The Energon Pub

Ninjaburn wrote:No, I'm pretty sure we will still have tournies. They may be 'Autobot vs Predacon' or whathaveyou, but we still will. Besides, we haven't even had a big tourny in MONTHS.

I meant in the sense of the RDD/AWC tournies. The only tournaments we'll probably see now is the automated system tournament. As someone already said somewhere, all the recent tournaments were run by RDD members and kaijubot. However I can't see any players bothering to run a tournament after seeing the thanks they get for it.

crazyfists wrote:A subfaction is like maximals under autobots.

NO.

The Maximals might ally with the Autobots in v2 (for your sake I hope so), but we are not going to be your underlings.

Caelus wrote:

crazyfists wrote:A subfaction is like maximals under autobots.

NO.

The Maximals might ally with the Autobots in v2 (for your sake I hope so), but we are not going to be your underlings.

Damn straight!

You're going to be the underlings of the Decepticons. Now go and bake me a pie!

Renegade Scout 3 wrote: My clan's more than my friends. It's my family and I won't stand by and watch as anyone tries to destroy it.

That's right you tell them sister!

I'd like to think that a compromise can still be reached for the subfactions, but I won't hold my breath.

What really annoys me is announcements like this.

If [respecting enemy subfaction's privacy] proves too difficult for you, these forums can easily be removed and all discussion would be moved back to HMWGD for all to see.

Now there are more threats hovering above we player's heads. All it would need is a malicious double account to get rid of subfaction forums? Excuse me, but weren't we just promised subfaction forums? What happens when you do find out about a Bot making a Con account to spy, or vice versa? You get rid of the forums apparently. Would that not then force players to make their own forums, getting them banned in the process?
You admins are contradicting yourselves in the same breath.

Daneki wrote:What really annoys me is announcements like this.

If [respecting enemy subfaction's privacy] proves too difficult for you, these forums can easily be removed and all discussion would be moved back to HMWGD for all to see.

Now there are more threats hovering above we player's heads. All it would need is a malicious double account to get rid of subfaction forums? Excuse me, but weren't we just promised subfaction forums? What happens when you do find out about a Bot making a Con account to spy, or vice versa? You get rid of the forums apparently. Would that not then force players to make their own forums, getting them banned in the process?
You admins are contradicting yourselves in the same breath.

That's a slippery slope argument, starting with a very unshaky assumption. Sure, a duplicate account would cause a breach, but we will have better tools to detect them. If it's only an occasional duplicate account we can deal it. Forums can be removed if it's discovered that a large group of people who show disrespect for our wishes. It is our hope that there won't be many weak links, but we'll see what the future holds.

Mkall wrote:

Daneki wrote:What really annoys me is announcements like this.

If [respecting enemy subfaction's privacy] proves too difficult for you, these forums can easily be removed and all discussion would be moved back to HMWGD for all to see.

Now there are more threats hovering above we player's heads. All it would need is a malicious double account to get rid of subfaction forums? Excuse me, but weren't we just promised subfaction forums? What happens when you do find out about a Bot making a Con account to spy, or vice versa? You get rid of the forums apparently. Would that not then force players to make their own forums, getting them banned in the process?
You admins are contradicting yourselves in the same breath.

That's a slippery slope argument, starting with a very unshaky assumption. Sure, a duplicate account would cause a breach, but we will have better tools to detect them. If it's only an occasional duplicate account we can deal it. Forums can be removed if it's discovered that a large group of people who show disrespect for our wishes. It is our hope that there won't be many weak links, but we'll see what the future holds.

Define large. Will a dozen pissed off posters grouping together be disruptive enough? Because after all this controversy, I doubt it would be hard for someone to gather such a group.
Then there's the threat of forum removal, taking the easy way out instead of handing out the appropriate punishments. First it's banning offsite discussion because of supposed cheating, instead of banning the supposed cheaters. Now it's removing the future forums. Who knows where this will end?

