The Energon Pub

Agamemnon wrote:

Arctorro wrote:As for repaints, weren't there yellow and orange versions made during the G2 line?

Yes. Yes, there were. (I have a yellow G2 devastator that has an orange Mixmaster for one leg. They were all bought at my local Snyder Drug, so I had to get what they carried.)

There was also the Diaclone colors.

I'm not super knowledgeable in the G1/G2 toy-verse, so I didn't know there were so many variants. That bodes well.

Arctorro wrote:I agree with what you say about the existing MPs, but not the Constructicons. Personally I believe they could easily hold their own weight (Warbotrons Bruticus is going to be massive and looks like it has no problems) without any real difficulties.

We haven't any seen any finished in-hand Warbotron figures, and at any rate, it's about 15-16" tall. An MP combiner would likely be Metroplex-sized. And Metroplex is pretty hollow to avoid top heaviness.

I'm not saying MP Devastator is impossible to engineer, it just might prove problematic and challenging.

But, when it comes to MP Devastator... there is no deal breaker! (see what I did there?)

megatronus wrote:I'm not super knowledgeable in the G1/G2 toy-verse, so I didn't know there were so many variants. That bodes well.

We can hope, enough people asking for the various colour schemes would help make this a reality!

megatronus wrote:

Arctorro wrote:I agree with what you say about the existing MPs, but not the Constructicons. Personally I believe they could easily hold their own weight (Warbotrons Bruticus is going to be massive and looks like it has no problems) without any real difficulties.

We haven't any seen any finished in-hand Warbotron figures, and at any rate, it's about 15-16" tall. An MP combiner would likely be Metroplex-sized. And Metroplex is pretty hollow to avoid top heaviness.

I think he is 18" to the head, might be wrong. Yes he would be shorter than a MP gestalt, but they wouldn't be making WB01 if he couldn't support himself. It was more a way of pointing out that combiner teams keep getting bigger, so a MP isn't inconceivable with modern technology. I was under the impression Metroplex's hollowness was so he wouldn't crush babies and toddlers if he fell on them (manufacturing regulations), not due to structural concerns

megatronus wrote:I'm not saying MP Devastator is impossible to engineer, it just might prove problematic and challenging.

It would certainly be a challenge, but considering the track record from MP-10 onwards, not sure it would be problematic.

megatronus wrote:But, when it comes to MP Devastator... there is no deal breaker! (see what I did there?)

1980' likeness or Current IDW Likeness factors in to some of my decisions.

Well, to add my own thoughts to this, which echo a lot of what's said already...

*Ahem*

As with just about everyone else, there's no 'set' thing that will cause me to either buy or not buy a third-party product. But there's some stuff that comes up..

1. Almost all my TF collecting nowadays is funneled into Classics/Neo-G1 or Masterpiece, so would this purchase aid my goal? Those TF:A Huffer and Pipes figures aren't getting bought by me, no sirree. I'm also not purchasing any toys that seem to be Masterpiece replacements. That's for official product only.

2. Has Hasbro or Takara already put out something that suits that character already? Toyworld's Bumblebee is almost laughable. I've got about twenty versions of him already, not to mention the upcoming Masterpiece version I've already got a pre-order for!

However, I also don't suffer retroactive regret. I love my Warbot Defender and still consider him to be great. He and Hasbro's Springer are on my Classics shelves.

3. The company putting it out is a determining factor, too. Fansproject, Perfect Effect, Mastermind Creations, I haven't regretted any purchases from them. I honestly don't get the hate FP gets nowadays. Other companies, though, cause me a bit more hesitation. TFC isn't too bad, but the fact that Uranos seriously needed an upgrade kit bothers me. I've been burned too much by iGear, too.

4. Price, natch. Genesis looks cool... but he's way too expensive. And to bring back to point two, YOTS Omega Supreme is fine as my Classics Omega.

So, there's my criteria. I added nothing to the conversation!

I think my biggest thing is the play factor.(along with all the other great points made in this discussion) I still really like to play with my figures...so in turn I watch a lot of review vids before pulling the trigger. Also FP figs make great play pieces as well, I molest my Code and UUUU( ) regularly and find no play issues.

