The Energon Pub

The Mayan calender, the I Ching, the Book of Revelations, scientists and raving homeless people all predict the world will end on December 21 2012 due to whatever earthly cataclysm has the fortune of getting here first: Planet X (the real one), God, natural disasters etc.

Plenty of people are saying "They always say the world's gonna end!", but you have to remember this isn't the same 'they', and so don't have a track record of being wrong (yet, I guess). To my knowledge anyway.

So yeah, those who are already in the know, what are you thinking? Going to prepare for floods by moving inland? Get to higher ground? Party like mad or pray like hell?

I'm just curious. I haven't made my mind up if I believe it's going to happen or not or what I'm going to do, but I've been fascinated with the idea for a little while (I think we all are a little bit), just wondering what your thoughts are.

EDIT: In light of that fact that all of the above info is wrong...

Meverix wrote:

Dark Zarak wrote:You shouldn't just read some stuff and then make a post.

Yeah but that's not what the thread is about.

Okay, I got all my details wrong. Alright. That doesn't make the question any less valid or make any less sense, does it?

Either way, regardless of how, 'they' keep chanting that the 21st of December 2012 is it for us. What do you think, and how are you going, or not going to, act on that?

Well, I had a post on this a few months back.

2012 in itself may just be an insignificant year, the Mayan calendar doesn't say the world will end, but that a change will happen.

So it really depends, the rising levels in violence, tensions increasing, the weather and climate changes we've been having, the US economy going into the crapper. They could just be isolated events, or they could be leading up to something big.

You never know until it happens and look back to figure out when and where it began.

Senor Hugo wrote:Well, I had a post on this a few months back.

2012 in itself may just be an insignificant year, the Mayan calendar doesn't say the world will end, but that a change will happen.

So it really depends, the rising levels in violence, tensions increasing, the weather and climate changes we've been having, the US economy going into the crapper. They could just be isolated events, or they could be leading up to something big.

You never know until it happens and look back to figure out when and where it began.

Its true. Even if you ignore all this prediction of worlds ending stuff, there is an awful lot of hell out there right now and it doesn't seem to be stopping.

What you have to think about is that, if the world is going to end, it wont be a sudden thing. December 21st wont roll around and suddenly BAM we're all dead. You really have to visual the coming tortures, with the various wars escalating and water levels rising. All that comes first.

For me, when it becomes clear a huge something is going to happen, I think I'll start partying and making the most of it. Even if its a change, it means the end of the older ways.

I'd like to hope for a change in our values as human beings. Our value for life, for example, is minimal. We just don't seem to care. We're so desensitised to violence and death now. I think that if things continue, and more people are killed, those who are left are going to have a much greater understanding of human worth.

Yeah hold on, I'm ranting.

I hate to break it to you; but death and violence are all parts of the human condition. It's only 'convention' that stops me going out and murdering every last Frenchman on this Earth. **** society.

On a serious note though, how many other philosophers and legends has the planet discovered? All claiming that 'the end is nigh' on a certain year and when it does eventually come around, nuff all happens. The precise same thing will happen this time as well.

I don't believe in all that judgment day crap, I mean they predict the exact date like 6 times in the past 20 or so years and every time they fail.

Oh yes change will come, it's here already, the world will die due to the actions of our race, in fact it already is.

I mean all those that say there is no global warming, have no idea what they're talking about, I mean just look at the weather in Germany, we used to have snow in winter and not in spring!

I'm with Dead Metal. I don't believe in all this judgement Day crap, like he said the world has been predicted to end coutnless times...And nothing. I do recall heavy belief in 1999, and nothing still. I think people shoudl stop worrying so much about the future and put thought and do something about the world we live in now.

However, there is a part of me that is scared about 2012, becuase you see, that's the last I will probably have in college and I have big plans aftwards and if the world actually ends then I had spent so much time studying for nothing and trying to work on a drema that wouldn't even come true. I do beleive change will occur, but hopefully for the better. If this change actually happens and is good I hope it means an end to this war in Iraq, global warming, horrible health care, etc. And we can all go outside and just say "the world is at ease".

Just in case and end does happen I will try to live as much as I can, read as much as I can, study as much as I can, etc.

I think the whole topic of 2012 is very interesting. Of course you'd have to believe in the Bible, or some kind of prophecy. There are numbers of "signs" that have already happened. What we could be looking for here is more news with Israel, conflicts with Russia and Iran, and INSANE natural disasters. And then what?

Either the world or planet is destroyed, or something like God interfering takes place. In the latter belief you'd probably be better off as a Christian. Even in that religion, there is much argument.

