The Energon Pub

Autobot032 wrote:

Noisemaze wrote:These things make me feel ashamed & embarrassed to call myself a Transformers fan.

It's hard to believe anybody seriously likes these.

Apparently you forget that children are the main focus of toylines, not us. Hasbro and Takara/Tomy take care of us just fine, but children are their target audience, not us.

And yes, children are Transfans too.

They will like these. They will buy these. They will enjoy these.

Again, I say, the fandom is completely selfish and constantly thinks "Me, me, me" (this includes children, but we can't hold them accountable, they don't know any better. The adults however, no friggin' excuse.)

Whether they're aimed at children,adults or senior citizens, bad designs are bad designs! Some ideas & concepts should be rejected. Letting Cartoon Network anywhere near Transformers was the worst idea in the history of bad ideas!

Noisemaze wrote:

Autobot032 wrote:

Noisemaze wrote:These things make me feel ashamed & embarrassed to call myself a Transformers fan.

It's hard to believe anybody seriously likes these.

Apparently you forget that children are the main focus of toylines, not us. Hasbro and Takara/Tomy take care of us just fine, but children are their target audience, not us.

And yes, children are Transfans too.

They will like these. They will buy these. They will enjoy these.

Again, I say, the fandom is completely selfish and constantly thinks "Me, me, me" (this includes children, but we can't hold them accountable, they don't know any better. The adults however, no friggin' excuse.)

Whether they're aimed at children,adults or senior citizens, bad designs are bad designs! Some ideas & concepts should be rejected. Letting Cartoon Network anywhere near Transformers was the worst idea in the history of bad ideas!

....I get what you're trying to say, and how important your point is, to you. I really do.

However...eh, forget it. There's so many things wrong with that post, I just don't know where to start, and I'm not sure it'd be worth the trouble involved.

I don't know if anyone said this because I'm feeling too lazy to read through all the posts right now, but I'm really not digging the different heights on the hands of Prime there. Those look really terrible. I would hope they can be slid up or down to put them more in the centre of the wrist area.

Autobot032 wrote:Apparently you forget that children are the main focus of toylines, not us. Hasbro and Takara/Tomy take care of us just fine, but children are their target audience, not us.

And yes, children are Transfans too.

They will like these. They will buy these. They will enjoy these.

And so will I.

At least the Bumblebee, anyway.

does BB's plastic look cheap or is just me? anywho- im excited for this line, partly because it will be the first TF line i'll experience as a collector. (is that sound corny? oh, well ) theyve done a great job at being toon-accurate, both in alt and robot mode!

I think the plastic on these figures looks nice from what I can tell.

olokin wrote:

Glitcher wrote:
1. Really, how the hell do people get hold of items like these? Do they raid Hasbro's warehouses at night?

I have been wondering about the same thing.

What i been wondering is who in there right mind would go bidding that much on a toy that will be like $9 to 15$ in the store? Big deal you got one first but in the end all you really have is a loose opened figure and no proof that its one of the first ones sold.. I mean i could open mine when i buy it and turn around and say " oh i bought this from a shop , it's a prototype.. honest the guy told me so... ill sell it for 400$ " .. Unless that thing comes with a certificate or something saying its a prototype or something , no way will i bid more then 15$ for those toys...

And back onto the topic lol, i really like how they look.. Like a fresh new outtake on transformers.. Im all for change.. I'll be buying this toy line as well

Wes Crayon wrote:

Autobot032 wrote:Apparently you forget that children are the main focus of toylines, not us. Hasbro and Takara/Tomy take care of us just fine, but children are their target audience, not us.

And yes, children are Transfans too.

They will like these. They will buy these. They will enjoy these.

And so will I.

At least the Bumblebee, anyway.

Well, there you go. And more power to you!

Autobot032 wrote:

skywarp-2 wrote:

Briggs wrote:

reanimate28 wrote:Gimmie a break!!! They suck....wake up people

If there were a door in this thread, I'd kick your @$$ right out of it.

Come on guys we are up to 8 Pages with no fighting so far, so lets keep it cool here, and not have this thread locked..

I for one welcome opposing views, except on a certain scalping subject, but never mind that..


What is wrong with the animated toys that you dislike them so much reanimate28?

and let's be nice here people, everyone is entitled to uphold their opinions..

I fully agree.

I can't speak for Reanimate28, but I can speak for me.

1.) They're bloated.
2.) They're too bright.
3.) Too colorful.
4.) Too kiddified.
5.) Too goofy.

On the flipside, they *are* show accurate and do a nice job of bringing the characters to reality. Not to mention, it *is* aimed at kids, so they did right in that as well.

