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Autobot032 wrote:I can't help it... loladiprizio829 wrote:I challenge anyone here to tell me the Michael bay movies are better than the 1985 animated movie.
Challenge accepted. The Bayverse movies are better than the Animated movie. The critics, box office and general consensus all prove it to be so. Those are facts. On a personal level? The original movie stunk.
acchillyaout wrote: I have been a transformer fan longer than all of you put together.
vegetacron wrote:You will find that there are generally two types of Transformer fans: Generation 1 fans and Bayformer fans.
Gen1 fans are the 30 somethings of today that grew up play with the original Tranformers back in the early to mid 80s and actually loved watching the 80s cartoons.
Bayformers are fans under 30 that either grew up in the 2000s or were teenyboppers when the first Bayformer movie came out. Bayformer fans love the Micheal Bay Transformer movies because really, that was their first exposure to intellectual property.
Most Gen1 fans just get along and except the Bayformer fans because Bayformer fans are usually the retards in the room that we all take pity on and graciously thank them for spending money on an IP that we grew up with. If it wasn't for them and Micheal Bay, we wouldn't have all this great Gen1 revival stuf that Hasbro keeps making.
Bayformer fans have something to prove. They generally hate the history of Transformers and believe that the true continuity is that of what Micheal Bay and Co have produced on the silver screen. To them Micheal Bay is the god of all Transformerdom.
Kinda retarded all around, but it is what it is. I stopped posting here as much because quite frankly, I rarely have the patience for the Bayformer fans. I just want them to kee0p watching the movies and buying the crap Bayformer stuff that comes out so we G1 fans keep getting the good Gen1 stuff.
So as my good friend John would say "Proooooceeed wit da bullshit!" lol
Autobot032 wrote:Yes, it does really matter. Average Joes, I can't comment on, but I can tell you that you're outright wrong on some of the converts being dullards. Just because they're n00b fans doesn't mean their desire is any less powerful than any of our's.
You act like the fandom belongs only to you. It doesn't. The doors are open to people of all ages and we should welcome them, not shun them.
If it wasn't for the increased revenue and popularity, we'd probably be facing a Power Rangers situation. The media sucked, except for RPM, the toys were stripped of their Japanese awesomeness and downsized along with entire features gutted, just to make them cheap enough to produce and sell. I remember what the original Power Rangers toys were like. Today's don't even compare. Trust me, you do not want that to happen to TransFormers. The movies pretty much saved the entire franchise when it was in danger of going stagnant. Proven fact? The movies and toyline did over a billion in 2007. The AEC trilogy pulled in about $75 mill. Google it, it's out there.
The movies were fun and breathtaking. Somewhat stupid, I admit, but it's a small price to pay to get what we want, and we do get what we want.
MINDVVIPE wrote:I don't like the new fans because they are being given the wrong impressions of what Transformers are, and that is a crappy movie that is all special effects and NOTHING else.
vegetacron wrote:You will find that there are generally two types of Transformer fans: Generation 1 fans and Bayformer fans.
Gen1 fans are the 30 somethings of today that grew up play with the original Tranformers back in the early to mid 80s and actually loved watching the 80s cartoons.
Bayformers are fans under 30 that either grew up in the 2000s or were teenyboppers when the first Bayformer movie came out. Bayformer fans love the Micheal Bay Transformer movies because really, that was their first exposure to intellectual property.
vegetacron wrote:Most Gen1 fans just get along and except the Bayformer fans because Bayformer fans are usually the retards in the room that we all take pity on and graciously thank them for spending money on an IP that we grew up with. If it wasn't for them and Micheal Bay, we wouldn't have all this great Gen1 revival stuf that Hasbro keeps making.
vegetacron wrote:Bayformer fans have something to prove. They generally hate the history of Transformers and believe that the true continuity is that of what Micheal Bay and Co have produced on the silver screen. To them Micheal Bay is the god of all Transformerdom.
Sodan-1 wrote: It's these differences that lead to constructive debates....
Marcdachamp wrote:MINDVVIPE wrote:I don't like the new fans because they are being given the wrong impressions of what Transformers are, and that is a crappy movie that is all special effects and NOTHING else.
But that's YOUR opinion of what Transformers are and YOUR opinion of the quality of those films.
At the end of the day, there are tons of different ways you can get Transformers related things that satisfy your interest: comics, toys, DVDs, bobbleheads... the fact of the matter is, you wouldn't be able to get those things without the movies doing well, and fans of those movies aren't constantly wishing that all the G1 stuff disappears.
