The Energon Pub

So here's the thing, I love bots! We all do, but I fall into the category of the kind of collector who acquire these beauties with the soul purpose of playing with and exercising my imagination(and sometimes just to stare at because they're that damn cool), but oh my goodness the prices! I know most of you vets here have done careful budgeting and planning to gain the nice third party figures you have, but what is it that compels you fine lads and lasses to make that initial plunge for the price. It's always fun to see what makes other fans tick.

-this is what has my internal metronome off a beat right now.
Xovergen TF-01 149.99
Make Toys type(61) 355.95
Fans Project (not)Menasor ???
Fans Project Headmasters ??? (I'll be foolish and speculate 50-80usd)
Fans Project Shadow Commander 130.00-140.00
All Dr.Wu TP-05 variants

(1200.00usd or higher hasbro again missed out on)

I don't know if I understand what you mean. What compels us to spend so much $$$ on a third party product? Or how much we HAVE spent on them? (which I choose to put a mental block on after it's done)

for the most part i try to avoid thirs party figures. though i did get prime, magnus and nemesis's trailers. they just felt like they needed them. took alot of debateing before i finnally did buy them.

Naturally I can't speak for everyone, but it's this very question that can eventually lead someone to stop collecting. I have also been troubled by this question as well, but as a friend tried to explain to me recently... "Sometimes it's all in chasing that dragon."

Take from those words what you will, but to me it made things a little clearer. I'm chasing that Collector Dragon to enjoy the ride and watch my collection fill out piece by piece. Sometimes, the price is hard to swallow, other times so much so that you have to pass and wait a few years and come across a better deal on ebay.

The biggest excuses for buying up 3rd figures though is simply the quality of the product which Hasbro just can't compete with in most cases and the variety of characters that Hasbro just flat out refuses to touch up on at times. For example... I seriously... -SERIOUSLY- doubt Hasbro will ever give the fans an updated set of Throttlebots. They're still on the drawing boards trying to figure out how to crossbreed Bumblebee with Pikachu, Rambo, Superman, and Jesus to care that some of the fans would be thrilled to have a new Rollbar or Searchlight figure. That makes it easier to swallow the 50-60 dollar drop.

Another nice bit with 3rds is they generally take longer to put out figures. Gives the wallet some time for the pain to dull. Though, this year 3rds are pushing on the gas a little...

You need to be fairly rich to afford all these great 3rd party products coming out these days. I'm being very choosey and really considering what will actually keep me amused long term. A head swap won't. That 3rd party Rollar looked great but I finally decided he wouldn't please me long term and I really think I made the right choice, although I thought he looked great at the time.

I think combiners are something that Hasbro will never do a good job on so it's worth buying those. I also think complete sets like Insecticons are something Hasbro are unlikely to do (remember the DotM Wreckers?) so I feel my FP nonInsecticons were a good choice.

I'm pleased to see the different 3rd party companies and how much they actually try to please us long-time collectors. So far, I've bought Fansproject Protector and both FWI products, but I have gotten rid of Protector since, I lost total interest. I liked the add-ons for the robot mode of Rodimus, but I hated having the leftover kibble of the trailer. I'm looking forward to FWI-3, and I wish I could afford MakeToys Giant as well. Looks amazing, as does Hercules. Hasbro is missing out on all this great opportunity. Yeah, Transformers is only a small part of their production, and collectors are an even smaller part of that. But still, if they add up all the money all the collectors have spent on all the 3rd party stuff, I'm sure its a considerable number. Maybe the Hasbro marketing and engineering departments just aren't that creative?

Hasbro has some good reasons for not doing certain characters. They have a whole TV show and video game they want to promote and higher profile characters fans want (like Wheeljack was before he was done) and it's pretty understandable that they do what they do to me. Plus, there's just no pleasing EEVRYBODY. Hasbro's done a lot and I think we ought to be grateful for what we do get from them.