The show's worth watching. The toys (at least to me) are a total write off, but hey, you win some and you lose some.

Enjoy folks.

you can speak for me.... I agree the toys are just as you described...thats why I said they sucked they look goofy
and before anyone calls me a G-wunner I am not part of that age group but I will side with them anyday ..these toys look totally idiotic!

And these toys are not geared towards us , they are for KIDS , that's why they are bright colored and goofy looking.

I couldn't agree more. When I first looked at this thread I was expecting to see 95% of people slagging them off but there seems to be a lot who like them. I'm sort of glad there will be a line I won't want any of, my wallet can have a rest after the onslaught of movie tf's I've bought recently - who actually look like real vehicles and realistic robots and don't have ridiculous faces with desperate Dan style chins!

C'mon people - leave this crap to the kids. Thats obviously who they are aimed at. I would feel embarressed having any of these on display if any of my mates saw them. They are in a totally different league than all other lines yet.

You know, I like the amount of pros vs cons in this thread. Makes for a good read. I'm a G1 fan and I like these. Mind you I don't judge toys until I see them for myself. I'm also impressed that Skywarp-2 is a voice of reason in this thread

Oh, and most times it is people from Hasbro giving out early protos to companies for test shot purposes and then those people selling them.

NIFTY!

Noisemaze wrote:

Autobot032 wrote:

Noisemaze wrote:These things make me feel ashamed & embarrassed to call myself a Transformers fan.

It's hard to believe anybody seriously likes these.

Apparently you forget that children are the main focus of toylines, not us. Hasbro and Takara/Tomy take care of us just fine, but children are their target audience, not us.

And yes, children are Transfans too.

They will like these. They will buy these. They will enjoy these.

Again, I say, the fandom is completely selfish and constantly thinks "Me, me, me" (this includes children, but we can't hold them accountable, they don't know any better. The adults however, no friggin' excuse.)

Whether they're aimed at children,adults or senior citizens, bad designs are bad designs! Some ideas & concepts should be rejected. Letting Cartoon Network anywhere near Transformers was the worst idea in the history of bad ideas!

Amen to that. I've never been a fan of Cartoon Network's cut and paste animation style, it looks cheap and stupid.
I know I'm in the minority but I loved the art style and the
the look of Energon and Cybertron because the artists at least knew how to draw. TF: Animated looks like a bad Teen Titans and Justice League Unlimted rip-off.

doomseer wrote:C'mon people - leave this crap to the kids. Thats obviously who they are aimed at. I would feel embarressed having any of these on display if any of my mates saw them.

You do realise that every Transformers mainline has been aimed at children, right?
And that collector aimed lines like MP or BT/Alt are just detailed depictions of characters from a children's cartoon?

I'm not embarrassed by anything to do with my collection, but if I were, it'd be knowing people around me think I've deluded myself into thinking I'm collecting anything other than characters from a children's product, that are somehow less "kiddy" than everything else.

Also, if the style is so obviously "kiddy aimed" how do you explain this?



This figure is one of many in that style, it's not realistic at all, and features the same kind of exaggerated proportions as TF Animated, yet it's a collector aimed and very delictate statue.
If it's so obviously a style for little kids, why would they make a slew of collector aimed statues in that style?
And why has no one who's ever seen mine looked at it and called it kiddy?

Could it be that, without the snobby eyes of fanboyism, it just looks like a figure done in a modern art style?

Yes it's aimed at kids, just like G1, BW, RiD, A/E/C, the movie, taht's what Transformers is.

If you don't like 'em, fair enough, but this "it's clearly aimed at kids and more childish or embarrasing than other toys in the same CHILDREN'S FRANCHISE" 'cos it's sytylized, is snobbery beyond belief and it's getting very old very fast.

I have to say that while I couldn't care less if the line is aimed at kinds...I like what I see of it less and less.

I dislike the head design. I think it overdoes the 'stylistic element' of the show. I also think it is too large.

I very much dislike the bulbous 'bombs' that he drives around with attached to the side of his car.

Without holding it, the toy appears to have a 'light', 'hollow' feel to it.

The colors are somewhat off, but this could be pre-production non-issue stuff.

I do however like the very clever 'hand cannon'.

Now for the most part, I really do find something cool and worthwhile in every TF toy, but I've yet to hear a response as to why this new style is a 'good' thing. I'd like to hear this argument in all honesty.

Also, if you can help me out by maybe making a case for how these toys could fit into everything else we've gotten over the past 4 or 5 years (which has had a continuous design style).

I'm asking all of this without being condecending too. Just to be clear.

