The Energon Pub

Dead Metal wrote:t

5150 Cruiser wrote:

DISCHARGE wrote:I just can't believe the creators of the TMNT signed off on the idea of making them aliens.

And there ya go. The creators are on board with the idea so if the "fans" want to be-head anyone it should be them.

Bay is just producing, not directing, so the blame can't be put on him anyhow. BUt i guess its just easier to hate on him.

Yea, but is this a case of the creators actually being on board or a case of "Alan Moore is super exited about what we die with the V for Vendetta movie!"?

Taking away the origins of TMNT takes all the history, meaning and ancestory of the genre away from them, throws it away and insults the invention and everybody who's followed it from infancy to present.
Through all the battles, locations and stories one thing has remained a constant: where the Turtles came from.

Was PL's statement really a "sign off"??

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/ ... s/?a=56750

His last words seem a bit sarcastic and snarky to me.

PL wrote:Joy. -- PL

Bay is the raper of people's childhood memories..
I am sure there will be plenty of explosions too as we all know that ninjas always carry bazookas and heavy artillery around with them..

Sabrblade wrote:

5150 Cruiser wrote:Bay is just producing, not directing, so the blame can't be put on him anyhow. BUt i guess its just easier to hate on him.

He's still heavily involved (Producer is an important role in the story) and approves of this.

So what? He's still the producer and not director and won't be calling all the shots. Its funny how people held him completely responisble for the TF movies since he was the director, but now that he's producing it he's still being held 100% responsible. Not one person in this thread who is upset with the idea of TMNT being aliens has even meantioned dumping responsibility on the director or the company who owns the rights to TMNT. If the fans are so important, why did they sign off on this idea??

Fires_Of_Inferno wrote:Realistically though, it's probably the original writer. I wouldn't know to be honest, I havn't been following the story very closely except to watch fan reactions.

I would be VERY stunned to believe to that either Kevin Eastman or Peter Laird would even approve to this blasphemy! They disliked what was done to make the 1987 cartoon what is was, and that was tame compared to this change.

DISCHARGE wrote:Taking away the origins of TMNT takes all the history, meaning and ancestory of the genre away from them, throws it away and insults the invention and everybody who's followed it from infancy to present.
Through all the battles, locations and stories one thing has remained a constant: where the Turtles came from.

AMEN!!!

Cyber Bishop wrote:I am sure there will be plenty of explosions too as we all know that ninjas always carry bazookas and heavy artillery around with them..

Well, they did get heavy artillery suits of mech armor at certain points in the 2003 cartoon, but those were just supplementary additions to their arsenal that were only used on special occasions.

5150 Cruiser wrote:So what? He's still the producer and not director and won't be calling all the shots. Its funny how people held him completely responisble for the TF movies since he was the director, but now that he's producing it he's still being held 100% responsible. Not one person in this thread who is upset with the idea of TMNT being aliens has even meantioned dumping responsibility on the director or the company who owns the rights to TMNT. If the fans are so important, why did they sign off on this idea??

Oh, I'm not just mad at Bay, but everyone who thought this aliens nonsense was a good idea. Though, Bay's been the only name mentioned so far (unless I've missed a post), so he's been the main target. Give me some other names and I'll give credit (YMMV) where credit is due.

Sabrblade wrote:

RhA wrote:

Evil_the_Nub wrote:I'm all for mixing a few things up to keep it fresh, but they're taking the mutant and turtle out of teenage mutant ninja turtles.

So? During the run of the original cartoon the word 'ninja' was replaced by 'hero' over here. Semantics.

Despite their being called "heroes", they were still so obviously ninjas due to their fighting styles and training. Heroes can be ninjas without the term "ninja" being used.

Now had that cartoon had its visuals altered to the point at which the Turtles' fighting styles were something other than Ninjitsu or any non-Asian martial arts, then that would be too drastic a change as it changes the foundational nature of what they are: Ninjas.

