The Energon Pub

ZeroWolf wrote:

AllNewSuperRobot wrote:

o.supreme wrote:Also for the record, I have never understood the "Armada" as an individual character argument. Armada is a plural noun, has never been meant to be singular. It was likely meant to mean that Cyclonus himself was the commander of all the Cyclonus-like bots & Sweeps that were created.

Indeed. When Unicron refers to "his armada" there are two of them onscreen. Later in the show ..more:

tf.jpg

So how many of them are destined to become Selects releases

Forty two.

sol magnus wrote:Aside from Megatron they were all dead, anyway.

Just watched the movie again last night. They weren't dead, they were just all going to be dead sooner or later.

-Percepter

AllNewSuperRobot wrote: compare and contrast. In the Universe bot mode, try and find the jet mode. Other than the wings, behind his arms (which is design accurate) you can't see it.

So, you like the look better. Which is fair enough. But I can't say that the old one is superior.



While the new one has jet parts in robot mode the old one doesn't because it has a very gappy jet mode.

I will say it was great for it's time. But with TFs getting closer to the sizes they're supposed to be and vehicle modes getting tighter it doesn't satisfy outside of some very specific display setups.

Gauntlet101010 wrote:While the new one has jet parts in robot mode the old one doesn't because it has a very gappy jet mode.

The solution to that isn't fat legs though. It is an extra connection to click the legs together. The engineering is the bit I'm looking at. I don't care for the superficial bits such as show accuracy or colour scheme.

First-Aid wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:

AllNewSuperRobot wrote:

o.supreme wrote:Also for the record, I have never understood the "Armada" as an individual character argument. Armada is a plural noun, has never been meant to be singular. It was likely meant to mean that Cyclonus himself was the commander of all the Cyclonus-like bots & Sweeps that were created.

Indeed. When Unicron refers to "his armada" there are two of them onscreen. Later in the show ..more:

tf.jpg

So how many of them are destined to become Selects releases

Forty two.

In light of the Seekers existence, why they didn't do the same with Cyclonus and Scourge is a real mystery. This animation error alone, gave them plenty of redeco options.

Percepter wrote:

sol magnus wrote:Aside from Megatron they were all dead, anyway.

Just watched the movie again last night. They weren't dead, they were just all going to be dead sooner or later.

-Percepter

Megatron was dying, the rest of the 'cons were D.O.A.

Arguably, Megatron is just badly damaged not necessarily fatally. The scene itself was ambigious. Although I would say after being dumped out of Astrotrain, most of the others were dead.

bluecatcinema wrote:These guys all look amazing, especially Megatron.

And does anyone else find it funny that Cyclonus' description describes him as being reformatted from Bombshell/Skywarp? It seems they just can't make up their minds...

TBH I always took the dubious dual origins as something like Unicron merged both Skywarp and Bombshell's sparks together to make Cyclonus. The same could be said for Scourge as well in his origins with the merging of Thundercracker, Skrapnel, and Kickback. Then again Kickback and Skrapnel could've been made into Sweeps instead of merged with Thundercrack to make Scourge too. The Vok technically did this with both Tigatron and Airazor in Beast Wars to make Tigerhawk after all so we see something like this later on in the continuity. Then again this could be a headcanon I created based off how I interpreted the scene. Still I feel it has some merit to share.

While it doesn't matter to me, personally, I always thought Bombshell was Cyclonus. He's in the foreground. Even if Skywarp would have fit better the intention seems clear.

I also felt that Cyclonus was meant to have a whole army like Scourge did, but it just didn't happen in the final cut, so he just got the one guy who disappeared immediately afterwards. I'm not tempted to try and misread the scene so Skywarp is actually Cyclonus.

Of course they added a price hike. Gotta stick it to us any way they can.

That Megatron is incredible! I initially thought the T-Rex head looked doofy from the angle it's at in the robot mode photo, but the two beast mode photos make it look so much better. I'm definitely buying him, Cheetor and Rattrap, but Cyclonus is on the maybe pile for now, until I've decided whether or not there's really a place for Cyclonus in my revised Generations collection.

sol magnus wrote:

Notimus Crime wrote:

Bounti76 wrote:

CYCLONUS, a herald of UNICRON, first appears in the 1986 movie when BOMBSHELL/SKYWARP were reformatted into the second-in-command of GALVATRON. 

