The Energon Pub

do you like bay formers yes or no why or why not ok. i'm a so,so bays work is genius yet hideous,some bots are genius like bumblebee prime and iron hide but some are horrible like rachet actualy they did make a green g1 rachet so its not so bad rememder opinion so no spam on people

Let's see, I think they're... awesome.

And i think they are complete garbage. But ill watch the movies because, hell it's giant robots!

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I was always a G1 purist and it was very difficult for me to accept how different the movie characters looked. But, after seeing the movie, the designs grew on me and I realized they were pretty awesome and original. Sometimes you just gotta let go and think outside the box. The only design that I still don't like is the choice Bay used for Megatron. He looks like mechanical Spaghetti

The new design for Megatron in RotF looks a lil' better but I won't decide until I see the movie. All in all, I think the movie designs are acceptable and are brought to life by some of the best effects I've ever seen.


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I'm a g1 kinda gator so they really aren't my thing, having said that though I think they are great for what they are. There are a few questionable molds, but overall I think they're pretty solid, just not meant for my shelf.

Alligator

Not really feeling the love here. I'm generally unhappy with the bayformers because they're impossible to differentiate in the rapid action scenes at which Bay excels. I like the CGI stills for the Autobots (the 'cons were a mess though), but in the movie they just look like blurs of indistinguishable machine-spaghetti. More boxy and G1-stylish would be better, with spaghetti innards when they're wounded.

Still, bayformer Ravage looks awesome.

I think that they are different, and still freakin' awesome.

I enjoy the movie, and didnt mind the new forms. Having played the movie game, and seen the G1 skins(for megatron and prime), they just didnt look right against the real world surroundings. Far too blocky. They also had another skin where was basically prime without the flames, and he looks so plan and boring. You begin to understand why they made the changes they did. (though i did like starscream with his G 1 paint job, but I understand why he doesnt have it in movie cause he wouldnt blend in with other F -22s then.)

I feel like over all they captured the spirit of the characters , which is the main point rather than making a carbon copy of G1 in live action. Which Im glad megatron wasnt a gun. he hasnt been 1 in 20 some years(which I thought was dumb ni the first place, it basically cut the firepower of his team down why was rarely used), which him keeping his cybertronian jet mode was in line with what id expect of megs. hes too full of himself to take an earth form at that moment in time since was an all out attack anyways.

Im guessing his new alt mode is his pre-all spark form before he amped himself into a flier with it in the comics. His death might knocked him back to square one and when he rebooted he was his default mode. Since the aerial form he received from the all spark, and began his quest to gain it for his own for good. (and implied was capable of far more than that.)

I just hope the fights have less shaky cam, and more bot time as a whole. I think will be a great film in anycase Im optimistic about it all.

Well, its kind irritating that they aren't all very close to their G1 counterparts. Still, the designs have their merits. In a way Bay sort of "updated" them to fit in better. So I kind of like the designs.

Anyways,I just have to take into account some people I know who aren't even interested in the show or anything else saw the movie with no prior knowledge and enjoyed it. (I'll admit after a lot of urging them to see it on my part)

I'll love as long as they are Transformers.

The design of the robots has it's merits and i tip my hat off to the designers and CGI crew that make it possible for us to enjoy the amazing special effects that occur in this kind of film.

My gripe is with the new character creation, iv'e heard of names such as Jolt, Skids, etc.

I mean, c'mon, don't we have enough characters in the G1 series to actually place them in this new movie, why re-invent the wheel when you have a product that has been successful with the existing characters.

Another thing; why bring Autobots that are so small in size compared to the Deceps, Cause other than Sideswipe and Jetfire, the others are a Chevy Bolt, Chevy Trax and Chevy Beat and Arcee is a Motorcycle, so when they transform they are going to be what?.. 7 feet tall?, perhaps 8 feet, compared to 20 or 25 feet and lets not even go into the Constructicon's size.

shandemia wrote:My gripe is with the new character creation, iv'e heard of names such as Jolt, Skids, etc.

I agree, I don't know who the heck this "Jolt" is, however, "Skids" I do know of, he was in the G1 comics I think and the cartoon, at least I'm pretty sure, unless I'm thinking of another character with a similar name..

I really don't mind most of the designs of the main movie characters. I think Bay could have done worse.

I love em at first I was kinda iffy on em but once I saw them on the big screen and in toy form I knew I would always like em.

Designs make Beast Machines Maximals look TERRIFIC in comparison.

Story is poorly wrighten and geared too much twards humans.