Same goes for this aliens bit changing another foundational part of their nature: Mutants and/or Turtles.

Aliens can be mutants. It's not mutually exclusive. It does not change a thing purely based on that.

RhA wrote:Aliens can be mutants. It's not mutually exclusive. It does not change a thing purely based on that.

If they're already aliens, there's no point in them being mutants (or turtle-like). It's just one more unnecessary step from them being inhuman.

Being mutant turtles is a more unique concept than being aliens.

DISCHARGE wrote:

Dead Metal wrote:t

5150 Cruiser wrote:

DISCHARGE wrote:I just can't believe the creators of the TMNT signed off on the idea of making them aliens.

And there ya go. The creators are on board with the idea so if the "fans" want to be-head anyone it should be them.

Bay is just producing, not directing, so the blame can't be put on him anyhow. BUt i guess its just easier to hate on him.

Yea, but is this a case of the creators actually being on board or a case of "Alan Moore is super exited about what we die with the V for Vendetta movie!"?

Taking away the origins of TMNT takes all the history, meaning and ancestory of the genre away from them, throws it away and insults the invention and everybody who's followed it from infancy to present.
Through all the battles, locations and stories one thing has remained a constant: where the Turtles came from.

Dude, I understand and I'm on your side of the argument.

The Wachovkies lied about Alan Moore liking and being exited about the V for Vendetta movie, that was my point here. Is Bay saying the truth about having one of the original creators or is he lying?

Well, there is a glimmer of hope

From an interview with the actual Director, Jonathan Liebesman

“Look, it’s so funny—if everyone was such a die-hard fan, they would know that the TCRI canisters where the ooze comes from. That is alien ooze. Now I’m not saying what Michael said is exactly what the movie is, because we’re sitting in a room now figuring everything out. So we don’t know, but we are like Michael said: we’re expanding it, and the expansion will be true to the mythology.”

So there is a chance Michael Bay is just talking out of his ass and the turtles are only alien in that they were mutated by alien ooze.

Volrathicus Baenimus wrote:Well, there is a glimmer of hope

From an interview with the actual Director, Jonathan Liebesman

“Look, it’s so funny—if everyone was such a die-hard fan, they would know that the TCRI canisters where the ooze comes from. That is alien ooze. Now I’m not saying what Michael said is exactly what the movie is, because we’re sitting in a room now figuring everything out. So we don’t know, but we are like Michael said: we’re expanding it, and the expansion will be true to the mythology.”

So there is a chance Michael Bay is just talking out of his ass and the turtles are only alien in that they were mutated by alien ooze.

If that were the case, then all the more reason to get on bay's case for not only making us mad with this alien nonsense, but making us mad with his lies.

If he's lying, he never should have done so, as it just makes him more disliked. If he's not, then it's still stupid for the TMNT to be aliens.

lol ... fanboys got trolled by Bay.

Do believe I said something like that back on page 1. Still, it was fun watching you all rage.

Burn wrote:lol ... fanboys got trolled by Bay.

Do believe I said something like that back on page 1. Still, it was fun watching you all rage.

Still doesn't make Bay look any better. He's seen as either a liar or a hack, so it's a lose-lose situation for him.

Not really. Because he doesn't care. That's what all that anti-Bayers fail to understand. HE.DOES.NOT.CARE.WHAT.THEY.THINK.ABOUT.HIM.

-edit-

Full interview

Looks like the "co-creator" is none other than Kevin Eastman himself, so not someone who may have been nothing more than a penciller as some have suggested.

Keep raging kids, keep raging.

I love Michael Bay.

Make 'em squirm!

There is a third option. Bay wasn't lying, he's just an idiot who wasn't paying attention, half listened to what was going on while he doodled explosions and robot balls in the margins of his script, and then shot his mouth off not realizing he didn't have any idea what he was talking about.