If you don't care at all, I suppose you won't be worrying much. I think that one day, soon or not, the world WILL be destroyed either naturally or because of man. Things are happening in this age, but 4 years is pretty drastic. But could it happen? I say YES.

When or if humanity does end, there is going to be a generation just like us, if not us, that is going to be wiped out, and there are always going to be the people that are going to say, "it's not gonna happen."

What it all boils down to is, However you interpret it, do you believe?

Like they said on The Simpsons: "People have been predicting the end of the world for centuries, and they've all been wrong."

Even Nostradamus couldn't get it right. He said we'd be dead by the early 19th century, and I seem to still be breathing.

Senor Hugo wrote:2012 in itself may just be an insignificant year, the Mayan calendar doesn't say the world will end, but that a change will happen.

I'm hoping that a benevolent alien race comes and shares their cool stuff with us. That would be awesome.

Yeah but as I said

This isn't (in all cases) the same 'they', these arent the same prophecies, they haven't had the chance to be proven wrong yet. You can look back at the older predictions and say 'well they didn't come true', but still, they aren't this.

I mean I see why people would simply shrug it off as 'just another mad, unlikely outcome' but you still have to wonder. The world's got to end some time, and this is as likely a time as any.

2012 isn't the Y2K Bug, it isn't the sixth of june '06 (that was a dumb one), etc etc. It's 2012, it's four years off and there's a lot going on right now that could easily build up to a fatal end by that time.

Shadowman wrote:Like they said on The Simpsons: "People have been predicting the end of the world for centuries, and they've all been wrong."

Even Nostradamus couldn't get it right. He said we'd be dead by the early 19th century, and I seem to still be breathing.

Senor Hugo wrote:2012 in itself may just be an insignificant year, the Mayan calendar doesn't say the world will end, but that a change will happen.

I'm hoping that a benevolent alien race comes and shares their cool stuff with us. That would be awesome.

The "V"isitor aliens are returning in 2009!!! perhaps only to end the world by 2012 ?
hmmm.

First it depends on what you mean by "End of the world" End of society, humanity, all life, the actual world? Gotta be more specific with this stuff. Not that I would buy any of it anyway.

Tangent wrote:First it depends on what you mean by "End of the world" End of society, humanity, all life, the actual world? Gotta be more specific with this stuff. Not that I would buy any of it anyway.

Well like I said, 'end of the world' isn't really whats been predicted by the Mayans.

It's a change, which could be just seeds sown for a greater change later on.

People didn't know they were in the dark ages until the history books were written.

It could be the end of an era, America seems to be going down the crap-chute fairly well, so it could be something similar to the fall of Rome.

But then all great civilizations are destined to fall, then be replaced by a new one.

But then to find out an idea as to what could happen, you gotta delve pretty deep into religion, and I don't mean Christianity, Catholicism, Judaism etc. Their stuff has been butchered so badly it's pretty ridiculous(I apologize if I offend anyone of said religions, but it's true, the church has butchered the original teachings to suit heir own purpose, that any credibility died with Jesus).

But with religions like Shamanism, Shamans, who are found throughout the world, in different countries, in tribes that have had no contact with each other, but they share the same experiences, speak of the same visions etc.

It's pretty fascinating looking back at the older religions, piecing together commonalities trying to find that one link.

Senor Hugo wrote:But with religions like Shamanism, Shamans, who are found throughout the world, in different countries, in tribes that have had no contact with each other, but they share the same experiences, speak of the same visions etc.

Merlin? Shipton (sp?)?

I think its a pretty major coincidence that the I Ching, The Book of Revelations and the Mayan's, all civilisations and concepts that are, as far as I know, largely unrelated to each other (two names above included) could all arrive at the same basic idea - 12-21-12 is going to be a massive event in the history of this planet.

Shadowman wrote:Even Nostradamus couldn't get it right. He said we'd be dead by the early 19th century, and I seem to still be breathing.

Or was that just how it was translated? I've seen translations where the Earth lasts till the 3000s, 6000s...

i just hope this world lives long enough so i can see the full transformers trilogy

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/science/20 ... 2012_n.htm

meh, so this is basically an ancient millenial new years, that some new age dudes have grabbed hold of, and have spun in some eschatology to make a few bucks off of gullible folk, or that they'll be a great change? they'res been great changes every year for ages, that's one of the things about time, stuff happens, the word changes. see now what would be really surprising would be if nothing changed, if 2012 was exactly like 2011, now that would be something to get uppity about. i can go in to wiki type in a year and something will have happend;

1974: nixon leaves office,
1711: tuning fork invented
1804: napoleon claimed emperor of the french
605: The Chinese Zhaozhou Bridge is completed under the Sui Dynasty, the earliest known fully-stone open-spandrel segmental arch bridge in the world
1997: blair becomes primeminister
208: Zhou Yu and Liu Bei defeat Cao Cao at the Battle of Red Cliffs; along with the Battle of Yamen and Battle of Lake Poyang, this is one of the largest naval battles in China's history.

until someone can give me a more detailed information of the whys and hows before i beleive a man-made tally ticking over will cause meteor's to fall from the sky or aliens to bean down i'll treat this as superstious twoddle.

