The Energon Pub

http://www.seibertron.com/news/view.php?id=8873

though i'm not sure that the picture of just the torso is the same... seeing as how i doubt takara paints even their protos with tamiya paint... but who ever made that one should be proud too, because its pretty awesome also.


On another note, they probably will, but i sure hope they bulk his legs up some. Also, the size of his cannon is bordering on ridiculous. I know its probably in scale to the gun and all that, but i'd really rather it look good on the bot than the pistol, if i had to choose.

im fine with the blaster.. its the puney lil legs... may be no way to make them better due to the fact that it would make the grip huge...

... i'm ok with that

Is it jsut me or does it look like he's not going to be able to hold up his arm with the cannon on it without a stand? I mean the thing is huge. And those legs are tiny. Hopefully he'll get some bulking up and the joints will be nice and strong to hold things up. He looks promising.

Maybe they could make the arm cannon 2 seperate cannons(one for gun and one for bot). Or make the one cannon seperate pieces or telescopic to make up for the javelin on his arm. The legs, and IMO the waist could use some bulking up. But this is only a prototype, like starscream went through some changes maybe megs will too.

i'm sure they'll bulk up the legs, as i'm pretty postive they'll go more for bot accuracy than alt mode, like Prime instead of Starscream. If they don't, they've lost a customer... cause if they're only to charge $100 and slap the "Masterpiece" moniker on their, it'd be nice if the if it wasn't just a bigger G1 Megatron toy with a bit more articulation.

Prime went for accuracy in both modes, not just one. Bulking up the legs would make him look absolutely ridiculaous in alt mode. the same with having a smaller arm cannon. This prototype is still very accurate in robot mode, even with the thin legs. Compromises have to be made.

prime doesn't really make all that accurate of a truck... for one, i don't think i've ever seen a semi without... oh i don't know... DOORS. Or even side windows for that matter, or rear view mirrors... or more than one seat. And i'm not sure, but i think semi's also tend to have steering wheels.

All i'm saying is that if compromises have to be made, i'd much rather they be made to the alt mode, not the bot mode.

Tramp wrote:Prime went for accuracy in both modes, not just one. Bulking up the legs would make him look absolutely ridiculous in alt mode. the same with having a smaller arm cannon. This prototype is still very accurate in robot mode, even with the thin legs. Compromises have to be made.

Yeah, but accurate to a bad design, which IMO G1 Megs was, isn't really a good thing. And they could easily bulk up the legs without screwing up the alt mode. The stock could fold up into the legs in bot mode and add some more bulk there and it would still leave the gun handle thin as its supposed to be. And I don't see how a slightly smaller cannon would screw up the alt mode that much.

Personally though I just want a cool Bot mode, alt mode is somewhat secondary to me. And this one jsut looks goofy, he really doesn't look like he'll be able to stand up on his own. Hopefully some things will get tweaked before release, this is a proto after all. But at this point the figure is not living up to Master Piece in my mind.

fromwednesday747 wrote:All i'm saying is that if compromises have to be made, i'd much rather they be made to the alt mode, not the bot mode.

I agree I'd much rather have more accuracy in the bot mode than alt mode. Having a bigger grip and a smaller cannon is ok because he's already going to be a very large gun anyway. A 12" bot into a Walther P-38 is going to be larger than the actual gun and a Walther is a small gun to begin with

I’m just the opposite. The alternate mode is more imortant since that is the disguise. The robot mode must convincingly look like it can transform into the apparopriate alt mode. It has to make those compromises. Yes, for a toy, the alt mode does need to make some sacrifices, but they should be kept to a minimum—mirrors and side windows missing to accombidate the transformation mechanisms for example.

For Megatron, the thin profile of his legs, and the huge arm cannon are compromises for a more accurate gun mode, which is as it should be.

Rest assured, the quality and stability will be there.

well, i'm ok with agreeing to disagree

Tramp wrote:I’m just the opposite. The alternate mode is more imortant since that is the disguise. The robot mode must convincingly look like it can transform into the apparopriate alt mode. It has to make those compromises. Yes, for a toy, the alt mode does need to make some sacrifices, but they should be kept to a minimum—mirrors and side windows missing to accombidate the transformation mechanisms for example.

