The Energon Pub

This is in relation to the rumored Deszaras re-issue etc.

CounterPunch has made an observation that try as we might, for lovers of re-issued but obscure G1 figures that is,Star Convoy in particular failed miserably in retail. (Though in my country in particular, it sold like hotcakes).Given that fiasco (though Takara not following up with the other Battlestars may have also contributed to its not so stellar sales may be also to blame)TakTomy might have second thoughts releasing/reconstituting those old molds.And it seems that the recent pic posted might also be a red herring..........so in general, how do we gauge when a particular figure sells as in SELLS?

In video games,PS3,Wii or Xbox, if I'm not mistaken, those that break the 500,000 unit is labeled a best seller. In TF figures, does 500,000 sold unit amount to a best seller? Not counting the limited run exclusives but retail wise, is there anybody at seibertron who can give accurate numbers on how to gauge if a particular fig that sells?

Not all Optimus Primes sells, the Universe mold with the tomy gun is a clunker(the one given the transparent treatment by TakaraTomy together with Rodimus). It has like 3 incarnations already but still a shelf warmer in my country.

In the Encore line, Skylynx, Ratchet/Ironhide,Hoist, TT and Skywarp had abbysmal sales figures according to our Japan based members. TFA also had less than anticipated sales figures. Again it may also be due to the current world wide economic slow down or just bad luck. ROTF figs have also some hits and misses so..........when does a particular fig become a certified blockbuster?

A mold is a success once it's been repainted so many times we're fed up of seeing it, despite owning two or three copies.

no wonder they've rereleased the seekers so many times...

Repaints are not a sure-fire indicator, Armada Sideswipe was repainted several times and was even remolded once, but that was in no way a "hit".

Same goes for the Seeker theory. Cybertron Thundercracker (and it's Legends version) was also repainted several times, which was useless since the mold itself was pretty bad.

Also, one could say that certain molds are "sleeper hits"... some molds don't get repainted or even put in the show, but they're still cool. Cybertron Hardtop is one of my favorite scout-class figures.

Cap'n_falcon222 wrote:Also, one could say that certain molds are "sleeper hits"... some molds don't get repainted or even put in the show, but they're still cool. Cybertron Hardtop is one of my favorite scout-class figures.

Wasn't hardtop repainted into Swindle and then again for the movie?

Nujevad wrote:

Cap'n_falcon222 wrote:Also, one could say that certain molds are "sleeper hits"... some molds don't get repainted or even put in the show, but they're still cool. Cybertron Hardtop is one of my favorite scout-class figures.

Wasn't hardtop repainted into Swindle and then again for the movie?

He sure was, I've got those two repaints and it's one of my favorite molds too.

Back on topic I've been wondering what figures sell the most and why all the repaints of figures we know suck. Voayager Ratchet has been a shelf warmer in all his various repaints, why do they keep making more? It's irritating when a store is so clogged with repaints no one wants that they don't stock any new figures.

Evil_the_Nub wrote:

Nujevad wrote:

Cap'n_falcon222 wrote:Also, one could say that certain molds are "sleeper hits"... some molds don't get repainted or even put in the show, but they're still cool. Cybertron Hardtop is one of my favorite scout-class figures.

Wasn't hardtop repainted into Swindle and then again for the movie?

He sure was, I've got those two repaints and it's one of my favorite molds too.

Back on topic I've been wondering what figures sell the most and why all the repaints of figures we know suck. Voayager Ratchet has been a shelf warmer in all his various repaints, why do they keep making more? It's irritating when a store is so clogged with repaints no one wants that they don't stock any new figures.

Well, from a Business side, my best guest is that reason he got repainted a lot is because Hasbro/TakaraTomy puts serious money into designing each and every single TF toy. That means paying people good money to make them (remember, a sculptor and a artists have to be able to make living to keep on making products). And then there's the cost of legally copyrighting and trademarking the toy, designing and making the package, writing the bio, etc. This process more or less get repeated with each repaint of a mold. So as a company, they're looking to make a return on all that money, hence redecos.

So a TF toy is considered to be a huge success when Hasbro/TakaraTomy not only recovers the cost of designing/making the toy, but makes a substantial profit, which then could be used to make a new toy, or recover the losses from a loser.

