The Energon Pub

-Kanrabat- wrote:G1 Fortmax's city mode: YES!
The Spaceship mode? No. Just no.

You're entitled to your opinion, even if I vehemently disagree.

Might as well call all TR Leaders "triple changers".

If they have 3 modes, sure.

Rodimus Prime wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:Might as well call all TR Leaders "triple changers".

If they have 3 modes, sure.

Hasbro does at the very least, as pointed out earlier. Then again their definition of "Triplechanger" has been a broad one, starting with Scorponok in 1987:

Decent list, I agree with your #1 for sure, but the rest, nah.

For me at least, Cityformers have a good mode and then a weak mode. Every single one has done it.

And I don't own energon Shockwave, but I'm really not sure what to think when looking at it.

My own list would go:

#5 - TR Titan Master Shuffler
#4 - TR Titan Master Ptero
#3 - TR voyager Alpha Trion
#2 - TR voyager Octone
#1 - T30 voyager Springer

How Titan Masters count as triple changers?

-Kanrabat- wrote:How Titan Masters count as triple changers?

Beast/vehicle mode, beast/vehicle that's piloted mode, weapon mode. If we are gonna count cityformers, titan masters should count too

D-Maximus_Prime wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:How Titan Masters count as triple changers?

Beast/vehicle mode, beast/vehicle that's piloted mode, weapon mode. If we are gonna count cityformers, titan masters should count too

While I of course agree that anything can count as long as we explain it, I do understand the distinction between what Hasbro has labelled as official triplechangers and what it has not.

Base mode bots, at least G1 Scorponok and the TR leaders have been officially labeled as triple changers, while the Titan Masters are not. Maybe that is what Kanrabat is referring to.

Personally, I think Shuffler is a great pick, much better than most TR voyagers (when considering what you are getting for the price).

william-james88 wrote:

D-Maximus_Prime wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:How Titan Masters count as triple changers?

Beast/vehicle mode, beast/vehicle that's piloted mode, weapon mode. If we are gonna count cityformers, titan masters should count too

While I of course agree that anything can count as long as we explain it, I do understand the distinction between what Hasbro has labelled as official triplechangers and what it has not.

Base mode bots, at least G1 Scorponok and the TR leaders have been officially labeled as triple changers, while the Titan Masters are not. Maybe that is what Kanrabat is referring to.

Personally, I think Shuffler is a great pick, much better than most TR voyagers (when considering what you are getting for the price).

Then again, there are toys that have been officially labelled having three modes, but they do not, such as ROTF Megatron (NOTE: - I am SURE I saw a sticker or mention of this on the Voyager box but I cannot find evidence of it online. It might have been in Simon Furman's TF guidebook, though, or in promotional material? It's listed at TFwiki as a triple changer, though).

Plus, Hasbro hasn't been consistent.

"In Transformers fiction, the term "Triple Changer" refers almost exclusively to these two subgroups, which are the only such characters ever shown as cohesive teams. However, other official sources such as toy packaging, catalogs, Hasbro spokespersons, and commercials have applied the term "Triple Changer" rather haphazardly to many other characters from various continuities. Further muddying the waters, a few characters with three distinct modes have never been labeled as Triple Changers in toys or fiction, even in cases where it would really make sense to do so."

(Source: -http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Triple_Changer )

D-Maximus_Prime wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:How Titan Masters count as triple changers?

Beast/vehicle mode, beast/vehicle that's piloted mode, weapon mode.

And head mode making four modes, not three. Officially the Hasbro reps referred to them as having four modes: Robot, Headmaster, Powermaster, and Targetmaster, hence them being renamed Titan Masters, but those last two modes require the partner vehicle which I consider a huge gray area. I don't like the idea of combining with something else counting as an alt mode because then you'd have to count every combiner member as a Triplechanger as well. The TM's Powermaster mode is one thing (however unconvincing on its own), but the Targetmaster mode definitely requires the vehicle.

Emerje

Emerje wrote:

D-Maximus_Prime wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:How Titan Masters count as triple changers?

