp. KOTOR, collected comics, watched the films... but collecting figures - this i never did. and i guess i am glad for it. i already have a hard time balancing finances for TFs, i can't afford to let SW figure collecting into my budget considerations every month. hahaha.

since this is on scalpers (on-topic, mods ) albeit not on TFs, can you guys give me examples of the most scalped SW/HW figures, and links if ever? also, the going prices, if possible.

Well, I'm a huge toy collector in general. I still collect GI joe, SW, and legos. As a SW collector, Anything that Is a clone trooper that is new, not a repaint, but a new mold, is something that is always scalped. New jedi characters and translucent characters as well. Right now the hot thing is the "concept characters". There is one per case, and sometimes none in a case! Everywave has that one figure that you can barely find.

When i go to my local retailers all i see is pegs and price tags..I call ahead all the time but in my area there is just ntohing to be had..I really dislike buying things online but it looks like i may have too..at least the product is there

Toyotus Superion wrote:

zemper wrote:Autobot032, Toyotus Superion:

thanks for the enlightening responses. all i can say is -

OH MY. wow. i can't imagine someone paying big bucks over a matchbox-sized (pun intended heh heh) car, even if some of its parts are die-cast. i mean, what gives? i really don't understand people's interest in these tiny machines. sure, i had a few boxes of Matchbox cars when i was young, but they never really interested me that much unlike TFs. can you call rolling on wheels a comparable GIMMICK to TFs? LOL.

and star wars... man, i never thought hardcore collectors were like that. i mean, i consider myself a "hardcore" SW fan too (grew up on ROTJ), played the games esp. KOTOR, collected comics, watched the films... but collecting figures - this i never did. and i guess i am glad for it. i already have a hard time balancing finances for TFs, i can't afford to let SW figure collecting into my budget considerations every month. hahaha.

since this is on scalpers (on-topic, mods ) albeit not on TFs, can you guys give me examples of the most scalped SW/HW figures, and links if ever? also, the going prices, if possible.

Well, I'm a huge toy collector in general. I still collect GI joe, SW, and legos. As a SW collector, Anything that Is a clone trooper that is new, not a repaint, but a new mold, is something that is always scalped. New jedi characters and translucent characters as well. Right now the hot thing is the "concept characters". There is one per case, and sometimes none in a case! Everywave has that one figure that you can barely find.

Exactly. The difference here?

One or two figures here and there, or a Treasure Chest here and there.

While our entire toyline is friggin' disappearing! Basics (Target Exclusives), Deluxes, Voyagers, Leaders, Ultimate....you name it, it's gone. Oh sure the fans and kids get their piece of the pie (for the most part) but figures are off the shelves that you just know wouldn't sell (and don't) which is the work of a scalper. Even Robot Replicas are selling (that's how bad people want a piece of the TFTM pie!) and you couldn't move them if your life depended on it.

...even the T.E.C.H. line is selling. (Seriously...WTF man?)

All I know is, I don't know what to do anymore...That's it man, game over man, game over! [ALIENS'D]

Autobot032 wrote:

Toyotus Superion wrote:

zemper wrote:Autobot032, Toyotus Superion:

thanks for the enlightening responses. all i can say is -

OH MY. wow. i can't imagine someone paying big bucks over a matchbox-sized (pun intended heh heh) car, even if some of its parts are die-cast. i mean, what gives? i really don't understand people's interest in these tiny machines. sure, i had a few boxes of Matchbox cars when i was young, but they never really interested me that much unlike TFs. can you call rolling on wheels a comparable GIMMICK to TFs? LOL.

and star wars... man, i never thought hardcore collectors were like that. i mean, i consider myself a "hardcore" SW fan too (grew up on ROTJ), played the games esp. KOTOR, collected comics, watched the films... but collecting figures - this i never did. and i guess i am glad for it. i already have a hard time balancing finances for TFs, i can't afford to let SW figure collecting into my budget considerations every month. hahaha.

since this is on scalpers (on-topic, mods ) albeit not on TFs, can you guys give me examples of the most scalped SW/HW figures, and links if ever? also, the going prices, if possible.