Marcdachamp wrote:MINDVVIPE wrote:I don't like the new fans because they are being given the wrong impressions of what Transformers are, and that is a crappy movie that is all special effects and NOTHING else.
But that's YOUR opinion of what Transformers are and YOUR opinion of the quality of those films.
At the end of the day, there are tons of different ways you can get Transformers related things that satisfy your interest: comics, toys, DVDs, bobbleheads... the fact of the matter is, you wouldn't be able to get those things without the movies doing well, and fans of those movies aren't constantly wishing that all the G1 stuff disappears.
MINDVVIPE wrote:I just said I don't care about the money. Or even if the quality is roughed out and sub par. Atleast it might have some substance instead of a total misdirection of what the Transformers are about.
MINDVVIPE wrote:Yea, I do feel TF belongs to me, because I have been a loyal supporter of it. Thats called customer loyalty of any product or service. Its the feeling that a customer has that ensures they stay with the product that is instilled by the company or organization. When the consumer, i.g. me, feels betrayed by one of their huge products, its a loss of a costumer due to this change in product image or form.
MINDVVIPE wrote:I don't like the new fans because they are being given the wrong impressions of what Transformers are, and that is a crappy movie that is all special effects and NOTHING else.
Autobot032 wrote:MINDVVIPE wrote:I just said I don't care about the money. Or even if the quality is roughed out and sub par. Atleast it might have some substance instead of a total misdirection of what the Transformers are about.
Wait...wait... How can it have quality and substance if it's "roughed out and sub par"? That makes absolutely no sense, you do see that, right? After reading that, I have no idea what you actually want. For all of my dislike for G1, even I have to say there was enough quality to it. Even it wasn't "roughed out and sub par". Well, at least not all of the time. So, obviously G1 doesn't impress you and the movies don't impress you. I'm getting the feeling you really have no idea what you want and you're grasping at straws.
At that point, the problem lies with you, not the franchise or it's different iterations.MINDVVIPE wrote:Yea, I do feel TF belongs to me, because I have been a loyal supporter of it. Thats called customer loyalty of any product or service. Its the feeling that a customer has that ensures they stay with the product that is instilled by the company or organization. When the consumer, i.g. me, feels betrayed by one of their huge products, its a loss of a costumer due to this change in product image or form.
I used to think like you. Then I grew up. I'm a loyal supporter, I love TransFormers, but I don't own it. Never have. Hasbro has been loyal to their customers. Their service has been somewhat questionable, but they are loyal. I could understand your feelings if this was a several hundred dollars purchase such as a computer from a brand you love and invested in. Or a car that's been reliable for years and then they change it into a Yugo 2.0. That's not what's going on here, though. This is...
These toys have always been for children. They will always be marketed towards children. They will be changed, shaped, and adapted for children. You can either accept this and enjoy it, or not at all and be left out. The choice is your's.
MINDVVIPE wrote:I don't like the new fans because they are being given the wrong impressions of what Transformers are, and that is a crappy movie that is all special effects and NOTHING else.
...wait... You're holding it against the fans for being "misled"? So, they deserve to be disliked and even hated because someone fooled them? Do you have any idea how...CRUEL that sounds? In your scenario, the new fans are victims. In your scenario, you don't like the victims because they're victims and don't know it.
WTF?!?! *screams*
1.) The new fans are capable of finding other TF mythos. G1 cartoons or the DW/IDW comics, or fanfiction, etc. How dare you say they're stupid and incapable of more. You don't have that right.
2.) No one misled them. No one tricked them. It's their personal choice to stick with Bayverse or expand. If they choose not to, that's their right and there's nothing wrong with it. I like Beast Wars, even though I know it's a sequel of sorts to G1. That doesn't mean I have to like G1. Same applies to the new fans. Just because you say it as golden truth, doesn't mean it is.
All of this, plus the whole "I own it" thing further proves my point concerning this sense of entitlement everyone in the fandom has. I don't know where we got it, why we have it, or how to fix it, but it needs to go the hell away. NOW.
We are owed nothing. We are but tiny cogs in a very large machine that makes very large amounts of money. The fact that we're even recognized and catered to should be enough, but it never is.
If Hasbro ever does anything out of spite, towards us, it's well deserved and earned.
Autobot032 wrote:I used to think like you. Then I grew up. I'm a loyal supporter, I love TransFormers, but I don't own it. Never have. Hasbro has been loyal to their customers. Their service has been somewhat questionable, but they are loyal. I could understand your feelings if this was a several hundred dollars purchase such as a computer from a brand you love and invested in. Or a car that's been reliable for years and then they change it into a Yugo 2.0. That's not what's going on here, though. This is...
