The Energon Pub

[Kurona]

Also, better Afterburner

Scattershot ruins it tbh

Well I was going with non subjective things that the takara set didnt give you. I wasnt going with better or worse since those are always subjective. For example, Afterburner. I fail to see how Habsro's is better since it isnt accurate to anything. That green comes out of nowhere and is really odd. At least Takara's is faithful to one source and its cool how the shade of red on the motorbike is different from the rest of the red on Computron, giving it both uniformity and still a sense of something different and seperate. Plus it has 2 awesome new guns that are perfect for him.

Accuracy doesn't always mean better - just compare CW Drag Strip to UW Drag Strip. Drag Strip strives for a more cartoon-accurate colour scheme; and if that's your thing, cool. For the rest of us, it's extremely bland and boring in every mode.
For Afterburner's case, I find Takara's a little boring as well - just stark white and red. Hasbro's is much warmer and just nicer to look at. The green windshield I feel works very well in a strange thematic sense; Computron was originally devised as 'futuristic' in the 80s - and if you look at what the 80s thought was futuristic, it's pretty hilarious. It tends to be an exaggerated and ridiculous blend of what no-one would ever make due to it's enormous impracticality, and being derived from what primitive technology was around at the time.
Which, for instance... included green LCD screens. That's why I love Afterburner's green hoodshield; it reminds me of old green LCD screens which is the sort of weird technological era the Technobots come from and are all about.
I probably could have saved you a lot of time if I just said 'green lcd screen'.

[william-james88]

But you dont get those nice guns

[D-Maximal_Primal]

Plus, ya know, GIANT DRILL!

[Kurona]

That's true... but honestly, if I were to go with any, I'd go with UW Computron so I'd get those guns anyway.
I'd just also like CW Computron for his Afterburner, Hands, Feet and Scrounge. And maybe using their Nosecone for a leg.

[D-Maximal_Primal]

That's true... but honestly, if I were to go with any, I'd go with UW Computron so I'd get those guns anyway.
I'd just also like CW Computron for his Afterburner, Hands, Feet and Scrounge. And maybe using their Nosecone for a leg.

All personal preferences. If I could, I would get the Hasbro version and love that Strafe and Scrounge and Afterburner and I could get it for much cheaper. But I really hate Hasbro Nosecone and Lightspeed and Scattershot's Torso modes are very disappointing to me, so I will spend the extra this time for something that looks more unique and, to me, is much better, enough so to justify buying it

[Kurona]

That's true... but honestly, if I were to go with any, I'd go with UW Computron so I'd get those guns anyway.
I'd just also like CW Computron for his Afterburner, Hands, Feet and Scrounge. And maybe using their Nosecone for a leg.

All personal preferences. If I could, I would get the Hasbro version and love that Strafe and Scrounge and Afterburner and I could get it for much cheaper. But I really hate Hasbro Nosecone and Lightspeed and Scattershot's Torso modes are very disappointing to me, so I will spend the extra this time for something that looks more unique and, to me, is much better, enough so to justify buying it

Yeah, I honestly feel Scattershot is the weak link here. I think everyone can agree that Afterburner and Strafe are fine in both versions; and after that it's just Lightspeed and Nosecone - who in Hasbro, function just fine as legs.
It's that goddamn torso that makes it not work.

[D-Maximal_Primal]

That's true... but honestly, if I were to go with any, I'd go with UW Computron so I'd get those guns anyway.
I'd just also like CW Computron for his Afterburner, Hands, Feet and Scrounge. And maybe using their Nosecone for a leg.

All personal preferences. If I could, I would get the Hasbro version and love that Strafe and Scrounge and Afterburner and I could get it for much cheaper. But I really hate Hasbro Nosecone and Lightspeed and Scattershot's Torso modes are very disappointing to me, so I will spend the extra this time for something that looks more unique and, to me, is much better, enough so to justify buying it

Yeah, I honestly feel Scattershot is the weak link here. I think everyone can agree that Afterburner and Strafe are fine in both versions; and after that it's just Lightspeed and Nosecone - who in Hasbro, function just fine as legs.
It's that goddamn torso that makes it not work.

