The Energon Pub

Sodan-1 wrote:I have to admit that I don't see a valid reason to blame Hasbro. The one thing that sticks in my mind from the last podcast is mention of how much it costs to develop a mold in the first place. Hasbro has obviously developed the mold and produced it in numbers, so it makes no sense that they would be the ones to prevent them hitting U.S. retail.

Hasbro can't force a retailer to sell their figures, and from a retailers perspective I can see why the First Editions might not be too attractive. An entire line that offers only 8 figures for a limited time until they are replaced in short order by the main RiD line which everyone knew was coming and would contain a good variety of figures. Hasbro only need to distribute their goods to a handful of the retailer's distribution centres. It's then their job to distribute them to the hundreds, if not thousands of stores across the nation, where they would most likely sit taking up peg/shelf space. The First Edition deluxe wave 1 figures were the smallest, cheapest and contained the most well-known characters. I'd say you were lucky to get them as it is.

The only way I think Hasbro can be held accountable is for putting these figures in a line of their own. Sticking to the original plan and integrating them with the Generations line would've avoided this problem.

If it was solely the retailers fault for not wanting to run a lot of them, could Hasbro not just sell them on Hasbro Toyshop? They aren't, and so they get my rage and not my money.

KenjaminLinus wrote:If it was solely the retailers fault for not wanting to run a lot of them, could Hasbro not just sell them on Hasbro Toyshop? They aren't, and so they get my rage and not my money.

Excellent question, considering they have Arcee, Bumblebee and Starscream on there.

they wont be re-released even if there is a demand just look at all the RTS figures that we all wanted but still have yet to get. Whats the point of making molds then making them more or less an exclusive but then leave it up to the store to order them or not? Good thing i wasnt looking forward to this line, would've liked an arcee but oh well. Thats more money for me and less for TRU & Hasbro. Also now that i think about it all this means is that all the scalpers out there that bought out the stores are about to make a **** ton of money.

Sodan-1 wrote:I have to admit that I don't see a valid reason to blame Hasbro. The one thing that sticks in my mind from the last podcast is mention of how much it costs to develop a mold in the first place. Hasbro has obviously developed the mold and produced it in numbers, so it makes no sense that they would be the ones to prevent them hitting U.S. retail.

Hasbro can't force a retailer to sell their figures, and from a retailers perspective I can see why the First Editions might not be too attractive. An entire line that offers only 8 figures for a limited time until they are replaced in short order by the main RiD line which everyone knew was coming and would contain a good variety of figures. Hasbro only need to distribute their goods to a handful of the retailer's distribution centres. It's then their job to distribute them to the hundreds, if not thousands of stores across the nation, where they would most likely sit taking up peg/shelf space. The First Edition deluxe wave 1 figures were the smallest, cheapest and contained the most well-known characters. I'd say you were lucky to get them as it is.

The only way I think Hasbro can be held accountable is for putting these figures in a line of their own. Sticking to the original plan and integrating them with the Generations line would've avoided this problem.

Given the cost it takes to produce the molds, it's more baffling to me that they'd scrap them after a tiny release, and then develop new ones for the RID line, at least for the characters already created. Honestly, given Hasbro's propensity to reuse molds, I'd assumed we'd get all the First Edition figures rereleased, possibly with less paint apps, in the main line, in the new packaging. I still doubt we've seen the last of those molds, but who among us can really say? The "Revealers" portion of RID doesn't seem to have anything that would exclude the use of the FE Deluxes, but the "Powerizers" have that light-up gimmick that the FE Voyagers certainly don't, so someone might think that stores will have a harder time selling them on the same shelf as ones that do something more obviously flashy.

That the newer molds appear to be less appealing to the majority of us posting here, because of complexity and size, suggests that these new toys may be cheaper to produce, but then why make the First Edition ones in the first place? I'm sure people would be complaining a whole lot less about the new Micromaster sized Revealer Cliffjumper if there hadn't already been a quite nice proper-sized Deluxe version out...or advertised, at least. Seems like an overall poor marketing and business decision from Hasbro.