I just can't stand the hypocrisy of this entire situation.
YOu guys say that offsite forums aren't neccessary because you will be providing an alternative, but if there isn't a guarantee of subfaction forums being there and STAYING there then this threat will be in poster's minds each time they log on - "I could discuss things here, but why bother when I don't know if it or the rest of the board will be here tomorrow?"

Know what's really silly about dis-allowing off-site forums?

Mech-G had no problem with it.

In fact, "clans" were an integral part of Mech-G. Each clan had their own forum on the Mech-G forums but considering how dodgy they were the majority of clans set up their own off-site forums.

Never once did the owner (yes, one guy owned it and programmed it) have a problem with that because he had a dedicated team of support staff who helped him handle any problems that arised.

During my time with the Fishes, they had set their forums up with a general discussion area, an area for Mech-G discussions, and a special area where members of OTHER clans could come and discuss potential alliances or wars.

It was all about having fun and making the Mech-G experience more enjoyable.

I know when it comes to HMW I assume the worst about people, but at least I don't go so far as to generalise an entire group of people as potential problems. Is it so hard to deal with problems as they come up or are the Mods just wanting to sit back and have a cup of tea and hope they never have to use their powers?

Don't listen to'em, OS. You made the right decision.

lkavadas wrote:Don't listen to'em, OS. You made the right decision.

So seeing people as expendible numbers and not real people who are being really hurt is the right decision?

It's not...it 's not at all. People are being affected in real life about this. We're being forced to give up something we love one way or the other. And we're didn't do anything wrong at all..we're being persecuted over paranoia and fear, every damned reason this world is going down the tubes.

WHAT DID WE DO THAT WAS SO WRONG?

ONE OF YOU COWARDS COME HERE AND TELL ME!!!

Have the balls to look the people you are persecuting right in the eye and tell us what truely justifies the pain your making us feel, the tears we shed, the heartbreak. Tell me what justifies such inhuman cruelty? or don't any of you have the balls to look us in the eyes as you cut us off?

Keep in mind my tags are off and as any one of you can see...the links to the RDD and DSA take you to dead pages. So I do not fall under the category of your targets. But I'll be damned if I don't get my answers. I deserve THAT much.

crazyfists wrote:i really dont feel like reading 7 pages, but the awc and rdd are not subfaction, they are clans. a subfaction is like maximals under autobots.

Actually subfactions of the Autobots would be Dinobots, Protectobots, Wreckers ect.




I guess part of the problem I'm haveing with understanding this situation is why people care so much. I mean if you want to have a site that you and your friends meet and talk about stuff without 15000+ people reading and posting then have a site. Why it HAS to be a HMW subfaction/clan site I don't know. If it has no HMW theme to it then OS/Ryan have NO right to mess with it. How much they have of a 3rd party site that happens to talk about it is another discussion.

I agree entirely with only haveing HMW stuff in the HMW forums. Siebertron has other forums for other stuff. So no Dr. Who threads in the Iacon forum. Sorry ,that's my opinion on the matter.

I also agree that because the new game will hopefully/supposedly have an actual strategic element to it (in which info about what the other side is doing will have a big affect on the game) some amount of effort should be done to control game info for the game to work. People will do it anyway but an attempt has to be made.

That being said I think OS (and whoever else was involved) took to big a step with the ban comment right off the bat. From what I have seen here and other places neither the AWC or the RDD leadership/core group were talked to about this, before the public stance was made. They could have been approached about intergrating existing group into the forums. It might not have worked but...

crazyfists wrote:i really dont feel like reading 7 pages, but the awc and rdd are not subfaction, they are clans. a subfaction is like maximals under autobots.

if anything no more clans are allowed. i hope discussion are underway about this though. however it comes down to seibs.

Errr Maximals are not a subfaction.

They are a faction, they replaced the Autobots.

