The Energon Pub

I know on the moonbases there were optimus Prime,Ironhide,Gears,Jazz,Cliffjumpeer,Bumblebee,Brawn,Ratchet,Ironhide,The Dinobots. But i do not know the ones who were at the battle of autobot city. I know outside the city there were Hotrod,Kup,Huffer,Bluestreak. Sunstreaker and hound i am not sure about we see them there but later we see them comign to earth with prime event hough we saw sunstreaker in the shuttle and hound outside but by telling where he was standing it looked like he was disembarking from the shuttle. Were was them two suppsoe to be at. I know inside the city there was ultra magnus,perceptor,blurr,arcee,springer,blaster,wheeljack,windchargher,inferno even though it looked like grapple i think it was an animation error considering that them too are the same model and infernos name only appears in the credits not grapple. I am sure that it was than 9 autobots inside the city when it was attacked not mentioned any others who were outside it at the time. When ultra magnus said blurr you can help me alert the others i am sure there had to of been 4 others considering there were perceptor,springer and arcee were there and well aware of the attack. Thats not much to alert. Do you think there were characters there that were there but not shown. It cant be more than 20 cause thats about how many decepticons that were there and springer said they were outnumbered agaisnt megatron,6seekers,3 insecticons,6 contructicons,soundwave,and astrotrain,blitzwing minus the cassetes inside soundwave and inside blaster. Thats brings the total up to 19 decepticons agaisnt outnumberd autobots that were inside the city when attacked. so who were the autobots that were at the city but never showsn if there were any.

i know wheeljack and windcharger must've been stationed there (as they were shown among the dead), and MAYBE sideswipe (in the original version, it showed his body off to the side when arcee and springer moved the missile launcher, but it's rumored to be a miscolored smokescreen). other than that, i'm not sure.

G1Decepticons wrote:I know on the moonbases there were optimus Prime,Ironhide,Gears,Jazz,Cliffjumpeer,Bumblebee,Brawn,Ratchet,Ironhide,The Dinobots. But i do not know the ones who were at the battle of autobot city. I know outside the city there were Hotrod,Kup,Huffer,Bluestreak. Sunstreaker and hound i am not sure about we see them there but later we see them comign to earth with prime event hough we saw sunstreaker in the shuttle and hound outside but by telling where he was standing it looked like he was disembarking from the shuttle. Were was them two suppsoe to be at. I know inside the city there was ultra magnus,perceptor,blurr,arcee,springer,blaster,wheeljack,windchargher,inferno even though it looked like grapple i think it was an animation error considering that them too are the same model and infernos name only appears in the credits not grapple. I am sure that it was than 9 autobots inside the city when it was attacked not mentioned any others who were outside it at the time. When ultra magnus said blurr you can help me alert the others i am sure there had to of been 4 others considering there were perceptor,springer and arcee were there and well aware of the attack. Thats not much to alert. Do you think there were characters there that were there but not shown. It cant be more than 20 cause thats about how many decepticons that were there and springer said they were outnumbered agaisnt megatron,6seekers,3 insecticons,6 contructicons,soundwave,and astrotrain,blitzwing minus the cassetes inside soundwave and inside blaster. Thats brings the total up to 19 decepticons agaisnt outnumberd autobots that were inside the city when attacked. so who were the autobots that were at the city but never showsn if there were any.

Are you expecting different answers on this site????

Praxus Prime wrote:i know wheeljack and windcharger must've been stationed there (as they were shown among the dead), and MAYBE sideswipe (in the original version, it showed his body off to the side when arcee and springer moved the missile launcher, but it's rumored to be a miscolored smokescreen). other than that, i'm not sure.

Actully Wheeljack and Windcharger were never "confirmed" to be dead from within the narrative.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Praxus Prime wrote:i know wheeljack and windcharger must've been stationed there (as they were shown among the dead), and MAYBE sideswipe (in the original version, it showed his body off to the side when arcee and springer moved the missile launcher, but it's rumored to be a miscolored smokescreen). other than that, i'm not sure.

Actully Wheeljack and Windcharger were never "confirmed" to be dead from within the narrative.

i wondered about that since they didn't turn grey, but i just assumed they were because of the huge holes in 'em.

