The Energon Pub

[Rodimus Prime]

So now the question is how Optimus came to even be on Cybertron if he wasn't already born there.

And does this mean that Jetfire was wrong in RoTF when he stated "he must be a great descendant." And if he was, does this mean Optimus was given the title of Prime, instead of inheriting it? And how does 1 go from being a Knight to being Prime, whether it's a promotion or a demotion?

[SKYWARPED_128]

Except that there does exist official canon material that depicts the original Seven Primes as having been created by the AllSpark. So if the Knights were made by the Creators, which came first? The Knights or the Primes?

Plus, there's also the question if the Knights even have any affiliation with Cybertron at all. Aside from Optimus, we know nothing of their history as far as where lived or what places they explored. For all we know, the Creators could have built the Knights in some place off of Cybertron, maybe even aboard their own vessels (there sure were a lot of them at the beginning of this movie). So now the question is how Optimus came to even be on Cybertron if he wasn't already born there.

Ugh, why did they have to bring it this Creators thing to make everything so confusing?

Well, that does complicate things a bit.

Since knights are said to be "explorers", there's really nothing to stop a knight from visiting Cybertron. The question is, why did the Creators allow Cybertron itself to descend into civil war?

Could it be that the knights' rebellion might have somehow triggered the war? The first Decepticons might have been knights themselves, remaining loyal to the Creators while the faction that became the Autobots fought for freedom against their masters. It would explain how Megatron, despite not being a Prime, was strong enough to take on Optimus--they're both knights. It also explains why Optimus called him "brother" in TF1, and why Megatron keeps trying to persuade Optimus to his cause in the first 3 movies.

So now the question is how Optimus came to even be on Cybertron if he wasn't already born there.

And does this mean that Jetfire was wrong in RoTF when he stated "he must be a great descendant." And if he was, does this mean Optimus was given the title of Prime, instead of inheriting it? And how does 1 go from being a Knight to being Prime, whether it's a promotion or a demotion?

Well, Jetfire couldn't even remember what planet he was on, so I wouldn't count on him to be accurate with the details.

Seriously though, at this point, I have to just give up trying to make sense of the movie canon as a whole, and treat each movie up until AOE as it's own universe. In other words, discard everything set up in the first trilogy and just treat the AoE "soft reboot" as the new canon.

It's a mammoth task trying to piece everything perfectly together, as each new movie seems to create its very own canon without taking into account what was established in the last movie.

But for what it's worth, my theory for the AOE trilogy is that after rebelling against the Creators and abandoning his role as a knight, Optimus might have been "appointed" as a Prime during the civil war, when the Primes were nearly wiped out by the Decepticons. This follows the WFC story line of how Optimus came into his new title.

[Sabrblade]

Well, that does complicate things a bit.

Since knights are said to be "explorers", there's really nothing to stop a knight from visiting Cybertron. The question is, why did the Creators allow Cybertron itself to descend into civil war?

Could it be that the knights' rebellion might have somehow triggered the war? The first Decepticons might have been knights themselves, remaining loyal to the Creators while the faction that became the Autobots fought for freedom against their masters. It would explain how Megatron, despite not being a Prime, was strong enough to take on Optimus--they're both knights. It also explains why Optimus called him "brother" in TF1, and why Megatron keeps trying to persuade Optimus to his cause in the first 3 movies.

The war was started by Megatron after The Fallen went Palpatine on him by coercing Megatron into coveting the AllSpark.

Optimus and Megatron are only "adopted" brothers, as Optimus was an orphan (and amnesiac) when he was found and taken in by Sentinel Prime.

And, the more I think about it, the Knights feel redundant as explorers since that's what the Seekers were for the Seven Primes. Unless the Creators needed their own separate unit of explorers instead of using the AllSpark-born Seeker explorers that the Primes used.

A lot of the pre-war and wartime history can be found in IDW's Movieverse comics like "Defiance" and "Foundation".

Seriously though, at this point, I have to just give up trying to make sense of the movie canon as a whole, and treat each movie up until AOE as it's own universe. In other words, discard everything set up in the first trilogy and just treat the AoE "soft reboot" as the new canon.