These toys have always been for children. They will always be marketed towards children. They will be changed, shaped, and adapted for children. You can either accept this and enjoy it, or not at all and be left out. The choice is your's.
Marcdachamp wrote:Autobot032 wrote:I used to think like you. Then I grew up. I'm a loyal supporter, I love TransFormers, but I don't own it. Never have. Hasbro has been loyal to their customers. Their service has been somewhat questionable, but they are loyal. I could understand your feelings if this was a several hundred dollars purchase such as a computer from a brand you love and invested in. Or a car that's been reliable for years and then they change it into a Yugo 2.0. That's not what's going on here, though. This is...
These toys have always been for children. They will always be marketed towards children. They will be changed, shaped, and adapted for children. You can either accept this and enjoy it, or not at all and be left out. The choice is your's.
You hit the nail on the head. I love it when Transformers fans question Hasbro's fan loyalty. Universe Hot Shot had a license plate that said "jAAM." If that doesn't show just the tiniest fraction of their love and loyalty to the fanbase, I'm not sure what does.
vegetacron wrote:You will find that there are generally two types of Transformer fans: Generation 1 fans and Bayformer fans.
Gen1 fans are the 30 somethings of today that grew up play with the original Tranformers back in the early to mid 80s and actually loved watching the 80s cartoons.
Bayformers are fans under 30 that either grew up in the 2000s or were teenyboppers when the first Bayformer movie came out. Bayformer fans love the Micheal Bay Transformer movies because really, that was their first exposure to intellectual property.
vegetacron wrote:Most Gen1 fans just get along and except the Bayformer fans because Bayformer fans are usually the retards in the room that we all take pity on and graciously thank them for spending money on an IP that we grew up with. If it wasn't for them and Micheal Bay, we wouldn't have all this great Gen1 revival stuf that Hasbro keeps making.
vegetacron wrote:Bayformer fans have something to prove. They generally hate the history of Transformers and believe that the true continuity is that of what Micheal Bay and Co have produced on the silver screen. To them Micheal Bay is the god of all Transformerdom.
Marcdachamp wrote:_Anshin_ wrote:Lets do everyone a favor. We know you are going to make more movies. quote]
I see this plea at least once a week on this website. You guys DO realize that a Transformers movie with no Earth and no humans would literally kill this franchise, right?
Do you honestly think your casual movie-goer wants to see that? No, they don't. They want to see high-stakes action that makes them gasp and think "Oh my God, what if that did happen here?" The second you take away that human element, we're back to praying for the next Beast Wars to pull the franchise out of the fire.
You want movie-verse prequels and sequels with no humans that take place on Cybertron? Go buy IDW's Movie Prequel and Reign of Starscream comics. They're fun, and they have a majority of robot action.
And as for Statham and Bay? Yeah, I'd be down for that. That would probably be amazing, actually. I would like to see Shia cameo, though.
YoungPrime wrote:@Marcdachamp, do you really believe that parents enjoyed taking their children to see dogs hump each other (repeatedly) or Devastators balls? How about the sector 7 guy Seymour in a thong, or two men in a bathroom stall?
I guess during your race to deflate the opinions of other people you forgot about the effeminate Asian guy performing fellatio on a juice box straw in an elevator for no valid reason.
And as terrible as these humorless practices are you’re going to sit here with a straight face and tell people what they’re not willing to see when Transformers taking center stage with a few humans playing “supporting roles” is all most people wanted in the first place???
Do some researching before you try to deflate someones request. Those movies were horrible and the fact is most people tuned out the negative human aspects in order to enjoy the little bit a Transformer relevant parts in the movie that they could.
The first 3 minutes of DOTM was the best part with in the first hour of the film. So if you think the annoying, poorly played humans were the sole reason people went to see these films then you’re crazy…
a Transformers film doesn’t have to be Master Piece Theater, but humans acting like Sponge Bob while taking up most of the screen time isn’t fulfilling either. Which more and more people are agreeing to.
So no more Bay..REBOOT PLEASE!
SlyTF1 wrote:YoungPrime wrote:@Marcdachamp, do you really believe that parents enjoyed taking their children to see dogs hump each other (repeatedly) or Devastators balls? How about the sector 7 guy Seymour in a thong, or two men in a bathroom stall?
Yes.I guess during your race to deflate the opinions of other people you forgot about the effeminate Asian guy performing fellatio on a juice box straw in an elevator for no valid reason.