Same with the Predacons, they replaced the Decepticons

Am I the only one who has noticed a 'Subfaction Forum' added to the page that has the HMW GD and Faction forum?

no noticed it to but..

nope you ain't but it's to talk and ONLY for surtan members not all of us.... btw. has anyone else noticed my thread has been deleted? (wth?)

Redimus wrote:Am I the only one who has noticed a 'Subfaction Forum' added to the page that has the HMW GD and Faction forum?

It's for OS and Ryan to talk to the Subfaction Leaders without having to have the conversation off-site via IM. The first round of talks is between them and EP, since he was the first to respond to OS's original request to negotiate.

lkavadas wrote:Don't listen to'em, OS. You made the right decision.

IK, everyone should be able to have their voice heard so long as they remain reasonable and respectful toward one another. This staff doesn't intend to stop listening to people when they disagree with us.

Of course that said I'll remind everyone of a common fallacy on this board - a lot of people think 'well if they listened to me they would agree with me'. However much you might want that to be true it isn't.

Dy, if you want answers I'd suggest you follow EP's example, but that's between you and the admins. All I can say otherwise is - have your wife take you out for ice cream. You won't necessarily feel better afterwards, but online melodrama makes a good excuse to eat fattening sugary foods.

Dynamax wrote:[Have the balls to look the people you are persecuting right in the eye and tell us what truely justifies the pain your making us feel, the tears we shed, the heartbreak. Tell me what justifies such inhuman cruelty? or don't any of you have the balls to look us in the eyes as you cut us off?

LOL, we're still talking about a handful of people who talk on the interwebbs with each other, right?

I don't think the subfactions did anything wrong. I just find them distracting and unncecessary. On top of that they drive traffic away from Seibs and I just don't think they have any place in V2. With the Risk style gameplay it'll pay off big time to have all faction communication centralized right here at any player's fingertips.

There just won't be room for a bunch of people who want to be part of an elitist clique when we'll need to engage in actual faction wide strategy which will need to be communicated to every single faction member. Subfaction stuff offsite just doesn't belong in this vision. Sorry.

Caelus wrote:

Redimus wrote:Am I the only one who has noticed a 'Subfaction Forum' added to the page that has the HMW GD and Faction forum?

It's for OS and Ryan to talk to the Subfaction Leaders without having to have the conversation off-site via IM. The first round of talks is between them and EP, since he was the first to respond to OS's original request to negotiate.

So basically it's only a discussion forum for a select group of individuals about a topic that affects the entire game?

Sorry, but this affects non-sub-faction members as well. I personally hate the thought of finding myself banned simply because I discussed HMW on another forum.

no offense to anyone but I think those convos will be one way

zorian wrote:

crazyfists wrote:i really dont feel like reading 7 pages, but the awc and rdd are not subfaction, they are clans. a subfaction is like maximals under autobots.

Actually subfactions of the Autobots would be Dinobots, Protectobots, Wreckers ect.




I guess part of the problem I'm haveing with understanding this situation is why people care so much. I mean if you want to have a site that you and your friends meet and talk about stuff without 15000+ people reading and posting then have a site. Why it HAS to be a HMW subfaction/clan site I don't know. If it has no HMW theme to it then OS/Ryan have NO right to mess with it. How much they have of a 3rd party site that happens to talk about it is another discussion.

I agree entirely with only haveing HMW stuff in the HMW forums. Siebertron has other forums for other stuff. So no Dr. Who threads in the Iacon forum. Sorry ,that's my opinion on the matter.

I also agree that because the new game will hopefully/supposedly have an actual strategic element to it (in which info about what the other side is doing will have a big affect on the game) some amount of effort should be done to control game info for the game to work. People will do it anyway but an attempt has to be made.

That being said I think OS (and whoever else was involved) took to big a step with the ban comment right off the bat. From what I have seen here and other places neither the AWC or the RDD leadership/core group were talked to about this, before the public stance was made. They could have been approached about intergrating existing group into the forums. It might not have worked but...