It's a mammoth task trying to piece everything perfectly together, as each new movie seems to create its very own canon without taking into account what was established in the last movie.

John Barber managed to piece everything together (pre-AOE, that is), which Chris McFeely then Wiki-fied - http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Movie_timeline

Or at least, only the fiction that's supposed to be part of the main movie continuity was pieced together, as other pieces of fiction are either alternate timelines or separate Movieverse continuities.

[SKYWARPED_128]

The war was started by Megatron after The Fallen went Palpatine on him by coercing Megatron into coveting the AllSpark.

Optimus and Megatron are only "adopted" brothers, as Optimus was an orphan (and amnesiac) when he was found and taken in by Sentinel Prime.

And, the more I think about it, the Knights feel redundant as explorers since that's what the Seekers were for the Seven Primes. Unless the Creators needed their own separate unit of explorers instead of using the AllSpark-born Seeker explorers that the Primes used.

A lot of the pre-war and wartime history can be found in IDW's Movieverse comics like "Defiance" and "Foundation".

Admittedly, I've never read any of the IDW comics (movie or otherwise), so I have little to no idea what backstory has been set up outside of the movies themselves.

Out of curiosity though, do Bay and/or the writers consider the comics as canon to the movies? Because they don't seem to be all that concerned about stepping over even the established canon in the movies themselves.

And yes, the knights do seem to be doing pretty much the same job as the seekers. The thing is that until TF5 comes along and hopefully reveals the true role of the knights, we can only guess at what their purpose might be.

John Barber managed to piece everything together (pre-AOE, that is), which Chris McFeely then Wiki-fied - http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Movie_timeline

Or at least, only the fiction that's supposed to be part of the main movie continuity was pieced together, as other pieces of fiction are either alternate timelines or separate Movieverse continuities.

I said it was a mammoth task, not that it was impossible.

I gotta hand it to him, though, it's about as coherent as it get for the movieverse timeline. He even managed to work in the knights idea despite the rather sketchy info given in the film.

So Primus is supposed to be the Cybertronian equivalent of Adam?

[Sabrblade]

I gotta hand it to him, though, it's about as coherent as it get for the movieverse timeline. He even managed to work in the knights idea despite the rather sketchy info given in the film.

Barber didn't work in the Knights as I said he only put together the pre-AOE stuff since AOE didn't exist yet (meaning the Knights didn't exist as a concept yet).

Their inclusion in the TFWiki timeline is due to the Wiki staff having to try and fit them in around the preexisting timeline material since the AOE movie itself dictated the Knights' existence in this timeline.

[SKYWARPED_128]

I gotta hand it to him, though, it's about as coherent as it get for the movieverse timeline. He even managed to work in the knights idea despite the rather sketchy info given in the film.

Barber didn't work in the Knights as I said he only put together the pre-AOE stuff since AOE didn't exist yet (meaning the Knights didn't exist as a concept yet).

Their inclusion in the TFWiki timeline is due to the Wiki staff having to try and fit them in around the preexisting timeline material since the AOE movie itself dictated the Knights' existence in this timeline.

I see.

Either way, the inclusion does kind of work in a concise, non-involved kind of way.

[Sabrblade]

I gotta hand it to him, though, it's about as coherent as it get for the movieverse timeline. He even managed to work in the knights idea despite the rather sketchy info given in the film.

Barber didn't work in the Knights as I said he only put together the pre-AOE stuff since AOE didn't exist yet (meaning the Knights didn't exist as a concept yet).

Their inclusion in the TFWiki timeline is due to the Wiki staff having to try and fit them in around the preexisting timeline material since the AOE movie itself dictated the Knights' existence in this timeline.

I see.

Either way, the inclusion does kind of work in a concise, non-involved kind of way.

All on their part since that's what the Wiki staff had to do to prevent from contradicting either previous fiction or the AOE movie itself.

In reality, though, we still got some holes to be filled since we still don't know how the Knights and Creators connect to things like the AllSpark and the Primes.

[SKYWARPED_128]

I gotta hand it to him, though, it's about as coherent as it get for the movieverse timeline. He even managed to work in the knights idea despite the rather sketchy info given in the film.