That said, it's awesome 3rd party companies exist for the really niche stuff collectors want. Still, there's no denying the price. And I hate to say it, but there's stuff coming out that I don't really want; that I'm sure other people are just dying for. I don't care to own any of the throttlebots, save for the Belzeboss upgraded BB I already own. I don't really care for Headmasters, although I may pick up just one. Hearts of Steel, although cool is also not my thing. I don't care about the Insecticon repaints or any of the repainted armors like Shadow Scyther. But I'm not bashing any of these products, they just aren't for me.

One thing that does sometimes give me pause is the idea of future value. It's questionable that even the official stuff will appreciate, so what of the 3rd party stuff? Is it all just money down the drain? Can we say that about ALL the stuff we buy, official or not? I guess this veers the thread into the other made here, but it ties together in my mind.

Gauntlet101010 wrote:we ought to be grateful for what we do get from them.

I can't go along with that. When it comes to fan service, Hasbro breaks even at best, but that's rare. And once again, I completely understand what a small percentage us collectors are of their consumers. Hasbro is a toy company that makes toys for kids. Period. But it's not an excuse or a reason they can't set up a small department to maybe throw a bone our way once in a while. After all, today's kids usually become tomorrow's collectors.

Rodimus Prime wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:we ought to be grateful for what we do get from them.

I can't go along with that. When it comes to fan service, Hasbro breaks even at best, but that's rare. And once again, I completely understand what a small percentage us collectors are of their consumers. Hasbro is a toy company that makes toys for kids. Period. But it's not an excuse or a reason they can't set up a small department to maybe throw a bone our way once in a while. After all, today's kids usually become tomorrow's collectors.

Throw us a bone one in a while ... like TFCC? Or Botcon? Like the various classics lines? Like the Masterpieces? Like the constant homages in current TF media? Or more than that?

Well I’m in my mid-30’s, so for me it’ all about the G1 cartoon. I wouldn’t mind having the entire cast, as well as other selected characters from other continuities that could mesh well in a classics display as Cybertronian characters that lived during the golden era. I spend more money than I should on these figures, but I guess it keeps me from wasting money in strip clubs or building another custom lowrider since I been there, done that. I do not see any monetary value in this hobby. If I wanted to make money I would be buying stocks, not toys. If I ever was forced to sell my collection on e-bay, I might break even on the more expensive stuff from Botcon and 3rd parties, but I will no doubt take a huge hit on Hasbro products. It’s all good with me because I’m having fun. Back on the topic of third parties, (and high quality KO’s) I feel they are put here for a reason so lets enjoy them. Hasbro has made it perfectly clear that Bayformers, TF Prime, and WFC/FOC are the future of the brand. With that being said, I think it’s time they let G1 go and focus on their cash cow. I’m not saying Hasbro should stop making occasional G1 “classics” homages. What Im saying is that Hasbro needs to stop bullying 3rd party companies for giving new life to characters Hasbro buried in the Transformers crypt. It’s like a 90 year old Rosa Parks trying to sue Outkast for making a song using her name. In my opinion, when something that is non-tangible such as a name or image reaches a certain age, it becomes community property. That’s how I feel about G1 characters. I say that because Hasbro likes to lock their characters in a vault for decades and expect people to respect that. The perfect example is Bumblebee. He wasn’t s**t until 2007 when Michael Bay decided that little boys need a special character they can relate to. Bumblebee did not have a homage throughout the entire Unicron Trilogy unlike many other G1 characters that their images and/or names were re-incarnated. On the other hand, if you go to a Disney or Warner Bros. store, there’s no shortage of products that pay homage to any brand character, old or new. Maybe I would feel different about the ethics of third party products if Hasbro provided fans with a store that carried virtually every character we could want. But I guess comparing Hasbro to Disney is like comparing apples to oranges. With that being said I’m all for the exploitation of forgotten Transformers characters by 3rd party entities. So wheres my classics Blitzwing ? C’mon guys, lets GIT-R-DUN !!!

Gauntlet101010 wrote:Throw us a bone one in a while ... like TFCC? Or Botcon? Like the various classics lines? Like the Masterpieces? Like the constant homages in current TF media? Or more than that?