I wasn't talked to about it. i found out from a third party and confronted Mkall on the weekend. Os finally got to me today.

Burn wrote:

Caelus wrote:

Redimus wrote:Am I the only one who has noticed a 'Subfaction Forum' added to the page that has the HMW GD and Faction forum?

It's for OS and Ryan to talk to the Subfaction Leaders without having to have the conversation off-site via IM. The first round of talks is between them and EP, since he was the first to respond to OS's original request to negotiate.

So basically it's only a discussion forum for a select group of individuals about a topic that affects the entire game?

I don't think the negotiations are so much a 'convince us to repeal this ruling' as they are a 'help us satisfy the needs of the subfactions here' thing. So, in this one particular situation, it isn't about you Burn.

Burn wrote:

Caelus wrote:

Redimus wrote:Am I the only one who has noticed a 'Subfaction Forum' added to the page that has the HMW GD and Faction forum?

It's for OS and Ryan to talk to the Subfaction Leaders without having to have the conversation off-site via IM. The first round of talks is between them and EP, since he was the first to respond to OS's original request to negotiate.

So basically it's only a discussion forum for a select group of individuals about a topic that affects the entire game?

Sorry, but this affects non-sub-faction members as well. I personally hate the thought of finding myself banned simply because I discussed HMW on another forum.

You're just saying that in hopes of getting access!

Dynamax wrote:I wasn't talked to about it. i found out from a third party and confronted Mkall on the weekend. Os finally got to me today.

Last Thursday, in a statement that your wife read, Omega Sentinel wrote:
If the leadership or active members of these subfaction groups wish to continue playing the game after the reset then I am more than open to meeting with them in order to accomodate reasonable needs on the official site.
Other than that these rules are final.

That same statement was then repeated in this forum yesterday morning.

Doesn't mean you haven't been slighted Dy, I just wanted to suggest that the gaff was unintentional rather than personal. OS probably assumed that you already knew and would contact him when you were ready, rather than vice versa.

Caelus wrote:I don't think the negotiations are so much a 'convince us to repeal this ruling' as they are a 'help us satisfy the needs of the subfactions here' thing. So, in this one particular situation, it isn't about you Burn.

I know you're trying to lighten the situation here but wasn't one of the issues "sub-factions expect to be treated differently, that's not going to happen", but now they are?

And how much consultation is needed? Didn't this discussion happen months ago about helping to accommodate the sub-factions return to Seibertron.com?

Didn't it end with "oh well, no big problem at the moment, leave things as they are and see how things work" and then suddenly this.

And I realise this isn't about me Caelus, but i've seen a number of other non-sub-faction members posting in this thread that find this to be completely and utterly deplorable. Are we now being told that our opinions simply don't matter?

-edit-

Actually consider this. One one side you've got the sub-faction members, on the other side you've got the powers that be. Wouldn't it make sense to have a third opinion that could help both groups come to a compromise?

Fender Bender wrote:You're just saying that in hopes of getting access!

No i'm just saying it so I can get clarification that people will be banned for chatting elsewhere, at which point i'll point the powers that be in YOUR direction and get you removed once and for all.

Caelus wrote:

Burn wrote:

Caelus wrote:

Redimus wrote:Am I the only one who has noticed a 'Subfaction Forum' added to the page that has the HMW GD and Faction forum?

It's for OS and Ryan to talk to the Subfaction Leaders without having to have the conversation off-site via IM. The first round of talks is between them and EP, since he was the first to respond to OS's original request to negotiate.

So basically it's only a discussion forum for a select group of individuals about a topic that affects the entire game?

I don't think the negotiations are so much a 'convince us to repeal this ruling' as they are a 'help us satisfy the needs of the subfactions here' thing. So, in this one particular situation, it isn't about you Burn.

Didnt you know, everything's about Burn! He's the center of the known universe!