The Energon Pub

I don't believe it was ever suggest that he be the same size as Prime, my issue is that he's taller in the show than this figure is period. In ever scene I've seen with those two together Ironhide has always come very close to Prime's shoulders, this figure barely stands above the base of the windows.
Whether or not ER Prime isn't that big doesn't help matters so I don't know why it was even brought up, if that Prime is the standard then all bot should be in scale to it.

Grant it, it's a minor technicality and possibly won't even be noticeable on the shelf to most people.
But for me it will be because based on those photos he's going to be hidden behind Tracks, Sunstreaker and Sideswipe and fall just short of Hoist. Of Which he should be the same height as.
I have my figures displayed in layers from tallest to shortest and any slight change can alter that display so that now Ironhide can no longer stand next to prime in the back but have to be placed in the middle amongst the shorter ones.

Can we all try and understand what everyone else is saying
I never said ¨Ironhide is the same size as Prime¨. I am saying I would rather have him the same size as Prime than the same size as Wheel jack. But if we want them at voyager scale, we will have to wait for the KOs to do it for us.


*If anyone complains about the voyager price for this Ironhide or the future Ratchet Redeco, I will remind you that the rid deluxe and earth rise/siege cost even more

Sabrblade wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:Why would ironhide be the same size as Prime? I don't think even the original toys were the same height.

You are correct:

Since when did the G1 toys have accurate scale LOL

I could not find a picture, but Blaster and Optimus are a great example

My point was why would you even want him the same height as Prime? It's not a one or the other decision. Saying you want him bigger then the carbots doesn't mean going the whole hog to Prime height.

As pointed out, the scale guides have ironhide at chest window height (a point the ss86 hide comes within distance of)

ZeroWolf wrote:My point was why would you even want him the same height as Prime? It's not a one or the other decision. Saying you want him bigger then the carbots doesn't mean going the whole hog to Prime height.

As pointed out, the scale guides have ironhide at chest window height (a point the ss86 hide comes within distance of)

IF I HAD to choose between Carbot and Prime height.

Emerje wrote:

william-james88 wrote:

Till-all-R1 wrote:Heck I'm more disappointed with SS86 being shorter than ER considering Ironhide is a taller bot and not that much shorter than prime, thus IMO this new version is going to look a bit short/inaccurate standing next to him.

I too think of Ironhide as a big gruff military dude who's seen some action, but if we are going for accuracy, which is what SS86 hopes to do, we have to stick to the G1 scale. And in g1, Ironhide was not a big guy, same size as a carbot. He looks tiny next to Optimus. And there lies the genius of this particular figure's engineering. They replicated the idea of having a van, far bigger than a car, become the same size as a carbot in bot mode.

Here's just three shots, but you can look at any episode of the cartoon and see the same scale more or less.

He isn't the same size as Optimus, but he isn't nearly as small as a car bot, even in those pictures he's coming up to Prime's shoulder (though usually he's even with his chest windows) and towering over the cars. This is more or less accurate to the official scale chart used by the cartoon.

e8399867f769d35adfe3e5b.jpg

This is the same scale that MP uses and nailed it.



The SS figure is accurate, but it's really at the most minimum of accurate just barely clearing the bottom of Prime's windows.



My problem is that they not just felt the need to make him smaller than the WFC figure but also made him smaller than a Deluxe figure at the Voyager price point with no obvious gains (ER Ironhide also has many more folding panels than the Siege mold), and the WFC Ironhide mold isn't even a uniquely tall Deluxe, there's plenty of others that are the same size like Impactor. It was a very bad move on Hasbro's part.

Emerje

Okay, everyone needs to take a minute on this. We’ve seen comparison shots of Studio Series and Earthrise Ironhide. The new Studio Series mold is about 1-2 millimeters shorter than the Earthrise one, which is pretty negligible. Please stop acting and thinking as if the height difference is drastic.

RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:Why would ironhide be the same size as Prime? I don't think even the original toys were the same height.

You are correct:

Since when did the G1 toys have accurate scale LOL

I could not find a picture, but Blaster and Optimus are a great example

The G1 toy scale does come into play as it influenced the scale of the characters on the show. It was the starting point.

william-james88 wrote:

RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:Why would ironhide be the same size as Prime? I don't think even the original toys were the same height.