Burn wrote:Not really. Because he doesn't care. That's what all that anti-Bayers fail to understand. HE.DOES.NOT.CARE.WHAT.THEY.THINK.ABOUT.HIM.

Hack, liar, egotist, a real gem of a guy, ain't he?

Burn wrote:-edit-

Full interview

Looks like the "co-creator" is none other than Kevin Eastman himself, so not someone who may have been nothing more than a penciller as some have suggested.

Keep raging kids, keep raging.

That article has me feel a little relieved, though I'd be moreso if we had confirmation that just the ooze is alien in origin and not the Turtles.

I guess one could think of them as "aliens" if they were Earth turtles mutated by alien ooze, thinking that the alien ooze turns the Earth turtles *into* "alien turtles", which is the vibe I'm getting from this article. But, technically, that isn't how being an alien works. Being a creature coming from another planet = alien. Being a domestic creature mutated into another form by alien ooze =/= alien. So, maybe they're just using the term loosely rather than literally, which would be a big sign of relief for me.

Consider me now "skeptical" instead of "appalled".

Volrathicus Baenimus wrote:There is a third option. Bay wasn't lying, he's just an idiot who wasn't paying attention, half listened to what was going on while he doodled explosions and robot balls in the margins of his script, and then shot his mouth off not realizing he didn't have any idea what he was talking about.

Also possible.

Sabrblade wrote:I guess one could think of them as "aliens" if they were Earth turtles mutated by alien ooze, thinking that the alien ooze turns the Earth turtles *into* "alien turtles", which is the vibe I'm getting from this article. But, technically, that isn't how being an alien works. Being a creature coming from another planet = alien. Being a domestic creature mutated into another form by alien ooze =/= alien. So, maybe they're just using the term loosely rather than literally, which would be a big sign of relief for me.

I agree.

I guess it also makes sense. When you think about it, they're probably trying to make it a little more "believable". An ooze developed on this planet that can mutate things? nyah. But if it was alien in origin, that would be more believable.

So yeah, in a way, they are alien in origin, but the turtles themselves are not from another planet. I think it's a fair thing to do.

And maybe Bay wasn't paying attention, or maybe, maybe after all the raging the TF fanboys did, he really does love to troll. (Can't say I blame him considering some of the reactions over the last 4-5 years)

Burn wrote:I agree.

I guess it also makes sense. When you think about it, they're probably trying to make it a little more "believable". An ooze developed on this planet that can mutate things? nyah. But if it was alien in origin, that would be more believable.

So yeah, in a way, they are alien in origin, but the turtles themselves are not from another planet. I think it's a fair thing to do.

It's not just fair, but accurate! The ooze was developed on Earth, but by alien refugees hiding on Earth, disguising themselves as humans. TCRI is short for "Techno Cosmic Research Institute", which is the corporate front of the Utroms' headquarters.

Burn wrote:And maybe Bay wasn't paying attention, or maybe, maybe after all the raging the TF fanboys did, he really does love to troll. (Can't say I blame him considering some of the reactions over the last 4-5 years)

Sooner or later, there's gonna be an official (and more witty) term for Bay's trolling.

Sabrblade wrote:It's not just fair, but accurate! The ooze was developed on Earth, but by alien refugees hiding on Earth, disguising themselves as humans. TCRI is short for "Techno Cosmic Research Institute", which is the corporate front of the Utroms' headquarters.

Well there you go, you learn something every day. I'll admit i'm not a great lore on TMNT as I was hitting the teenage years then and moving into "more grown up" stuff. I watched the movies, maybe watched a cartoon or two here and there but that was it.

So i'm probably the target audience they're looking for. Yay me!

Burn wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:It's not just fair, but accurate! The ooze was developed on Earth, but by alien refugees hiding on Earth, disguising themselves as humans. TCRI is short for "Techno Cosmic Research Institute", which is the corporate front of the Utroms' headquarters.