Beast/vehicle mode, beast/vehicle that's piloted mode, weapon mode.

And head mode making four modes, not three. Officially the Hasbro reps referred to them as having four modes: Robot, Headmaster, Powermaster, and Targetmaster, hence them being renamed Titan Masters, but those last two modes require the partner vehicle which I consider a huge gray area. I don't like the idea of combining with something else counting as an alt mode because then you'd have to count every combiner member as a Triplechanger as well. The TM's Powermaster mode is one thing (however unconvincing on its own), but the Targetmaster mode definitely requires the vehicle.

Emerje

The plot thickens and I get it. Like how Lione can only have a lion mode if you add the titan master to complete the lion's mane. Hence this class not being as straight forward a triplechanger as, say, the TR leaders.

Emerje wrote:

D-Maximus_Prime wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:How Titan Masters count as triple changers?

Beast/vehicle mode, beast/vehicle that's piloted mode, weapon mode.

And head mode making four modes, not three. Officially the Hasbro reps referred to them as having four modes: Robot, Headmaster, Powermaster, and Targetmaster, hence them being renamed Titan Masters, but those last two modes require the partner vehicle which I consider a huge gray area. I don't like the idea of combining with something else counting as an alt mode because then you'd have to count every combiner member as a Triplechanger as well. The TM's Powermaster mode is one thing (however unconvincing on its own), but the Targetmaster mode definitely requires the vehicle.

Emerje

That depends. For example, the same toys in Japan are listed as drones, and are not always linked to a Headmaster. Thus, they can be considered teller changers, where the Headmaster "rides" the drone in two configurations.

primalxconvoy wrote:

Emerje wrote:

D-Maximus_Prime wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:How Titan Masters count as triple changers?

Beast/vehicle mode, beast/vehicle that's piloted mode, weapon mode.

And head mode making four modes, not three. Officially the Hasbro reps referred to them as having four modes: Robot, Headmaster, Powermaster, and Targetmaster, hence them being renamed Titan Masters, but those last two modes require the partner vehicle which I consider a huge gray area. I don't like the idea of combining with something else counting as an alt mode because then you'd have to count every combiner member as a Triplechanger as well. The TM's Powermaster mode is one thing (however unconvincing on its own), but the Targetmaster mode definitely requires the vehicle.

Emerje

That depends. For example, the same toys in Japan are listed as drones, and are not always linked to a Headmaster. Thus, they can be considered teller changers, where the Headmaster "rides" the drone in two configurations.

OK, but the original post referred directly to the TR Titan Masters. And That makes the drone the Triplechanger, not the Titan Master. Hasbro treats the vehicles as an accessory to a TM, not a figure on its own. I feel like non-sentient vehicles don't belong in this list, they'd be better off in a different list along side Action Master weapon partners and Beast Machines Deployers.

BTW, don't the G1 combiner torsos count as Triplechangers since they have an included base mode?

Emerje

Emerje wrote:BTW, don't the G1 combiner torsos count as Triplechangers since they have an included base mode?

Emerje

Since we're getting technical here:

All: Robot, Vehicle, Torso; at least 3 modes
Silverbolt, Motormaster, Onslaught: Ramp Mode for Metroplex
Hot Spot: Repair Mode for Metroplex, Carrier Mode for any limb bot

Scattershot: Cannon Mode
Hun-Gurrr: aborted Base Mose that serves no purpose

Emerje wrote:

primalxconvoy wrote:

Emerje wrote:

D-Maximus_Prime wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:How Titan Masters count as triple changers?

Beast/vehicle mode, beast/vehicle that's piloted mode, weapon mode.

And head mode making four modes, not three. Officially the Hasbro reps referred to them as having four modes: Robot, Headmaster, Powermaster, and Targetmaster, hence them being renamed Titan Masters, but those last two modes require the partner vehicle which I consider a huge gray area. I don't like the idea of combining with something else counting as an alt mode because then you'd have to count every combiner member as a Triplechanger as well. The TM's Powermaster mode is one thing (however unconvincing on its own), but the Targetmaster mode definitely requires the vehicle.

