Angelus wrote:It really is getting louder every issue...
Transformers Ongoing is not going to survive!
Angelus wrote:Even when real TF fans are thinking about dropping the book and accepting that this is the single most terrible comic version of the Transformers ever
-Kanrabat- wrote:TF-fan kev777 wrote:First-Aid wrote:Okay, did anyone else notice that we all get a wonderful shot of Starscreams crotch anytime he sits in that throne? That's unnerving. Couldn't they have put n extra flap in there? It's....weird.
Its kind of like Basic Instinct, but not in a good way...
Goddammit, now I can't unsee it.
Angelus wrote:The Diamond Comics list istn't real possitive in sales information for the G1 ongoing book...
Angelus wrote:And if you read all the complaints in the forums here or at IDW, the sounds are very, very clear from the TF fans...
Angelus wrote:11,000 issues sold and declining every month...
Profit, or lack thereof, is the voice of the people... vocal or not.
Midnight_Fox wrote:Angelus wrote:And if you read all the complaints in the forums here or at IDW, the sounds are very, very clear from the TF fans...
A very vocal minority does not carry the voice of the people.
-Kanrabat- wrote:TF-fan kev777 wrote:First-Aid wrote:Okay, did anyone else notice that we all get a wonderful shot of Starscreams crotch anytime he sits in that throne? That's unnerving. Couldn't they have put n extra flap in there? It's....weird.
Its kind of like Basic Instinct, but not in a good way...
Goddammit, now I can't unsee it.
Yes the target audience is a bunch dumb drooling twelve year old children.First-Aid wrote:Very true. And once again, we have to remember that comics aren't necessarily aimed at adult fans either, despite being a "G1 reboot". It's just like the toy line...we aren't the primary audience.
-Kanrabat- wrote:TF-fan kev777 wrote:First-Aid wrote:Okay, did anyone else notice that we all get a wonderful shot of Starscreams crotch anytime he sits in that throne? That's unnerving. Couldn't they have put n extra flap in there? It's....weird.
Its kind of like Basic Instinct, but not in a good way...
Goddammit, now I can't unsee it.
morphobots wrote:Sooooo . . . Hot Rod was blasted out into space with the Matrix, but there it is still around Starscream's neck on the cover? All right, it's a cover, meant to just garner interest, so I'll sort of let that slide.
Stormer wrote:
So, it's good to see some of the faithful and optimistic here. Where the hell have you all been? If you like Ongoing, then say so - and say why. I'm always holding out hope that this comic is going to get better, but for me - always the hopeful one - it hasn't and I'm losing that excitement to see the next issue. I really don't think that the fans who dislike Ongoing are a vocal minority. I think it's the majority. So, those of you who like it have some work ahead of you - time to make some noise!
First-Aid wrote:Diamond Comics has sold out of issue 15. Just went in yesterday to pick it up and the store was out of them, and my friend- who is the store manager- checked with Diamond and they were sold out.
Dagon wrote:Not trolling or anything, but I just wanted to say that I applaud your saying this. The far too depressingly common mindset forced on this board seems to be the one that if you don't like something you are far and away the minority voice, and I am just glad to see someone taking the time to postulate that the opposite may be true. I don't care for the new ongoing, and stopped reading it a number of issues ago, and I am not being argumentative, but I am heartened to see someone saying that the majority of people may not be the ones who are accepting of something. It may not be coming out the right way, but I respect your idea here much more than I respect things like "It's not intended for you, but for children, so stop not liking something that isn't even meant for your consumption," which is apparently the only voice of TF debate in forever.
In an argument or a debate, the negative side is not the one that needs to prove itself. It is the responsibility of the affirmative to convince the negative otherwise, and saying "Stop being a candy ass, all of this **** is meant for kids" is not even kind of effective.
I just wanted to say Stormer, that I respect your opinion infinately, even though I don't like the comic. You seem a voice of reason here, and not just someone being mad because everyone doesn't like what you like. Thanks, a little bit of my faith in humanity has been restored thanks to you.