All the things you listed are good examples. But BotCon and TFCC has been a clusterf**k lately (seems like they got some problems solved with the new pieces, but really there's no need for the obscene amount of repaints, instead introduce new figures). And if they were doing such a great job, there would be no need for 3rd party companies, and they would go out of business. And that is not the case.

Rodimus Prime wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:Throw us a bone one in a while ... like TFCC? Or Botcon? Like the various classics lines? Like the Masterpieces? Like the constant homages in current TF media? Or more than that?

All the things you listed are good examples. But BotCon and TFCC has been a clusterf**k lately (seems like they got some problems solved with the new pieces, but really there's no need for the obscene amount of repaints, instead introduce new figures). And if they were doing such a great job, there would be no need for 3rd party companies, and they would go out of business. And that is not the case.

I didn't say they were perfect, but I am saying we should be grateful for what we do get from them. Because, like you said, their target market is kids. They don't have to give us ANYTHING. Not a thing.

Sometimes I think the fandom needs to step back and look in appreciation for what we get. Both from official sources AND the third party market. Glass half full, man.

Gauntlet101010 wrote:Because, like you said, their target market is kids. They don't have to give us ANYTHING. Not a thing.

You're right... they don't "have" to pay any attention to the fans that got them where they are today... but they SHOULD. I don't see why they couldn't do something for the adult collectors, something similar to the subscription service Mattel is doing for MOTU. It might not be a major money-maker... but it'd definitely be profitable at least and would make the fans incredibly happy.

Ah well... I'm perfectly happy following and collecting what FansProject and Maketoys are doing (my only 3rd-party ventures so-far). I think they're doing it better than Hasbro could anyway.

So, what does TFCC do then?

Mekatron wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:Because, like you said, their target market is kids. They don't have to give us ANYTHING. Not a thing.

You're right... they don't "have" to pay any attention to the fans that got them where they are today... but they SHOULD. I don't see why they couldn't do something for the adult collectors, something similar to the subscription service Mattel is doing for MOTU. It might not be a major money-maker... but it'd definitely be profitable at least and would make the fans incredibly happy.

Make the fans happy? Man, the fans are NEVER happy. And that's kind of my point.

This isn't me saying Hasbro's perfect, but I am saying that people are really overly negative in this forum.

daimchoc wrote:So, what does TFCC do then?

Excessively overpriced and ridiculous-looking repaints? Nothing interesting, that I've seen so far.

Mekatron wrote:

daimchoc wrote:So, what does TFCC do then?

Excessively overpriced and ridiculous-looking repaints? Nothing interesting, that I've seen so far.

Again, you just can't make the fans happy.

You can please some of the people some of the time, but not all of the people all of the time.

Edit: I've derailed this topic with my annoying optimism, so I'll put it back on track a bit.

You get what you pay for. I got The RotF Bruticus set on sale for $40. I was pretty pleased with it for that price all on it's own. I got Herc for over $500 and I love it. Of course spending big bucks on something is way more likely to gain a favorable view from me.

Gauntlet101010 wrote:Make the fans happy? Man, the fans are NEVER happy. And that's kind of my point.

This isn't me saying Hasbro's perfect, but I am saying that people are really overly negative in this forum.

There's always going to be haters of course... but it's pretty obvious that a huge percentage of Transformers fans like myself have little or nothing "official" that's worth spending money on. Classics line was really nice for the first few waves, not sure what happened after that... all their good designers must've quit when forced to create movie toys.

For the record, I'm a very happy fan... my only complaint is that my money isn't going to the people that actually own this franchise because they're no longer in touch with what I like. Luckily, 3P's are on the scene. If not for them, I'd have no interest in Transformers at all anymore.

Mekatron wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:Make the fans happy? Man, the fans are NEVER happy. And that's kind of my point.

This isn't me saying Hasbro's perfect, but I am saying that people are really overly negative in this forum.

There's always going to be haters of course... but it's pretty obvious that a huge percentage of Transformers fans like myself have little or nothing "official" that's worth spending money on. Classics line was really nice for the first few waves, not sure what happened after that... all their good designers must've quit when forced to create movie toys.

