The Energon Pub

Hello all, delurking since the hay-day of A.T.T. I feel compelled to voice my opinion on the matter, looking to get a response from some of the folks that have maybe gone through the same.

First off, I'd like to point out, I frakkin' _HATE_ TF: Armada. IMO, there are too few redeeming qualities to that line, with the aesthetics and posability going the way of the Dodo. In retrospect, I think the only reason I got these figs was b/c I was going through my (thankfully last) completist phase, and b/c, well, they were there?

Now, fast forward a few years. You know the story, you meet a girl, get hitched, and now we have two wonderful kids to introduce to TF lore, one shelf at a time.

Folks, I _really_ hate to admit it, but; Armada's kinda neat now. Setting aside for a moment the expectations we as fans have for Hasbro, as the bar gets continuously raised by Takara, and remembering that these are, after all, primarilly toys. For kids. Said kids are now demanding that whole "attention" thing from me, so I decided to unbox some of the potential ebay stuff that was collecting cobwebs in the basement.

I'm glad I didn't sell these or give them away. To think that I would have been depriving my little dude of quality TF time. I mean, isn't that what it's all about? I, for one, went
through childhood with a red-chrome G1 beetle (cliffjumper?) under my pillow. A couple of days ago, guess what I found when I was making my son's bed? That's right. I damnear cried. ManTears, ahem!

Sure, Armada was 35 lbs. of brick with a questionable powerlink gimmick and 17 ways to say "WTF?" But then again, wasn't G1 a cavalcade of diecast brickness and a dozen repaints with COMB (Car-On-My-Back) Syndrome? Not to shatter anyone's childhood; quite the contrary. We turned out okay, and now mini-me is having the time of HIS life with Brick-mada. So much so, that when he asks me to transform them for him, I've spent what seems like hours trying out the different combinations and getting them all to actually
look...interesting?

The problem with Armada isn't that it was it was (just) poorly designed, it's that it was poorly showcased. The packaging and some of the "official" images leave much to the imagination. HOWEVER, if we throw out the instructions and just let the inner (or outer) kid twist them every which way, the results are actually not that bad.

I'm to the point where I might actually do a fanfic off the combined 'bots characters. I might even post pictures of the 'reimagined' Armada poses I've got them in.

This leaves me to wonder, how many of us who have seen the lines up to now, have experienced this? Is it nostalgia? SandBox Envy perhaps? What do you think, and do you have any attic-box stories of your own?

-Kronatron

I've been a fan of Armada since day one. I can't really say I strongly 'hate' any Transformers series, it's just I'm more or less devoted to one single Universe and that's where I collect from.

I love Armada.

Alow me to repost a short article I wrote on the matter two years ago:

Armada.

The title alone brings with it a tide of discontent, disappointment, and overall dislike. Arguing for the high points in this line is like playing Devil’s Advocate. Childish, lacking articulation, and gimmick heavy, Armada is the whipping boy of modern Transformers lines. I have to admit, after being taken in by RiD, I was certainly taken back by Armada. Many of my early purchases of this line were actually due to boredom or just to buy something ‘fun’ (I was working a miserable, exhausting job as nighttime security for my University…). Needless to say, my first take on the toys, like many people who see them today for the first time, was not necessarily positive.

Interestingly enough, the line started to sell really well. Not only that, but there was a lot of hype and excitement around the series, much like Animated is causing today. There were people who were unhappy with this new series, but for the most part, those folks were able to get by on the new and exciting reissue G1 toys that were appearing from Takara. Hard to believe in a way, but Armada got less popular with collectors as time went by, where as most series toys seem to see a slow but steady gain in popularity.

Why take another look at this series? Do we really dislike these toys to the degree that popular opinion would suggest? I don’t think so... We all know the bad, I’m going to review some things which might just change your mind, well, that or have to justify to your girlfriend and/or wife why you are spending $40 on a Mini-con.

I’ll start with the big guy. There is one figure from Armada that almost every generation of collectors will find a way, excuse, or reason to include in their collection: Unicron. If you weren’t collecting when the news of this toy broke, I’m not sure if you can understand what a big deal this was. Not only was this one of the more important characters in the Transformers mythos come to life, but it was the return of truly massive Transformers. There had not been a genuinely Supreme sized figure since G1 (Supreme Cheetor does not friggen count.). There were a fair number of fans who were literally escorted out of Wal-Mart for routing through pallets after midnight and opening cases without permission.