Counterpunch wrote:
Without holding it, the toy appears to have a 'light', 'hollow' feel to it.

The colors are somewhat off, but this could be pre-production non-issue stuff.

I agree. The paint job also seems a little rough around the edges. Actually I thought the toys looked a lot better in previously released photos. I'm not sure if this is down to photography/lighting, or if earlier prototypes were made from better quality materials.

I don't know what it is, but it's nothing new. Official photographs of figures always seem to differ from what we wind up getting. Either the materials are more reflective, or more crisp and matte. Maybe I'm being over-fussy, but there's a lot of subtle things that can make a big difference in the overall desirability of a figure.

Counterpunch wrote:Now for the most part, I really do find something cool and worthwhile in every TF toy, but I've yet to hear a response as to why this new style is a 'good' thing. I'd like to hear this argument in all honesty.

Also, if you can help me out by maybe making a case for how these toys could fit into everything else we've gotten over the past 4 or 5 years (which has had a continuous design style).

I think that's the whole point. They're not supposed to fit in with anything from the past 5 years. It's time for a change of pace. It's a new aesthetic. I wasn't a big fan of the design stylings of Armada, Energon and Cybertron, though there were some good figures.

Alternators and Classics broke from that somewhat, though both had a lot of that same blockiness. The movie line gave us something quite different. More complexity, less clunkiness. With the movie sequels on the horizon that's an aesthetic we'll be seeing a lot more of.

In the interim, we have this new animated cartoony look. It has some of the blockiness of before, but with more fluid shapes.

I think this diversification is healthy. The more transformers keep offering us the same old thing, the sooner I'll grow tired of them. But there's something to be said for offering a certain consistency. When they change things too much, it can feel like it's just not transformers anymore. But at the moment they're doing a good job something for everyone. If the cartoon's not you're cup of tea, there's the movie, there's classics.[/quote]

Counterpunch wrote:I'm asking all of this without being condecending too. Just to be clear.

I think it's clear you're not being condescending.

I think there's a very big different between someone saying they don't like them or find them too cartoony personally, which is saying you don't like a style, and someone saying they're obviously aimed at kids, not adults, which implies the style itself is suitable only for kids.

Counterpunch wrote:Also, if you can help me out by maybe making a case for how these toys could fit into everything else we've gotten over the past 4 or 5 years (which has had a continuous design style).

I don't think the past 4 or 5 years has been a continuous style.

As far as designs go, I'm a traditionalist. I like Transformers and not other mech because of the style it established with the Diaclone and Microman G1. Blocky, man in suit-ish, sometimes human faces.
The movie mostly didn't follow that style at all, and whilst the toys are closer than the movie version they still look, to me at least, like a technologically different race.

Long story short, Animated don't, fit in.
Like BW, movie, Alternators, they look best on a seperate shelf.

Counterpunch wrote:Now for the most part, I really do find something cool and worthwhile in every TF toy, but I've yet to hear a response as to why this new style is a 'good' thing. I'd like to hear this argument in all honesty.

I hate the G1 show, but I loved the designs.
I also loved the G1 toys, but they looked nothing like them.
Years later, I, like many, still wanted show accurate figures.
Masterpiece, Robotmasters, statues, even BT to some degree, all exist because there's a demand for fiction accurate figures.
Even in Classics, Jetfire's likeness has been a big issue.

Up until now, art and tech have never met in TF.
Either the shows and toys are radically different, like G1 and arguably the movie, or the artistic style of the show is limited by having robots run around like giant limited articulation toys, as in A/E/C.

This is the first time in the franchises history I've not felt like I'm looking at mech with a show later attatching personalities to them, but I'm watching a show that's a 100% artistic creation with toys built to represent them.

In the past Hasbro have talked about treating Transformers as a creative property rather than just a toyline with commercials, treating it more like Star Wars than, say, Gobots, and this is the first time they have actually lifted the limitations a toy line brings.
The only way it could get better, imo, is to release humans, aknowledging that Transformers refers to the brand and all characters in it, not just toy gimmicks.

Or in a less long winded way, they look like mini statues, characters come to life, like Batman and other things that didn't come from toylines first.

It's not a toyline of robots, it's a toyline of characters.

I agree on the hollow look and the colours though.

How dare a company try and advance themselves with a new toy line and new story and style! How dare they, without asking US first if it's ok to proceed!

It makes me so angry!

<sarcasm:off>[/b]

doomseer wrote:I couldn't agree more. When I first looked at this thread I was expecting to see 95% of people slagging them off but there seems to be a lot who like them. I'm sort of glad there will be a line I won't want any of, my wallet can have a rest after the onslaught of movie tf's I've bought recently - who actually look like real vehicles and realistic robots and don't have ridiculous faces with desperate Dan style chins!