KenjaminLinus wrote:If it was solely the retailers fault for not wanting to run a lot of them, could Hasbro not just sell them on Hasbro Toyshop? They aren't, and so they get my rage and not my money.

Erm.... I'm sorry, I don't speak english.

What logical reason could there be for Hasbro not releasing these figures in the U.S., their home market? I can't believe it's something as obvious as they're useless.

If First Edition Prime was for collectors, why on earth they were using (really) soft rubber in some figures, like Voyager Optimus...?

Anyway, it is not a problem to release limited editions. All manufactures like Bandai, Toynami etc do that. However, they make clear to the public what will be limited edition. They inform how many pieces will be produced, where the figures will be selling etc. The consumers know beforehand what to expect.

I don't remember Hasbro saying that. So they just created a big expectation and are not fulfilling that, which results in frustration. Good job...

Even worse, now the prices of those figures will go up, the sellers on ebay (not Hasbro) will make a good money and I wouldn't be surprised if Hasbro decide to re-release them in the future, only for the despair of all those who had burned their money on ebay...

I was in the Toys r us in Dartmouth Nova Scotia this past Saturday and picked up a first edition Voyager Prime for my son. He's been looking for it since before Christmas. It was nowhere to be seen up until a few weeks ago and now suddenly they have about 25-30 of them along with first edition Bee, Arcee and Starscream. No sign of Bulkhead however. I'm thinking it would be wise to grab a few of these as they seem few and far between. Regardless, they are there for the taking if any of you have any connections to pick them up.

Had to triple check I was still on Seibertron and hadn't swapped tabs.

So much whining, I thought I was on a Games Workshop fan site!

i see all the comments that it's the stores fault and what not.. and sure that's true..

BUT..

OVERALL it's hasbros fault. why is there a need to make two new inferior molds for characters. First Edition Voyager Prime is leaps and bounds better than the RiD version.. Same goes for Cliffjumper.

There is ABSOLUTELY no reason why these figures couldn't have just been repacked.. it baffles my mind that they would create two ALL NEW molds for these characters rather than just adding to their character list.

I think we should organize a petition.. or have everyone at once email hasbro about this garbage.

I have to say that is they do not put some of the DOTM figs on clearance at local Wal Marts, no one is getting any new TF figs.. Every one that I visit is overloaded with the figs...

not true i can tell you that , because they wont stop senting large shipments of the first line to my area in toronto ontario in canada and that a first because canadains never get first pick we wait months and months even lots of times never get them i have to go to convections to get one

anyways they sent and shipment this week to toyrus and still have not seen the vechicons figure or soundwave or wheejack so come here take them so i get the new one 's

Hasbro's face when they replied to their message:

this is total bs. gonna have to pay a lil bit more to get em on ebay.

Ok, so we're all clear, there's a lot of rage on this issue. A few reasoned arguments, but a lot of 'Hasbro screwed me' sentiment

Just to go back to before the first editions were released, Hasbro said these were originally designed for generations (therefore they are of a classics standard in engineering) There was talk from bbts that they were online retailer exclusive and they mostly were. And it's called 'first edition' that implies that it's a: limited or preview in nature and b: the first version, as in not the only one they will do

The patchy retail appearance is, I will admit, a slap in the face. The uk didn't get them in retail, we got 2 shops that got them limited, we got shafted way worse considering. But they were figures spun off from a line we love, into their own line. It was limited and those that have missed out on the opportunity to get them, you missed a treat but it's not like preorders were hard to find at the time

Now, onto the present. I cant speak of soundwave or Wheeljack as I don't have either in hand yet, but the Optimus, Bee and Cliffjumper (not so much megatron) are simplified and also quite sturdy as figures. The best approximation I could give is animated wave 1. Very little parts forming, but they're rigid and tough for play. Took me about 20 seconds to transform bumblebee.

Hasbro released a set of figures with a less complex transformation and quite a few shortcuts because the average 7 year old needs to be able to work it. It says 5+ on the box for a reason. They're not making these toys just for adults. The 'I can't see why they would scrap the molds' arguments is simple, they did a line we all devoured like crack addicts. The limited nature made us more ravenous. Now they're building a line for a different demographic.