I don't even know WTF that is, but my parents laughed, and I repeat it every time I drink something and they don't curse me out or beat me, so it must not be too bad.And as terrible as these humorless practices are you’re going to sit here with a straight face and tell people what they’re not willing to see when Transformers taking center stage with a few humans playing “supporting roles” is all most people wanted in the first place???
Just skip to the damn parts with the giant robots fighting. That's what I do.
Do some researching before you try to deflate someones request. Those movies were horrible and the fact is most people tuned out the negative human aspects in order to enjoy the little bit a Transformer relevant parts in the movie that they could.
That's your opinion, and you're trying to make it seem as though it's a fact. just like most people do when they put these movies down.The first 3 minutes of DOTM was the best part with in the first hour of the film. So if you think the annoying, poorly played humans were the sole reason people went to see these films then you’re crazy…
That was 10 minutes...I would follow up with something else, but it would probably just get me in trouble.a Transformers film doesn’t have to be Master Piece Theater, but humans acting like Sponge Bob while taking up most of the screen time isn’t fulfilling either. Which more and more people are agreeing to.
So no more Bay..REBOOT PLEASE!
What the hell would be the point of having a live action movie if the TFs are the whole movie? They might as well just make it animated. Oh wait. I do agree that the first movie was stupid on the basis that the Autobots showed up for like the last 40 minutes, and it had like 2 minutes of Decepticons before that; but ROTF and DOTM have the TFs in proabably over 80% of the scenes.
MINDVVIPE wrote:You also seem to think that everyone who voices their opinion is really complaining from a self-entitlement complex. Its really not. Its just being a fan, and publically stating opinion. But since you guys gota take it so seriously to hopefully end with a sense of self-rightousness... I can't help that.
YoungPrime wrote:@Marcdachamp, do you really believe that parents enjoyed taking their children to see dogs hump each other (repeatedly) or Devastators balls? How about the sector 7 guy Seymour in a thong, or two men in a bathroom stall? I guess during your race to deflate the opinions of other people you forgot about the effeminate Asian guy performing fellatio on a juice box straw in an elevator for no valid reason.
And as terrible as these humorless practices are you’re going to sit here with a straight face and tell people what they’re not willing to see when Transformers taking center stage with a few humans playing “supporting roles” is all most people wanted in the first place???
Do some researching before you try to deflate someones request. Those movies were horrible and the fact is most people tuned out the negative human aspects in order to enjoy the little bit a Transformer relevant parts in the movie that they could.
The first 3 minutes of DOTM was the best part with in the first hour of the film. So if you think the annoying, poorly played humans were the sole reason people went to see these films then you’re crazy…
If you like Bayformers that's fine, but don’t deflate a legitimate request or dismiss people as G1 Bay-haters as if there’s no valid reason for the criticism. Not calling out you personally but generally speaking, a Transformers film doesn’t have to be Master Piece Theater, but humans acting like Sponge Bob while taking up most of the screen time isn’t fulfilling either. Which more and more people are agreeing to.
So no more Bay..REBOOT PLEASE!
YoungPrime wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:YoungPrime wrote:@Marcdachamp, do you really believe that parents enjoyed taking their children to see dogs hump each other (repeatedly) or Devastators balls? How about the sector 7 guy Seymour in a thong, or two men in a bathroom stall?
Yes.I guess during your race to deflate the opinions of other people you forgot about the effeminate Asian guy performing fellatio on a juice box straw in an elevator for no valid reason.
I don't even know WTF that is, but my parents laughed, and I repeat it every time I drink something and they don't curse me out or beat me, so it must not be too bad.And as terrible as these humorless practices are you’re going to sit here with a straight face and tell people what they’re not willing to see when Transformers taking center stage with a few humans playing “supporting roles” is all most people wanted in the first place???
Just skip to the damn parts with the giant robots fighting. That's what I do.
Do some researching before you try to deflate someones request. Those movies were horrible and the fact is most people tuned out the negative human aspects in order to enjoy the little bit a Transformer relevant parts in the movie that they could.
That's your opinion, and you're trying to make it seem as though it's a fact. just like most people do when they put these movies down.The first 3 minutes of DOTM was the best part with in the first hour of the film. So if you think the annoying, poorly played humans were the sole reason people went to see these films then you’re crazy…
That was 10 minutes...I would follow up with something else, but it would probably just get me in trouble.a Transformers film doesn’t have to be Master Piece Theater, but humans acting like Sponge Bob while taking up most of the screen time isn’t fulfilling either. Which more and more people are agreeing to.