It really is. I was content to get the Hasbro version, but when I saw that Takara had remolded the chest on both robot and torso mode and had made a new combiner head, the was the last straw there. They went there and made Computron different from Superion in combined form, and that was what I really wanted. Lightspeed, Nosecone, and the new guns were all extras, though Nosecone uses my favorite mold and hasbro nosecone uses my least favorite, so that was a heavy hitting part of the decision too. But the torso was the big thing

[Kurona]

That's true... but honestly, if I were to go with any, I'd go with UW Computron so I'd get those guns anyway.
I'd just also like CW Computron for his Afterburner, Hands, Feet and Scrounge. And maybe using their Nosecone for a leg.

All personal preferences. If I could, I would get the Hasbro version and love that Strafe and Scrounge and Afterburner and I could get it for much cheaper. But I really hate Hasbro Nosecone and Lightspeed and Scattershot's Torso modes are very disappointing to me, so I will spend the extra this time for something that looks more unique and, to me, is much better, enough so to justify buying it

Yeah, I honestly feel Scattershot is the weak link here. I think everyone can agree that Afterburner and Strafe are fine in both versions; and after that it's just Lightspeed and Nosecone - who in Hasbro, function just fine as legs.
It's that goddamn torso that makes it not work.

It really is. I was content to get the Hasbro version, but when I saw that Takara had remolded the chest on both robot and torso mode and had made a new combiner head, the was the last straw there. They went there and made Computron different from Superion in combined form, and that was what I really wanted. Lightspeed, Nosecone, and the new guns were all extras, though Nosecone uses my favorite mold and hasbro nosecone uses my least favorite, so that was a heavy hitting part of the decision too. But the torso was the big thing

It's a choice that really confuses me on Hasbro's part, honestly. Not because Cyclonus was retooled enormously so - but that's also a good point - but because they did do a lot of retooling on Scattershot.
... for his vehicle mode.
I mean... okay, it's not as if the vehicle mode doesn't matter, but it's Combiner Wars. Isn't that Combined mode the most important part? I can take a Scattershot that transforms into a Concord. I mean, it'd annoy me, but considerably less so than a Scattershot that's just a Superion repaint.

[william-james88]

It really is. I was content to get the Hasbro version, but when I saw that Takara had remolded the chest on both robot and torso mode and had made a new combiner head, the was the last straw there. They went there and made Computron different from Superion in combined form, and that was what I really wanted. Lightspeed, Nosecone, and the new guns were all extras, though Nosecone uses my favorite mold and hasbro nosecone uses my least favorite, so that was a heavy hitting part of the decision too. But the torso was the big thing

That is exactly how I felt. I just want to look at my combiners all built up and see them being distinct one from the next. Thats all about the torso and head. Everything else that Takara did was just gravy (but oh so excellent gravy).

[D-Maximal_Primal]

I mean... okay, it's not as if the vehicle mode doesn't matter, but it's Combiner Wars. Isn't that Combined mode the most important part? I can take a Scattershot that transforms into a Concord. I mean, it'd annoy me, but considerably less so than a Scattershot that's just a Superion repaint.

I agree. Of all the things the most important part is how it looks as a torso since that is how it most likely will be used. And to that extent UW Computron does its job like a boss. The head is gorgeous on him too. and like Will said, everything else is very delicious gravy (Nosecone!)

[Kurona]

Now see I get what you're saying
But
>Nosecone's drill not being the best part

[Sabrblade]

I know I've posted this before but the current discussion warrants its re-posting.

Hasbro basically stated at BotCon this year that they don't prioritize G1-accuracy (or accuracy to any past media) above all else. Here's a transcript of the answer they gave to a fan asking about the differences between Hasbro and Takara Computron during the Q&A session of the Hasbro Brand Panel:

Q: What goes into the decision-making process of things like for the figures’ prime character still having a Superion head versus a few months later Takara comes out with a Generation 1-accurate Computron head?

John Warden: That’s a good question. A complicated question.

