Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby Cyberpath » Fri Dec 14, 2018 3:12 pm

Translation from the latest GENERATIONS book --

Source: page-727#post-16398191

1: When did the project planning start?
We normally start planning for an MP project a long time in advance, this was started from back in December 2016. At that time we still thought MP10 (Convoy 2.0) was the best/definitive OP, but looking at the time line from 1.0 to 2.0, a 3.0 would be on the table sooner of later, so we started planning real early.

2: Where did you start?
The first thought was "to surpass OP 2.0", but we couldn't quite imagine exactly what counts as "surpass" at the beginning. We thought of areas of improvement, for example a more accurate mouth plate, better articulation etc. Also the comparability with MP 36. we wanted to do a cartoon accurate Optimus just like MP 36 Megatron. So we drew up an Optimus with ideal proportions then started to think about the mechanism within,

Image


3: It'd be difficult to recreate a cartoon accurate Optimus?
For example the truck wind shield and the 'bot mode chest. The angle and height-width ratio are both different. In the past we would find a middle ground between truck and bot then achieve a balanced look by detail design. But this time around, we really wanted to recreate this difference in physical form. Although MP 10 has quite an involved transformation, the parts placement actually follows the G1 toy. But in order to create the definitive Optimus, we were willing to change it up this time around. If it couldn't surpass OP 2.0 this project would be pointless.

Image


4: Proportions have evolved too!
From past experience designing Optimus, the balance in the cab and back section is very tricky. First it's the size of 'bot mode chest; it'd be too wide to be toon accurate if using the truck wind shield directly. Also the trailer hitch section needs to be thin in order for the trailer to sit at a proper height, but on the other hand Optimus' legs are long and thick in the cartoon so kind of mass shift between modes, it's very difficult to achieve a balance.

5: How did you solve this?
We had a flash of genius to move the mass as solution, so that in 'bot mode the volume in the legs is increased and volume in the chest decreased. So we came up with the transformation to move some of mass on the side of the cab to the lower half of 'bot mode. We used to have to put a lot of effort into concealing the arms seamlessly into the cab, with this design it's automatically solved as well.

6: What an amazing idea!
But here comes the color problem: the upper body (cab) is red and the lower body is blue. So we had to hide the red surface within the legs, with the rear tires too.

7: The tires have finally disappeared
The rear tires are narrow and rotate to conceal inside the legs. We felt this is a must.

Image


8: Another evolution in design is a clean and flat waist.
Finally able to make the waist flat (LOL). Initially we though of the same mechanism as Megatron. Then we wanted to achieve better articulation without breaking up the sculpt, so this time the waist doesn't have the articulated front skirt pieces but has an automatic mechanism where if the thighs move up the skirts retract. And we made them pop back up automatically as well.

Image


9: The double knee joint gives off an action figure impression
This is a modern construction we only started to pay attention to recently. The friction resistance in the the two joints is different, so only when the first joint is bent to a certain degree then would the second joint engage. So that in normal posing only one joint is engaged to keep the body proportions. Because MP 36 has incredible articulation, this Optimus definitely needs to be able to match up with that.

10: The trailer has several new gimmicks, a lot more play value
We thought if the trailer isn't re-made properly, it wouldn't be called Optimus 3.0, so we can't have a similar trailer to MP 10's. So we thought about what gimmicks hadn't been done before. For example the mobile artillery in "Fire in the Sky". We thought it could be formed from the battle station with wheels added.

Image


11: Using Roller to drag the artillery; seems like a very Takara-esque Sci-Fi design
Yeah we wanted to include this kind of Takara-esque Sci-Fi gimmick similar to Diaclone. The figures included have magnets on the bottom of their feet so they can stand on the deck etc. Although it's not an official way to play, you can have this interact with the Diaclone figures as well. This sort of product cross over play pattern is something we'd love to see.

12: There are two styles of head sculpt..lots of accessories!
Because there's two drawing styles in the G1 cartoon so we made two head sculpts. And the head is removable so that scene from "City of Steel" where Bumblebee is holding Prime's detached head can be recreated.

Image


13: I almost forgot there's that episode where Prime had a jet pack...
Yup he sure did.