Praxus Prime wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Praxus Prime wrote:i know wheeljack and windcharger must've been stationed there (as they were shown among the dead), and MAYBE sideswipe (in the original version, it showed his body off to the side when arcee and springer moved the missile launcher, but it's rumored to be a miscolored smokescreen). other than that, i'm not sure.

Actully Wheeljack and Windcharger were never "confirmed" to be dead from within the narrative.

i wondered about that since they didn't turn grey, but i just assumed they were because of the huge holes in 'em.

Yes its a safe assumption.....but both characters were seen in later episodes.

Windcharger was seen running around in "Call of the primitives and Wheeljack was featured in the Victory series.

Sunstreaker is also seen form the front on Prime's shuttle, so his presence at the begining of the battle could be an animation error (wouldn't be the first). As far as who was at the battle off screen, there are scenes that were storyboarded but cut that included the deaths of Red Alert, Trailbreaker, and Mirage.

Decepticon Spike wrote:Sunstreaker is also seen form the front on Prime's shuttle, so his presence at the begining of the battle could be an animation error (wouldn't be the first). As far as who was at the battle off screen, there are scenes that were storyboarded but cut that included the deaths of Red Alert, Trailbreaker, and Mirage.

i read about red alert's death scene, and i remember it mentioning Sideswipe being right next to him when he died

Ok guys, im gonna break this down for you so everybody understands who was killed during the autobot city seige. First off, let me remind everyone that this battle took place from the late morning/noonish hours of day #1, and continued uninterupted until the early morning of the next day (day #2). Ok here we go: So upon megatron hearing the autobots are planning a massive invasion of cybertron, from there "now" main base of operations on earth called autobot city and it was created sometime over the past 20 years being the decepticons claimed control of cybertron. Prowl, Ironhide, brawn and ratchet are the first of the autobot casualties. As the decepticons enters autobot city vicinity airspace (probably as far out as a mile from the city limits), hot rod sees that decepticons have obviously taken control of the shuttle and proceeds to begin attacking without hesitation... Thus causing the decepticons to suddenly 'scrap' their plan "A" of espionage via an autobot shuttle, and commencing a full scale assault. Now remember that there are autobots down in the canyons below with kup. Im sure its safe to say that this is when huffer is killed. Now the animation errors of sunstreaker and hound with kup are completely errors! Lets pretend they werent even drawn, instead it would naturally have to be sideswipe,smokescreen and bluestreak with kup. (Especially being that in the storyboards, sideswipe will be with tracks and red alert led by magnus, defending the inner hall corridor of autobot city against devastator just after hes ripped off the north wall). Ok... so, as megatron fires two shots at the mountain ridge, the other decepticons are already progressing toward the city. And during their progression toward the city gates, naturally they're flying over the valley were kup is with sideswipe,smokescreen and huffer. So kup most likely tells them to go back to the city for cover and hes gonna go help hot rod and daniel. Obviously during sideswipe,bluestreak and huffer's journey back to the city, huffer is killed, while the other two make it back to the city. Now lets fast-foward a bit shall we........ just about everyone from seasons 1 and 2 are present for the seige. Remember, all autobots were forced off of cybertron years ago, and the only place near cybertron any autobot could be is on two of its moons. But the moons are waaaaay to small for the entire autobot army to occupy. So naturally prime only kept a few up there for manufacturing and surveillance purposes, and of course to pilot shuttles back and forth to deliver weaponry to the city and take energon back to the 2 moons. So anyways, as sideswipe and bluestreak get back, they alert magnus that decepticons are probably less than a mile out from the city and theyre attacking and hot rod, kup, and daniel are still out there. Magnus sends perceptor on-top of the city to observe and confirm what sideswipe and/or bluestreak tells him., and that he will meet him at the designated point he, perceptor,arcee, blurr and springer do meet in the movie. Perceptor confirms and the rest is history for that. Now the only reason why magnus,arcee,springer and blurr are outside is because they are confirming whats happening..(As bombs are falling all around them might i add :/) EVERYBODY else is inside at their command posts as magnus has so ordered already. Thats why when hot rod and kup get back, (in the storyboards) magnus charges hot rod with a security violation!!! And if this scene would have been animated you would have seen the following autobots: sideswipe, bluestreak, wheeljack, smokescreen, grapple, trailbreaker, windcharger, tracks, red alert, inferno, and mirage! Because during the scene where magnus gives hot rod the violation, youll see all of these characters running around scrambling if you wish, in order to counter-attack. Now mirage is killed while shooting at bombshell, because megatron flies in just after mirage shoots bombshell, and he blows up the bridge mirage was standing on and also using for cover. OK, so far theres 2 autobot casualties but sadly the seige has only just begun... So into the afternoon the seige is full force, smokescreen then falls in battle (according to the storyboards) along with windcharger. As evening turns to nightfall, the decepticons are still attacking strong and this is when our friend trailbreaker takes the fall in the field. OH! I almost forgot...before nightfall hits, as devastator breaches the city wall, magnus drives tracks,red alert and sideswipe to prevent him from infiltrating any further into the city itself. While holding off devastator, red alert is shot down by scrapper (i think it was him) after devastator was forcefully disengaged by "Team Magnus". Sunstreaker and hound come in with prime and the dinobots, jazz and cliffjumper are on moon base 1 and bumblebee and spike are on moonbase 2... and blaster miraculously survives, and ummmmm... i think thats about it!