Barber didn't work in the Knights as I said he only put together the pre-AOE stuff since AOE didn't exist yet (meaning the Knights didn't exist as a concept yet).

Their inclusion in the TFWiki timeline is due to the Wiki staff having to try and fit them in around the preexisting timeline material since the AOE movie itself dictated the Knights' existence in this timeline.

I see.

Either way, the inclusion does kind of work in a concise, non-involved kind of way.

All on their part since that's what the Wiki staff had to do to prevent from contradicting either previous fiction or the AOE movie itself.

In reality, though, we still got some holes to be filled since we still don't know how the Knights and Creators connect to things like the AllSpark and the Primes.

I just hope they don't leave that part of the story hanging in TF5, and focus exclusively on Galvatron's renewed invasion of Earth.

Doesn't seem very likely, on second thought, since they'll want to use Optimus in each and every movie. Or do they? Bumblebee's been relegated to second fiddle in AOE, and he was supposed to be the indispensable kid appeal character. I wonder if we'll actually see Hot Rod(imus) take the lead in TF5.

[Autobot032]

They won't do it, but the simplest way to fix of this is this:

Rip off G1 and put some Kruger touches on it. Make it so that the Creators (Quintessons) created the Cybertronian races as consumer goods and military hardware. (This would help with Lockdown's line about them acting like little children and him having to clean up their mess all the time.) Also make it so that they created the creatures Lockdown had in his prison. Illegal genetic modification and whatnot.

Have Prime face the Creators and let them tell him the hard truth: "You're nothing more than consumer goods. The whole race. We wanted our malfunctioning product back. Nothing more, nothing less." He could rebut the whole thing with how he and others like him have a soul, they can get into an argument about Primus, which will tell his backstory. Let's say he was a drone, like them, but ala Short Circuit, a fortuitous miracle, never again replicated, brought him sentience and life.

He decided to pour his soul, literally, into what would become the Allspark. The Matrix could've been conceived by the Primes as a tool to help rebuild the Allspark and to locate it. To find something as powerful as the Allspark (and control it), you'd need something of nearly the same amount of power, which is why the Matrix is basically pure Energon.

Prime can say something like "You made the body, but he gave us life" or something like that. Make it about being more than what you are, who you are, Just being more. Prime has always been considered the savior figure of the Transformers universe, to some degree, in different parts of the canon, so there's no reason to change it now. I mean, he already died and came back once in the movie series, might as well do a "Return Of The King" kinda deal.

Have Optimus lead the Cybertronians he finds along the way to an uprising against the Creators, promise them he'll lead them to freedom (in keeping with the savior thing) and bring it back to Earth so Prime and his new army of Autobots not only have a new home, but Cade and his family are still in it (since they signed on for the entire trilogy), and then they can have their usual free for all in a massive city setting, going up against Galvatron and his army of the undead. He can manipulate their Transformium to make them become Cyclonus, Scourge, the Predacons, all of it.

As for the Knight thing? Think of it as the Knights Templar. The best of intentions, but the road to hell is paved with good intentions. The Primes broke free of their "duties" to become who they are now: Good and decent beings who value life and will do anything to defend it.

Does it answer all questions? No, but it will certainly cover some gaps and fix some continuity problems. It allows The Fallen to still exist, it allows the previous trilogy to still exist and keeps AOE all canon and in step with each other. As for the things it doesn't all cover, can't spoonfeed everyone, it's not possible. Nor is it possible to make everyone happy, either, so cover as many bases as you can and keep on truckin'. (No pun intended.)

[Sabrblade]

I'm still trying to better familiarize myself with the Movieverse fiction, but I will say this. Both the Matrix and Primus (of all things) were created by the AllSpark.

[Cthulhunicron]

I'm still trying to better familiarize myself with the Movieverse fiction, but I will say this. Both the Matrix and Primus (of all things) were created by the AllSpark.

Primus hasn't been mentioned anywhere in the movieverse yet.

[Sabrblade]

I'm still trying to better familiarize myself with the Movieverse fiction, but I will say this. Both the Matrix and Primus (of all things) were created by the AllSpark.