You are correct:

Since when did the G1 toys have accurate scale LOL

I could not find a picture, but Blaster and Optimus are a great example

The G1 toy scale does come into play as it influenced the scale of the characters on the show. It was the starting point.

Explains why Skyfire was huge in the show, the Valkyrie toy was massive (and wonderful to play with)

ZeroWolf wrote:

william-james88 wrote:

RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:Why would ironhide be the same size as Prime? I don't think even the original toys were the same height.

You are correct:

Since when did the G1 toys have accurate scale LOL

I could not find a picture, but Blaster and Optimus are a great example

The G1 toy scale does come into play as it influenced the scale of the characters on the show. It was the starting point.

Explains why Skyfire was huge in the show, the Valkyrie toy was massive (and wonderful to play with)

I understand that. But it's still funny

Wolfman Jake wrote:

Emerje wrote:

william-james88 wrote:

Till-all-R1 wrote:Heck I'm more disappointed with SS86 being shorter than ER considering Ironhide is a taller bot and not that much shorter than prime, thus IMO this new version is going to look a bit short/inaccurate standing next to him.

I too think of Ironhide as a big gruff military dude who's seen some action, but if we are going for accuracy, which is what SS86 hopes to do, we have to stick to the G1 scale. And in g1, Ironhide was not a big guy, same size as a carbot. He looks tiny next to Optimus. And there lies the genius of this particular figure's engineering. They replicated the idea of having a van, far bigger than a car, become the same size as a carbot in bot mode.

Here's just three shots, but you can look at any episode of the cartoon and see the same scale more or less.

He isn't the same size as Optimus, but he isn't nearly as small as a car bot, even in those pictures he's coming up to Prime's shoulder (though usually he's even with his chest windows) and towering over the cars. This is more or less accurate to the official scale chart used by the cartoon.

e8399867f769d35adfe3e5b.jpg

This is the same scale that MP uses and nailed it.



The SS figure is accurate, but it's really at the most minimum of accurate just barely clearing the bottom of Prime's windows.



My problem is that they not just felt the need to make him smaller than the WFC figure but also made him smaller than a Deluxe figure at the Voyager price point with no obvious gains (ER Ironhide also has many more folding panels than the Siege mold), and the WFC Ironhide mold isn't even a uniquely tall Deluxe, there's plenty of others that are the same size like Impactor. It was a very bad move on Hasbro's part.

Emerje

Okay, everyone needs to take a minute on this. We’ve seen comparison shots of Studio Series and Earthrise Ironhide. The new Studio Series mold is about 1-2 centimeters shorter than the Earthrise one, which is pretty negligible. Please stop acting and thinking as if the height difference is drastic.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, 1-2 centimeters is a big difference in certain situations.

chuckdawg1999 wrote:

Wolfman Jake wrote:Okay, everyone needs to take a minute on this. We’ve seen comparison shots of Studio Series and Earthrise Ironhide. The new Studio Series mold is about 1-2 centimeters shorter than the Earthrise one, which is pretty negligible. Please stop acting and thinking as if the height difference is drastic.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, 1-2 centimeters is a big difference in certain situations.

Damnit! I meant millimeters

Thanks for helping by pointing out the error to me in the form of a genitalia joke

I’ve edited my original post for clarity in discussion going forward, for what it’s worth.

RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:

william-james88 wrote:And in g1, Ironhide was not a big guy, same size as a carbot. He looks tiny next to Optimus.

And here is him in alt mode. Talk about size changing!

could not find the picture of him in alt mode (Optimus on a stretcher going into Ratchets ambulance mode), but This will have to do:

Wheelejack taking a ride in Ratchet.jpeg

Altmodes can be whatever they want it seems.

Just ask Astrotrain.

TF-fan kev777 wrote:

Emerje wrote:My problem is that they not just felt the need to make him smaller than the WFC figure but also made him smaller than a Deluxe figure at the Voyager price point with no obvious gains (ER Ironhide also has many more folding panels than the Siege mold), and the WFC Ironhide mold isn't even a uniquely tall Deluxe, there's plenty of others that are the same size like Impactor. It was a very bad move on Hasbro's part.

Emerje

I just looked, and those many more folding panels you mention appear to be only 4 and all located on the shield/sled, the window panels. The bot himself has the same number of panels in the same places.