Now Unicron wasn’t technically G1 accurate, but he was as close as most people needed to fill that role. First, but certainly not last in a line of planet formers, Armada Unicron remains a figure piece in most collections. Huge, accurate to the Armada show, and containing vast amounts of articulation, features, and detail, Unicron is probably the best toy in the line. What else is there in the Armada line? Micromasters, Target Masters, Head Masters, the remnants of Transtech, Starscream-Thundercracker-&-Skywarp, and more G1 homages that only truly 1337 fans will notice than you can shake a Star Saber at.

Masters!
Of the micro/target/head/power kind!, otherwise known as Mini-Cons. Everyone in Armada got one. Unfortunately, something was lost in the translation of the story and key elements were left out which would explain away one of the major problems fans have with the concept: “Why do Transformers need Mini-Cons to activate weapons etc, that are already in their bodies? Did they not know they had a gun in their chest?”

Here’s the part that was lost somewhere in the sea of translation: When a Mini-con first links to a larger Transformer, the link causes a small scale reformatting. The first link-up actually does change the Transformer and after that they are free to use the weaponry as they like. See, the other story-driven aspect of Mini-Cons which isn’t so well known is that they were intended to be tools of Unicron which would give Transformers big, destructive power and cause strife among the race. Unicron is a jerk hunh?

Now that you know all the powerlink stuff has some rhyme and reason behind it, take another look at what Mini-Cons actually do for the toy line: They make everyone into a potential “Master” character. Your favorite character is a sharpshooter? Hook him up with the Emergency team; they turn into guns. Instant Targetmaster! Want to replicate MicroMaster Base goodness? Take Optimus Prime’s trailer and put a squad of Mini-Cons with it. That’s the point of the trailer after all. Mini-Cons serve a wide variety of uses ranging from aesthetic, to functional, to story based, but they always allow you to customize your figures and accessories. You do want to accessorize don’t you?
G1-ishness
One thing that I always try to remind people of when they look at the Armada series in a critical manner is that the comparisons to G1 are readily evident. We have blocky, yet robust designs that are willing to focus on play value over movement. While this might mean that your Armada toys aren’t going to be kicking high all that often, they are going to be lots of fun for kids and are going to display well on the shelf of a collector.

Oh the homage! (like, Oh the carnage!, but happier)
I like pointing out that Leader Class Optimus Prime from Armada is not much more than an updated Star Convoy. After winning this discussion time and again, I like to follow up by pointing out that Jetfire is just an updated Galaxy Shuttle. These two are the most interesting in my opinion, but there are plenty of others about. Some of those lost Transtech designs even made their way into Armada. Megatron and Scavenger are both directly descended from those concept drawings.

All the rest…
Notice anything which particularly stands out? Likely not; Armada is a series of toys which expresses itself in an almost schizophrenic number of ways. Good and bad, large and small, blocky and slick, it’s all there. It becomes easy to find something to like about the toys and just as easy to find something you don’t.

Armada displays aspects of all the best Transformers lines, lacking only in consistent articulation. Sure, toy technology is better now and many of these toys could possibly be better done today. Still, I enjoy the toys as Transformers in spite of these flaws. For every Sideswipe, Hotshot, and Smokescreen failure, there is a Tidal Wave, Megatron, or Overload slice of awesome.

Of course, Energon would look to fix many of the issues we take with Armada, but it would be a long time before we see the variety and scope of toys that Armada introduced to hoards of fans.

http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/ ... rs-/12562/

Smokescreen is not a failure.. I love his big, massive missile firing thing. So much playability, and it comes with a real string!

(Yeah I think I just set myself up for a 'that's what she said' quote from kirbenvost.

Blurrz wrote:Smokescreen is not a failure.. I love his big, massive missile firing thing. So much playability, and it comes with a real string!

His hands man, his hands! The tragedy!

Why you gotta make me shout at you? You know we both love Armada...

Edit: Also, it's awesome when ole' att members show up.

O.k I admit, Armada did have some really strange design decisions, that led to poor figures, but come on there are lots of awesome figures in the line too.

Bendy Prime is awesome and is poseable.

Base Electronic Prime.: They trailer transforms by itself!!! Yes its large and kills all articulation for Super Prime but come one that feature alone is totally worth it.

The Seekers where really cool. Had cool gimmicks. All they needed was a swivel hip joint to move the legs out form the body for extra poseabilty.

O.k so there where some hiccups, like Sideswipe which sacrificed everything about his robot mode for all the gimmicks. And Hot Shot with his but actvated over head axle cannon But those where really the minority.