Ginrai Minor wrote:I think my biggest thing is the play factor.(along with all the other great points made in this discussion) I still really like to play with my figures...so in turn I watch a lot of review vids before pulling the trigger. Also FP figs make great play pieces as well, I molest my Code and UUUU( ) regularly and find no play issues.

Indeed, while most of my FP figs are display only, the Headmasters are much fun to play with!

Given the extremely limited amount of money I've had for a while now, I've got a pretty strict series of "rules" for buying a new figure

- Is it a G1 Reissue with something different from the original? (if yes - buy. if no - don't)
- Is it a G1 character that never got a toy and does this toy (kinda) fit in my collection?
- If its not the above, is the figure as cool as the Monster High doll I am undoubtedly holding in the other hand?

Figures that have fitted into the above -

- TFC Megatron, TFC Convoy, TFC Starscream, TFC Stepper
- Darkmount. Impossible Toys Valkyrie (fits better than Delicate Warrior, which is more "classics" than G1) Hopefully Takara will colour Jhiaxus correctly and Generations Arcee won't suck.
- Hasn't happened yet >.>

Gonna have to point out that for me - how poseable a figure is has little bearing on if I buy it. I have a long, long history of enjoying good bricks (Powermaster Prime), but abhor others (Starsaber). Transformers quickly become little more than ornament after the first couple plays, so the overall look is often more important. G1 wins out for me because its got a cute aesthetic the later series lack (Armada came close)

Ginrai Minor wrote:I think my biggest thing is the play factor.(along with all the other great points made in this discussion) I still really like to play with my figures...so in turn I watch a lot of review vids before pulling the trigger. Also FP figs make great play pieces as well, I molest my Code and UUUU( ) regularly and find no play issues.

Yeah, I like to give all my figs a bit of play time when I have the chance and most 3P stuff I get has to fall into that... however that's exactly why I would NOT buy FP stuff for anything but display purposes, given their fragility. I dunno or particularly care what anyone else thinks of them, but FP has been one broken bit after another with minimal input on my part. So Quadruple-U and any future headmasters I make the mistake of trusting to buy from them go strait to the shelf.

Price and scale for me

Amelie wrote:Given the extremely limited amount of money I've had for a while now, I've got a pretty strict series of "rules" for buying a new figure

- Is it a G1 Reissue with something different from the original? (if yes - buy. if no - don't)
- Is it a G1 character that never got a toy and does this toy (kinda) fit in my collection?
- If its not the above, is the figure as cool as the Monster High doll I am undoubtedly holding in the other hand?

Figures that have fitted into the above -

- TFC Megatron, TFC Convoy, TFC Starscream, TFC Stepper
- Darkmount. Impossible Toys Valkyrie (fits better than Delicate Warrior, which is more "classics" than G1) Hopefully Takara will colour Jhiaxus correctly and Generations Arcee won't suck.
- Hasn't happened yet >.>

Gonna have to point out that for me - how poseable a figure is has little bearing on if I buy it. I have a long, long history of enjoying good bricks (Powermaster Prime), but abhor others (Starsaber). Transformers quickly become little more than ornament after the first couple plays, so the overall look is often more important. G1 wins out for me because its got a cute aesthetic the later series lack (Armada came close)

Question:

When you say "G1" are you referring to 1980's cartoon accuracy or 1980's toy accuracy ?

For many people "classics" are considered G1 because they homage mostly G1 characters. Although the aesthetic for most classics figures is usually G1 cartoon accuracy. (Although it might be painted in toy accurate colors)

Also your examples were all official Has/Tak molds. what's your take on 3rd party figure deal breakers ?

Price. The final word always hinges on the price. I have two kids and a house, so disposable income is hard to come by. Although I understand--and even sympathize with--the reasoning behind the high prices, they're often too high to justify the purchase.

Shadowstream wrote:Yeah, I like to give all my figs a bit of play time when I have the chance and most 3P stuff I get has to fall into that... however that's exactly why I would NOT buy FP stuff for anything but display purposes, given their fragility. I dunno or particularly care what anyone else thinks of them, but FP has been one broken bit after another with minimal input on my part. So Quadruple-U and any future headmasters I make the mistake of trusting to buy from them go strait to the shelf.