Well, I'm a huge toy collector in general. I still collect GI joe, SW, and legos. As a SW collector, Anything that Is a clone trooper that is new, not a repaint, but a new mold, is something that is always scalped. New jedi characters and translucent characters as well. Right now the hot thing is the "concept characters". There is one per case, and sometimes none in a case! Everywave has that one figure that you can barely find.

Exactly. The difference here?

One or two figures here and there, or a Treasure Chest here and there.

While our entire toyline is friggin' disappearing! Basics (Target Exclusives), Deluxes, Voyagers, Leaders, Ultimate....you name it, it's gone. Oh sure the fans and kids get their piece of the pie (for the most part) but figures are off the shelves that you just know wouldn't sell (and don't) which is the work of a scalper. Even Robot Replicas are selling (that's how bad people want a piece of the TFTM pie!) and you couldn't move them if your life depended on it.

...even the T.E.C.H. line is selling. (Seriously...WTF man?)

All I know is, I don't know what to do anymore...That's it man, game over man, game over! [ALIENS'D]

LOL - love that reference dude. Aliens is one of my fave sci-fi films, and loved the space marines.

Lapse Of Reason wrote:

Cyber Bishop wrote:Definition of a scalper: one that buys toys at normal or less than retail prices and resells them for double or triple the original price and claims that the item is uber rare.

They are seen hanging out at flea markets a lot.

So by this line of reasoning, any online store such as BBTS, Digital-toys, TFSource, all the Botcon sellers, and anyone else who sells something over the original MSRP is a detriment to TF collecting?

Those kinds of stores don't get their merchandise from a store like Wal Mart, they get it from a distributor or Hasbro themselves.

Lapse Of Reason wrote:Some other quesions to consider:

If you found five $10 bills on the ground, would you pick one up for yourself and leave the other four for the next passerbys to find?


If your boss offered you a raise even though you had not been there the longest, would you say no?


If someone gave you a good stock tip, would you not invest because you feel you'd make too much money and that wouldn't be fair to others who made poor investments?



I have no problem with someone like me who might see a few rare figs and buy them all to resell a few. I am not making a living off of it, and if I did it would not be a very good one. Only a few bucks here and there with a huge boon at Botcon time.

I am trying to see how your 3 examples have anything to do with scalping..
Oh and there are people that live off of it.

Lapse Of Reason wrote:I think the ugliest think about all this "scalper" debate is the outpouring of hatred towards the few that are taking advantage of a very small opportunity. Many of the whiners and complainers should be ashamed of themselves.

Very small opportunity? Look on ebay and you will see thousands of scalpers.. Go to flea markets or those traveling mall dealers..
There are more than you know.

Lapse Of Reason wrote:I have been called a douche and told I am despised by members of this community just because of my stance on the issue. I'm the same member who was giving away free stuff only a few weeks ago (and only one of the three recipients even bothered to thank me for it once it arrived). I can provide a list of 40+ names who responded at the opportunity for free stuff. Nobody had a problem with me giving away $50+ dollars worth of stuff, yet if I were to say I made $20 on a Bumblebee toy I'd get slammed with hate posts. For shame.

I don't have any idea why anyone calls you that (I have other things to worry about y'know).
What you described in the last paragraph, that's not being a scalper it is being generous.

I know a guy around here and he scours the stores and buys all things that are "new" and puts them on ebay INSTEAD of getting just one for him self and letting other possible collectors get the items at retail instead of buying them all and selling them for an inflated price.
Oh and he has a well paying job too.

I have heard people say they buy multiples and sell the extras on ebay to "fund their collection".
I guess I look at it like this, collecting is something I want to do, so why should I make others pay higher prices just for me to get more stuff or offset the price of gas. It is my collection so I need to take the hit in the pocketbook for something I want.

Cyber Bishop wrote:

Lapse Of Reason wrote:

Cyber Bishop wrote:Definition of a scalper: one that buys toys at normal or less than retail prices and resells them for double or triple the original price and claims that the item is uber rare.

They are seen hanging out at flea markets a lot.

So by this line of reasoning, any online store such as BBTS, Digital-toys, TFSource, all the Botcon sellers, and anyone else who sells something over the original MSRP is a detriment to TF collecting?