So no more Bay..REBOOT PLEASE!
What the hell would be the point of having a live action movie if the TFs are the whole movie? They might as well just make it animated. Oh wait. I do agree that the first movie was stupid on the basis that the Autobots showed up for like the last 40 minutes, and it had like 2 minutes of Decepticons before that; but ROTF and DOTM have the TFs in proabably over 80% of the scenes.
LOL I stopped taking your post serious after you ans. "Yes"
Next!
Marcdachamp wrote:
As far as what a parent wants their children to see, that's their call. But that level of humor has been in all 3 films, and, judging by the box office returns, that hasn't stopped anyone from taking anyone to see the next film in the series.
And for the last time, what I said was that a film with NO humans (which is what people on this board seem to want) would fail. Not a film with limited humans.
GodMagnus wrote:I have to agree with you there. My mom would take me to go see Friday the 13th movies. That was her call. For a movie that is also product placement for a toy, it did have some suggestive themes in it, but that's up to parents if they want to take their kid to see it and I didn't see any walk out the theater.
Marcdachamp wrote:MINDVVIPE wrote:You also seem to think that everyone who voices their opinion is really complaining from a self-entitlement complex. Its really not. Its just being a fan, and publically stating opinion. But since you guys gota take it so seriously to hopefully end with a sense of self-rightousness... I can't help that.
You literally said that the franchise belongs to you! If that isn't self-entitlement, I don't know what is! It doesn't belong to you. It belongs to Hasbro, end of story. It's like the Star Wars fans that want Star Wars taken away from George Lucas. If you don't like it, vote with your wallet. But don't assume that you speak for anyone other than yourself when you try labeling who is and isn't a "true fan." The fact is, I love every incarnation of the Transformers and I can probably recite every line from the '86 movie. And you know what? I love the Bay films.YoungPrime wrote:@Marcdachamp, do you really believe that parents enjoyed taking their children to see dogs hump each other (repeatedly) or Devastators balls? How about the sector 7 guy Seymour in a thong, or two men in a bathroom stall? I guess during your race to deflate the opinions of other people you forgot about the effeminate Asian guy performing fellatio on a juice box straw in an elevator for no valid reason.
And as terrible as these humorless practices are you’re going to sit here with a straight face and tell people what they’re not willing to see when Transformers taking center stage with a few humans playing “supporting roles” is all most people wanted in the first place???
Do some researching before you try to deflate someones request. Those movies were horrible and the fact is most people tuned out the negative human aspects in order to enjoy the little bit a Transformer relevant parts in the movie that they could.
The first 3 minutes of DOTM was the best part with in the first hour of the film. So if you think the annoying, poorly played humans were the sole reason people went to see these films then you’re crazy…
If you like Bayformers that's fine, but don’t deflate a legitimate request or dismiss people as G1 Bay-haters as if there’s no valid reason for the criticism. Not calling out you personally but generally speaking, a Transformers film doesn’t have to be Master Piece Theater, but humans acting like Sponge Bob while taking up most of the screen time isn’t fulfilling either. Which more and more people are agreeing to.
So no more Bay..REBOOT PLEASE!
It's okay to have a dissenting opinion about the films. No one is saying otherwise. But as soon as Vegetacron starts calling fans of those movies a "retard" his arguement falls apart.
As far as what a parent wants their children to see, that's their call. But that level of humor has been in all 3 films, and, judging by the box office returns, that hasn't stopped anyone from taking anyone to see the next film in the series.
And for the last time, what I said was that a film with NO humans (which is what people on this board seem to want) would fail. Not a film with limited humans.
YoungPrime wrote:Either you’re missing the point or using all of your effort to ignore it in order to save face from the truth. We all know what to expect in a rated R slasher Film. But the bad toilet humor and antics used by the human characters and bots in Bayformers is in no ways necessary for cheap laughs that fall short more than not. And although most parents won’t storm out the theatre due to these displays, most people in general would agree that they could live without them.
Hell, the whole sales pitch of DOTM revolved around Bay and Co. venting on how disappointed they were with ROTF, only to do most the same things in the sequel.
So spare me of all the excuses. The fact that people still came to view the films only proves that they love the Transformers name in spite of Bays flaws. And I have no doubt in my mind that people wouldn't turn theirs noses up at a reboot from a director with at least an ounce of respect for the Transformer lore. So if you’re even half the Transformers fan you claim to be why would you deny idea of a reboot?
Many of the major Cons and bots were poorly used and killed off by Bay anyway…
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