Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby Alpha Weltall » Tue Jul 16, 2019 11:07 am

Motto: "I am the seeker of power."
Weapon: Razor Tipped Wing Swords
For some reason I used to not like redecos. Not so much didn't like them as much as just didn't purchase them. Some like the two Devastator two-packs or Frostbite. "I already have those figures", I foolishly thought to myself. I later regretted those decisions but was able to get some of them for cheap along the way

Now I love redecos and retools when they make sense. When I have a toy that's good, I want more. More that are designed like it or just more of that particular mold just in different colors. I loved Combiner Wars because of it. I still want more characters done in the CW/PotP style. All the ones that never got made like Sideswipe, Tracks, Seekers, Soundwave and everyone else. To me it makes sense that they should all use the same bodies. Only certain body types should be able to accommodate the combining process. Therefore for a bot to be able to combine, they would need to reformat themselves to a body capable of combining. Even if it doesn't make sense for them to use the same body like Streetwise and Prowl. I couldn't care less about them never having shared a body type before.

I also don't want to limit it to just G1 guys. I love Alpha Bravo and Rook. I loved how Beast Wars and Beast Machines had so many toys of characters that weren't on the shows due to the budget constraints needing small casts. I'd like more toylines to have new, toy only characters in them. A good toy is a good toy regardless of having any fiction associated with them other than the bio on the back of the box. I have an imagination. I can make them do or be whatever I want them to be. I can even change their names which seems to be difficult for some people regarding characters with official name tweaks.

Bring on the redecos and retools. I want all the characters using good toys. I'll even go so far as to pick up extras and make even more. I plan on getting a few extra from the Sideswipe mold to make Clampdown and Deep Cover. Provided that Hasbro doesn't show them off themselves soonish.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby gothsaurus » Tue Jul 16, 2019 11:12 am

That's a good point. When some odd repaint takes the place of a good character on the shelf, that does bother me. I'm remembering a lot of Night Watch this guy, or Sand Camo that guy... when I really wanted an Ultra Magnus or a Cliffjumper. (The latter just can't get a break.)

Hoping Hasbro learned their lesson after all the fan backlash about the seeker jets and the Botcon Wings box set, etc.

Case in point, if we don't get a Hotlink because Red Wing took his spot, I'll be bummed.

Looking at the trio of datsun brothers and original seekers, etc.... Hasbro's track record in the past few years has been really good, in spite of a few oddities missing, like Combiner Wars Sideswipe. They seem to be putting a lot of care and thought into their releases lately.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby gothsaurus » Tue Jul 16, 2019 11:17 am

Good call Alpha W. –  I wanted Tracks and the Seekers as well. It was especially painful knowing THEY HAD THE MOLD to make the seekers. Sheesh. We could have an all seeker gestalt — or have a Galvatron with seeker arms. (not to mention a troop builder Sweep army.) There's so much awesome there waiting for me to buy it.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby Vic Zanzibar » Tue Jul 16, 2019 11:19 am

Given how high quality the figures they are releasing now are, I have no issues with repaints. For instance, I will gladly buy the Siege Ironhide mold three times and still ask for them to make even more versions because that figure is just that good.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby william-james88 » Tue Jul 16, 2019 11:22 am

Latebrus-K wrote:Awesome piece, and an interesting cross-section of the fandom.


Thanks man!

I do, however, understand disappointment when a repaint takes a mainline spot that could have gone to something more original. Not really sure why one would complain about selects, since it seems to have a minimal impact on the normal line's content.


For sure, I get that and would feel that way too. I do think that things have been fine in that regard too though, with us having as many original molds per year as before.

Flashwave wrote:The one that really fits the pattern here is the G2 redeco of TR Voyager Prime, but as an exclusive, thats a little harder for me to count.