If you want the first editions then the takara releases or TRU is your best bet. Don't expect the peak of show accurate design and engineering from rid because it's not going to happen. I can see a child LOVING rid bumblebee. I can also see a child throwing fe bb at a wall in frustration over his chest pieces.

I respect the worldwide right of fanboys to bitch and moan irrationally but if you wait until a toyline enters the secondary market you need to accept the price. Or road trip to Canada it seems

I don't know why I felt the need to post this, it won't change any minds, but it's sometimes good to rant

I really wanted the blue Arcee. So i caved and just now bought it on ebay for $27. I got the pink one from HTS too a while back. You can never enough fembots, IMO!

Other than Arcee, CJ looks really nice, but I have decided to live without him. After market prices are too high and my local TRU never got the Prime stuff. Eff the world on that.

Stumpybot wrote:It was limited and those that have missed out on the opportunity to get them, you missed a treat but it's not like preorders were hard to find at the time

Herein lies the only flaw I can find in your argument. You speak as though everyone who preordered them has gotten them. This is, in fact, not true. Several people in this thread have stated that some places are still waiting to get some of the preorder items in for the first time. BBTS is an example. They're still waiting on "Wave 1.5" which includes Cliffjumper, the Voyagers, and the entertainment pack. That means their customers who did preorder are still waiting.

In other words, some people who did preorder may still be missing out on them, despite taking advantage of the opportunity to do so. Somehow, I think that's the real issue a lot of people are having, not getting what they were waiting to see released in the first place.

Stumpybot wrote:Just to go back to before the first editions were released, Hasbro said these were originally designed for generations (therefore they are of a classics standard in engineering) There was talk from bbts that they were online retailer exclusive and they mostly were. And it's called 'first edition' that implies that it's a: limited or preview in nature and b: the first version, as in not the only one they will do

Hasbro/Takara/Whoever-is-in-charge has a big problem labeling transformers...
If it is LIMITED edition, just put the bloody LIMITED word in the box, not FIRST edition... They don't know how to communicate very well. And I will not even comment on the infinity number of groups and subgroups that keep changing (nowadays I have a hard time trying to figure out if the new figures are scout, deluxe or voyager...). Too messy...

And I think it is more than time to separate things by age... Instead of releasing multiple molds of the same character for the same 5+ years old audience, why not make one mold for kids and other mold for an older public (a little more expensive, no problem, but without worry about soft rubber for safety reasons... )? In this particular, manufactures like Bandai and Yamato are much more ahead of Hasbro...

CommanderHazar wrote:

Stumpybot wrote:It was limited and those that have missed out on the opportunity to get them, you missed a treat but it's not like preorders were hard to find at the time

Herein lies the only flaw I can find in your argument. You speak as though everyone who preordered them has gotten them. This is, in fact, not true. Several people in this thread have stated that some places are still waiting to get some of the preorder items in for the first time. BBTS is an example. They're still waiting on "Wave 1.5" which includes Cliffjumper, the Voyagers, and the entertainment pack. That means their customers who did preorder are still waiting.

In other words, some people who did preorder may still be missing out on them, despite taking advantage of the opportunity to do so. Somehow, I think that's the real issue a lot of people are having, not getting what they were waiting to see released in the first place.

My problem exactly. I've got.no problem getting them on ebay but i pre order them from bbts in November. I email bbts and asked if i can still expect to receive the voyagers from bbts or if i need to go the ebay route. Should hear back tomorrow.

Whoa whoa whoa hang on guys, time ooooooouuut!! Lets do some creative examination of this announcement, shall we? Nowhere in the announcement did it say they would stop shipping figures. The first edition molds were unique to that line, so PERHAPS it means that they will no longer produce NEW molds in that style or line. Nowhere did it say they would stop making or shipping current figures. Many people (myself included, i'll admit) did this same thing late last year when the announcement came out about the First Editions being an online-only market; and wouldja look at that, they weren't! Yes, it's possible that what everyones saying is true and they wont produce anymore, but its called creative and deceptive wording. People will think that theyll have to get their toys right away so theres a big rush for all Prime toys, even shelfwarmers. Be cautious, yes, but it's very unlikely that they would cancel the line before even a semi-full release, cuz ive never known a company to pass up an opportunity for making buttloads of money.