Armada was and is totally cool. What other line had the audacity to give us Unicron.
And a nicely articulated one at that.

Armada is really fun for younger kids. I'd know, I was eight-ish when the toys came out. When I got Armada Hotshot, he was the most fun I had had with a toy in a long time. I played with him every night for the longest time. My family was having money problems at that time, and I never got a lot from Armada however. I'd stare at the included ads for hours thinking about how much I'd like Red Alert, or how cool Megatron or Unicron were.

Years later I'd grow to feel how crappy Hotshot was, and would slightly forget the toy. I felt the Energon version was superior and never cared to look back. Then, more recently I get out my old Hotshot and realize that he was indeed a fine toy, not because he was intended for some older person like myself, but because he was a great toy for kids. He can be transformed with a single hand, and had a sturdy design. His gimmick was fun too, and seemed powerful to me, when I was small anyway.

Armada toys are great, especially for kids. It was really fulfilling to me when I finally got movie Inferno, who shared the same mold as Red Alert.

<chuckles at responses> That's exactly my point. For all the nasty that armada was, there are the 'quirks' that I see now that make it good. Kinda. I still loathe it, but in a good way. It's like the line I love to hate. Minus Unicron. He is the bringer of chaos and death and destruction and other unpleasant things.

Wait, that's it! Oh, lightning has struck my brain! Armada is all Unicron's doing. Hoards sent to us as heralds of distraction through gimmicky charm, only to be awed into submission with the Supreme EggBot himself. And now that legacy has been passed to the new generation, for a whole new era of consumerist confusion.

Seriously, though. It's like Armada was a rite of passage for TF Lore. That odd pre-adolescent period where nothing makes sense, but if you get through it, there'll be an important lesson to be learned. Somewhere.

I just don't feel the same hesitation when it comes to other lines. Universe & 2.0 rocked! There will always be a soft spot in my spark for BW (and let's face it, even BM if only for the vehicons). Some of the movie stuff is not too shabbay, either. Armada though. Somehow they're always first on my list for when I have to make more space on the ol' shelf.

-Kronatron

Blurrz wrote:Smokescreen is not a failure.. I love his big, massive missile firing thing. So much playability, and it comes with a real string!

(Yeah I think I just set myself up for a 'that's what she said' quote from kirbenvost.

Aww, now you just ruined it for me.

Well, I gotta say, I kinda do hate Armada. Out of all the generations I collect, it's the least represented. (Still ain't no gol'dern munkeys in my collection, boy! Or neon!) But even then, there are the few redeeming gems. I have the Nemesis 'Bendy' Prime. The Cybertron Blurr which is an Armada remold. Energon Ultra Magnus, another Armada Recolor, is on my 'to-buy' list. And for those who love tiny TFs, its minicons are a treasure-trove. Thankfully, I'm not one of them, because I don't have the time or patience to be hunting down hordes of miniature bricks. Also I...kinda want Unicron, even though I decided long ago I wouldn't be getting him... Even the seekers are not so bad.

I definitely see the appeal of Armada. Most of it's just not for me. I can stand bricks if they're good-looking, but the only bricks I want through my window are ones as sexy as God Ginrai and Star Convoy.

You guys justify Armada however you see fit. I actually enjoyed a small portion of the figures. I also have some weird love for yellow Powerlinx Jolt that I cannot begin to explain. However, having recently finished watching Armada cartoon in its entirety....CP you're wrong! It doesn't get better at all. It makes me sleepy and when it doesn't I want to put sharp things in my ears, if only to stop hearing the dialogue. You lied to me!! Back to the figures though, I do wish I had Takaras version of Jetfire and Tidal Wave. I wanted them then, I simply couldn't afford them.

Sounds like you guys needs some more tissues

Looks like I'm the only one who still isn't impressed by them. I was fairly unaware of Transformers between BW and Classics because I didn't really have TV in that period, or any spare money. I had a friend who had a bunch of Energon figures (Prime, Galvatron, a few microscopic combiners) but they didn't impress me in the slightest because it seemed transformers toys had not improved since the 80s. Lack of improvement in articulation is what stopped me collecting before G1 ended. When I watched Armada a couple of years ago I wasn't impressed by the story or script (every time Prime and Megatron meet in the first 8 or so episodes all they do is hold hands and smack talk) and when a new character appeared I'd look him up in the galleries and my reactions varied from laughing out loud to open mouthed horror.