Oh man, I love that that toy exists.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby omega666 » Tue Jul 16, 2019 11:22 am

At 20 bucks for deluxe figure?! I pass at the repaints.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby o.supreme » Tue Jul 16, 2019 11:57 am

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Will, I don't know what the percentage is of your editorials I agree or disagree with, but I always respect your insights, and on this subject, I tend to agree. Repaints have been a part of Transformers from it's inception, even Takara in it's Diaclone/Microman/Microchange lines would usually use the same basic design twice, if not more.

But the great thing about today is that we see releases of so many obscure characters that we never thought we'd see. Also their availability is not an issue; by making them online exclusives. Hasbro doesn't have to worry about a glut of unwanted product on shelves, and those fans who really want these lesser known characters can obtain them online.

I think making Refraktor a standard release was a bit of a gamble IMHO, however, Hasbro seemingly decided not to pack it in larger quantities than the others, so it will be interesting to see how many fans who actually want 3 are able to obtain that quantity (fortunately I'm not one of those fans, so I'm doing my part to leave them alone although I've only seen one in store as of this writing ;))

With the Seekers. I know some fans may be upset, but there is precedent for all of these to be unique characters. I think one of the most egregious releases of pointless repaints I can recall was from Playmates Super-Human-Samurai-Syber-Squad back in 1994/95. Initially toys were lifted from Bandai's Gridman toy releases, but then when product was all used up, I kid you not, there must have been a DOZEN recolors of the basic "Servo" action figure, and the larger electronic version, that were absolutely without purpose, or tied into the show at all.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby gothsaurus » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:49 pm

Interesting question. There should be a thread with a quiz asking if everyone found all the Reflectors they want... and if they got 1, 3, or more.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby ZeroWolf » Tue Jul 16, 2019 1:32 pm

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Great article Will! Question is, how many other repaints are left to do.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby Munkky » Tue Jul 16, 2019 1:47 pm

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The number of repints don't bother me anywhere near as much today as it did in 2015, but I am really starting to miss Earth vehicle modes in Generations. I know the Siege line is supposed to have a Cybertronian setting and I have liked a couple of the Cybertronian modes, but I do generally prefer Earth modes and hope they return sooner rather than later. It's one of the big reasons why I'm buying more Studio Series toys and have barely touched Siege thus far.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby ZeldaTheSwordsman » Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:17 pm

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Hound, Sideswipe, Prowl, Voyager Optimus, and Ultra Magnus are really all Earth vehicles doing Cybertronian cosplay :P And SIEGE Astrotrain is outright Earth mode, a fitting trade since his Titans Return mode was basically a Cybertron mode toy
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby william-james88 » Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:24 pm

Munkky wrote:The number of repints don't bother me anywhere near as much today as it did in 2015, but I am really starting to miss Earth vehicle modes in Generations. I know the Siege line is supposed to have a Cybertronian setting and I have liked a couple of the Cybertronian modes, but I do generally prefer Earth modes and hope they return sooner rather than later. It's one of the big reasons why I'm buying more Studio Series toys and have barely touched Siege thus far.


Honestly, the majority of siege toys have more earth looking modes than cybertron looking. They are as cybertronian as the Combiner Wars protectobots are. The cybertronian theme is there to basically avoid licenses for car modes and so that collectors can use them in any time frame for their collections. Only voyagers soundwave, starscream and shockwave (ha) seem unavoidably cybertronian.

And you are gonna love astrotrain, he is as earthy as can be in his train mode :)
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby Lunatic Prime » Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:45 pm

Motto: "For 'cons I'm annoying like a swarm of Scraplets."
Weapon: Cyber Tail Claw
BUT what :HASBRO: could really do to support his customers is to show their plans about recolors and retools as soon as they are ready and not wait until people bought one version and then show them the next one afterwards in hopes that they want that one even more and so much that they buy an alteration of the previous one.