Those kinds of stores don't get their merchandise from a store like Wal Mart, they get it from a distributor or Hasbro themselves.

Lapse Of Reason wrote:Some other quesions to consider:

If you found five $10 bills on the ground, would you pick one up for yourself and leave the other four for the next passerbys to find?


If your boss offered you a raise even though you had not been there the longest, would you say no?


If someone gave you a good stock tip, would you not invest because you feel you'd make too much money and that wouldn't be fair to others who made poor investments?



I have no problem with someone like me who might see a few rare figs and buy them all to resell a few. I am not making a living off of it, and if I did it would not be a very good one. Only a few bucks here and there with a huge boon at Botcon time.

I am trying to see how your 3 examples have anything to do with scalping..
Oh and there are people that live off of it.

Lapse Of Reason wrote:I think the ugliest think about all this "scalper" debate is the outpouring of hatred towards the few that are taking advantage of a very small opportunity. Many of the whiners and complainers should be ashamed of themselves.

Very small opportunity? Look on ebay and you will see thousands of scalpers.. Go to flea markets or those traveling mall dealers..
There are more than you know.

Lapse Of Reason wrote:I have been called a douche and told I am despised by members of this community just because of my stance on the issue. I'm the same member who was giving away free stuff only a few weeks ago (and only one of the three recipients even bothered to thank me for it once it arrived). I can provide a list of 40+ names who responded at the opportunity for free stuff. Nobody had a problem with me giving away $50+ dollars worth of stuff, yet if I were to say I made $20 on a Bumblebee toy I'd get slammed with hate posts. For shame.

I don't have any idea why anyone calls you that (I have other things to worry about y'know).
What you described in the last paragraph, that's not being a scalper it is being generous.

I know a guy around here and he scours the stores and buys all things that are "new" and puts them on ebay INSTEAD of getting just one for him self and letting other possible collectors get the items at retail instead of buying them all and selling them for an inflated price.
Oh and he has a well paying job too.

I have heard people say they buy multiples and sell the extras on ebay to "fund their collection".
I guess I look at it like this, collecting is something I want to do, so why should I make others pay higher prices just for me to get more stuff or offset the price of gas. It is my collection so I need to take the hit in the pocketbook for something I want.

QFT!

Well spoken.

Lapse Of Reason wrote:

Cyber Bishop wrote:Definition of a scalper: one that buys toys at normal or less than retail prices and resells them for double or triple the original price and claims that the item is uber rare.

They are seen hanging out at flea markets a lot.

So by this line of reasoning, any online store such as BBTS, Digital-toys, TFSource, all the Botcon sellers, and anyone else who sells something over the original MSRP is a detriment to TF collecting?

Some other quesions to consider:

If you found five $10 bills on the ground, would you pick one up for yourself and leave the other four for the next passerbys to find?


If your boss offered you a raise even though you had not been there the longest, would you say no?


If someone gave you a good stock tip, would you not invest because you feel you'd make too much money and that wouldn't be fair to others who made poor investments?



I have no problem with someone like me who might see a few rare figs and buy them all to resell a few. I am not making a living off of it, and if I did it would not be a very good one. Only a few bucks here and there with a huge boon at Botcon time.


I think the ugliest think about all this "scalper" debate is the outpouring of hatred towards the few that are taking advantage of a very small opportunity. Many of the whiners and complainers should be ashamed of themselves.

I have been called a douche and told I am despised by members of this community just because of my stance on the issue. I'm the same member who was giving away free stuff only a few weeks ago (and only one of the three recipients even bothered to thank me for it once it arrived). I can provide a list of 40+ names who responded at the opportunity for free stuff. Nobody had a problem with me giving away $50+ dollars worth of stuff, yet if I were to say I made $20 on a Bumblebee toy I'd get slammed with hate posts. For shame.

Lapse Of Reason, I really think you are one of the few people here who actually understands the basic principles of Economics and uses common sense to apply them to TF collecting. I have always foud your posts to be entertaining and even informative. Keep doing your thing.