So I guess this settles, once and for all, who Cyclonus really is. He's an amalgam of Skywarp AND Bombshell. Cool.

I do like that they know of the controversy there and didn't want to give a concrete answer, so they just go "everyone's right!". Cyclonus will always be Skywarp to me.

Skywarp was in the back. The Armada.

Plus, Skywarp was an idiot. Why Cyclonus has to be him is beyond me. In fact, any of them could be either one because they're completely different guys. Aside from Megatron they were all dead, anyway.

Just to be clear I don't really have strong feelings on who became who. I don't really feel like there necessarily is a right answer. It's just for me that I like the idea that Skywarp became Cyclonus better. Probably because Skywarp's my favorite seeker and I'd like to think he (or at least his body) became important purple space jet man instead of generic armada man.

o.supreme wrote:

sol magnus wrote:In fact, any of them could be either one because they're completely different guys. Aside from Megatron they were all dead, anyway.

This^. I think it just matters to some fans who's Dead husks were made into Cyclonus & Scourge's bodies. It's just easiest to go Blue seeker= Blue Scourge, Black/Purple seeker= Purple Cyclonus.

Also for the record, I have never understood the "Armada" as an individual character argument. Armada is a plural noun, has never been meant to be singular. It was likely meant to mean that Cyclonus himself was the commander of all the Cyclonus-like bots & Sweeps that were created.

Oh, I know "Armada" refers to all of them. I have always found it funny, though.

These look great, although, I think that that may have been a purposely flattering pose for megs, as I think the backpack is actually pretty out of control especially behind the waist

Don't get me wrong......almost all are bought on site and that says alot for me considering the ONLY original BW toy I ever liked was Megatron. I love how Cyclonus and Scourge turned out. Can't wait for Galvatron....BUT...where are Earthrise figs at?....the year is almost up and my neck of the woods has only seen a restock of wave 1 and the voyager wave with Snapdragon.....

Megs is definitely a buy for me. I have the OG toy, it was my joly grail, so i think having it standing side by side with this one will look satisfying. His backpack seems pretty wild, and the angle they choose seems to try their best to hide that. But then again, the backpack on MP wasn't exactly tidy either, so eh.

Cheetor and rattrap, well we already see them before. And it seems the stolen copy we saw is the final color.

Cyclonus, not exactly feeling it, gonna wait for more pics, and video reviews before making my decision.

All this back and forth over who became who is easy to solve: pop in a DVD or blu-ray of TF:TM and do a shot-by-shot analysis of the reformatting scene.

...well Cyclonus is still a pass, but I wasn't expecting an official reveal of him to change my mind because I'm just not that big on the design. Megatron though? Bought on sight, love it, ready to see Primal and the others. I wasn't expecting any of this until Saturday, this was quite a pleasant surprise.

Can't help but wonder if there are still gonna be figures in Kingdom with blast effects other than the Commander and Titan though, since Megatron's product listing calls out his compatibility.

Hellscream9999 wrote:These look great, although, I think that that may have been a purposely flattering pose for megs, as I think the backpack is actually pretty out of control especially behind the waist

bacem wrote:His backpack seems pretty wild, and the angle they choose seems to try their best to hide that. But then again, the backpack on MP wasn't exactly tidy either, so eh.

I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt and say that between the past instances of Hasbro photos being wrong and the fact that the Cheetor photos have both his shoulders caving in weirdly in bot mode and his robot feet jutting out of the back of his cheetah legs in cheetah mode, Cyclonus's knees and Megatron's back and left arm are probably mistransformed. I think Cyclonus's knees are supposed to collapse down and lock in so they actually look attached (and I think we saw them transformed correctly in his initial leak), and looking at Megatron, I'm pretty sure I can see a hinge for the claw part of his left arm to flip out and I'd be shocked if that backpack can't condense down more so it doesn't have dinosaur thighs sticking straight outwards.