Image


14: What's with Starscream's head and the intakes
To recreate that certain scene lol.

Image


15: So technically it's not Prime
Yep, so yeah these can't be stored inside the trailer (does it sound like an excuse? lol)

16: Which part to design has most effort gone into?
The trailer. Although the cab is always more important and the trailer just kinda needs to be a square box, its thickness is quite hard to get right. Making it too thick would effect the overall height, so it took several tries to get to where we are.

17: Something not in the cartoon?
We've made slight changes to the toes and added bumper-like details so they look more realistic.

18: Would this product be the benchmark for future releases just like MP 10 did before?
MP 10 already had the design philosophy of "recreating the cartoon". In a sense we finally arrived at a time where we can face the origin of Transformers, where staying true to that source material without modifying or compromising can be viewed as a good thing.

Image


19: Now that the project is finally done and dusted, how do you feel?
Feel like "we've done everything we could". This is Optimus Prime after all, so we put in our heart and soul. At the same time even if we overdid it, Prime would forgive us (LOL). After MP44, the MP benchmark might have been raised again!
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby Scramjet » Fri Dec 14, 2018 3:16 pm

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Good stuff Cyberpath. I read that over at TFW a few hours ago after saving all of the high-res scans of the Generations book to my phone. I like your picture additions to the article, nice!
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby Cyberpath » Fri Dec 14, 2018 3:17 pm

itscramtastic wrote:Good stuff Cyberpath. I read that over at TFW a few hours ago after saving all of the high-res scans of the Generations book to my phone. I like your picture additions to the article, nice!
;)^
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby -Kanrabat- » Fri Dec 14, 2018 3:20 pm

Motto: "Love it? GET IT!
It's that simple."
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I... begin to actually want the thing... :shock:
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby Scramjet » Fri Dec 14, 2018 3:21 pm

Motto: "Peace through sandwiches."
Weapon: Shoulder-Mounted Mega-Blast Missile Cannons
-Kanrabat- wrote:I... begin to actually want the thing... :shock:
I'm at the "what am I parting with to gain funds to buy this thing" stage. There's a lot on the chopping block :shock:
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby Cyberpath » Fri Dec 14, 2018 3:22 pm

It was an interesting read. I always enjoy the designers' insight. Even if this project is pretty much self-explanatory.
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby Scramjet » Fri Dec 14, 2018 3:24 pm

Motto: "Peace through sandwiches."
Weapon: Shoulder-Mounted Mega-Blast Missile Cannons
Cyberpath wrote:It was an interesting read. I always enjoy the designers' insight. Even if this project is pretty much self-explanatory.
I agree, I'm actually excited to hear what they have to say about Hound whenever they do a similar (albeit smaller) article on him!
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby ZeldaTheSwordsman » Fri Dec 14, 2018 3:27 pm

Motto: "It's unnerving and insulting when people in a toy-based fandom, whatever it is, make statements to the effect that general consumers and fans of lesser financial means should be deprived entirely of the ability to partake of the primary market."
Weapon: Galaxial Rocket Launcher
A big part of me is hoping they cancel it and spare you all the financial agony. Or maybe just scrap the cab and retool the trailer to hitch to MP-10

I think some of those design directives were seriously wrongheaded (such as trying to have it both ways on the window proportions) and the ways they were executed overcomplicated. In the case of the concealment of the tires it ends up hurting the look of the truck mode because of how much they overthought it. And dumbing the colors down to the cartoon's level is just plain inexcusable especially in cases where the cartoon tried its damnedest to overcome those limits despite the cheap, rushed animation.
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Translation of interview with Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime designers

Postby ZeroWolf » Fri Dec 14, 2018 3:56 pm

Motto: "My past no longer binds my future..."
Weapon: Battle Blades
Thanks to fellow Seibertron user, Cyberpath, we've learned that a user on the Chinese social media site, Baidu has uploaded a transcript of an interview found in the Transformers Generations 2019 Book. This interview is with the creators of MP-44 and talks about the design process they followed, and even talks of cross compatability with Takara Tomy's Diaclone line.

Please note that the text has been translated with Google Translate and cleaned up by TFW2005 member opoptimus. Here is the translation.