AND the Seekers for example were made to get maximum money out of one mold.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby Ultimate Weapon1 » Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:52 pm

I mean they're all supposed to be the same mold, so it makes sense, and for people who like those characters, this would be great for them. I see also see this as more options to pick from, for example: I didn't like the prowl mold, till I saw it in smoke-screen colors. Basically it's more options to choose from which is a good thing.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby Lunatic Prime » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:04 pm

Motto: "For 'cons I'm annoying like a swarm of Scraplets."
Weapon: Cyber Tail Claw
Ultimate Weapon1 wrote:I mean they're all supposed to be the same mold, so it makes sense, and for people who like those characters, this would be great for them.
I think you don't get what I mean here. The whole concept of the Seekers, the characters were all designed the same so they only need ONE mold for them. For Transformers remember first there were the toys then the TV show and comics.

I see also see this as more options to pick from, for example: I didn't like the prowl mold, till I saw it in smoke-screen colors. Basically it's more options to choose from which is a good thing.
Same here with Prowl and Barricade. But what IF I liked Prowl and bought him first in fear of having to pay high aftermarket prices if there wouldn't be coming a better version of the mold and then I saw Barricade and thought "Oh, if I knew before I wouldn't have bought Prowl."? So knowing about all versions planned for the mold at ones and in forefront would be a huge advantage :HASBRO: / :TAKARATOMY: could give us if they wanted to.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby Wolfman Jake » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:10 pm

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I don't see the alleged problem with the repaints in the Siege line so far. Almost all of them are either supposed to be the same mold as another character, like Prowl, Bluestreak, and Smokescreen, Ironhide and Ratchet, or Starscream, Thundercracker, Skwarp, and all the other background Seekers from the original cartoon, or they are an homage to an obscure use of a G1 or G2 mold, like with Galactic Man Shockwave or G2 Combat Megatron. Even better, Hasbro and Takara are taking more care to use alternate head sculpts to differentiate mold-mates, like Sideswipe and Red Alert, alternate accessories, like Prowl and Bluestreak, and now even alternate body parts, like Ironhide and Ratchet. These are being made exactly how they're supposed to be, based on their G1 toys and character models, with some retooling or alternate weapon load outs in almost all the right ways (seriously, Red Alert should have had his shoulder cannon).

Even with the Female Autobots, they're not all strictly repaints with different heads. Greenlight and Lancer have some remolding to their bodies, and Chromia is practically her own mold with just a few parts and engineering ideas shared with the original Moonracer and Firestar molds. The differences in color layouts and paint apps have also done a great job to differentiate all of the characters from one another to the point that you're given the illusion that there are more molding differences among them than there actually are. This gives us a very nice and symmetrical gestalt mode too for Orthia.

Maybe repaints like Barricade and Crosshairs strike a nerve, as they did have their own unique molds in G1. However, Barricade is more of a cross-over with his live action movie incarnation that his original Micromaster self, and he's even based on "fan art" by Guido Guidi using the Smokescreen body type. Crosshairs is more of a compromise, but again, Hasbro surprised us by using his "The Rebirth" cartoon character model head instead of his toy one, and the Siege Ironhide mold itself is a pretty good fit for what the original G1 Crosshairs looked like in vehicle and robot mode anyway.

The main retail line of Siege seems to have only a few repaints used at all. There's Sideswipe and Red Alert, Prowl and Barricade, and Starscream and Thundercracker. All the others are online exclusives. Those repaints aren't taking the place of other characters either. They're just bonus options for fans who want them (and a LOT of fans want them, trust me). And they don't even cost more, for the most part!

And last, but not least, you don't have to buy them if you don't like them or want them. Don't want the Rainmakers? Don't get 'em. No one says you have to. It's the same with "Shackwave" or the rumored toy-colored Reflector trio of Viewfinder, Spyglass, and Spectro. They're there for fans who want them, and they're not taking up space on store shelves.