What's your point? The shield is an integral part of the figure, you can't complete the alt mode without it and it's part of the figure's mold. Therefore the shield is included as part of the figure's part count not as an accessory that Hasbro could leave out if they chose to.

Wolfman Jake wrote:Okay, everyone needs to take a minute on this. We’ve seen comparison shots of Studio Series and Earthrise Ironhide. The new Studio Series mold is about 1-2 millimeters shorter than the Earthrise one, which is pretty negligible. Please stop acting and thinking as if the height difference is drastic.

My issue is that Hasbro designs these figures in CAD and know the exact height to the millimeter. They actively chose to make him shorter than several deluxe figures instead of making him a few millimeters taller to justify the Voyager price tag and make him a few millimeters taller. I'm very curious if it'll be justified in the use the of plastic, definitely a figure worth pulling out the scales for.

Emerje

Hoping that core Ratchet shows up here soon, he looks more enjoyable in photos and I am looking forward to him

Emerje wrote:

TF-fan kev777 wrote:

Emerje wrote:My problem is that they not just felt the need to make him smaller than the WFC figure but also made him smaller than a Deluxe figure at the Voyager price point with no obvious gains (ER Ironhide also has many more folding panels than the Siege mold), and the WFC Ironhide mold isn't even a uniquely tall Deluxe, there's plenty of others that are the same size like Impactor. It was a very bad move on Hasbro's part.

Emerje

I just looked, and those many more folding panels you mention appear to be only 4 and all located on the shield/sled, the window panels. The bot himself has the same number of panels in the same places.

What's your point? The shield is an integral part of the figure, you can't complete the alt mode without it and it's part of the figure's mold. Therefore the shield is included as part of the figure's part count not as an accessory that Hasbro could leave out if they chose to.

Wolfman Jake wrote:Okay, everyone needs to take a minute on this. We’ve seen comparison shots of Studio Series and Earthrise Ironhide. The new Studio Series mold is about 1-2 millimeters shorter than the Earthrise one, which is pretty negligible. Please stop acting and thinking as if the height difference is drastic.

My issue is that Hasbro designs these figures in CAD and know the exact height to the millimeter. They actively chose to make him shorter than several deluxe figures instead of making him a few millimeters taller to justify the Voyager price tag and make him a few millimeters taller. I'm very curious if it'll be justified in the use the of plastic, definitely a figure worth pulling out the scales for.

Emerje

Wouldn't a more equitable comparison be the amount of parts and paint applications?

-Kanrabat- wrote:

RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:

william-james88 wrote:And in g1, Ironhide was not a big guy, same size as a carbot. He looks tiny next to Optimus.

And here is him in alt mode. Talk about size changing!

could not find the picture of him in alt mode (Optimus on a stretcher going into Ratchets ambulance mode), but This will have to do:

Wheelejack taking a ride in Ratchet.jpeg

Altmodes can be whatever they want it seems.

Just ask Astrotrain.

I usually decide which mode to scale for, and I think astrotrain should be giant in robot mode in favor of his alt mode. And cyclonus should drop getting flown by Galcatron for his robot mode scale.

thanks

william-james88 wrote:Wouldn't a more equitable comparison be the amount of parts and paint applications?

Only if they're different, which I'm not entirely convinced they are since people seem to forget how many different parts the ER shield is made of. That just leaves plastic use.

Emerje

RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:

william-james88 wrote:And in g1, Ironhide was not a big guy, same size as a carbot. He looks tiny next to Optimus.

And here is him in alt mode. Talk about size changing!

could not find the picture of him in alt mode (Optimus on a stretcher going into Ratchets ambulance mode), but This will have to do:

Wheelejack taking a ride in Ratchet.jpeg

Altmodes can be whatever they want it seems.

Just ask Astrotrain.

I usually decide which mode to scale for, and I think astrotrain should be giant in robot mode in favor of his alt mode. And cyclonus should drop getting flown by Galcatron for his robot mode scale.

In IDW Ver 2.0 Astrotrain is massive in robot mode, being the size of a Cybertronian building. I think he was similarly sized in Cyberverse as well.

ZeroWolf wrote:

RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:

william-james88 wrote:And in g1, Ironhide was not a big guy, same size as a carbot. He looks tiny next to Optimus.