Having just skimmed this thread, having been gone for the week, I agree with Ryan's posts as well. Sonray, I think you are taking all this waaaay too personally. We all know it is very hard to be a collector living in the UK. However, you HAVE to understand that reselling collectibles, toy or not, is just as legit as reselling any antique. There is absolutely nothing illegal about it. Not to mantion, where do you come off judging people you have never met. For all you know, the scalper in question might be a single mom with 4 kids, who has to stay home to watch the kids because she can't afford day care. In doing so she may have stumbled across reselling TFs to feed her kids. Is this possible? Absolutely.

Is scalping TFs immoral? No.

Is judging and despising people you do not know immoral? Absolutely.

If buying multiples of super rare figures, like the Botcon sets to resell is moraly wrong,I have no morals either, and neither does any serious member of the TF community.

I defy you to show me ONE person who attended Botcon this year, who had the finances to afford multiple sets and did not buy them.

Buying out shelves of basics to sell for 10 bucks is small potatoes. The real scalping goes on at online retailers. You'd better thank the Scalpers, they create competition. Without them, all your precious legit online retailers would be charging quadruple what they currently do.


P.S. I have a feeling that a lot of the negative sentiment towards scalpers does come from collector newbs or from people with limited finances directing their frustration at a very obvious target.

P.P.S. Use some patience. All the toys you so desperately covet will be in ample supply well before x-mas. Relax..

Bonger wrote:P.P.S. Use some patience. All the toys you so desperately covet will be in ample supply well before x-mas. Relax..

This is why I never buy toys at an inflated rate.. I can wait and don't have to have it "right away"..

And in case anyone is wondering scalping as we know it derived from ticket scapling.

Ticket resellers use several different means to secure premium and previously sold-out ticket inventories (often in large quantities) for events such as concerts or sporting events. Established resellers often operate within vast networks of ticket contacts, including season ticket holders, individual ticket resellers and ticket brokers. They make a business out of getting customers hard-to-find and previously sold-out tickets that are no longer available through the official box office.
Ticket scalpers work outside events often showing up with unsold tickets from brokers' offices on a consignment basis or showing up with no tickets at all and buying extra tickets from fans at, or below face value with their own money on a speculative basis hoping to resell them at a profit. There are many full-time scalpers who are regulars at particular venues and even have a following. These full-time scalpers are often sought out by fans hoping for a last minute deal and are comfortable buying from a familiar face knowing they are not likely to be ripped off by a stranger with counterfeit or stolen tickets. However, there are plenty of scam artists that sometimes follow a concert tour from city to city selling fake tickets to unsuspecting buyers for whatever they can get.

It happens in every area of toy collecting not just Transformers.

I understand the economics of it, I just don't agree with scalping it is my opinion and I am not forcing it on anyone. If you follow these practices and make money then good for you. I have a job and that job pays my bills and feeds my collection, I don't need to pick up extra stuff just to resell to make money back.
I have had so many instances where I could have picked up multiple Star Wars, Hot Wheels, Transformers, etc.. etc.. and made a profit, I just chose not to and let other collectors get the same crack at them that I had.

The easy way to solve the problem, if you have a problem with the scalpers is not buy from them. Ultimately anyone who buys a G1 repaint Jazz from the jag with 18 of 'em is contributing to the problem.

Is it wrong, yes. Will it stop, no. Will these toys be clogging the shelves soon, yes. And soon the collectors will be the ones sitting back and laughing when they can't unload their slew of shelfwarmers.

Sure, 95% of the time, I just buy one item for myself too, when the money to be made is 5 10 bucks. But what about situations like Botcon, where there were thousands to be made. Did you pass on those as well if you did go?

As for scalping. I agree. I do find scalpers in all arenas to be annoying. If it wasn't for scalping, I could actually afford to go to all the sporting events I would like to. However, I cannot afford scalper ticket prices. Oh well, one day I will.

However, being frustrated with scalpers is one thig. But one needs tro understand that they are not necesarily bad people. They have found a market to resell some items on to make a few dollars. I highly doubt they are making millions selling some TFs for a 5 dollar progit, ya know. I thin the anti-scalper sentiment in this post is waaay over the top. I mean, this type of rage should be reserved for child molesters and rapists. Not some poor bastard trying to earn a couple of bucks.

All I'm basically saying is that I think some people just need to reign it in a little and this would be a lot more peaceful of a discussion, rather than a rage fest.