I hate that you had some bad experiences with your figures man, I totally understand why you have that view. Week or two ago when I got my Hyper Novae I was mid transform with the cab and had a damn screw pop out somewhere in the shoulder/backpack assembly. Still love the figure though but it was a "WTF I payed 180 to make myself mad."

I'll grant that I've been molded into a cynic by many negative life experiences, so when pretty much all the products I've bought from one company end up failing to the whims of things like design or construction flaws I'm quick to write off all their practices as junk. With that in mind, as much guff as I give Fansproject for giving me low quality expectations, I really do enjoy the aesthetics of their stuff over most other 3P companies. Explorer and Munitioner on their own look a lot better in my eyes than any of the Warbotron stuff, and so long as I don't touch it I also much prefer the combined Colossus in terms of overall looks.

Shadowstream wrote:I'll grant that I've been molded into a cynic by many negative life experiences, so when pretty much all the products I've bought from one company end up failing to the whims of things like design or construction flaws I'm quick to write off all their practices as junk. With that in mind, as much guff as I give Fansproject for giving me low quality expectations, I really do enjoy the aesthetics of their stuff over most other 3P companies. Explorer and Munitioner on their own look a lot better in my eyes than any of the Warbotron stuff, and so long as I don't touch it I also much prefer the combined Colossus in terms of overall looks.

I'm more willing to give 3rd parties a chance. Because this is all still a learning curve for them.

Tsutsukakushi wrote:I'm more willing to give 3rd parties a chance. Because this is all still a learning curve for them.

If they actually improved their build quality then sure, but one problem after another doesn't inspire confidence. What's worse is when we give these guys so much praise, it builds up their hubris until they think they're infallible in any given endeavor they pursue. We need to be more critical to remind these guys that they are not perfect so they can learn to be more vigilant! From what I hear a lot of people seem to be giving Deisel and the combined form of the PF stunt team the thumbs up irregardless of the noted points of fragility. Don't excuse that! Tell FP how much they suck for delaying that crap and not getting the end result right! Be critical!

For what it's worth: I haven't encountered any fragility issues with Diesel or any of the Stunticons. Although I did loosen the screw on Down Force out of caution (no need to tempt fate after all).

But we're all different. Maybe we all treat out figures somewhat differently. Anyway, everyone's entitled tot heir opinion, especially on VERY pricy 3rd party stuff.

Shadowstream wrote:

Tsutsukakushi wrote:I'm more willing to give 3rd parties a chance. Because this is all still a learning curve for them.

If they actually improved their build quality then sure, but one problem after another doesn't inspire confidence. What's worse is when we give these guys so much praise, it builds up their hubris until they think they're infallible in any given endeavor they pursue. We need to be more critical to remind these guys that they are not perfect so they can learn to be more vigilant! From what I hear a lot of people seem to be giving Deisel and the combined form of the PF stunt team the thumbs up irregardless of the noted points of fragility. Don't excuse that! Tell FP how much they suck for delaying that crap and not getting the end result right! Be critical!

Have there been actual points of fragility? I know the windshield on one or two cars was an issue. I think there may have been some stress marks on Diesel, but to my knowledge, I don't think it has actually been fragile. It just feels that way. And the reviewers are advising caution. (Which is a good idea!)

Shadowstream wrote:

Tsutsukakushi wrote:I'm more willing to give 3rd parties a chance. Because this is all still a learning curve for them.

If they actually improved their build quality then sure, but one problem after another doesn't inspire confidence. What's worse is when we give these guys so much praise, it builds up their hubris until they think they're infallible in any given endeavor they pursue. We need to be more critical to remind these guys that they are not perfect so they can learn to be more vigilant! From what I hear a lot of people seem to be giving Deisel and the combined form of the PF stunt team the thumbs up irregardless of the noted points of fragility. Don't excuse that! Tell FP how much they suck for delaying that crap and not getting the end result right! Be critical!

I feel like this fits TFC

Shadowstream wrote:

Tsutsukakushi wrote:I'm more willing to give 3rd parties a chance. Because this is all still a learning curve for them.