Tammuz wrote:until someone can give me a more detailed information of the whys and hows before i beleive a man-made tally ticking over will cause meteor's to fall from the sky or aliens to bean down i'll treat this as superstious twoddle.

Other way around. The meteors cause the tallys.

Please read all of this and remember I'm only relaying it. I'm still neither here nor there with this whole thing.

The story is that there's a tenth planet that has a path that sends it, most of the time, way out of our system and then straight back in, passing between the earth and the sun. It's a brown dwarf, or something, and it's gravity will have lots of devastating effects and cause the sun to get kinda pissy and unleash lots of solar storms or something.

This only occurs every so many thousand years or something. And the last known recording was (theorised to be) one of our most well known bible stories. In fact, a few.

Now I'm not religion buff so 'scuse the odd bit of wrong detail. Feel free to correct me.

The one with Moses parting the water when the... which ever minority left Eqypt? Well apparently that, plus the story of Noah's Ark (its flood) was down to the effects of what Moses (I think) and the Egyptians called 'The Destroyer', a planet sized object that came from the sky.. or something.

This, scientists believe, is what is now called Planet X. And this is what Scientists believe is going to rip us apart in 2012.




Apparently.

EDIT: I forgot a link. I know Wikipedia has its critics but I can't find the stuff I was looking at earlier, maybe this'll give you some idea of what I'm talking about though
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planet_X

but the tally ticks over every 400 years (1 baktun) in the mayan long count, so we should've had cosmic annihilation a while back in the 17th century (and while there's a fair number of wars going on there's only 1 plague and one famine, so nothing really out of the odinary)

but once again this seems to be a hodge podge of scientific mis understandings;

nemesis, the theoretical brown dwarf(star not planet) postulated to orbit somewhere in the oortcloud continualy sending oort cloud debris into the inner solar system, but due to orbital alighnments means we only get it on a regular basis. the entire basis of this is because their could be a pattern in major extinctions occuring every 26 million years. and two of the recent ones have been attributed to large impact events, the last major extinction event happened about 5 million years ago, so the next ones not due for maybe 20 million years.

and while i have no belief whatsoever in the factual content of the bible, i doubt many christians could be persuaded that the floods and moses and all that stuff happened at 26 million year intervals.

remember the whole meteor thing is becuase we sort have these extinctions at 26million year intervals(and i mean sorta), scientists have a few big holes here but nothing as solid as say evolution or gravity, and it has very little to do with the mayan long count and the year 2012.

you really out to read you're own link, and then it's references, i know people criticise wiki, but if you read it properly and follow the citations you can actually get alot of good info (especially) the refernces to scientific papers and then maybe a review of the from a scientific journal, you'll get what scientists actually think.

2012 is not going to be the end of the world. The Mayan calendar doesn't actually end on that date, it simply goes into a new cycle. This will be the 14th time, I think. Big whoop.


A solar flare is not going to happen right as the Northern Hemisphere of a tiny mudball is pointed away from the sun. Think about it. It's like saying me waiting 30 seconds to finish typing this sentence will somehow make a new volcano erupt in Nepal.

And don't bring up the butterfly wings or the pebble on a hillside. It's not relevant here. The way the Earth is aligned in space is far too insignificant to suddenly yank an abnormal amount of charged particles into space. If it was, why hasn't it been happening for the past several billion years?

Now if you can provide scientific studies and data suggesting some kind of activity build-up in the sun that will peak, by coincidence, in 2012, I'll consider it.


And, pray tell, where does the book of Revelations say the world will end in 2012?


2012 is the new Y2K. When midnight hit in 2000, I was sitting around playing Donkey Kong on Nintendo 64. Didn't even realize it was 2000 until fifteen minutes in. If I'd been at a party, I would have turned the lights out, or even the circuit breaker if I'd been wasted enough.

Meverix wrote:The Mayan calender, the I Ching, the Book of Revelations, scientists and raving homeless people all predict the world will end on December 21 2012

What "scientists" predict the world will end in 2012? I'm sorry, but that's just stupid.