Well there you go, you learn something every day. I'll admit i'm not a great lore on TMNT as I was hitting the teenage years then and moving into "more grown up" stuff. I watched the movies, maybe watched a cartoon or two here and there but that was it.

So i'm probably the target audience they're looking for. Yay me!

Yeah, the 1987 cartoon ignored this and instead had Shredder be the maker the mutagen ooze.

This backstory comes from the original Mirage Comics, and was later repeated in the 2003 cartoon (both of which were aimed at older audiences than the 1987 cartoon, being darker and more mature, but the 2003 cartoon was still friendly enough to be enjoyed by everyone).

The live movies, however, adapted this backstory to have the ooze be manmade by by the human-run TGRI instead of the Utron-run TCRI (the G standing for "Global" instead), not wanting to involve aliens.


Still, there is the possibility that this is false hope and the Turtles really are alien creature in this movie.

Mutated by alien ooze? I love the idea. This whole situation has been hilarious. Watching people get so worked up over nothing and making asses of themselves with all their unreasonable Bay hate. I think I'll see this movie opening day just to spite them.

Evil_the_Nub wrote:Mutated by alien ooze? I love the idea.

That's how it was originally (and recently).

Evil_the_Nub wrote:This whole situation has been hilarious. Watching people get so worked up over nothing and making asses of themselves with all their unreasonable Bay hate. I think I'll see this movie opening day just to spite them.

My critiques were due to this supposed "the Turtles are aliens" bit was an outright contradiction of the very nature of the Turtles themselves. They can't be the TMNT if they're aliens from another planet. But now that things seem to be in better light, this contradiction seems to be nonexistent, of which I am thankful.

Burn wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:It's not just fair, but accurate! The ooze was developed on Earth, but by alien refugees hiding on Earth, disguising themselves as humans. TCRI is short for "Techno Cosmic Research Institute", which is the corporate front of the Utroms' headquarters.

Well there you go, you learn something every day. I'll admit i'm not a great lore on TMNT as I was hitting the teenage years then and moving into "more grown up" stuff. I watched the movies, maybe watched a cartoon or two here and there but that was it.

So i'm probably the target audience they're looking for. Yay me!

Check out the first 11 issues of the original Mirage comic, then stop.
Tee original intent was to make a gritty, violent, and dark comic parodying gritty, dark, and violent comics like Frank Miller's Ronin and his Daredevil run and stuff like that. The only thing "funny" about them is however that the violence is handed out by turtles that are also Ninjas.
And yes they use their weapons the way they're intended to be. Their origin is also tied in with daredevil's, which I have to say is actually pretty funny.
they're not particulary good and they get worse after issue 11, which was the hight point of the series.

A bit (more) comic relief:

http://www.the-gutters.com/comic/272-josh-adams

Va'al wrote:A bit (more) comic relief:

http://www.the-gutters.com/comic/272-josh-adams

lol, here's another one:
http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/videol ... -be-aliens

Sabrblade wrote:

Burn wrote:lol ... fanboys got trolled by Bay.

Do believe I said something like that back on page 1. Still, it was fun watching you all rage.

Still doesn't make Bay look any better. He's seen as either a liar or a hack, so it's a lose-lose situation for him.

I don't see it that way at all. I see it as a bunch of fan boys making their own conclusions. Which is fine. But then when its starts to come out that things aren't going to be what they (the fanboys) thought, they still want to castrate him. BUt your right about one thing... its a lose-lose- situation for him. Just being envloved is enough for people to hate. He'll be damned if he does, and he'll be damned if he doesn't. This movie could be an absolute bomb and people will point all the blame on Bay and Bay alone. BUt if it does great, critics and fans alike aprove, and everyone will make claims that Bay had nothing to do with its success and it was all the director.

And on the whole..
"Bay is lieing as ussual". He just wants all of us to get upset on purpose!"
Well if that's the case, then why did you take his word in the first place?