C'mon people - leave this crap to the kids. Thats obviously who they are aimed at. I would feel embarressed having any of these on display if any of my mates saw them. They are in a totally different league than all other lines yet.

Yes those craptastic movie designs were leagues better

Imagine that though, a toyline aimed at kids with kid friendly colours and styles, who would have thunk it...

Not like that's never happened before with Transformers.

I'm so glad my G1, G1, BW, BM, RiD, Armada, Energon, and Cybertron stuff was aimed at us smart adult people.

Whatever.

The bashing of this line is by a select few who can't open their minds to new concepts. Some of them raise a few good points on why they don't like it and at least they explain why. Then we get people like doomseer here who can't be bothered except to say it sucks and G1 Roxxors foreverorrrrss!!!!

I'm looking forward to the cartoon and some of the toys. But I'm really not all that excited about the trendy art-deco american style of animation.

It does have that 'Cartoon Network' look to it. I like that the TF's had a different look to their cartoons, but the new one looks interchangable with Dexters Lab or any of the other new cartoons.

The kids will love em I'm sure, they have the NEW look to them that kids are into these days.

Besides the same thing over and over would be boring.

DON'T LIKE EM?
PROTEST WITH YOUR WALLET!

If you don't buy them they will drop the line and (hopefully) begin another.

until then, if you don't like it, don't buy it!

i be getting them all.

Counterpunch wrote:Now for the most part, I really do find something cool and worthwhile in every TF toy, but I've yet to hear a response as to why this new style is a 'good' thing. I'd like to hear this argument in all honesty.

OK, I'll give it a shot. I am a huge fan of Batman the Animated series, where this design style originates from. I like the sleek look of everything. The style lends itself well to animation, with squash and stretch, and dynamic poses.

It is good for Transformers because it is using a style that is very popular and familiar with todays kids. This will help Hasbro to increase their fanbase to a whole new generation. Kids that saw the movie will now watch the new cartoon and have their own G1.

It's just like when Beast Wars premiered, it was completely different. I never watched that show until this year because it wasn't what I remembered, but now I enjoyed watching it because it was a really good show. I still don't like the organic designs, but it is still Transformers.

The faces in the new series don't bother me either because everything that is in the show is stylized. Even in G1 they had mouths and expressions that you could not get with solid metal. If you change their faces from blue to grey, I'll bet it would look very similar (minus the chins).

And the best thing that I can say about the new line of toys is that they look almost exactly like their cartoon counterparts. Same colors, almost the same transformations, and a lot of their cool weapons. Even the great G1 didn't have that. AEC were limited because of the computer animation, making everything blocky and stiff (I still like a lot of the designs though). With this kind of animation you have a lot of leeway with your designs.

Feel free to disagree with me on any of these points, but that is how I feel. I can certainly understand why some people do not like the new designs, and that's fine with me. But please say something constructive as to why you don't like it other than "hate it," or something along those lines.

What I am looking forward to most is the fact that they look like their cartoon selves. Of course, this is in part due to the fact that the animation style is a lot cleaner and "simpler" it seems.

Also, perhaps they are getting the hint "Hey, we should probably make the toys look more like the show/movie".

And I think ball-joint technology will contribute to that as well.

I'm also psyched that it's another continuity of transformers that we can let our imaginations delve into, made for 5-9 year olds or not, I don't care.

I am glad they have this color scheme, G1 was great because of all the wonderful colors and everyone was "simple" looking and that's why I like G1, and why I will like these.

While I like the Batman Animated designs, and the JLU later on.
Even Teen titans has a good design It took me a while to get used to them. I didn't immediately like Batman Animated when it came out back in the 90's but It grew on me. I had to watch the show and see how fluid Bruce Timm's animations where to actually start to like them.

TF:Animated takes these designs and stylizes them even further. And I just don't think it works that well on robots, they aren't meant to be smooth or continuous. I like details and vents, and rough surfaces. But that's just me.

That's not to say I think they suck, or the entire line is Garbage. There are some figures I do like. Some I think have potential, but others that the design just breaks them.

Voyager Prime looks pretty good. . Deluxe Prime is acceptable. Starscream I just can't come to grips with the big Leno Chin. Yes I dislike the Head, but the rest of him isn't bad. If I find an easy way to replace the head, or maybe re-sculp it somehow, I might just buy it.

There are other figures I just don't like and probably won't buy. (don't like to make anything definitive until I've seen them in person). and others I think are really cool. Like Bltizwing's Design, I even like Soundwave and those I will buy.