For the record, I'm a very happy fan... my only complaint is that my money isn't going to the people that actually own this franchise because they're no longer in touch with what I like. Luckily, 3P's are on the scene. If not for them, I'd have no interest in Transformers at all anymore.

I'm more in agreement with your post here than your previous ones. With Prime commanding the franchise's attention the 3rd party has mine. Although I do like most of what I see from Hasbro in regards to the Gen line.

First off I just want to say thank you so much to ALL the awesome fans that took the time so far to give me some insight and perceptions on the topic. I think at the end of the day I just have to realize I'm 21 and don't make a 6 figure income at this point in my life lol, I just need to buy what is gonna warm that little spot in my heart and plan out the purchases just like most of you fine fans do.

p.s. but I can say this......thank you hasbro for giving me the characters to fall in love with, and thank you 3rd parties for dressing them up or giving them there just representation when hasbro.

p.s.s- shout out to my classics style fans! I love my bots to be blocky!!!!!

Gauntlet101010 wrote: Glass half full, man.

Apparently yours is, with Hasbro Kool Aid.

No, they aren't perfect. That's precisely why I don't feel the need to praise them for every little thing they get right. That's like giving the losing team of a sports contest a trophy, just a smaller one. Why? They don't deserve it. No, they don't have to give us anything. But if they do, and they beat their chests for it, they should at least knock it out of the park. I give it to them, MP-10 is impressive, and they're now getting the scale right with the new pieces. MPs 1 through 9 are alright, but why so many damn repaints? Ran out of ideas? There are certainly plenty of characters to go around. BotCon is a positive experience, but not thoroughly. And TFCC has had quite a few problems as well as laughable management. I give it to them, between the exclusive figure and the discount on BotCon tickets, the price is worth it. But other than that, what do we get for belonging to this "club?"

I do commend Hasbro for what they have brought us. But by no means is it the be-all end-all of fan service. All I say is that I disagree with those who think we should kiss their ass for what they do bring us. The fact that most of us buy their products is proof of our general approval. But as customers, we have the right to criticize. You can like Hasbro if you want, I have no problem with that. But don't belittle those of us who don't.

3rd party products aren't perfect either AND they're far more expensive. Every single 3rd party product has it's share of flaws and detractors. How can you lift up the third party market as a whole, with all of it's flawed products, and putdown Hasbro despite it's successes? That's just illogical.

Not praising Hasbro because they aren't perfect? Hell, man. Nobody's perfect.

I don't see how I'm belittling you. If you're getting this angry we should just agree to disagree. We're pretty far off topic anyway.

I'm in the same camp as Rated X. This is pure nostalgia for me, and not for future selling value.

I kind of started collecting these late so basically am limiting myself to the characters I remember and like the most to not go crazy with spending as I might be prone too, and that is essentially the season 1 G1 cast.

I'm not proud, but my collection started off with the KO seekers and a KO City Commander.

I love the look of 3 party figures an dI get the characters I want, but I got to say even the best quality ones still aren't as durable as the new hasbro figures coming out these days. Its tough to try to break an official hasbro toy release.

by Rated X » Mon Oct 01, 2012 11:07 am

Motto: ""Assumption is the mother of all screw ups.""
Weapon: Saw-Edged Pincer
Well I’m in my mid-30’s, so for me it’ all about the G1 cartoon. I wouldn’t mind having the entire cast, as well as other selected characters from other continuities that could mesh well in a classics display as Cybertronian characters that lived during the golden era. I spend more money than I should on these figures, but I guess it keeps me from wasting money in strip clubs or building another custom lowrider since I been there, done that. I do not see any monetary value in this hobby. If I wanted to make money I would be buying stocks, not toys.

Why does everyone think they'll get rich buying stocks? Buy REITs!! that's where its at

Well, there's soemthing satisfying in buying soemthing that'll appreaciate even a small bit over time.

And then there's the feeling you get when you buy stuff that'll just be worthless.

I mean ... of course I buy bonds and mutual funds, but ... you know.