The Energon Pub

Rtron wrote:Jetstorm and Tigerhawk could fit a leader class budget, but Gigatron? No way.

While Commander Class would seem the most likely price bracket for Gigatron. Yet he wasn't that much bigger than everyone else.



Unlike Jetfire...

How much more did the Encore Car robots Fire Convoy and God Magnus cost compared to their original releases?

They won't be in this years legacy line as store listings have more or less confirmed what we're getting at retail and there's no car robots. Scrouge is part of the Walmart Exclusive line.

AllNewSuperRobot wrote:

Rtron wrote:Jetstorm and Tigerhawk could fit a leader class budget, but Gigatron? No way.

While Commander Class would seem the most likely price bracket for Gigatron. Yet he wasn't that much bigger than everyone else.



Unlike Jetfire...

The problem is not the size, it's the amount of pieces required to make all his modes work. And his ridiculously intricate deco. Size is not the only thing that costs money.

Rtron wrote:The problem is not the size, it's the amount of pieces required to make all his modes work. And his ridiculously intricate deco. Size is not the only thing that costs money.

In truth, I've still got the Beast Machines mentality when it comes to pricing: A bigger figure costs more. The number of pieces doesn't matter. Ultra Class Jetstorm is more expensive than Deluxe Jetstorm. Purely because of size. Whereas in reality, UC Jetstorm is essentially an upscaled version of the Deluxe. Or sharing similar engineering.

By the same token, it is a bit of a con that they only now list that as an excuse for increased pricing. For example, Transmetal 2 Megatron cost the same at retail as Magnaboss/Tripredacus. The combiner teams clearly required more "pieces" than the red Dragon. But that didn't matter then...

AllNewSuperRobot wrote:

Rtron wrote:The problem is not the size, it's the amount of pieces required to make all his modes work. And his ridiculously intricate deco. Size is not the only thing that costs money.

In truth, I've still got the Beast Machines mentality when it comes to pricing: A bigger figure costs more. The number of pieces doesn't matter. Ultra Class Jetstorm is more expensive than Deluxe Jetstorm. Purely because of size. Whereas in reality, UC Jetstorm is essentially an upscaled version of the Deluxe. Or sharing similar engineering.

By the same token, it is a bit of a con that they only now list that as an excuse for increased pricing. For example, Transmetal 2 Megatron cost the same at retail as Magnaboss/Tripredacus. The combiner teams clearly required more "pieces" than the red Dragon. But that didn't matter then...

It did matter then. It's always mattered.

Thing is, Magnaboss and Tripredacus didn't require more pieces, they were extremely simple compared to Transmetal 2 Megatron. They also didn't use chrome paint. They barely had any paint, in fact.

It's always been a factor of product design. You just used to not notice because corporate culture, inflation, production costs and income inequality weren't as bad back then.

It's funny, where my collecting is so sporadic. Prices didn't really factor in. Masterpiece BW Megatron was the most expensive figure I've ever bought. But he was a one time thing and the only thing I put money to that year.

But, when MP-44 and Blackarachnia dropped, with their pricing. I took notice. The recent Nemesis recolour of MP-44 being half to two thirds of the cost of the original mold. "Justified" as the price of the trailer. Meanwhile, BA being the smallest Predacon in Season One. Receiving a price hike solely because she was packaged with a lot of superfluous shite that wasn't asked for or required. That's when HasTak's tactics caught my eye.

Dr. Caelus wrote:
Shattered Glass Ultra Magnus (Probably going to be online this year). I was really hoping for a recolor of the Siege Mold, because then I would have had an excuse to unload my Siege Magnus, buy an Earthrise Magnus, and still have one version of each mold. It seems almost certain, though, that they would use the Legacy Laser Prime mold though. I'll definitely get a SG Ultra Magnus regardless of the mold used, so that makes Scourge and Optimus doubly redundant.
/angst

It's going to be Siege.

TF-fan kev777 wrote:

Dr. Caelus wrote:That brings to mind a question - how likely is a Shattered Glass Ultra Magnus from Laser Prime this year?

Zero percent likely, he'll be from the Siege mold. The comics already revealed this (issue 5). Note the shoulder pylons, definitely the Siege mold.

20220130_102223.jpg

Fingers crossed!

Rtron wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Price is a factor for remaking the big bots. Tigerhawk, Ultra Class Jetstorm or Gigatron wouldn't carry the same relative price tag they once did.

Those would most likely be sold as leader class.

Jetstorm and Tigerhawk could fit a leader class budget, but Gigatron? No way.

Gigatron was just a "voyager". A big one with lots of parts, but a voyager nonetheless. Thus, transferred to modern standards, a reissue would most likely be leader priced like vintage Optimus Primal and BW Megatron.

However, if REMADE into a new mold and in scale, that's another thing.

Sixshot was a leader class toy, gigatron could be too.