O yea guys!! Almost forgot....All of the other characters such as warpath, powerglide, maybe even beachcomber, and even possibly skids, were all at the ark as depicted in "Five faces of darknes Part 3" i wanna say?! When trypticon attacks the ark, most of these characters were there to try to stop it from being destroyed. Now this kinda confirms they were here during the attack because "five faces of darkness" only takes place right after the destruction of unicron.

Lboogierollout wrote:Ok guys, im gonna break this down for you so everybody understands who was killed during the autobot city seige. First off, let me remind everyone that this battle took place from the late morning/noonish hours of day #1, and continued uninterupted until the early morning of the next day (day #2). Ok here we go: So upon megatron hearing the autobots are planning a massive invasion of cybertron, from there "now" main base of operations on earth called autobot city and it was created sometime over the past 20 years being the decepticons claimed control of cybertron. Prowl, Ironhide, brawn and ratchet are the first of the autobot casualties. As the decepticons enters autobot city vicinity airspace (probably as far out as a mile from the city limits), hot rod sees that decepticons have obviously taken control of the shuttle and proceeds to begin attacking without hesitation... Thus causing the decepticons to suddenly 'scrap' their plan "A" of espionage via an autobot shuttle, and commencing a full scale assault. Now remember that there are autobots down in the canyons below with kup. Im sure its safe to say that this is when huffer is killed. Now the animation errors of sunstreaker and hound with kup are completely errors! Lets pretend they werent even drawn, instead it would naturally have to be sideswipe,smokescreen and bluestreak with kup. (Especially being that in the storyboards, sideswipe will be with tracks and red alert led by magnus, defending the inner hall corridor of autobot city against devastator just after hes ripped off the north wall). Ok... so, as megatron fires two shots at the mountain ridge, the other decepticons are already progressing toward the city. And during their progression toward the city gates, naturally they're flying over the valley were kup is with sideswipe,smokescreen and huffer. So kup most likely tells them to go back to the city for cover and hes gonna go help hot rod and daniel. Obviously during sideswipe,bluestreak and huffer's journey back to the city, huffer is killed, while the other two make it back to the city. Now lets fast-foward a bit shall we........ just about everyone from seasons 1 and 2 are present for the seige. Remember, all autobots were forced off of cybertron years ago, and the only place near cybertron any autobot could be is on two of its moons. But the moons are waaaaay to small for the entire autobot army to occupy. So naturally prime only kept a few up there for manufacturing and surveillance purposes, and of course to pilot shuttles back and forth to deliver weaponry to the city and take energon back to the 2 moons. So anyways, as sideswipe and bluestreak get back, they alert magnus that decepticons are probably less than a mile out from the city and theyre attacking and hot rod, kup, and daniel are still out there. Magnus sends perceptor on-top of the city to observe and confirm what sideswipe and/or bluestreak tells him., and that he will meet him at the designated point he, perceptor,arcee, blurr and springer do meet in the movie. Perceptor confirms and the rest is history for that. Now the only reason why magnus,arcee,springer and blurr are outside is because they are confirming whats happening..(As bombs are falling all around them might i add :/) EVERYBODY else is inside at their command posts as magnus has so ordered already. Thats why when hot rod and kup get back, (in the storyboards) magnus charges hot rod with a security violation!!! And if this scene would have been animated you would have seen the following autobots: sideswipe, bluestreak, wheeljack, smokescreen, grapple, trailbreaker, windcharger, tracks, red alert, inferno, and mirage! Because during the scene where magnus gives hot rod the violation, youll see all of these characters running around scrambling if you wish, in order to counter-attack. Now mirage is killed while shooting at bombshell, because megatron flies in just after mirage shoots bombshell, and he blows up the bridge mirage was standing on and also using for cover. OK, so far theres 2 autobot casualties but sadly the seige has only just begun... So into the afternoon the seige is full force, smokescreen then falls in battle (according to the storyboards) along with windcharger. As evening turns to nightfall, the decepticons are still attacking strong and this is when our friend trailbreaker takes the fall in the field. OH! I almost forgot...before nightfall hits, as devastator breaches the city wall, magnus drives tracks,red alert and sideswipe to prevent him from infiltrating any further into the city itself. While holding off devastator, red alert is shot down by scrapper (i think it was him) after devastator was forcefully disengaged by "Team Magnus". Sunstreaker and hound come in with prime and the dinobots, jazz and cliffjumper are on moon base 1 and bumblebee and spike are on moonbase 2... and blaster miraculously survives, and ummmmm... i think thats about it!