Ben Montano: Yeah, I don’t think it’s something we can get into the full details here, it’s something we definitely know and acknowledge for you guys it can be confusing, but it’s a decision we make on, a lot of it is timing-based, what we kinda wanna get on the market certain things and in our stories. And some of it may have to do with what we’re doing outside of toys and video games, you know, stuff that’s influencing and impacting how we approach our characters and our stories, so we often have an eye to the future that the things we introduce here we expect to see that kind of evolution of that character and that look in other spaces. So, a lot of what you see here is an homage to the past, but as John and Eddie have talked about, a lot of what we’re doing too is an eye towards the future of bringing new fans in and kind of giving us a chance to tell a new story versus kinda being chained to only the old stories. Hopefully you guys all see that big part of the new Machinima Combiner Wars story is there’s a lot of story that’s untold, a lot of gray area, a lot of gaps in our continuity, and that’s part of what we see the opportunity to do with the toys. Like, let’s fill in some gaps, let’s do some cool things that kind of open up the freedom whether it’s a comic or animation just to introduce something new.

As for Takara's adherence to media-accuracy, there's also a cultural factor at play. As seen above, Hasbro seems to be looking more towards the future and moving things forward with not as strong a regard for the past as TakaraTomy, who instead resides in a culture that has a much stronger reverence and respect for the past than the culture that Hasbro resides in.

Hasbro's mindset seems to be more about making their products look "good" instead of "bad", even if it doesn't look accurate to any preexisting media of the past. Whereas Takara's mindset seems to be more about making their products look "right" instead of "wrong", even if that ever results in a bland/under-detailed look that favors the use of solid coloring and ignores sculpted detail instead a colorful/detailed look that uses less solid coloring and makes use of said detail.

For better or for worse, Hasbro goes for what looks "cool" to them , while Takara goes for what looks "correct" to them.

[Hellscream9999]

I know I've posted this before but the current discussion warrants its re-posting.

Hasbro basically stated at BotCon this year that they don't prioritize G1-accuracy (or accuracy to any past media) above all else. Here's a transcript of the answer they gave to a fan asking about the differences between Hasbro and Takara Computron during the Q&A session of the Hasbro Brand Panel:

Q: What goes into the decision-making process of things like for the figures’ prime character still having a Superion head versus a few months later Takara comes out with a Generation 1-accurate Computron head?

John Warden: That’s a good question. A complicated question.

Ben Montano: Yeah, I don’t think it’s something we can get into the full details here, it’s something we definitely know and acknowledge for you guys it can be confusing, but it’s a decision we make on, a lot of it is timing-based, what we kinda wanna get on the market certain things and in our stories. And some of it may have to do with what we’re doing outside of toys and video games, you know, stuff that’s influencing and impacting how we approach our characters and our stories, so we often have an eye to the future that the things we introduce here we expect to see that kind of evolution of that character and that look in other spaces. So, a lot of what you see here is an homage to the past, but as John and Eddie have talked about, a lot of what we’re doing too is an eye towards the future of bringing new fans in and kind of giving us a chance to tell a new story versus kinda being chained to only the old stories. Hopefully you guys all see that big part of the new Machinima Combiner Wars story is there’s a lot of story that’s untold, a lot of gray area, a lot of gaps in our continuity, and that’s part of what we see the opportunity to do with the toys. Like, let’s fill in some gaps, let’s do some cool things that kind of open up the freedom whether it’s a comic or animation just to introduce something new.

As for Takara's adherence to media-accuracy, there's also a cultural factor at play. As seen above, Hasbro seems to be looking more towards the future and moving things forward with not as strong a regard for the past as TakaraTomy, who instead resides in a culture that has a much stronger reverence and respect for the past than the culture that Hasbro resides in.

Hasbro's mindset seems to be more about making their products look "good" instead of "bad", even if it doesn't look accurate to any preexisting media of the past. Whereas Takara's mindset seems to be more about making their products look "right" instead of "wrong", even if that ever results in a bland/under-detailed look that favors the use of solid coloring and ignores sculpted detail instead a colorful/detailed look that uses less solid coloring and makes use of said detail.

For better or for worse, Hasbro goes for what looks "cool" to them , while Takara goes for what looks "correct" to them.