RiD Scourge is already in the rumors/leaks for the Velocitron line, under his Japanese name "Black Convoy".

Sabrblade wrote:RiD Scourge is already in the rumors/leaks for the Velocitron line, under his Japanese name "Black Convoy".

So many toys of him, not bad for a non-Nemesis Prime Optimus Prime duplicate

Jelze Bunnycat wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:RiD Scourge is already in the rumors/leaks for the Velocitron line, under his Japanese name "Black Convoy".

So many toys of him, not bad for a non-Nemesis Prime Optimus Prime duplicate

He's the original and best, so there's that.

sol magnus wrote:

Jelze Bunnycat wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:RiD Scourge is already in the rumors/leaks for the Velocitron line, under his Japanese name "Black Convoy".

So many toys of him, not bad for a non-Nemesis Prime Optimus Prime duplicate

He's the original and best, so there's that.

Being a main character in a show sure helps.

Though, the original "evil black Optimus redeco" was Onyx Primal. Then Copy Convoy. Scourge was the third.

And had the name "Nemesis Prime" been thought up at the time (instead of not until Armada), Scourge most likely would have absolutely used that name.

Laser Prime is looking good. I won't get him, but I am looking forward to seeing his Black Convoy repaint. I am excited for that one. Just need to find a UW Ruination to complete the RiD2001 cons

Emerje wrote:

william-james88 wrote:Sixshot was a leader class toy, gigatron could be too.

I think people forget how simple Gigatron really is and just get caught up in how many forms he can change into. He's mostly made out of jointed parts and very few small panels. And of course they'd certainly simplify him as well. No chrome, no firing missiles, probably no "ear" articulation like Galaxy Upgrade Prime. There's really no reason why he couldn't still be Leader class.

As for Shattered Glass Ultra Magnus, I still don't see how his comic appearance is any indication of what mold they'll use. His first appearance in the original SG comic was also the G1 mold before changing to the new body. If we're getting 5 more figures then surely they also intend to include 5 more comics that'll further the story along. Wanting him to be in his G2 style body isn't wishful thinking, it's absolutely possible.

Emerje

While true, and probably ideal considering the character's history, I think the fact that outside of Megatron they have used zero prior appearance retooling/imagination, the comic appearance should be taken as the almost certain option. They will do a Diaclone/SG dual purpose with it, same way with wheeljack/Slicer, I'm betting.

Believe me, I'd like to see Laser Prime with a skull head and new sword, I think that since this continuity is almost (Megatron once again the exception) entirely just G1 recolored with no imagination like Goldbug with Rodimus spoiler, I think that is wishful thinking

D-Maximal_Primal wrote:

Emerje wrote:

william-james88 wrote:Sixshot was a leader class toy, gigatron could be too.

I think people forget how simple Gigatron really is and just get caught up in how many forms he can change into. He's mostly made out of jointed parts and very few small panels. And of course they'd certainly simplify him as well. No chrome, no firing missiles, probably no "ear" articulation like Galaxy Upgrade Prime. There's really no reason why he couldn't still be Leader class.

As for Shattered Glass Ultra Magnus, I still don't see how his comic appearance is any indication of what mold they'll use. His first appearance in the original SG comic was also the G1 mold before changing to the new body. If we're getting 5 more figures then surely they also intend to include 5 more comics that'll further the story along. Wanting him to be in his G2 style body isn't wishful thinking, it's absolutely possible.

Emerje

While true, and probably ideal considering the character's history, I think the fact that outside of Megatron they have used zero prior appearance retooling/imagination, the comic appearance should be taken as the almost certain option. They will do a Diaclone/SG dual purpose with it, same way with wheeljack/Slicer, I'm betting.

Believe me, I'd like to see Laser Prime with a skull head and new sword, I think that since this continuity is almost (Megatron once again the exception) entirely just G1 recolored with no imagination like Goldbug with Rodimus spoiler, I think that is wishful thinking

On top of this, you also have to consider that IDW is losing the license as well. Those next 5 issues could very well be the end, which really wouldn't give much time to write in a body swap. Its "absolutely possible" they use the Legacy mold, just very very unlikely.

D-Maximal_Primal wrote:

Emerje wrote:

william-james88 wrote:Sixshot was a leader class toy, gigatron could be too.

I think people forget how simple Gigatron really is and just get caught up in how many forms he can change into. He's mostly made out of jointed parts and very few small panels. And of course they'd certainly simplify him as well. No chrome, no firing missiles, probably no "ear" articulation like Galaxy Upgrade Prime. There's really no reason why he couldn't still be Leader class.

As for Shattered Glass Ultra Magnus, I still don't see how his comic appearance is any indication of what mold they'll use. His first appearance in the original SG comic was also the G1 mold before changing to the new body. If we're getting 5 more figures then surely they also intend to include 5 more comics that'll further the story along. Wanting him to be in his G2 style body isn't wishful thinking, it's absolutely possible.