Boy you really like to fill in the gaps with non-canon materials.

"sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:
Boy you really like to fill in the gaps with non-canon materials.


Ya darn skippy brother, I always believed if your gonna spit somethin, then you spit it with complete thought and precision. If not, then whats the point!? Plus, im too much of a TF fan not to know this crap......

Lboogierollout wrote:"sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:
Boy you really like to fill in the gaps with non-canon materials.


Ya darn skippy brother, I always believed if your gonna spit somethin, then you spit it with complete thought and precision. If not, then whats the point!? Plus, im too much of a TF fan not to know this crap......

The problem with that thinking is that "Precision" implies the info is completely accurate and derived from a canon source..

And since most of the gaps you filled were filled with "NON CANON" martial its not worth much.
No insult intended.

No insult taken. But at the same time "irrelevance" is all that i get from your statement. Because the person asked what characters were present during the battle, and i provided an answer. I simply aided him by painting a complete picture based on what i have seen in storyboards that were supposed to be in the film but never made into the film. As far as your claim about me getting whatever is from a canon source..., again brother, irrelevance. Everybody gets something from somewhere, it all depends if you plagiarize and thats not what is occuring here. Ive gathered bits and peices from all different sources and put those thoughts and visions together and gave my man a vivid picture from my own ideas and findings. Mainly because theres so many animation errors in that movie that you see characters twice during the same time frame. And I for one had the same questions too about what characters were present but had nobody to help give a good description to understand, so I helped out as much as I could.

Lboogierollout wrote:No insult taken. But at the same time "irrelevance" is all that i get from your statement. Because the person asked what characters were present during the battle, and i provided an answer. I simply aided him by painting a complete picture based on what i have seen in storyboards that were supposed to be in the film but never made into the film. As far as your claim about me getting whatever is from a canon source..., again brother, irrelevance. Everybody gets something from somewhere, it all depends if you plagiarize and thats not what is occuring here. Ive gathered bits and peices from all different sources and put those thoughts and visions together and gave my man a vivid picture from my own ideas and findings. Mainly because theres so many animation errors in that movie that you see characters twice during the same time frame. And I for one had the same questions too about what characters were present but had nobody to help give a good description to understand, so I helped out as much as I could.

The inherent problem here is that the "complete picture" you provided is not accurate.

What you call "irrelevant" I call the facts.Useing the story boards and other sources is pretty much the same as "making it up" because, as far as the story goes....non of those event accrued.