Emerje

That depends. For example, the same toys in Japan are listed as drones, and are not always linked to a Headmaster. Thus, they can be considered teller changers, where the Headmaster "rides" the drone in two configurations.

OK, but the original post referred directly to the TR Titan Masters. And That makes the drone the Triplechanger, not the Titan Master. Hasbro treats the vehicles as an accessory to a TM, not a figure on its own. I feel like non-sentient vehicles don't belong in this list, they'd be better off in a different list along side Action Master weapon partners and Beast Machines Deployers.

BTW, don't the G1 combiner torsos count as Triplechangers since they have an included base mode?

Emerje

Indeed, plus the limbs. The tfwiki article is interesting and touches upon many of the issues mentioned in this thread.

I mainly wanted to use 2 of the titan masters since they are really good triple changers (I don't count the head mode as part of the mode count since the head is separate from the partner vehicle, so I'm more talking about the partner vehicle than the head dude)

And I don't own many triple changers apart from TR and Thrilling 30. So I had to fill in my list

william-james88 wrote:

Bradimus wrote:Good list! I completely agree with number one.

My one issue is I don't think G1 Scorponok should be included as I don't consider base modes as part of the definition of a triple changer. I agree with the comment that G1 Astrotrain and G1 Blitzwing should have each held their own spots on the list with G1 Scorponok excluded.

Looking forward to the next one.

The next one is gonna be fun and like nothing I have done before, I am looking forward to sharing it with you.

About G1 Astrotrain and Blitzwing, which do you feel is better and why?

I have Astrotrain but like you pointed out he has his shuttle exhaust ports sticking out the rear of the train. I'm not sure if I've ever handled Blitzwing, but looking at Seibertron's gallery pics his tank turret is clearly visible underneath the jet. While both are brilliant I think I have to give the edge to Astrotrain because it' easier to ignore the exhaust ports than the tank turret.

Strangely I feel the opposite for Titans Return. I had many opportunities to get TR Astrotrain but I don't like the train mode at all as a train. Chalk that up to personal preference. His shuttle mode is amazing. As for TR Blitzwing, I have the Megatron version because I think the mold suits him better for two reasons:

1: There is no way to hide TR Blitzwing's purple get parts so they ruin the rear of the tank whereas since Megatron is two tones of gray there is no significant color issue to break up the look of the tank.

2: The robot body just screams Megatron to me, not Blitzwing.

The other thing about TR Blitzwing is how well his tank and jet modes have been adapted whereas with TR Astrotrain I feel like the designers didn't even want to try make him transform into something resembling a locomotive or another actual train and I think they could have pulled it off. So I guess I disagree with TR Astrotrain being on the list in place TR Megatron as well.

Also strangely, I was initially put off by TR Megatron because his Titan Master looks like Blitzwing since they already released the Megatron Titan Master with Galvatron. However, another turn off for TR Astrotrain is that his Titan Master looks like Sentinal Prime instead of a mini Astrotrain. When I finally chose TR Megatron over TR Blitzwing I did so because the idea of the TM looking like a mini Blitzwing began to appeal to me, and in my head-canon little Blitzwing transformers into Megatron and mini Megatron transforms into Galvatron (but still the same character like the Japanese canon, just goes by a different name in TM robot mode).

I prefer generations Metroplex (robot, city, vehicle... and the tallest ever made)

Hmm..

5. G1 Galvatron - Bot/Cannon/Gun
4. TM Rattrap - Bot/Rat/Car
3. TM Waspinator - Bot/Wasp/Jet
2. TM Depthcharge - Bot/Manta/Space Ship
1. TM Rampage -Bot/Crab/Tank

AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Hmm..

5. G1 Galvatron - Bot/Cannon/Gun

How is G1 Megs a triple-changer? The accessories don't count as a mode in itself. They are more like Optimus Prime's trailer and are their own thing.

-Kanrabat- wrote:

AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Hmm..