I had thought that the Prime Wars Trilogy was our Transformers Renaissance, but in truth, the new War for Cybertron Trilogy is blowing that out of the water, even the almost impeccable Titans Return portion of the previous trilogy!
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby steals_your_goats » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:13 pm

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They will never reveal all the repaints ahead of time. That would be the stupidest decision they could make because they're potentially robbing themselves of sales. Also if they showed all the recolors at the same time then at that point why not just reveal the entire line from the start? And if they did that then that kind of takes away a good chunk of the fun of this hobby. Half of the posts on the boards are speculation of what's going to happen next.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby gothsaurus » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:22 pm

Nice job putting the puzzle together Wolfman Jake. You're right... seems like all of the products are exactly where they should be released... niche items going to store exclusives and club, and main line items being popular characters. Not too many mold re-uses on the shelf.

Seriously, someone at Hasbro has to have worked day and night to get all that to work out. Logistics and store-exclusive deals like that don't happen overnight, or without a lot of meetings, phone calls and hand shaking.

Good job, Hasbro. Big props to you this year. You're nailing it.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby Ultimate Weapon1 » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:43 pm

Lunatic Prime wrote:
Ultimate Weapon1 wrote:I mean they're all supposed to be the same mold, so it makes sense, and for people who like those characters, this would be great for them.
I think you don't get what I mean here. The whole concept of the Seekers, the characters were all designed the same so they only need ONE mold for them. For Transformers remember first there were the toys then the TV show and comics.


I was commenting on the thread, and didn't even see your comment, so I wasn't replying to you directly. But yeah I know it was the toys first back in the olden days, but Im talking about after the characters have become established as having the same mold, so it makes sense for them now to continue that practice, since it was already established.



I see also see this as more options to pick from, for example: I didn't like the prowl mold, till I saw it in smoke-screen colors. Basically it's more options to choose from which is a good thing.
Same here with Prowl and Barricade. But what IF I liked Prowl and bought him first in fear of having to pay high aftermarket prices if there wouldn't be coming a better version of the mold and then I saw Barricade and thought "Oh, if I knew before I wouldn't have bought Prowl."? So knowing about all versions planned for the mold at ones and in forefront would be a huge advantage :HASBRO: / :TAKARATOMY: could give us if they wanted to.[/quote]

Yeah it would be nice to let us know what repaints they are doing with a mold in advance, but it wouldn't make sense business wise, because people wouldn't buy the other versions of the mold, and would just wait for the one they like best. Also if you bought Prowl, also like Barricade, you could either sell Prowl then buy Barricade, or just keep Prowl and buy Barricade, doesn't matter to me what you do.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby Lunatic Prime » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:44 pm

Motto: "For 'cons I'm annoying like a swarm of Scraplets."
Weapon: Cyber Tail Claw
steals_your_goats wrote:They will never reveal all the repaints ahead of time. That would be the stupidest decision they could make because they're potentially robbing themselves of sales.
Of course. I know that. That's my whole point.

Also if they showed all the recolors at the same time then at that point why not just reveal the entire line from the start? And if they did that then that kind of takes away a good chunk of the fun of this hobby. Half of the posts on the boards are speculation of what's going to happen next.
I could do without that "fun" for saving time, space and money. >:oP
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby ScottyP » Tue Jul 16, 2019 4:05 pm

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I don't think the opinions of those endlessly griping about repaints existing matter.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby chuckdawg1999 » Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:36 pm

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Normally articles like this come off schilling for the house, like we're all supposed to fall prostrate in front of Hasbro and be grateful for whatever they put out. Here you make some good points.

As someone who was a day one member of the TFCC we knew that there was no way they'd be able to make new tooling and were ok with that, once they got cooking it was amazing at times what they could do.

Obviously this brand was founded on repaints, everyone knows this. The problem is we're missing one key ingredient, compelling media that captures the imagination. A child in 1984 wasn't buying the same mold three times, he was buying Starscream, the back-stabbing second in command; Skywarp, the moody loyal follower of Megatron; and Thundercracker, the soldier who's not 100% convinced of the cause he's fighting for. There's a reason the cartoon is so beloved, it captured the imagination and gave life to these hunks of plastic, picking up where the bios started. Beast Wars did the same thing. Since then nothing much. If Hasbro would give deeper bios like they used to, or put out a well written compelling show, repaints will have the life they once did.