Emerje

While true, and probably ideal considering the character's history, I think the fact that outside of Megatron they have used zero prior appearance retooling/imagination, the comic appearance should be taken as the almost certain option. They will do a Diaclone/SG dual purpose with it, same way with wheeljack/Slicer, I'm betting.

Because it's Ultra Magnus, I'm going to buy it anyway Laser Optimus Skull face or whatever. BUT - I want the Diaclone / SG repaint for the express purpose you mention. Regardless, there has been exactly zero deviation from what has shown up in the comic series to the toy as it's a cross marketing subline.

My question is how come out of everybody, Ultra Magnus is the one who has to follow the other SG storyline and has to look like what he did in 2011(?) when literally no other character is being held to that standard? It doesn't make sense.

sol magnus wrote:

D-Maximal_Primal wrote:

Emerje wrote:

william-james88 wrote:Sixshot was a leader class toy, gigatron could be too.

I think people forget how simple Gigatron really is and just get caught up in how many forms he can change into. He's mostly made out of jointed parts and very few small panels. And of course they'd certainly simplify him as well. No chrome, no firing missiles, probably no "ear" articulation like Galaxy Upgrade Prime. There's really no reason why he couldn't still be Leader class.

As for Shattered Glass Ultra Magnus, I still don't see how his comic appearance is any indication of what mold they'll use. His first appearance in the original SG comic was also the G1 mold before changing to the new body. If we're getting 5 more figures then surely they also intend to include 5 more comics that'll further the story along. Wanting him to be in his G2 style body isn't wishful thinking, it's absolutely possible.

Emerje

While true, and probably ideal considering the character's history, I think the fact that outside of Megatron they have used zero prior appearance retooling/imagination, the comic appearance should be taken as the almost certain option. They will do a Diaclone/SG dual purpose with it, same way with wheeljack/Slicer, I'm betting.

Because it's Ultra Magnus, I'm going to buy it anyway Laser Optimus Skull face or whatever. BUT - I want the Diaclone / SG repaint for the express purpose you mention. Regardless, there has been exactly zero deviation from what has shown up in the comic series to the toy as it's a cross marketing subline.

My question is how come out of everybody, Ultra Magnus is the one who has to follow the other SG storyline and has to look like what he did in 2011(?) when literally no other character is being held to that standard? It doesn't make sense.

I mean, at least to my standards, I have always stated that several characters used the wrong molds to make them true to their SG selves. I've always said Goldbug should have been Hot Rod, or at least a battlecharger to be a bigger meaner boy.

As for the others, Prime followed the original path. Nothing really worked for Blurr mold wise but he got the important paint apps. Ratchet should have been a Grapple use to stay true to fiction but I guess the CW Botcon toy made his G1 mold OK. Megatron, I think we all said should have used Galvatron but the new mode made up with new bits was close enough to the original to work. Starscream sort of worked for the most part too, thanks to the swords and having the tetrajet body. And Jetfire wasn't really in SG until last year, so they mostly had a blank slate there.

So, in theory, we tried to hold others to the Magnus standard, but some like Megatron got fudged, some worked like Prime, some had another precedent to use like Ratchet, some had no good alternate like Blurr, and some just didn't work and was said not to work like Goldbug

I seem to recall that Ratchet was originally supposed to be Soundwave, since his deco looks closer to that of SG Soundwave's earth body instead of Ratchet's deco.

Jelze Bunnycat wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:RiD Scourge is already in the rumors/leaks for the Velocitron line, under his Japanese name "Black Convoy".

So many toys of him, not bad for a non-Nemesis Prime Optimus Prime duplicate

It's another Shadow Panther/Tripredacus Agent/Ravage thing again, isn't it?

AllNewSuperRobot wrote:

Jelze Bunnycat wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:RiD Scourge is already in the rumors/leaks for the Velocitron line, under his Japanese name "Black Convoy".

So many toys of him, not bad for a non-Nemesis Prime Optimus Prime duplicate

It's another Shadow Panther/Tripredacus Agent/Ravage thing again, isn't it?

If you mean the name thing, Hasbro likely wants to keep the name "Scourge" reserved for the G1 guy, like how they kept the name "Chase" reserved for the Rescue Bot and renamed the G1 Throttlebot "Roadburn".

Rtron wrote:I think it's not so much that they don't consider it part of the legacy, but rather that it was a one-year thing with VERY expensive unique gimmicks and models to reproduce. So it'd be costly to make, and would have a very small fan base, so very little return.

The good thing is that a bunch of the cast was repaints. So rest assured you'll get those soon after getting the main models, as it was the case with Ruination and it's going to be the case with Scourge.

They did try reissuing God Fire Convoy and it was a disaster. The molds used were garbage and the sound chip(s) were screwed up. Takara was unwilling/unable to do a fix so I and many others canceled their pre-orders.