I honestly don't care what they're excuse is, it doesn't justify painting superion's head red and trying to pass it off as someone new - especially on the heels of 'betatron' and since so many people already have superion himself; maybe they should've just given the combiner a new head

[Kurona]

I really don't take that excuse at all.
Making something new and looking to the future rather than prioritizing accuracy, to me, is something like updating Drag Strip's design to be more unique and standout; or doing something really awesome and out of the blue like Sky Reign. These are both excellent, amazing things we wouldn't have gotten if Hasbro had stayed completely stick-in-the-mud G1-adherent.
It does not mean they have an excuse for making Computron a Superion recolour. If anything, that's even less looking to the future than being accurate to 1987.

[Sabrblade]

I honestly don't care what they're excuse is, it doesn't justify painting superion's head red and trying to pass it off as someone new - especially on the heels of 'betatron' and since so many people already have superion himself; maybe they should've just given the combiner a new head

To be fair, the original G1 Computron head looked a lot like Superion's head at first glance anyway:

[D-Maximal_Primal]

I am with Kurona and Scream here. I really don't care what the excuse is; sometimes, you just use to justify laziness and profit. Dragstrip's new paint job, Rook, Sky Lynx/Reign, Cyclonus/Galvatronus. Those are awesome new things that are actually legit attempts to make something new and cool from an older character/design. Computron is just sad. A new head would have made a world of difference on the torso, Nosecone and Lightspeed. Hasbro Computron comes more as an afterthought and not something that they actually tried on. Strafe is really the only character there that looks like they did really try, and that is truly disappointing.

That is not looking to the future unless you count looking to the future as seeing how little retooling you do before people stop becoming interested

[Sabrblade]

The mindset I wrote applies to all of Hasbro's current Generations releases, not just Computron.

Tis how we got Alpha Bravo, Offroad, Rook, jet Blast Off, combiner torso Sky Lynx, Ultra Prime/Optimus Maximus, Galvatronus, Headmaster versions of 1986-1988 non-Headmaster characters, Cassette characters as triple-changer media devices, etc.

[D-Maximal_Primal]

But you're missing our main point: several of those are working and they have worked great. The problem is that they made Computron so damn lazy. Computron, to me at least, is a flop on Hasbro's part. After nailing retooling with the likes of Rook/Swinde, Streetwise/Dead End, Offroad/First Aid, they went with repaints for Computron, the last vehicle mode combiner from the American version of the G1 cartoon, and they are repaints that don't even make sense and are outright lazy. You cannot tell me Brawl's head works in any capacity for Nosecone. Heck, Superion was given a mouthplate and his current look in the comics is with that mouthplate. And it works and he looks good. It also helps separate him from Computron's head, but instead the go and make them exactly the same for really no reason.

[Sabrblade]

As lazy as people chide Hasbro's Computron for being, if Hasbro really wanted to be completely lazy with it, why bother making the new hands and feet? Or Scrounge? Or retooling Strafe at all instead of making a straight redeco of Air Raid? Or the drill on the Brawl mold? Or retooling Groove into Afterurner instead of just redecoing Groove? Or even using the Deluxe Groove mold over the Legends class Groove mold? Or even giving us an actual attempt at Computron at all instead of just selling the retail Betatron as our Computron?

If Takara hadn't done their Computicon people might be singing a different tune about Hasbro's Computron. But even then, Hasbro's could have been far worse than it ended up being.

[Agamemnon]

Or we might not have Computron at all...

[Edit] And I forgot the best news, UW Bruticus will process at BBTS within 10 days.

[D-Maximal_Primal]

But if they went that far, why not go those tiny little extra steps? a combined mode head and 2 individual heads would have made for a world of difference. If it meant that the hasbro version had standard hands and feet instead of the special ones just to accommodate the retooled heads, it would have been a far different story for me.

But come on, a straight up torso repaint is still sad and that is the main part and component of the toy, seeing as it is a combiner. How would we have felt if Hasbro gave us a Defensor head and chest plate for Bruticus? It's the same mold, we did some retooling, you got 2 repainted limbs, a retool and a new mold and a cool little legends dude. what's the big deal if Bruticus has a Defensor head and the exact same chest?