1: When did the project planning start?
We normally start planning for an MP project a long time in advance, this was started from back in December 2016. At that time we still thought MP10 (Convoy 2.0) was the best/definitive OP, but looking at the time line from 1.0 to 2.0, a 3.0 would be on the table sooner of later, so we started planning real early.

2: Where did you start?
The first thought was "to surpass OP 2.0", but we couldn't quite imagine exactly what counts as "surpass" at the beginning. We thought of areas of improvement, for example a more accurate mouth plate, better articulation etc. Also the comparability with MP 36. we wanted to do a cartoon accurate Optimus just like MP 36 Megatron. So we drew up an Optimus with ideal proportions then started to think about the mechanism within,

Image

3: It'd be difficult to recreate a cartoon accurate Optimus?
For example the truck wind shield and the 'bot mode chest. The angle and height-width ratio are both different. In the past we would find a middle ground between truck and bot then achieve a balanced look by detail design. But this time around, we really wanted to recreate this difference in physical form. Although MP 10 has quite an involved transformation, the parts placement actually follows the G1 toy. But in order to create the definitive Optimus, we were willing to change it up this time around. If it couldn't surpass OP 2.0 this project would be pointless.

Image

4: Proportions have evolved too!
From past experience designing Optimus, the balance in the cab and back section is very tricky. First it's the size of 'bot mode chest; it'd be too wide to be toon accurate if using the truck wind shield directly. Also the trailer hitch section needs to be thin in order for the trailer to sit at a proper height, but on the other hand Optimus' legs are long and thick in the cartoon so kind of mass shift between modes, it's very difficult to achieve a balance.

5: How did you solve this?
We had a flash of genius to move the mass as solution, so that in 'bot mode the volume in the legs is increased and volume in the chest decreased. So we came up with the transformation to move some of mass on the side of the cab to the lower half of 'bot mode. We used to have to put a lot of effort into concealing the arms seamlessly into the cab, with this design it's automatically solved as well.

6: What an amazing idea!
But here comes the color problem: the upper body (cab) is red and the lower body is blue. So we had to hide the red surface within the legs, with the rear tires too.

7: The tires have finally disappeared
The rear tires are narrow and rotate to conceal inside the legs. We felt this is a must.

Image

8: Another evolution in design is a clean and flat waist.
Finally able to make the waist flat (LOL). Initially we though of the same mechanism as Megatron. Then we wanted to achieve better articulation without breaking up the sculpt, so this time the waist doesn't have the articulated front skirt pieces but has an automatic mechanism where if the thighs move up the skirts retract. And we made them pop back up automatically as well.

Image

9: The double knee joint gives off an action figure impression
This is a modern construction we only started to pay attention to recently. The friction resistance in the the two joints is different, so only when the first joint is bent to a certain degree then would the second joint engage. So that in normal posing only one joint is engaged to keep the body proportions. Because MP 36 has incredible articulation, this Optimus definitely needs to be able to match up with that.

10: The trailer has several new gimmicks, a lot more play value
We thought if the trailer isn't re-made properly, it wouldn't be called Optimus 3.0, so we can't have a similar trailer to MP 10's. So we thought about what gimmicks hadn't been done before. For example the mobile artillery in "Fire in the Sky". We thought it could be formed from the battle station with wheels added.

Image

11: Using Roller to drag the artillery; seems like a very Takara-esque Sci-Fi design
Yeah we wanted to include this kind of Takara-esque Sci-Fi gimmick similar to Diaclone. The figures included have magnets on the bottom of their feet so they can stand on the deck etc. Although it's not an official way to play, you can have this interact with the Diaclone figures as well. This sort of product cross over play pattern is something we'd love to see.

12: There are two styles of head sculpt..lots of accessories!
Because there's two drawing styles in the G1 cartoon so we made two head sculpts. And the head is removable so that scene from "City of Steel" where Bumblebee is holding Prime's detached head can be recreated.

Image

13: I almost forgot there's that episode where Prime had a jet pack...
Yup he sure did.

Image

14: What's with Starscream's head and the intakes
To recreate that certain scene lol.