If they actually improved their build quality then sure, but one problem after another doesn't inspire confidence. What's worse is when we give these guys so much praise, it builds up their hubris until they think they're infallible in any given endeavor they pursue. We need to be more critical to remind these guys that they are not perfect so they can learn to be more vigilant! From what I hear a lot of people seem to be giving Deisel and the combined form of the PF stunt team the thumbs up irregardless of the noted points of fragility. Don't excuse that! Tell FP how much they suck for delaying that crap and not getting the end result right! Be critical!

Why should I tell FP they suck over a figure I like?

mooncake623 wrote:

Shadowstream wrote:

Tsutsukakushi wrote:I'm more willing to give 3rd parties a chance. Because this is all still a learning curve for them.

If they actually improved their build quality then sure, but one problem after another doesn't inspire confidence. What's worse is when we give these guys so much praise, it builds up their hubris until they think they're infallible in any given endeavor they pursue. We need to be more critical to remind these guys that they are not perfect so they can learn to be more vigilant! From what I hear a lot of people seem to be giving Deisel and the combined form of the PF stunt team the thumbs up irregardless of the noted points of fragility. Don't excuse that! Tell FP how much they suck for delaying that crap and not getting the end result right! Be critical!

I feel like this fits TFC

I'm not so sure as they cop an absolute pasting on other sites. The problem is that they don't seem to listen to any comments

megatronus wrote:

Shadowstream wrote:

Tsutsukakushi wrote:I'm more willing to give 3rd parties a chance. Because this is all still a learning curve for them.

If they actually improved their build quality then sure, but one problem after another doesn't inspire confidence. What's worse is when we give these guys so much praise, it builds up their hubris until they think they're infallible in any given endeavor they pursue. We need to be more critical to remind these guys that they are not perfect so they can learn to be more vigilant! From what I hear a lot of people seem to be giving Deisel and the combined form of the PF stunt team the thumbs up irregardless of the noted points of fragility. Don't excuse that! Tell FP how much they suck for delaying that crap and not getting the end result right! Be critical!

Why should I tell FP they suck over a figure I like?

You're looking at one small part of his post, though I do agree that saying they suck is going to far. Diesel is a great figure, I like him waaay more than I thought I would, but there are a number of design flaws. They made the transformation so complicated that there is plenty of very thin spots that are developing stress marks that could limit how well he stands the test of time. The waist is badly designed (I'm talking mainly of the tight as hell joint the folding arm attaches to) and once in motion feels alright, but getting it moving is scary as hell. Many of the tabs were poorly thought out and suffer from a high risk of breaking. Then there are the combiner connecters, the are the worst I have ever seen! The connecters and shoulder assemblies seem to be designed to break A lot of people give TFC a hard time, but my Herc and Uranos have superb connecter ports that are strong, sturdy and allow for easy and safe connecting/disconnecting. M3 is a pain in the arse to assemble or disassemble.

Transforming a Transformer shouldn't be a scary or irritating excise, which can be the case with Diesel. I think this is what Shadowstream is getting at, FP did many things right, but also dropped the ball quite badly. With everyone banging on about how great M3 is while ignoring the issues they have with the rest it could mean that FP won't improve in these areas with later releases. The same can be said for UT and KFC, they produce crap that is not ever close to what MMC, FT and PE are doing atm, but everyone forgives them for that because of a couple of good things about their figures. People bitch about lack of quality with some 3P companies then give the dodgy companies a free pass

Arctorro wrote:Transforming a Transformer shouldn't be a scary or irritating excise,

Ever try an Alternator/Binaltech? *whistles*

Agamemnon wrote:

Arctorro wrote:Transforming a Transformer shouldn't be a scary or irritating excise,

Ever try an Alternator/Binaltech? *whistles*

Own a few and was never once scared something would break. Just found them to be a nice challenge

Arctorro wrote:

Agamemnon wrote:

Arctorro wrote:Transforming a Transformer shouldn't be a scary or irritating excise,

Ever try an Alternator/Binaltech? *whistles*

Own a few and was never once scared something would break. Just found them to be a nice challenge

I loved my Hound. Hated my Grimlock. Though I was only slightly concerned about breaking a part on Grimlock, it became more of an irritating exercise to transform him.

Oh, and I would throw Masterpiece Megs and Rodimus in this as well. I never had fun transforming them.