Fight scenes look like ****. I can't tell the difference from one character to another while they're movieing.

Basically I allways thought they looked like ****. People kept saying. "You're looking at still photos, you haven't seen them move yet." well moving just made them look worse. They look like exsplodeing car parts when they transform, move, fight, or do anything other than standing still. And standing still they look like robots built from junk piles.

Did I mention the movie was poorly wrighten and had more special effects than plot.

There was no characterization done due to the total lack of screen time for any of the Transformers other than Bumblebee. I really don't even know who died and who's still alive except for Jazz but he had like 3 lines before he bit the dust, who cares about him.

It was nothing but exsplosions, the preview, more exsplosions, I'm blowing up Bay's house, see if he still likes exsplosions after that.

The dude isn't a movie director. He's a pyromaniac. He shouldn't be in Hollywood, he should be in jail.

And that's what I think of Bayformers.

it would have been nice if there was more content about transformers, and far less about how they were affecting earth. the movie was not really about transformers very much, and that is disappointing.

didn't like all the hman boy gets girl story bogging down giant robot fightin.

i went to the movie. i watched it as if i knew nothing about transformers. i truely enjoyed it.

then i watched it as a g1 tf fan. i hated it.

over all its decent. as a g1 fan i hate the look, but the giant blocky robots wouldn't work either. atleast they don't look like anime characters.

now if they cold have less humans on screen and more good images of the tf's it'd be great. the igh definitinof super fast robots thing didn't work so well, and all of a sudden they were in the matrix at certain parts, like the end fight.

but who are we kidding, we all know we're all gonna see the new one, reguardless of how good or bad it is

Name_Violation wrote:didn't like all the hman boy gets girl story bogging down giant robot fightin.

i went to the movie. i watched it as if i knew nothing about transformers. i truely enjoyed it.

then i watched it as a g1 tf fan. i hated it.

over all its decent. as a g1 fan i hate the look, but the giant blocky robots wouldn't work either. atleast they don't look like anime characters.

now if they cold have less humans on screen and more good images of the tf's it'd be great. the igh definitinof super fast robots thing didn't work so well, and all of a sudden they were in the matrix at certain parts, like the end fight.

but who are we kidding, we all know we're all gonna see the new one, reguardless of how good or bad it is

you are correct. no matter what, i will likely see it on opening day. i can't lie about that!

Saber Prime wrote:Designs make Beast Machines Maximals look TERRIFIC in comparison.

Story is poorly wrighten and geared too much twards humans.

Fight scenes look like ****. I can't tell the difference from one character to another while they're movieing.

Basically I allways thought they looked like ****. People kept saying. "You're looking at still photos, you haven't seen them move yet." well moving just made them look worse. They look like exsplodeing car parts when they transform, move, fight, or do anything other than standing still. And standing still they look like robots built from junk piles.

Did I mention the movie was poorly wrighten and had more special effects than plot.

There was no characterization done due to the total lack of screen time for any of the Transformers other than Bumblebee. I really don't even know who died and who's still alive except for Jazz but he had like 3 lines before he bit the dust, who cares about him.

It was nothing but exsplosions, the preview, more exsplosions, I'm blowing up Bay's house, see if he still likes exsplosions after that.

The dude isn't a movie director. He's a pyromaniac. He shouldn't be in Hollywood, he should be in jail.

And that's what I think of Bayformers.

I agree with you man! I always wondered why CO2 could render a huge robot helpless.

MysticKnight wrote:

shandemia wrote:My gripe is with the new character creation, iv'e heard of names such as Jolt, Skids, etc.

I agree, I don't know who the heck this "Jolt" is, however, "Skids" I do know of, he was in the G1 comics I think and the cartoon, at least I'm pretty sure, unless I'm thinking of another character with a similar name..

Jolt is one of the most popular(and cool IMO)minicon from the Unicron trilogy.Especially the one from TF:Cybertron just rocks!
However I agree that there should be more G1 and well-known chararcters in the movie...Where the hell are Shockwave,Wheeljack etc???

As a G1 fan I don't look at the movies as a G1 replacement. I look at them as a take on real world transformers if they existed: complex and completely alien to us in every way. The CGI stills may have been blurry and focused more on humans but thats ok. The comics did that to us too if you remember the beginnings of DreamWave Transformer series. That adds to the mystery of them when first encountered.

As for bringing in familiar TFs, its ok whoever they introduce to us whether they are refurbished characters or brand new ones. Skids is not a new character. He did make at least one appearance in the G1 cartoons and several appearances in the comics. He even had star treatment in one. Jolt I only know of from the Armada series as a mini-con and was probably more prominent than Skids.