Image

15: So technically it's not Prime
Yep, so yeah these can't be stored inside the trailer (does it sound like an excuse? lol)

16: Which part to design has most effort gone into?
The trailer. Although the cab is always more important and the trailer just kinda needs to be a square box, its thickness is quite hard to get right. Making it too thick would effect the overall height, so it took several tries to get to where we are.

17: Something not in the cartoon?
We've made slight changes to the toes and added bumper-like details so they look more realistic.

18: Would this product be the benchmark for future releases just like MP 10 did before?
MP 10 already had the design philosophy of "recreating the cartoon". In a sense we finally arrived at a time where we can face the origin of Transformers, where staying true to that source material without modifying or compromising can be viewed as a good thing.

Image

19: Now that the project is finally done and dusted, how do you feel?
Feel like "we've done everything we could". This is Optimus Prime after all, so we put in our heart and soul. At the same time even if we overdid it, Prime would forgive us (LOL). After MP44, the MP benchmark might have been raised again!


What do you think of the interview? Do you think they've gone too far on this or that this is the pinnacle of the Masterpiece line to date? Let us know in the Energon Pub and stay tuned to Seibertron for all the latest news and reviews.
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby Cyberpath » Fri Dec 14, 2018 4:02 pm

Translation was cleaned up by opoptimus.
Last edited by Cyberpath on Fri Dec 14, 2018 4:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby chuckdawg1999 » Fri Dec 14, 2018 4:20 pm

Motto: "The man, the myth, the legend... yeah right."
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I'm starting to get excited for this figure, 8 months away
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby Ironhidensh » Fri Dec 14, 2018 5:40 pm

Motto: "Tell those damned kids to stay off my lawn!!!"
Weapon: Big Cannon
-Kanrabat- wrote:I... begin to actually want the thing... :shock:



I've wanted it since day one. The wanting has never been the problem.


This figure is NOT worth the price, end of discussion. For me, at least. This figure will be the first time that I actively seek out a knock off of, and I hate that I feel bad about that.
Photobucket can die now.

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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby -Kanrabat- » Fri Dec 14, 2018 5:52 pm

Motto: "Love it? GET IT!
It's that simple."
Weapon: Mace
Ironhidensh wrote:
-Kanrabat- wrote:I... begin to actually want the thing... :shock:



I've wanted it since day one. The wanting has never been the problem.


This figure is NOT worth the price, end of discussion. For me, at least. This figure will be the first time that I actively seek out a knock off of, and I hate that I feel bad about that.


Dunno about that. I'll definitely wait for the video reviews to hit so we finally know how it actually feel in hand.
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby Ironhidensh » Fri Dec 14, 2018 6:07 pm

Motto: "Tell those damned kids to stay off my lawn!!!"
Weapon: Big Cannon
-Kanrabat- wrote:
Ironhidensh wrote:
-Kanrabat- wrote:I... begin to actually want the thing... :shock:



I've wanted it since day one. The wanting has never been the problem.


This figure is NOT worth the price, end of discussion. For me, at least. This figure will be the first time that I actively seek out a knock off of, and I hate that I feel bad about that.


Dunno about that. I'll definitely wait for the video reviews to hit so we finally know how it actually feel in hand.



That information is irrelevant. All the basis needed to say this is ridiculously over priced can be found in previous Masterpiece releases.
Photobucket can die now.

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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby -Kanrabat- » Fri Dec 14, 2018 6:11 pm

Motto: "Love it? GET IT!
It's that simple."
Weapon: Mace
Ironhidensh wrote:That information is irrelevant. All the basis needed to say this is ridiculously over priced can be found in previous Masterpiece releases.



If you mean the latest MP released and how the prices keep increasing and increasing but people just buy them as much or even more, yeah, maybe.
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby Scramjet » Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:11 pm

Motto: "Peace through sandwiches."
Weapon: Shoulder-Mounted Mega-Blast Missile Cannons
Ironhidensh!! I know that feel. I do think I’m going to see what I can do to get it though. Let’s see what product moves over the next few months.
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby Autobot Roadburn » Sat Dec 15, 2018 12:06 am

Ok, that skirt piece automatically folding inward to work with the leg movement is super impressive. I'm really excited to get this guy next year.
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby noctorro » Sat Dec 15, 2018 3:08 am

I like MP 44, but I stopped collecting Masterpieces. Megatron looks impossible to transform.
And this guy costs like a new computer.