I'm not saying this to rock the boat or stir up arguments - it's good that you like/love Armada cos it brings you pleasure, it's also good that I don't like it as it saves me money!

I think Armada had a lot of real highs (Unicron, Starscream, Tidal Wave) but much of the rest of the line was pretty blah. I don't regret buying any of the figures I bought, but I dodn't regret not getting any of the ones I missed (except maybe Airrazor.)

Mykltron wrote:I had a friend who had a bunch of Energon figures (Prime, Galvatron, a few microscopic combiners) but they didn't impress me in the slightest because it seemed transformers toys had not improved since the 80s. Lack of improvement in articulation is what stopped me collecting before G1 ended.

I think there are two camps of people on this.

There's one group of people to whom articulation relates only to the number of joints that the figure can pose with.

There's another group of people to whom articulation is just another word for "playability". To this group, articulation can mean posable joints, features, and most importantly, vehicle mode features.

I'm of the second camp.

While posing a figure in breakdancing and precarious balance situations is fun, I really don't have time or interest in posing my toys. I want a well sculpted display piece with lots of "features". Those features can be numerous joints or some amazing gimmick like Armada Optimus Prime's transforming base/trailer. Perhaps I have too many figures, but for me the thing has to do something really cool beyond having 25 points of articulation.

I love Armada, its my favorite series besides Animated, and Bay's movies. It was the second TF series that I saw. I actually found out about G1 from looking for an Armada DVD in Blockbuster, then I came across the G1 movie. Good times. And when i found out that they were making a movie, i thought it was Armada. But after I watched the first episode of Energon, I said "screw it" and never watched (or liked) Transformers again...until the 07 movie. But yeah, Armada was the beginning of my TF fandom...Besides when i was 3 I got some Beast wars toy that transformed into a wierd yellow shark with red fins...IO still remember it. BTW, does any one know what that one is called? In robot mode, the robot's head is in the shark's mouth.

SlyTF1 wrote:I love Armada, its my favorite series besides Animated, and Bay's movies. It was the second TF series that I saw. I actually found out about G1 from looking for an Armada DVD in Blockbuster, then I came across the G1 movie. Good times. And when i found out that they were making a movie, i thought it was Armada. But after I watched the first episode of Energon, I said "screw it" and never watched (or liked) Transformers again...until the 07 movie. But yeah, Armada was the beginning of my TF fandom...Besides when i was 3 I got some Beast wars toy that transformed into a wierd yellow shark with red fins...IO still remember it. BTW, does any one know what that one is called? In robot mode, the robot's head is in the shark's mouth.

2 figures come to mind:

Poison Bite. He was a Mutant beast. no real robot mode, just a robot head, and 2 beast modes. Scorpion and Barracuda (not quite a shark)
http://www.tfu.info/2000/Mutant/PoisonB ... onbite.htm

or

Injector: Fuzor. half Lionfish (not shark either) and half hornet. Head was inside his Lionfish mouth
I'm betting its this one.

http://www.tfu.info/1998/Predacon/Injector/injector.htm

Counterpunch wrote:

Mykltron wrote:I had a friend who had a bunch of Energon figures (Prime, Galvatron, a few microscopic combiners) but they didn't impress me in the slightest because it seemed transformers toys had not improved since the 80s. Lack of improvement in articulation is what stopped me collecting before G1 ended.

I think there are two camps of people on this.

There's one group of people to whom articulation relates only to the number of joints that the figure can pose with.

There's another group of people to whom articulation is just another word for "playability". To this group, articulation can mean posable joints, features, and most importantly, vehicle mode features.

I'm of the second camp.

That there is an argument on language! Articulation, according to dictionaries, relates to joints. Playability can include articulation and electronic gimmicks and various other things. So I accept your stance that Armada may have great playability but certainly not articulation.

Definitions aside, we have totally different tastes in what we think of as a great display piece. I too want good display pieces but for me a wall full of figures standing to attention is not very interesting, although it looks tidy! Displaying figures in dynamic poses looks great but can look messy so my idea of a great display is a tidy display of attention-standers with some dynamic poses amongst them. Of course I want all of my figures to have the ability to enliven the display at some point (except my G1 case, obviously).

As neither of us is forced to look at each others displays every day we don't need to worry about upsetting each other so we can all be happy with what we have!