Che wrote:

Stumpybot wrote:Just to go back to before the first editions were released, Hasbro said these were originally designed for generations (therefore they are of a classics standard in engineering) There was talk from bbts that they were online retailer exclusive and they mostly were. And it's called 'first edition' that implies that it's a: limited or preview in nature and b: the first version, as in not the only one they will do

Hasbro/Takara/Whoever-is-in-charge has a big problem labeling transformers...
If it is LIMITED edition, just put the bloody LIMITED word in the box, not FIRST edition... They don't know how to communicate very well. And I will not even comment on the infinity number of groups and subgroups that keep changing (nowadays I have a hard time trying to figure out if the new figures are scout, deluxe or voyager...). Too messy...

And I think it is more than time to separate things by age... Instead of releasing multiple molds of the same character for the same 5+ years old audience, why not make one mold for kids and other mold for an older public (a little more expensive, no problem, but without worry about soft rubber for safety reasons... )? In this particular, manufactures like Bandai and Yamato are much more ahead of Hasbro...

You can't compare hasbro/takara to Bandai or Yamato since the later are much larger companies and have more money to spend. Wether they're for collectors or kids if it's a toy sold in the US, online or in store, it has to follow American safety laws.

A part of me is wondering if the FE's didn't show up in the US (beyond the 3) because Hasbro wanted to create a maelstrom and then bring 'em out with the mainline. In one sense it adds to the hype and makes people want to grab 'em when the see 'em. On the other hand they lose out on business because people get frustrated and lose interest and/or find other means of obtaining the the toys they want (via Japan for instance, in which case Hasbro isn't making anything).

Whatever they're doing it's pretty messed up. I'd be more understanding of it if it was like this everywhere but the fact Canada has had the FE's for nearly two months now and we still don't have them is really... beyond stupid. I do feel bad for the European guys though. At least we got 3 figures...

Erailea wrote:A part of me is wondering if the FE's didn't show up in the US (beyond the 3) because Hasbro wanted to create a maelstrom and then bring 'em out with the mainline. In one sense it adds to the hype and makes people want to grab 'em when the see 'em. On the other hand they lose out on business because people get frustrated and lose interest and/or find other means of obtaining the the toys they want (via Japan for instance, in which case Hasbro isn't making anything).

Whatever they're doing it's pretty messed up. I'd be more understanding of it if it was like this everywhere but the fact Canada has had the FE's for nearly two months now and we still don't have them is really... beyond stupid.

I agree, all i've seen in my area are the first three, and ill do almost anything i can to avoid the online prices.

chuckdawg1999 wrote:You can't compare hasbro/takara to Bandai or Yamato since the later are much larger companies and have more money to spend. Wether they're for collectors or kids if it's a toy sold in the US, online or in store, it has to follow American safety laws.

I don't know who is bigger, but Hasbro/Takara is certainly not small, and if they can release multiple molds of the same character for the same public, they can also change the strategy and try something new. Size doesn't mean you need to get stuck with the same strategy. Regarding safety laws in U.S., I am not sure the law doesn't make any distinction. What you need to do is to get the proper age classification. By the way, how come some masterpieces were released in the U.S. under those safety laws?

Crazy... In Japan you can get "toys" which by no way would be good for a 5 years old kid, but is in the U.S. that a cannon toy can kill you... http://gma.yahoo.com/blogs/abc-blogs/cops-probe-death-boy-killed-toy-cannon-221230562--abc-news.html

"There are no plans at this time for additional Prime First Edition figures, but if there is a demand for them, we may look at it again in the future."

This is what I don't understand. If there's a demand for them? Isn't that what we have now?
I bought Bee, Arcee, and Starscream FEs as soon as I saw them a few months ago. I know the stores will only put out what they want. But the way I see it wouldn't they make more money from us if they ordered/stocked the FE prime toys? I'm keeping my fingers cross that we see these molds again. Especially the CJ mold; that one is waaaaaayyy better then the RID version