On the Siege comparison.

I'm telling you man, Siege Optimus Prime is thé best G1 looking normal line Optimus Prime so far.
Anyone a better example?
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby -Kanrabat- » Sat Dec 15, 2018 4:15 am

Motto: "Love it? GET IT!
It's that simple."
Weapon: Mace
noctorro wrote:I like MP 44, but I stopped collecting Masterpieces. Megatron looks impossible to transform.
And this guy costs like a new computer.

On the Siege comparison.

I'm telling you man, Siege Optimus Prime is thé best G1 looking normal line Optimus Prime so far.
Anyone a better example?



Spot the Frenchie phoneposting! :lol:
I can relate because that damn auto-correct is relentless. :BANG_HEAD:

As for the perfect modern "G1" Optimus, Siege might be the best one so far if the only factor is to look close to the original. Next best one would be the good old Classic mold. Power of the Primes leader Optimus/Orion Pax is quite amazing too.
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby noctorro » Sat Dec 15, 2018 5:24 am

-Kanrabat- wrote:
noctorro wrote:I like MP 44, but I stopped collecting Masterpieces. Megatron looks impossible to transform.
And this guy costs like a new computer.

On the Siege comparison.

I'm telling you man, Siege Optimus Prime is thé best G1 looking normal line Optimus Prime so far.
Anyone a better example?



Spot the Frenchie phoneposting! :lol:
I can relate because that damn auto-correct is relentless. :BANG_HEAD:

As for the perfect modern "G1" Optimus, Siege might be the best one so far if the only factor is to look close to the original. Next best one would be the good old Classic mold. Power of the Primes leader Optimus/Orion Pax is quite amazing too.


Haha, very close m8. Dutch ;)

Agree, Classics Optimus is very good. I'm a real sucker for the flat chest and G1 headsculpt. I think Hasbro might remold Siege Optimus for a pure G1. The figure we have now has a great transformation and shave off some excess detail. G1 Optimus.
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby Cyberpath » Sat Dec 15, 2018 10:13 am

Takara posted a few samples of the unnecessary sound gimmick, check it out --

https://tf.takaratomy.co.jp/products/tf_mp/mp44_m

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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby Overcracker » Sat Dec 15, 2018 12:26 pm

Motto: "Collecting little transforming action figures is the right of all sentient Geeks."
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Cyberpath wrote:Takara posted a few samples of the unnecessary sound gimmick, check it out --

https://tf.takaratomy.co.jp/products/tf_mp/mp44_m

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Sounds a lot like the voice from MB-11 Prime. Probably same guy.

Also, for those wearing headphones, lower the volume for the second voice clip... :michaelbay: :michaelbay: :michaelbay:
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby kiwijinxter » Sat Dec 15, 2018 12:30 pm

Cyberpath wrote:
19: Now that the project is finally done and dusted, how do you feel?
Feel like "we've done everything we could". This is Optimus Prime after all, so we put in our heart and soul. At the same time even if we overdid it, Prime would forgive us (LOL). After MP44, the MP benchmark might have been raised again!


Thanks Cyberpath for this. It is helpful to know the details. Personally for me, I feel that the only MP benchmark they have set is the killer price. But in the end it's just business, so I can see why they chose Optimus Prime to charge the killer price - I can imagine Optimus as the best-selling figure across the range of Transformers. They wouldn't dare charge USD$450 for say, Ironhide... (which reminds me, Masterpiece MPM-6 really needs some major fixing from what I read!)
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby -Kanrabat- » Sat Dec 15, 2018 3:22 pm

Motto: "Love it? GET IT!
It's that simple."
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Not counting Maketoys version, how much longer for a 400$ new cartoon accurate MP seeker mold? :-?
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Re: Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-44 Optimus Prime 3.0 Discussion Thread

Postby ZeroWolf » Sat Dec 15, 2018 3:36 pm

Motto: "My past no longer binds my future..."
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-Kanrabat- wrote:Not counting Maketoys version, how much longer for a 400$ new cartoon accurate MP seeker mold? :-?

Considering the Starscream head...I'd say sooner rather than later.
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