While posing a figure in breakdancing and precarious balance situations is fun, I really don't have time or interest in posing my toys. I want a well sculpted display piece with lots of "features". Those features can be numerous joints or some amazing gimmick like Armada Optimus Prime's transforming base/trailer. Perhaps I have too many figures, but for me the thing has to do something really cool beyond having 25 points of articulation.[/quote]

Check out the pics @ TFU.INFO, I love that site b/c it's a great reference for all your TF needs.

http://tfu.info/series/armada.htm

Some of those powerlinkings make me cringe in the way Bandai wants you to believe their version of TFs is 'awesomer'. Looking at Armada sometimes, I'd be inclined to agree.

My satisfaction comes not only from the initial gratification of transforming a new bot for the first time, but also from revelling in all the technical work that went into each figure. That's why I don't have a problem dishing out for anything from FansProject. Shadow Commander was my first buy from them (If you move the clicky-gear from Nemesis Prime's elbow to the other one, he can hold up his BFG just fine), and I've been pre-ordering all their newer stuff loyally. That kind of obsession to a figure's integrity goes a long way in my book, and I don't get that feeling with Armada.

Don't get me wrong, I love Unicron and a select few others from the line, but I just feel a little jipped when I take a look at the whole spectrum. I'm hoping Armada-2.0 (Power Core) can do a better job of it. From the toyfair pics it looks like the sub line has potential, but I'll hold my criticisms until I've got the figures in-hand.

I've also noticed that if you powerlink 2 of the same characters together, the result can be interesting. I tried it w/ 2 downshifts (shoulda been named whelljack, whatever) and it holds up nicely. Anyone got pics of this with other bots?

-Kronatron

I've also noticed that if you powerlink 2 of the same characters together, the result can be interesting. I tried it w/ 2 downshifts (shoulda been named whelljack, whatever) and it holds up nicely. Anyone got pics of this with other bots?

Not to sound too stuck up, or nitpicky, but Downshift belongs to the Energon Line not Armada. Different Powerlinking concept.
And he was Wheeljack in the Japanese version: Superlink

Aw, slag. I stand corrected. But I am correct in thinking that these were a trilogy, right? I never saw any of the shows, and I keep forgetting which came first, Energon or Armada. I know for certain Cybertron came last, with the planet keys. I actually really enjoyed that line.

I am coming from the same place as you Kronatron. Married almost 5 years now and got twin 3 year old boys. This Christmas they got their first big boy transformers. Though there everywhere they still love them. I just honestly can't wait until they get older so I can start to pass my ebay fodder on to them as well.

Kronatron wrote:Aw, slag. I stand corrected. But I am correct in thinking that these were a trilogy, right? I never saw any of the shows, and I keep forgetting which came first, Energon or Armada. I know for certain Cybertron came last, with the planet keys. I actually really enjoyed that line.

Armada, Energon, Cybertron. Easy to remember

To me, Armada is more like a fresh start of the Transformers brand, a reformat of some sort. The articulation and transformations was thought to be "too much" if RiD is any indication (I'm looking at you, Side Burn), so much was replaced by actual gimmicks for "added playability". I agree that the designs were a hit and a miss, but it did set the bar for Energon and Cybertron, and other future lines. Sometimes you just have to think back to grow again, right?

All in all, Armada was a pretty decent toyline. It took some great ideas from G1 (Microns, Target Masters, Headmasters, etc) and found a unique way to update and combine them with the standard transforming figure. Personally I think the line started off strong but eventually petered out. The one thing that I noticed were the gimmicks on the larger figure got weaker as the line progressed. First release figs like Demolishor, Optimus Prime, Megatron, and Cyclonus had great interactivity with the Minicons while figures like Thrust, Sideswipe, and even bendy Prime had frivolous gimmicks that were difficult to use and ultimately failed. My thinking on this was the designers didn't want to reuse any of the special abilities so they tried to give each figure a unique one. Near the end, they ran out of good ideas and thus the later figs became sub par. I do feel that Cybertron made up for this as most of the line was flip out/pop up guns/weaponry when activated with a cyber key.

As for the lack of articulation on most of the figures, I am aware that during the planning and design stage, articulation is sacrificed to help keep the figure in a specific price range. I'm sure the addition of a smaller transformable figure included in the package in a way justified this. I'm sure if the larger figures had more articulated joints instead of the included Minicon, there would be a bunch of fan boys who'd hate the line because Hasbro should have included the Minicon and sacrificed articulation of the larger figure.

Was the line the best? Not really. Was it the most detailed and aesthetically pleasing? Nope. But it did have a brilliant concept of interaction and playability.