5. G1 Galvatron - Bot/Cannon/Gun

How is G1 Megs a triple-changer? The accessories don't count as a mode in itself. They are more like Optimus Prime's trailer and are their own thing.

Galvatron, not Megatron. The only Megatron I've ever owned is Beast Wars. I never liked the G1 design.

Derp.

Still, That gun mode is only an aftertought. The Titan Return version is a genuine triple changer with distinct modes. If only he was a leader with a helmet instead of the dumb face mask, he would have been perfect.

-Kanrabat- wrote:Derp.

Still, That gun mode is only an afterthought. The Titan Return version is a genuine triple changer with distinct modes. If only he was a leader with a helmet instead of the dumb face mask, he would have been perfect.

Still the Gun Mode has been used in canon, afterthought or no. When it comes to Galvatron, I'll stick with the G1 toy, until that hallowed day when MP Galvatron is released. Far too many years of Galvatron = Megatron repaint

Likewise with the Transmetals, not all of them should strictly count as Triplechangers. Munky on a Surfboard and T-Rex with jet skates would be pushing it a little.

AllNewSuperRobot wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:Derp.

Still, That gun mode is only an afterthought. The Titan Return version is a genuine triple changer with distinct modes. If only he was a leader with a helmet instead of the dumb face mask, he would have been perfect.

Still the Gun Mode has been used in canon, afterthought or no. When it comes to Galvatron, I'll stick with the G1 toy, until that hallowed day when MP Galvatron is released. Far too many years of Galvatron = Megatron repaint

Likewise with the Transmetals, not all of them should strictly count as Triplechangers. Munky on a Surfboard and T-Rex with jet skates would be pushing it a little.

Even if a mode is used in canon, it dosent really mean it's a "complete" mode. Ironically the same things with all the Transmetals. Too many are just "extra options" to be genuine modes. The forms must be COMPLETELY different and fuctional to really count.

Another example of "WTF-R-U doing" triple changer "impostors" are the BW2/Neo "battle station" modes. Like, really?



Also, indeed, MP Galvatron when?

-Kanrabat- wrote:Even if a mode is used in canon, it dosent really mean it's a "complete" mode. Ironically the same things with all the Transmetals. Too many are just "extra options" to be genuine modes. The forms must be COMPLETELY different and fuctional to really count.

Another example of "WTF-R-U doing" triple changer "impostors" are the BW2/Neo "battle station" modes. Like, really?



Also, indeed, MP Galvatron when?

Wow I've never seen that before... What is it and please tell me it was used in the show????

Yeah that was my thinking with the Transmetals too. That's why I discounted TM Terrorsaur, Cheetor, Airazor, Megatron etc as they were still in Beast mode, with jets stuck on(Airazor's "Seaplane" mode still doesn't make much sense). Hence why I selected those I did.

MP Galvatron... When Takara decides to pull it's finger out I guess. No, I don't want him in some other line, I want the Ultimate Decepticon in Masterpiece form.

AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Hmm..

5. G1 Galvatron - Bot/Cannon/Gun
4. TM Rattrap - Bot/Rat/Car
3. TM Waspinator - Bot/Wasp/Jet
2. TM Depthcharge - Bot/Manta/Space Ship
1. TM Rampage -Bot/Crab/Tank

this guy gets it!

Really? Really? TR Astrotrain on a top 5 triple changers list? Wat.

I'm sorry, but when it comes to triple changers TR Astrotrain ranks pretty dang low in my book. His "eh" Classics toy is better. TR Blitzwing (even with the wings issue) and Octane are far better. TR Alpha Trion is better. Hell, even TR Broadside is better IMO. Also Cybetron Megatron, Fortress Maximus, G1 & T30 Metroplex...

Basically, as far as I'm concerned, TR Astrotrain ranks below even G1 Galvatron when it comes to Triple Changers. Maybe even below G1 Springer. I hate the train mode and the execution of the shuttle mode that much. ...Although he still ranks higher than "Let's call Cryo Scourge a Triple Changer on account of the flip-out dragon heads".