Repaints didn't really become a problem or noticeable to me until CW and we were getting waves of deluxes with maybe one new mold if at all. Jet Blast-Off killed the line for me.

Now I'm concerned that we're just seeing repaints, not the usual retooling we would get. It feels that Hasbro is slowly sliding back, then again I'm just happy Red Alert is one tight figure.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby ScottyP » Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:54 pm

Weapon: Battle Blades
chuckdawg1999 wrote:Obviously this brand was founded on repaints, everyone knows this. The problem is we're missing one key ingredient, compelling media that captures the imagination. A child in 1984 wasn't buying the same mold three times, he was buying Starscream, the back-stabbing second in command; Skywarp, the moody loyal follower of Megatron; and Thundercracker, the soldier who's not 100% convinced of the cause he's fighting for. There's a reason the cartoon is so beloved, it captured the imagination and gave life to these hunks of plastic, picking up where the bios started. Beast Wars did the same thing. Since then nothing much. If Hasbro would give deeper bios like they used to, or put out a well written compelling show, repaints will have the life they once did.

Repaints didn't really become a problem or noticeable to me until CW and we were getting waves of deluxes with maybe one new mold if at all. Jet Blast-Off killed the line for me.
The first paragraph here and most of your post is spot on.

But CW Blast Off 1.0? Fun because of the toy bio. He's a jet because Onslaught made him be one after he couldn't handle the responsibilities of space flight. It's a good example of what you're wanting in toy bio form, especially since IDW's CW arc was super tepid.

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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby chuckdawg1999 » Tue Jul 16, 2019 7:18 pm

Motto: "The man, the myth, the legend... yeah right."
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ScottyP wrote:
chuckdawg1999 wrote:Obviously this brand was founded on repaints, everyone knows this. The problem is we're missing one key ingredient, compelling media that captures the imagination. A child in 1984 wasn't buying the same mold three times, he was buying Starscream, the back-stabbing second in command; Skywarp, the moody loyal follower of Megatron; and Thundercracker, the soldier who's not 100% convinced of the cause he's fighting for. There's a reason the cartoon is so beloved, it captured the imagination and gave life to these hunks of plastic, picking up where the bios started. Beast Wars did the same thing. Since then nothing much. If Hasbro would give deeper bios like they used to, or put out a well written compelling show, repaints will have the life they once did.

Repaints didn't really become a problem or noticeable to me until CW and we were getting waves of deluxes with maybe one new mold if at all. Jet Blast-Off killed the line for me.
The first paragraph here and most of your post is spot on.

But CW Blast Off 1.0? Fun because of the toy bio. He's a jet because Onslaught made him be one after he couldn't handle the responsibilities of space flight. It's a good example of what you're wanting in toy bio form, especially since IDW's CW arc was super tepid.

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My fault really, I drank the kool-aid of others who convinced me that Alpha Bravo could be retooled into a shuttle. Another issue was by this point the Aerialbot mold was becoming a little loose to say the least.
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Re: Why the Perception of Getting More Repaints than Ever Shows how Good Transformer Fans Have it Now

Postby -Kanrabat- » Wed Jul 17, 2019 3:39 am

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It's that simple."
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You can say that again! ;)^

Plus, yes, at least this time around the USUSAL repaints are not for the elite anymore. Plus those are mail orders so they won't be clogging the store shelves anytime soon.
The complainers truly don't know how business work and even how Transformers work as a whole.

I, for one, couldn't be happier. Well, I could. If I could buy those special repaints via a normal online store in Canada without having to pay high shipping price and reseller mark-ups.
♥♥♥ Love is in the air ♥♥♥

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