For Megatron, the thin profile of his legs, and the huge arm cannon are compromises for a more accurate gun mode, which is as it should be.

Rest assured, the quality and stability will be there.

Thing is he's already inaccurate jsut based on scale. If hte bot mode is 12 inches tall then the gun mode will most likley be almost twice the size of the original. Which would put it at about 125 percent the size of the real gun. And I jsut don't see the stability unless those legs get some bulk. He's gonna end up like Starscream unable to stand on his own unless he's in the exact right pose. Otherwise he'll be stuff on a display stand. Regardless of if he is an adult collectable, i still want to be able to "play" with and pose my figure. And the one in that picture doesn't look capable.

tentagil wrote:

Tramp wrote:I’m just the opposite. The alternate mode is more imortant since that is the disguise. The robot mode must convincingly look like it can transform into the apparopriate alt mode. It has to make those compromises. Yes, for a toy, the alt mode does need to make some sacrifices, but they should be kept to a minimum—mirrors and side windows missing to accombidate the transformation mechanisms for example.

For Megatron, the thin profile of his legs, and the huge arm cannon are compromises for a more accurate gun mode, which is as it should be.

Rest assured, the quality and stability will be there.

Thing is he's already inaccurate jsut based on scale. If hte bot mode is 12 inches tall then the gun mode will most likley be almost twice the size of the original. Which would put it at about 125 percent the size of the real gun. And I jsut don't see the stability unless those legs get some bulk. He's gonna end up like Starscream unable to stand on his own unless he's in the exact right pose. Otherwise he'll be stuff on a display stand. Regardless of if he is an adult collectable, i still want to be able to "play" with and pose my figure. And the one in that picture doesn't look capable.

It looks plenty capable to me.
As for the size, so what? As long as the proper proportions and design accuracy of the gun mode is there, it doesn’t matter that it is scaled up a bit. The size isn’t important, the proportions are. An overly thick handgrip would look ridiculous on any size gun; and that is what would happen if they thickened up the legs. And, given the length of his feet from heel to toe, he should be plenty stable unless you tried to stand him on one foot, and I don’t know of any TFs that can stand on one foot without falling over. Even scaled up 125%, the gun mode should still look like a Walther P-38, not a deformed one. Just because it is bigger than the real thing does not meant they shouldn’t try to make the gun mode look as close to the real thing as possible, then figure out how to transform it into a decent looking robot. This is what they did, and they did a damn good job of it IMO.

Look at that bot mod though! Damn, if you want a realistic looking walther, you can certainly obtain one. I realize that i don't speak for everyone, but i think most people would like a much better looking Megatron than that. Like i said before, that toy really looks not much better to me than the original. Screw the handle looking too big or the scope being too small, it would improve whats more important to most transfans. I doubt many people are going to be like "damn, what a convincing walther p-38 that toy is, i think i'll drop $100 on it". i think where we really differ is that paying that much for a "decent" robot isn't my idea of money well spent. I will, however, pay that much for the what the "Masterpiece" title would imply is the definitive version of a character i grew up with. That prototype isn't it.

fromwednesday747 wrote:Look at that bot mod though! Damn, if you want a realistic looking walther, you can certainly obtain one. I realize that i don't speak for everyone, but i think most people would like a much better looking Megatron than that. Like i said before, that toy really looks not much better to me than the original. Screw the handle looking too big or the scope being too small, it would improve whats more important to most transfans. I doubt many people are going to be like "damn, what a convincing walther p-38 that toy is, i think i'll drop $100 on it". i think where we really differ is that paying that much for a "decent" robot isn't my idea of money well spent. I will, however, pay that much for the what the "Masterpiece" title would imply is the definitive version of a character i grew up with. That prototype isn't it.

I disagree 100%. That is perhaps one of the best Megatron models, in robot mode, I have seen to date. The very fact that they were able to make a very accurate looking, though scaled up, Walther P-38, and create a robot mode that close to the cartoon character, along with making it fully articulated is laudable. I find absolutely no fault in that model what so ever. You are not going to get a 100% cartoon accurate robot mode, and still have it transform, without the alt mode looking totally ridiculous, and that wouldn’t be an improvement. This is the difinitive G1 Megatron.