I Dont See Why Everyone Complains About Bay's Transformers,
Dont Watch Em Then
Cus I Will Be
Probably Because I Wernt Around For G1...

Love 'em. I hated Frenzy at first but then he grew to be my favorite. Hell, I even liked Megatron's design.

I dont like Bayformers. I will leave G one out of this, since "Its not G one" seems to be everyones favorite "ironclad" argument.

A) for beings involved in a civil war, that are supposedly characters, they are designed to be remarkably one dimensional. The bad guys look like monsters, the good guys look like knights. Its not subtle. Its like the old movies when the bad guys have moustaches and top hats. I have no reason to even like the decepticons at all. They move like animals and are look like they hate everything, rather than being a military faction that actually has some brains and a plan. In other words, they look like sci-fi channel level bad guys. The autobot style is what the decepticons should have looked like too.

B) the designs are too hard for kids to draw and get pumped up about. Kids can draw superman, batman, etc. Try drawing megatron. Or optimus prime. They are just a mishmash of pieces. Prime and bumblebee you can get away with, maybe starscream. Not anyone else though. The designs are too complicated and dont easily recognizable items to be centered around. Think of the great, famous robots. None look like Bays transformers. All have a classic, very clean design

C) I was lied to. I was told the designs would be realisitic, and no mass shifting. Well, the allspark mass shifts, and it makes a cell phone into a tidy little ninja (with four legs, nonetheless), complete with missles?? Also, the robots do not have realisitic transformations as there are so many moving parts and exposed parts. Youd think war machines that transform would be more modular and armored and not so fluid and organic. I know they are alien. But they are not magic.

D) Its getting kind of old that the bad guy becomes a "cybetronian jet", which seems to mean "we drew him first, then couldnt figure out what to do, so we made him into a wedge or T and called it an alien jet"

E) They really do look like/mashed up parts , and in my opinion, very generic "X-treme" robots, which is fine, I guess...but I like my kids cartoons to have a classic look and not the "this is whats in now" look. I mean, why do you think Transformers/Macross still has fans? and by classic I dont mean G one, I mean something that still look cool in 20 years. Look at HAL, ron Giant, Macrouss, Exosuad.

F) the Fallen does not look fearsome. He is very spindly. Megatron looks like a monster. Stascream just looks weird. The toys are also poor IMO. Starscream has these weird giant guns under him..unlike a real plane. Megatron looks like a jet...if you use your imagination. Havent seen Prime and BBee. Ratchet was good though.

E) there were a lot of designs on the web, that as far as I could tell EVERYONE liked, including most of the G oners and Bay fans. Why were these designs not used? I felt like Bay went out of his way to make the designs really really like nothing else anyone had seen...which is a polarizing move, and I think failed with a lot of fans. I think he should have gone with clean, safe robot designs that were really good and not the bio-organic feel.

I was fine with a redesign, but look at the redesign of batman from Dark knight vs Old batman. Updated, kept the same, very recognizable. I feel like Bay went the Joel Schumacher route and cut holes all in the batmobile, gave it neon lights and put a sixpack with nipples on the armor...because it would be appealing? TF was a sucess, I wont deny that...but will people want to show it to their kids, the way G One fans show the original movie to their kids? I dont think so.

NewFoundStarscreamLuv wrote:A) for beings involved in a civil war, that are supposedly characters, they are designed to be remarkably one dimensional. The bad guys look like monsters, the good guys look like knights. Its not subtle. Its like the old movies when the bad guys have moustaches and top hats. I have no reason to even like the decepticons at all. They move like animals and are look like they hate everything, rather than being a military faction that actually has some brains and a plan. In other words, they look like sci-fi channel level bad guys. The autobot style is what the decepticons should have looked like too.

So how many heroic Decepticons have there been in the history of TFs?

NewFoundStarscreamLuv wrote:B) the designs are too hard for kids to draw and get pumped up about. Kids can draw superman, batman, etc. Try drawing megatron. Or optimus prime. They are just a mishmash of pieces. Prime and bumblebee you can get away with, maybe starscream. Not anyone else though. The designs are too complicated and dont easily recognizable items to be centered around. Think of the great, famous robots. None look like Bays transformers. All have a classic, very clean design

So...because kids can't draw them, that means terrible designs? Most schoolkids aren't exactly Picasso, (and that works on multiple levels) so I don't think kids inability to draw certain characters is a reflection of the characters' designs.