And here is him in alt mode. Talk about size changing!

could not find the picture of him in alt mode (Optimus on a stretcher going into Ratchets ambulance mode), but This will have to do:

Wheelejack taking a ride in Ratchet.jpeg

Altmodes can be whatever they want it seems.

Just ask Astrotrain.

I usually decide which mode to scale for, and I think astrotrain should be giant in robot mode in favor of his alt mode. And cyclonus should drop getting flown by Galcatron for his robot mode scale.

In IDW Ver 2.0 Astrotrain is massive in robot mode, being the size of a Cybertronian building. I think he was similarly sized in Cyberverse as well.

Cyberverse Astrotrain was a big guy too, almost combiner sized. His alt modes determined his robot mode scale.

D-Maximal_Primal wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:

RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:

william-james88 wrote:And in g1, Ironhide was not a big guy, same size as a carbot. He looks tiny next to Optimus.

And here is him in alt mode. Talk about size changing!

could not find the picture of him in alt mode (Optimus on a stretcher going into Ratchets ambulance mode), but This will have to do:

Wheelejack taking a ride in Ratchet.jpeg

Altmodes can be whatever they want it seems.

Just ask Astrotrain.

I usually decide which mode to scale for, and I think astrotrain should be giant in robot mode in favor of his alt mode. And cyclonus should drop getting flown by Galcatron for his robot mode scale.

In IDW Ver 2.0 Astrotrain is massive in robot mode, being the size of a Cybertronian building. I think he was similarly sized in Cyberverse as well.

Cyberverse Astrotrain was a big guy too, almost combiner sized. His alt modes determined his robot mode scale.

That's pretty damn cool!
Too bad we will never see a toy made for this version of Astrotrain. It would be Titan class, relatively in scale with core class bots.

(Copy-pasta this on my "will never be made" thread.)

I like alt modes to be consistant with each other in my collection. For instance cars should all be about deluxes (no problem there). Ideally planes would all be voyager to match up with the Seekers. But there's just no winning with space shuttles. Plus I don't want G1 AT to tower over Blitz.

The millimetres of difference on Ironhide ... I just don't see the big deal. Them not doing it right the first time is my big problem with him. We're well into the age where voyagers are by parts count and paint. Just have to trust them that Ironhide meets that criteria.

-Kanrabat- wrote:

D-Maximal_Primal wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:

RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

RodimusPrimeUkraine1 wrote:

william-james88 wrote:And in g1, Ironhide was not a big guy, same size as a carbot. He looks tiny next to Optimus.

And here is him in alt mode. Talk about size changing!

could not find the picture of him in alt mode (Optimus on a stretcher going into Ratchets ambulance mode), but This will have to do:

Wheelejack taking a ride in Ratchet.jpeg

Altmodes can be whatever they want it seems.

Just ask Astrotrain.

I usually decide which mode to scale for, and I think astrotrain should be giant in robot mode in favor of his alt mode. And cyclonus should drop getting flown by Galcatron for his robot mode scale.

In IDW Ver 2.0 Astrotrain is massive in robot mode, being the size of a Cybertronian building. I think he was similarly sized in Cyberverse as well.

Cyberverse Astrotrain was a big guy too, almost combiner sized. His alt modes determined his robot mode scale.

That's pretty damn cool!
Too bad we will never see a toy made for this version of Astrotrain. It would be Titan class, relatively in scale with core class bots.

(Copy-pasta this on my "will never be made" thread.)

Funny how everyone is telling me about Cyberverse Astro train as if he wasn the first other Astro train I thought of when I thought Giant Astro train.
He got beat up and killed by a bunch of perfect decepticons...........

Gauntlet101010 wrote:I like alt modes to be consistant with each other in my collection. For instance cars should all be about deluxes (no problem there). Ideally planes would all be voyager to match up with the Seekers. But there's just no winning with space shuttles. Plus I don't want G1 AT to tower over Blitz.

The millimetres of difference on Ironhide ... I just don't see the big deal. Them not doing it right the first time is my big problem with him. We're well into the age where voyagers are by parts count and paint. Just have to trust them that Ironhide meets that criteria.

I think Blitzwing SHOULD be shorter than Astrotrain

Ironhide is a little short, but to me it is what it is, and It is not that bad for what it is. I will be getting the ratchet version of Ironhide. It is a little overpriced, but it's better than the RID and Earthrise/Seige versions which will be more expensive.