Stormer wrote:
I want Ongoing to succeed. I think that's what everyone wants in the end.
Dagon wrote:Stormer wrote:
I want Ongoing to succeed. I think that's what everyone wants in the end.
We are fans. we naturally want the franchise to be successful, as that breeds franchise longevity.
But it is dissention which breeds said success, not chastising or looking down on people who are in the dislike camp for some new development. We have these boogeymen, like GeeWuners and that bullshit, like "Oh, you don't want to be a GeeWunner" like there's hundreds of thousands of them, and so we have to attach that name to anyone who doesn't straight up love something new. Opposition is true friendship. Fans complained about the movie look of the Ongoing robots. They don't look that movie-ish to me any more.
I am glad people like the Ongoning, and Animated, and ROTF and PRime and all the rest of it. I resent being made to seem less for not liking those things. I'm 32 years old. I'm glad kids like Transformers. But I like them too, and until my own kids like Transformers, the only fan of Transformers that I really care about is myself. I shouldn't be a neckbeard or whatever if I dont agree. I'm vocal about things I dont like, sure, but I'm not even close to as rude as some people are. But even in that, I accept it, because we are fans. We are passionate about this stuff, because we love it.
And Stormer, I love you. It just kind of went with the preceeding sentences, hope you don't mind.
Stormer wrote:Dagon wrote:Stormer wrote:
I want Ongoing to succeed. I think that's what everyone wants in the end.
We are fans. we naturally want the franchise to be successful, as that breeds franchise longevity.
But it is dissention which breeds said success, not chastising or looking down on people who are in the dislike camp for some new development. We have these boogeymen, like GeeWuners and that bullshit, like "Oh, you don't want to be a GeeWunner" like there's hundreds of thousands of them, and so we have to attach that name to anyone who doesn't straight up love something new. Opposition is true friendship. Fans complained about the movie look of the Ongoing robots. They don't look that movie-ish to me any more.
I am glad people like the Ongoning, and Animated, and ROTF and PRime and all the rest of it. I resent being made to seem less for not liking those things. I'm 32 years old. I'm glad kids like Transformers. But I like them too, and until my own kids like Transformers, the only fan of Transformers that I really care about is myself. I shouldn't be a neckbeard or whatever if I dont agree. I'm vocal about things I dont like, sure, but I'm not even close to as rude as some people are. But even in that, I accept it, because we are fans. We are passionate about this stuff, because we love it.
And Stormer, I love you. It just kind of went with the preceeding sentences, hope you don't mind.
Ya just gotta have a good balance. This is proof that two fans with different opinions can get along and even compliment each others opinions without coming to blows or being rude. And, you're absolutely right - we're all passionate about this stuff. Otherwise, why bother? I've said before on other threads that being on this forum and reading what others think or know about the subject enhances my fan experience. I really enjoy the discussions here because it makes me consider someone else's point of view and opens my mind up to other possibilities.
And...if we all agreed about everything all the time, Good Lord, how boring would that be?
Awww...I love you too, Dagon! I don't mind at all!
Dagon wrote:Utter agreement. I LOVE seeing the other opinions, it helps me to expand my own. I just don't think it's any kind of productive when a differing opinion is greeted with taunts of how this ****'s for kids like that excludes us, or that we all must change with times or else are the basement dwellers. I live in a basement by choice, got a problem with that? (Not you, the Cosmos) I've got two degrees and am pursuing the start of a doctorate, but I'm some loser because I like my Prime with smokestacks or I prefer Megatron's trigger crotch? I think not.
We need to disagree, and if that hurts a feeling here or there, or makes some 17 year old on the Internet not feel like the bee's knees, that's just sorta a part of it. I'm not mean or malicious, but disagreement breeds development. Opposition is true friendship.
So, uh, your place or mine? I live in a basement apartment, and have a large action figure collection....