[Kurona]

Actually, if Takara Computicon didn't come out... I'd still have complaints. It's really annoying having a combiner who doesn't have a standout identity from another.
If Hasbro Computron was all there was, I'm sorry, but I'd see Perfect Effect's Head/Chest set just as necessary - if not more necessary - for him than Perfect Effect's Hands/Feet kits for every other combiner. It just does not look distinct.
Believe me, I'm happy for all the extra stuff Hasbro was able to do for Computron. I'm loving the look of the hands and feet, I'm loving Scrounge, and I'm loving Strafe. But that doesn't mean he doesn't still have major problems or that I can overlook them because "OH LOOK AT ALL THIS OTHER COOL STUFF". Just because it could have been a lot worse doesn't mean there's no criticism to be applied at all. It could've been a lot better. More than every other combiner could have been a lot better.

[Autobot N]

Honestly, I don't see anything bad about the Hasbro Computron (of course, it's probably because I'm and optimistic young 'un who will snap up pretty much anything that comes my way) except for Nosecone. I'll list the reasons for each figure here (disclaimer: opinions ahead)

Scattershot: Can't really argue, the Takara one is a lot better. Not bad, but not great. Vehicle deco is nice, though.

Strafe: It uses the Air Raid mold (one of my favorites from the whole line), and has a heavy amount of retooling from the base mold. Only thing I don't like is the non-folding back wings.

Afterburner: Same as Takara besides the paint scheme, and I much prefer Hasbro's.

Lightspeed: I absolutely despise the Breakdown mold, and hope to never get another version of it. Compare it to the SW mold, one of, if not my favorite of the whole line. Plus, I like it that the white breaks up all the red. The bow tie lightbar is inexcusable, though.

Nosecone: Same as Scattershot, Takara blows it out of the water. Only thing I like is that the kneecap doesn't stick out as much as Takaracone.

Scrounge: No explanation needed.

Also, hands and feet.

So, with 4 preferred members, plus hands and feet, vs 2, Hasbro wins.

[D-Maximal_Primal]

Actually, if Takara Computicon didn't come out... I'd still have complaints. It's really annoying having a combiner who doesn't have a standout identity from another.
If Hasbro Computron was all there was, I'm sorry, but I'd see Perfect Effect's Head/Chest set just as necessary - if not more necessary - for him than Perfect Effect's Hands/Feet kits for every other combiner. It just does not look distinct.
Believe me, I'm happy for all the extra stuff Hasbro was able to do for Computron. I'm loving the look of the hands and feet, I'm loving Scrounge, and I'm loving Strafe. But that doesn't mean he doesn't still have major problems or that I can overlook them because "OH LOOK AT ALL THIS OTHER COOL STUFF". Just because it could have been a lot worse doesn't mean there's no criticism to be applied at all. It could've been a lot better. More than every other combiner could have been a lot better.

Very much along my thought lines as well. Takara Computron is looking to be the best combiner they release, and Hasbro really could have had that similar opportunity. They just dropped the ball on some areas, and those some areas overshadow the good parts that have been mentioned to me

[william-james88]

If Takara hadn't done their Computicon people might be singing a different tune about Hasbro's Computron. But even then, Hasbro's could have been far worse than it ended up being.

I have personally been singing this tune regarding Hasbro's since October 2015. I even said in another quote that if Hasbro's computron was gonna be full of cheap repaints and made using the brawl mold and no new combienr head, then I would rather not get it.

The drill part would need better molding to make Nosecone though. The one the club is doing wouldn't be fully satisfactory considering the drill is small.

He needs a nice meaty drill to widen all those crevices and enter with pride! How's he gonna excavate any cave to satisfaction with the tiny thing the club gave him?

It wasnt until I saw what Takara was up to that I was actually happy at the idea of Computron being part of Combiner Wars.
However, you are right Sabr, it could have been worse. Hasbro's earlier idea for Computron was far worse. I am not at liberty to post it here (nor do I have that photo), but I did see a preliminary layout of this combiner and Strafe was just a redeco'd air raid. It was really sad.