See... I can tell already that your one of those people that just knows too much for their own good. Theres one of you in every chat forum across the web , second: I can also tell that you have waaay too much time on your hands to actually debate what you think is true and untrue in a cartoon to try to prove a dead point about "canon and non-canon" stuff. Third: I see that alot of people on here consider you a demi-god of this website which I think is funny all in itself. Keep in mind buddy, that this website is for FUN and for the enjoyment and socialization of people who enjoy Transformers, so do us and yourself a favor, Have fun, lighten-up, and Arcee is just a robot bro, you cant have her hand in marriage...... (And also, dont tell me whats true and untrue about the storyboards depictions existence within the saga, because if it wasnt for the time constraints for the movie needing to be finished up, then a majority of the boards would have been included in the film. ****, part of one is in the movie when prime stands up after raming thrust's head into the ground.... )

Lboogierollout wrote:See... I can tell all ready that your one of those people that just knows too much for their own good. I wasnt even talking to you in the first place, second: I can also tell that you have waaay too much time on your hands to actually debate what you think is true and untrue in a cartoon to try to prove a dead point about "canon and non-canon" stuff. Third: I see that alot of people on here consider you a demi-god of this website which I think is funny all in itself. Keep in mind buddy, that this website is for FUN and for the enjoyment and socialization of people who enjoy Transformers, so do us and yourself a favor, Have fun, lighten-up, and Arcee is just a robot bro, you cant have her hand in marriage...... (And also, dont tell me whats true and untrue about the storyboards depictions existence within the saga, because if it wasnt for the time constraints for the movie needing to be finished up, then a majority of the boards would have been included in the film. )

See....I can tell your the type of person that doesnt like to have his/her opinion challenged.Which is funny since you posted it in an open forum.So I dont care if you were talking to me directly or not.

Your comment was made in an open topic....which allows me to comment on it.

Secondly I see your also the type of person that "pre-judges" others.Its not my fault some people here value my input.....there are many that dont.And with out sounding rude to either group, I could care less.I have far to much going on in my life to worry about what you or others here think of me.

Third....I find any friendly debate to be fun...always have.Shame not everyone here is mature enough to check their egos at the door and debate the facts.

And also, I will tell you, and anyone. whats true and untrue about the storyboards depictions existence within the saga, because every film has a story board faze. And there are a mutitute of reasons why they sometimes get dropped from the finished product.

But what matters is that they were dropped....not the reasons behind it.

From memory -

Autobots -

Hot Rod
Kup
Blurr
Arcee
Springer
Ultra Magnus
Perceptor
Blaster
Grapple (animation model could be Inferno, who appears in the credits)
Inferno (rumored, see above)
Sideswipe (rumored)
Wheeljack
Windcharger
Snarl (using logic - he appears after the battle, but isn't present with the others on the shuttle)
Bluestreak (although the animation model seems to be of Prowl)
Hound
Huffer
Swoop (whoops-a-daisy)
Sunstreaker (whoops-a-daisy)

Including mistakes, minus doubles (Inferno), plus continuity errors, that's 18 Autobots.

Lboogierollout wrote:Third: I see that alot of people on here consider you a demi-god of this website which I think is funny all in itself.

I'd like to say something about this. Look, the reason many of us value his opinion is because of the constructive critisism and such that sto provides. I've never really read a post that he's made that didn't seem to make the big picture a little clearer. How can we learn without being taught? Just sayin'.

Praxus Prime wrote:

Lboogierollout wrote:Third: I see that alot of people on here consider you a demi-god of this website which I think is funny all in itself.

I'd like to say something about this. Look, the reason many of us value his opinion is because of the constructive critisism and such that sto provides. I've never really read a post that he's made that didn't seem to make the big picture a little clearer. How can we learn without being taught? Just sayin'.

Wow.

Thank you very much.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Praxus Prime wrote:

Lboogierollout wrote:Third: I see that alot of people on here consider you a demi-god of this website which I think is funny all in itself.

I'd like to say something about this. Look, the reason many of us value his opinion is because of the constructive critisism and such that sto provides. I've never really read a post that he's made that didn't seem to make the big picture a little clearer. How can we learn without being taught? Just sayin'.

Wow.

Thank you very much.

Heh, sure thing man