Meverix wrote:Planet X (the real one)

There is no real one.

http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/planetx/index.html (The dates are off by a large number, but the science still stands).

It was my understanding that the Mayan calender referenced to stages of the earths life, or something? And we're in the fifth and final one? I know it doesn't specifically say 'WORLD ENDS HERE' at the last point but there is an abrupt and worrying end to the calender at this point.

Meverix wrote:The Mayan calender, the I Ching, the Book of Revelations, scientists and raving homeless people all predict the world will end on December 21 2012

What "scientists" predict the world will end in 2012? I'm sorry, but that's just stupid.

Those would be the scientists talking about a polar shift, I think.

Meverix wrote:Planet X (the real one)

There is no real one.

http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/planetx/index.html (The dates are off by a large number, but the science still stands).

I've only known it to be called Planet X. This isn't because I'm ignoring other names, I simply haven't heard any other names.


You have to remember I'm not exactly an expert. I read some stuff, got wondering, and now I'm wondering what you guys think.

How real a threat it is, I don't know, and for this thread, its not exactly important. If you think its all BS, then you'll be carrying on as usual, fair enough.

Either way, I'm spending it with my partner, just in case.

ah you're getting confused, again:

According to the Popol Vuh, a book compiling details of creation accounts known to the K'iche' Maya of the Colonial-era highlands, we are living in the fourth world. The Popol Vuh describes the first three creations that the gods failed in making and the creation of the successful fourth world where men were placed. In the Maya Long Count, the previous creation ended at the start of a 13th b'ak'tun.

The previous creation ended on a long count of 12.19.19.17.19. Another 12.19.19.17.19 will occur on December 20, 2012, followed by the start of the thirteenth b'ak'tun, 13.0.0.0.0, on December 21, 2012

pole shift hypothesis is that the axis of rotation will chang over time, this is true, the earths' axis changes by about a degree a millenia or so, course popular eschaton fiction has it happening at lot faster. this should not be confused with geo-magnetic reversal, which looks at the earths electomagnetic field being at about 0, in about a millenia or two, but even that doesn't correlate with extinctions.

you have about as much to fear from this as you do from manson coming back from the dead, and and painting your house with a little lamb motif. or conversely that you can cure cancer with homeopathy

Tammuz wrote:ah you're getting confused, again:

According to the Popol Vuh, a book compiling details of creation accounts known to the K'iche' Maya of the Colonial-era highlands, we are living in the fourth world. The Popol Vuh describes the first three creations that the gods failed in making and the creation of the successful fourth world where men were placed. In the Maya Long Count, the previous creation ended at the start of a 13th b'ak'tun.

The previous creation ended on a long count of 12.19.19.17.19. Another 12.19.19.17.19 will occur on December 20, 2012, followed by the start of the thirteenth b'ak'tun, 13.0.0.0.0, on December 21, 2012

pole shift hypothesis is that the axis of rotation will chang over time, this is true, the earths' axis changes by about a degree a millenia or so, course popular eschaton fiction has it happening at lot faster. this should not be confused with geo-magnetic reversal, which looks at the earths electomagnetic field being at about 0, in about a millenia or two, but even that doesn't correlate with extinctions.

you have about as much to fear from this as you do from manson coming back from the dead, and and painting your house with a little lamb motif. or conversely that you can cure cancer with homeopathy

Ah yeah, s'probably right.

See I didn't exactly read up on all of this stuff. I heard about one thing, read about it, heard about another, read about that. Nothing really sank in. S'just a phase, I'll get bored of it and go back to pretending I know stuff about UFO's after this probably.

I didn't pose the 'what are you gonna do' question specifically 'if the oceans rise' or 'if nuclear warheads get tossed around' or whatever. But a lot of things are saying 2012 is it for us, and that 21st of december is our final date. So you know, assuming it isn't something incredibly slow and painful, I'm just wondering what people are gonna do (or not gonna do)on what might be the last day for man (or not.

See I would've been all 'in between' in the first post to avoid all this stuff but that's just annoying

Whats funny Tam, is that Manson is still alive and that he's not eligible for parole until 2012

Original Sin wrote:Whats funny Tam, is that Manson is still alive and that he's not eligible for parole until 2012

Well that settles it. We're screwed.

Another one of these eh.

Well all I can say is since I was born it'll always been the end of the world!

Thirty somewhat years of the end and time and time again the sun comes up and I have to go to stupid work.

With that in mind I have to say I'm increadibly jaded on end of the world theories, so until it either happens or I get motivated to cause it, I say whatever!

Learn from the Y2K people and don't quite your day jobs just yet.