In other news, primevsprime just uploaded his review of kingdom rattrap. Considering they almost always tie in uploading early review speed, i assume this lateness is only because he intentionally waiting for hasbro to make the reveal themselves first, so at least he has some decency in that regard.

https://imgflip.com/i/1x01v8

I like how Megatron looks like he’d fit right in with Mattel’s Jurassic Park stuff. Cyclonus looks great, even if his face seems a little off to me. Cheetor and Rattrap are nice but also kinda meh but only because the surprise got spoiled thanks to all the goddamn leaks.

Rodimus Prime wrote:All this back and forth over who became who is easy to solve: pop in a DVD or blu-ray of TF:TM and do a shot-by-shot analysis of the reformatting scene.

There's a reason people still argue over it anyways much like the darn Frenzy/Rumble debate which also has a ridiculously simple answer that people look over anyways.

Cyclonus is Bombshell plain as day the one focused on during the transformation, people just wish it was Skywarp because it "makes more sense" which doesn't matter anyways because Cyclonus isn't even the same person as either of them.

I've always thought only Megatron was reformatted (because he was the only one alive at that point likely) while the others were not "reformatted" but the materials of the bodies were used to forge new ones for new individuals.

o.supreme wrote:Megatron was dying, the rest of the 'cons were D.O.A.

They were alive when they voted "Nay". Just because they didn't have a speaking part (which would have detracted from the dialogue between Unicron and Megatron) doesn't mean they were dead.

-Percepter

Deadput wrote:I've always thought only Megatron was reformatted (because he was the only one alive at that point likely) while the others were not "reformatted" but the materials of the bodies were used to forge new ones for new individuals.

That's exactly what was put in their original Marvel bios. It's just one of many discrepancies between English script, and Japanese animation that Transformers is known for.

I cannot wait to get Cyclonus and Scourge...
Both of them give me a lot of hope that Galvatron will be incredibly good too.
The BW Megatron is really tempting, and I'm not even a fan of BW!
At the same time, I also now have a good feeling about the SS86 Dinobots... So BW Megatron may be easier to pass on.

I really liked that '08 Cyclonus, but wow, this new version really is a huge improvement in a lot of ways.

Percepter wrote:

o.supreme wrote:Megatron was dying, the rest of the 'cons were D.O.A.

They were alive when they voted "Nay". Just because they didn't have a speaking part (which would have detracted from the dialogue between Unicron and Megatron) doesn't mean they were dead.

-Percepter

Let us consult a copy of the film's script, shall we?

DISSOLVE TO:

EXT. SPACE - LATER

Megatron and the other dented, dinged and dead Decepticon bodies
float through space.

we follow the wailing Megatron and the others down to:

THE SURFACE OF UNICRON

littering the otherwise beautiful technological expanse.

Emphasis mine.


Also, guys, the script says the following about Cyclonus's Armada:

ON CYCLONUS (NEW DECEPTICON WITH PLANE TRANSFORM ABILITY)

CYCLONUS is CREATED and then his "armada" of similar, but smaller
and similarly colored and clad creatures are formed.

UNICRON

Cyclonus, the warrior...and his armada.....

ANGLE FEATURING GALVATRON

GALVATRON

To Cybertron!

He roars with a mad power-rush, gets into Cyclonus (who will be
his personal ship) and leading the armada, takes off for the
distant stars.

Obviously, the final movie added in an extra ship to be Galvatron's vessel instead of Cyclonus, but there are remains of this intent in the movie with Galvatron riding inside Cyclonus twice; once at Starscream's coronation and later during the second attack on Autobot City, but otherwise Galvatron rode inside the other ship Unicron gave him.

Nonetheless, the Armada was intended to be Cyclonus's answer to Scourge's Sweeps; that just didn't really come to fruition in the final movie.

Sabrblade wrote:Let us consult a copy of the film's script, shall we?

DISSOLVE TO:

EXT. SPACE - LATER

Megatron and the other dented, dinged and dead Decepticon bodies
float through space.

we follow the wailing Megatron and the others down to:

THE SURFACE OF UNICRON

littering the otherwise beautiful technological expanse.

Emphasis mine.

Those are coordinate adjectives describing a plural. As long as there is a dented Con, a dinged Con, and a dead Con amongst the group, that statement is true. However, that doesn't state that all of them are dead or even which ones are.

-Percepter