Stormer wrote:Dagon wrote:Not trolling or anything, but I just wanted to say that I applaud your saying this. The far too depressingly common mindset forced on this board seems to be the one that if you don't like something you are far and away the minority voice, and I am just glad to see someone taking the time to postulate that the opposite may be true. I don't care for the new ongoing, and stopped reading it a number of issues ago, and I am not being argumentative, but I am heartened to see someone saying that the majority of people may not be the ones who are accepting of something. It may not be coming out the right way, but I respect your idea here much more than I respect things like "It's not intended for you, but for children, so stop not liking something that isn't even meant for your consumption," which is apparently the only voice of TF debate in forever.
In an argument or a debate, the negative side is not the one that needs to prove itself. It is the responsibility of the affirmative to convince the negative otherwise, and saying "Stop being a candy ass, all of this **** is meant for kids" is not even kind of effective.
I just wanted to say Stormer, that I respect your opinion infinately, even though I don't like the comic. You seem a voice of reason here, and not just someone being mad because everyone doesn't like what you like. Thanks, a little bit of my faith in humanity has been restored thanks to you.
Thanks, Dagon! That's quite a compliment!
Here's the thing that drives me completely batty - we've got those on here who don't have any problem with telling you why they dislike Ongoing and why which is fine. Then there are those who will just go along with whatever everyone else is saying. Then you got those who like it, but are afraid to speak up. I get why they're not forthcoming with their opinions - that vocal bunch who hate it will rip them apart for liking it. This is a two way street. We're here to better the fandom. We're all here because our beloved Transformers is what brought us together. We don't all have to like everything that has Transformers written on it, but when fans say what they like and don't like, the hope here is to arrive somewhere in the middle to make the majority happy. Not everyone is going to happy all the time - that expectation is ludicrous. I don't mind a good heated argument as long as there are valid opinions being vocalized. Remember the G2 comic from Marvel? That was a damn good story and it was still canceled! LSOTW was clearly not kid-stuff. The target audience is us - period. It doesn't matter how old you are. Quantity does not constitute quality - but the other way around. If you put out a quality product, people will buy and enjoy it.
I want Ongoing to succeed. I want to dig out those comics in twenty years and know I'm looking at a classic. I think that's what everyone wants in the end.
Cyberstrike wrote:I for one LOVE ongoing and thinks it's far better than Furman's whole IDW run which was IMHO at a best a forgettable snore fest and at worst complete and total **** (FTR I said at the IDW boards and I will say here it again Revelations was one of the worse comic series I ever read and Maximum Dinobots wasn't much an improvement). I think damn time we saw some new blood in the series that brings a new and fresh perspective on a franchise that under Furman's writing was going stale and boring. Furman had almost 50 issues between mini-series and Transformers: Spotlight and all it led up to was a bad Darth Vader rip off (Nemesis Prime) trying to merge univeses and the Autobots speaking in techno babble straight out of Star Trek: Voyager and vague threats of a larger dangers and the Dinobots and friends fighting Decepticons on Earth.
By time I slogged through Maximum Dinobots TPB I actually hated all The Transformers comics from Marvel, DW, and IDW because I was so disgusted by this crap by Furman who IMHO hasn't written a decent TF story since G2 #12.
Maybe the reason I loved All Hail Megatron was because I read it in trades and not as single issues, maybe it was because I did my best to advoid Transformers comic book discussions because I was so sick of the crap that Furman wrote. Maybe it's because it's because of iconoclastic nature, or combonations of all or some.
I honestly don't give a damn about people's opinions of me, I would rather be hated for being honest with my opinions that being loved as a liar to get and go a long with crowd because it's safer.
I've enjoyed all of the TF G1 related books since ongoing has started, they along with other titles like Mass Effect: Redemption, Dragon Age, X-Factor, and others have rekindled my love for monthly comics.
My advice to people who don't like the comics is simple: don't buy them.
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