Yeah, I know it would make sense to just redeco the successful ones, but if you think about it, it would actually hurt the possibility of introducing new characters/molds. So why make an new Impactor toy when they can just repaint Movie Optimus in his colors?

But given that all of the Generations Toys have two head designs as a part of the initial design process, Hasbro/TakaraTomy learned that fans will buy an "older" mold if the right changes are made to it. Yay capitalism!

When it's in my collection.

Haha, no I joke. I believe it's something we cant gauge by one factor, but by many. What price the figure goes for in the secondary market, how fast the figure was sold out, etc. I think we can tell a figure's a hit by simply looking at it.. usually something that's aesthetically pleasing to one unbiased fan should mean a majority of the fandom concurs..

So we cannot use the "video game" 500,000 units mark as a best seller gauge then? Always wondered just how many units does a particular fig sell to be a success.

Again, if we use the Japanese market standard (correct me if I'm wrong)

1. MP-01 had a second run issue
2. MP-04 had also a second run issue
3. THS-02 second run (default color), eHobby can be considered a third
4. THS-01 single run run (rumored to have a follow up)
5. G1 Convoy (don't get me counting on that

Using these examples, we know they had a "second" stamping, re-issue .........whatever. Am I right to assume they were best sellers?

This is so interesting. OP asks for numbers that define when a figure becomes a hit and the answers are all guesses about repaints.... Is there no source for the numbers on how much a figure sells? I think the post have made it clear that stores in different locations have different success with figures, so repaints and all that are not really solid indicators or "hit" status or not.

without sales numbers, I'd have to say that a mold is a hit when we're on the 5th repaint (retool) without many people complaining about it.

craggy wrote:without sales numbers, I'd have to say that a mold is a hit when we're on the 5th repaint (retool) without many people complaining about it.

The classic Seekers almost fits the bill. God, I have been a fan all my life I cannot remember any figure making to 5 repaints without complaint, let alone 5 repaints period. Which guys made it that far? I guess Botcon figures count, but it still doesn't leave that many molds making it to five.

If Botcon figures count than the Energon Sharkticon mold and the Cybertron Swerve mold made it, but the Cybertron Sidways mold only made it to four redecos.

Mini-cons maybe?

Do Energon combiner Limbs count? If that's the case then there's few more that make the list (The original Energon ones, the Movie repaints, and the Botcon repaint).

Omnicons I think almost make it, but people hated the movie repaints.

Granted the above mentioned guys count, but from the looks of it, they're all army building figures (Even the combiners). The seekers always seemed to me that they can work on their own or together. Kind of like Prowl/Classic Sideswipe molds, where despite being repaints they're not army building combiner guys. To date, the only "Limb" that struck on their own was Swindle, so combiners have always been army builders to me.

5 was an estimate, and yeah, I was thinking of seekers. There possibly is a few figures that have been released 5 times (G1 Prime has for sure) but maybe 4 is a better number. 3 is too few, and besides, there's quite a few molds we've seen multiple times and which have been disliked by a lot of folks every time. The classics seekers wouldn't have had people gurning, if they'd all been retail and with the right paint jobs first. Well, maybe moaning about availability, but I don't think people really wanting something would be a sign of a failed design, just failed distribution.

When Sean Long pays $400 to get it in advance?

when its a certain character alot of people would buy it say if it was jazz

craggy wrote:5 was an estimate, and yeah, I was thinking of seekers. There possibly is a few figures that have been released 5 times (G1 Prime has for sure) but maybe 4 is a better number. 3 is too few, and besides, there's quite a few molds we've seen multiple times and which have been disliked by a lot of folks every time. The classics seekers wouldn't have had people gurning, if they'd all been retail and with the right paint jobs first. Well, maybe moaning about availability, but I don't think people really wanting something would be a sign of a failed design, just failed distribution.

Optimus molds have always been a stretch for me. Granted the original G1 mold, the Powermaster mold, and the Masterpiece/Anniversary have all made it to five figures, but for the most part, they're all the same guy. So I consider each Optimus mold as three potential figures: Optimus, Naked Magnus, and the Nemesis Prime one, but only if it is a separate character, and not the Optimus the cat burglar repaint.