NewFoundStarscreamLuv wrote:C) I was lied to. I was told the designs would be realisitic, and no mass shifting. Well, the allspark mass shifts, and it makes a cell phone into a tidy little ninja (with four legs, nonetheless), complete with missles?? Also, the robots do not have realisitic transformations as there are so many moving parts and exposed parts. Youd think war machines that transform would be more modular and armored and not so fluid and organic. I know they are alien. But they are not magic.

So your main problem is that the massive unexplained cube which has no known origin and can bring machines to life, can also change it's size as well as make additional parts on it's creations?

NewFoundStarscreamLuv wrote:D) Its getting kind of old that the bad guy becomes a "cybetronian jet", which seems to mean "we drew him first, then couldnt figure out what to do, so we made him into a wedge or T and called it an alien jet"

Energon Megatron, RID Megatron, and Movie Megatron, all have very similar jet modes, so you can't bash one without bashing all of them.

NewFoundStarscreamLuv wrote:E) They really do look like/mashed up parts , and in my opinion, very generic "X-treme" robots, which is fine, I guess...but I like my kids cartoons to have a classic look and not the "this is whats in now" look. I mean, why do you think Transformers/Macross still has fans? and by classic I dont mean G one, I mean something that still look cool in 20 years. Look at HAL, ron Giant, Macrouss, Exosuad.

This is not a kids cartoon. I thought the guy being impaled by a robot scorpion made that clear.

NewFoundStarscreamLuv wrote:F) the Fallen does not look fearsome. He is very spindly. Megatron looks like a monster. Stascream just looks weird. The toys are also poor IMO. Starscream has these weird giant guns under him..unlike a real plane. Megatron looks like a jet...if you use your imagination. Havent seen Prime and BBee. Ratchet was good though.

1. The Fallen, if I recall, is supposed to have CGI fire covering him (Simon Furman's idea), and I'd be pretty intimidated by a massive alien robot coming at me while he's on fire.

2. Megatron is a monster. He killed his own planet because he didn't have as much power as he would have liked (He was already co-ruler), and intended to do the same to Earth.

3. Don't use toys as a way of saying designs are unrealistic.

NewFoundStarscreamLuv wrote:E) there were a lot of designs on the web, that as far as I could tell EVERYONE liked, including most of the G oners and Bay fans. Why were these designs not used? I felt like Bay went out of his way to make the designs really really like nothing else anyone had seen...which is a polarizing move, and I think failed with a lot of fans. I think he should have gone with clean, safe robot designs that were really good and not the bio-organic feel.

Yes, why did Michael Bay design robots the way he wanted to, and not the way the fans did? It's almost like he's trying to make a movie the way he wants to...

NewFoundStarscreamLuv wrote:I was fine with a redesign, but look at the redesign of batman from Dark knight vs Old batman. Updated, kept the same, very recognizable. I feel like Bay went the Joel Schumacher route and cut holes all in the batmobile, gave it neon lights and put a sixpack with nipples on the armor...because it would be appealing? TF was a sucess, I wont deny that...but will people want to show it to their kids, the way G One fans show the original movie to their kids? I dont think so.

On the last part:

1. I'd show it to my kids one day

2. I can't even go twenty minutes into the original movie because it is so very ridiculous.

My opinion is that it's got to understood that the cartoon style wouldn't fit for the real life movies.
In the cartoons most trasformers basically look like giant humans (especially in the face) wearing very cool armor. It's a little more simplistic, but it fits perfectly.

In live action (and reality in general) things are much more detailed. And they should be.
The complex designs are perfect and I love them as much as the cartoon designs.

I do have a couple complaints though.
I sorta argee with NewFoundStarscreamLuv. The Decpticons look and act too much like monsters. No they aren't good guys, but the blatantly beastial look (animal based TFs not counted) is a little overkill.
In the cartoon, the creators managed to make them look evil, but not so different from the Autobots. They are the same species after all.
And you actually liked a lot of them.

And as for the animalistic, mindless, psychotic personalities of the movie Decepticons, it fits a few of them. But it was very unfitting for Megatron.
Megatron can be a beastial monster, but in the movie we saw none of his more sinister, calm, calculating side. Megatron is a brute sometimes, but we've all seen the way he likes to play around with the minds of others. He not just a primal nutcase.
And I didn't appreciate all the snarling either. Come on, he's got more dignity than that.

But though I think the designs are cool, it's sort of frustrating. I can barely manage drawing the more simple cartoon look. The movie-verse is just way too complicated for me to draw correctly right now.
I guess I'll comsider it a challenge, but it's just slightly irratating.