Primus hasn't been mentioned anywhere in the movieverse yet.

Yes he has. In three places:

• The Fallen's profile in the Titan UK Transformers Comic issue 2.3
• IDW's "Tales of the Fallen" issue #4
• IDW's "Foundation" issues #1 and #2

The latter two are part of the main Movieverse continuity, while the former is part of the Titan UK version of the Movieverse continuity.

[Va'al]

Fellow Seibertron.com member, podcaster and professional voice actor jON3.0 has shared with us a new video he has worked on in collaboration with the Auralnauts, in which he features as Optimus Prime and Kelsey Grammer. The title of the humorous video? 10 Guaranteed Improvements To Transformers: Age Of Extinction. Check it out embedded below.

[Va'al]

In more serious Transformers: Age of Extinction news, the Transformorphagizersers Facebook page have uploaded an album containing more concept art for part of the robot cast of the movie, including Galvatron, the Dinobots, Lockdown, and Crosshairs. Check out the images mirrored below, and wander back to the exclusive art featured on Seibertron.com here!

[Lockdownhunter]

I liked bayformers but always thought they had a lot of loopholes that needed fixing.

[Henry921]

I know TF fiction makes paleontologists cry every time dinosaurs get involved, but all the extra spikes and especially the "hooks" on his chin and his sharp teeth really make me hate his design. That's not even remotely close to what a Triceratops looks like!

...He says while permitting the existence of a two-headed pterodactyl dragon thing.

[padfoo]

Fellow Seibertron.com member, podcaster and professional voice actor jON3.0 has shared with us a new video he has worked on in collaboration with the Auralnauts, in which he features as Optimus Prime and Kelsey Grammer. The title of the humorous video? 10 Guaranteed Improvements To Transformers: Age Of Extinction. Check it out embedded below.

That was funny way better than the movie. I miss you Oreo-bot.

[megatronus]

Fellow Seibertron.com member, podcaster and professional voice actor jON3.0 has shared with us a new video he has worked on in collaboration with the Auralnauts, in which he features as Optimus Prime and Kelsey Grammer. The title of the humorous video? 10 Guaranteed Improvements To Transformers: Age Of Extinction. Check it out embedded below.

That was funny way better than the movie. I miss you Oreo-bot.

HEY YOU GUYS!!!

[Evil Eye]

Honestly, that "parody" wasn't funny. What am I supposed to be laughing at? It doesn't even work as "BAY SUXX LOLOLOLOL!".

[megatronus]

Honestly, that "parody" wasn't funny. What am I supposed to be laughing at? It doesn't even work as "BAY SUXX LOLOLOLOL!".

How dare you disgrace the name of Oreo-bot!

[Evil Eye]

Oreo-bot shall be missed. ;_;7

That said, where is my Leader Class 3-in-1 Junkheap Hasbro? I know he barely got 3 seconds of screentime but damnit I want that guy!

[william-james88]

Honestly, that "parody" wasn't funny. What am I supposed to be laughing at? It doesn't even work as "BAY SUXX LOLOLOLOL!".

Wasnt a big fan either, but I did like the Oreo Bot segment a lot. And how they would reffer back to previous things later. I didnt care for the name change at all though. I thought it was in reference to how the decepticons morphed rather than transformed but they keep showing the legit transformers instead so I dont get it.

[william-james88]

Oreo-bot shall be missed. ;_;7

That said, where is my Leader Class 3-in-1 Junkheap Hasbro? I know he barely got 3 seconds of screentime but damnit I want that guy!

But how would he transform?

[Deadput]

Oreo-bot shall be missed. ;_;7

That said, where is my Leader Class 3-in-1 Junkheap Hasbro? I know he barely got 3 seconds of screentime but damnit I want that guy!

But how would he transform?

Its obvious


Three small scout/deluxe sized robots and each of them turns into a third of a Voyager sized garbage truck like one would be the front/cab, one would be the middle and the last one would be the end

[Deadput]

The only one of those concept arts that is new is the last one with Lockdown's telescope eye the rest we have seen before either on other sites or on special features.