HA. That is far from looking like any version of g1 Megatron except the toy, unless thats what they're going for. I think its ridiculous to say that thats the definitive version of Megatron. To me, thats just the definitive version of what a walther would look like if it changed into a robot. Obviously we're not going to get a perfect bot and a bot alt., but i just don't understand why you would prefer the gun to look better than the mech, seeing as how first and formost, transformers are robots whose alternate modes are a secondary function. I mean... we already have a Megatron that turns into a convincing walther. How bout this time we get a convincing Megatron.

Tramp wrote:I disagree 100%. That is perhaps one of the best Megatron models, in robot mode, I have seen to date. The very fact that they were able to make a very accurate looking, though scaled up, Walther P-38, and create a robot mode that close to the cartoon character, along with making it fully articulated is laudable. I find absolutely no fault in that model what so ever. You are not going to get a 100% cartoon accurate robot mode, and still have it transform, without the alt mode looking totally ridiculous, and that wouldn’t be an improvement. This is the difinitive G1 Megatron.

First have we actually seen pics of the alt mode yet, as far as I know the only pics are of him in bot mode. So we have no idea if they pulled off a convincing Walther P-38 or not. What we have seen is the Bot mode. And though I do agree that its an impressive piece of engineering and design, I jsut don't think the bot mode looks as good as it could, and unless that cannon is incredibly light I don't see it being able to hold it up. Those arms being as thin as they are may have ratcheted joints, but I still don't see them being strong enough, but time will tell on that. I just don't think he's in very good proportion over all. Perhaps after we get more pictures in more poses and see the alt mode I'll change my mind, but for now this figure really isn't as incredible as I think a masterpiece figure should be.

IMO id be happy with it but the elbows are a bit thin, then again how much did starscream change from first prototype to final release, and the first pictures we saw of him were official too,

if you want a cartoon accurate megatron i cant see it being possable, since they probably drew him slight differant every time
these are just random pictures and you can see changes from hit head shape to having elbow or not
http://www.unicron.us/tf1984/toypix/megatron.htm

as far as i see the MP line they are just highly detailed upgraded toys, it is the definitive version of Megatron,,,, well nearly
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a199/ ... CF1510.jpg

Well, from an artistic and anatomical standpoint, I would say he is pretty well proportioned, including the arms and legs. The probability is very high that they have taken the strength of the joints into account for the arm cannon, and, ratcheted joints should be able to support it. And, given that the cannon/scope will likely be made of plastic, I am pretty certain it will be light enough for the arm to support it. As Piranacon pointed out, you will never get a completely cartoon accurate model and still have it transform. Larger arms, and thicker legs would ruin the gun mode.

As for why I prefer the appearance of the alt mode to be spot on, that is simple. The alt mode is the robot’s disguise. If it isn’t convincing, it isn’t a very good disguise now, is it? This model does a very good job of making a convincing Megatron without sacrificing the alt mode. He is well proportioned, fully articulated, nicely detailed, and much closer to the cartoon version than he is to the original toy version. Is he spot on? No, but that is impossible to accomplish and still have him transform, and for the reasons Piranacon mentioned. There really isn’t much else they can improve on him.

This is just getting stupid. I don't like it, you do. Lets end it there.

How is it getting stupid? Is it because you can’t find fault in my logic? I am looking at it from a purely mechanical standpoint for both modes. I’m looking at the function of his design and his alt mode. You are thinking purely emotionally, looking at wanting something that is a dead ringer for the cartoon Megatron in robot mode with no regard to the alt mode. At least Tentagil is trying to think logically about the possible physical limitations of the design.

how about this..

just like the damn movie.... lets stop bitching about it.. untill we see the finished product.... seriously now...

my lord man, it has nothing to do with not being able to find fault in your logic, because your "logic" is based on your opinion of how it should look, which is clearly different than mine. I'm ok with the alt mode looking not quite right, like mp prime, if the bot mode looks perfect, LIKE MP PRIME. Thats why i think this stupid, because we're arguing over preference, not what is or isn't possible. Get over yourself, this isn't an arguement you can possibily be right about, and like wise, i can't be right either. Can we end it now, or does your ego dictate you need to get the last word in?