The Energon Pub

[Bun-Bun]

Kind of a clickbait-y title

Clickbait?!?
On Seibertron!?!
Surely you jest.

[-Kanrabat-]

He's not wrong about the 86 movie - it WAS a 'downer'. Like many films of the 80s, it was a disjointed, incoherent, apocalyptic hayride to nowhere. If it hadn't had the G1 characters in it as an anchor, I wouldn't have been able to connect with it in any meaningful way.

I tried watching the movie with my sis and niece some years ago. After Optimus's death, they were bored to tears and I had to stop the movie.

I was a bored too.

I have the impression that most of the movie budget went into that first tier. Then everything went downhill.

[Rodimus Prime]

Didn't we already know that this guy has no real frame of reference when it comes to the franchise? He looks at it as a producer who wants another studio property to make money, not as a fan of the franchise who wants to contribute a memorable addition to it.

[Spider5800]

He "doesn't get it" because he's not really a fan.

I'm a fan, and I don't get why people like this movie either. It's really not good. The best parts are in the first 3rd of the film, it's a dull slog after that. And even the "good" parts are pretty depressing, and basically just an excuse for toy execs to kill off their customer's action figures so they have to buy more toys. It's an incredibly cynical film.

I tried watching the movie with my sis and niece some years ago. After Optimus's death, they were bored to tears and I had to stop the movie.

I was a bored too.

Exactly this. It basically becomes a whole different movie after the Autobot City fight, and not a fun one. Optimus' death should have been the climax of the film.

[SpaceEagle]

Maybe I just don't have nostalgia goggles for the film, but I can see where he's coming from. Granted the title of this article makes it seem like he's baffled people find interest in it when really he makes a good point about it being very depressing and honestly rather shocking, especially with it killing off beloved characters to show kids the new products.
That being said, I don't hate the '86 film. I honestly don't think it's particularly good, but at the same time there isn't...really a lot of better alternatives. I don't hate the Bayverse either, which is arguably just as dark, if not darker, than the '86 film, just that of course that itself also had a lot of disappointed fans.
I do think he is still approaching this like a typical business guy doing business, but, meh, I can't exactly pretend the original film was a masterpiece in any way anyway.

[Sabrblade]

As of now, the best movie is Bumblebee, even without the GEEWUN-ness of the opening Cybertron scene.

[Glyph]

As of now, the best movie is Bumblebee, even without the GEEWUN-ness of the opening Cybertron scene.

Co-signed, literally the only one of the live action movies I enjoyed and the only one I'd recommend to other people. But '86 will always have the exception for pure nostalgia. (Opinion pending on ROTB for when I get around to watching it)

Didn't we already know that this guy has no real frame of reference when it comes to the franchise?

We did, and while it's true that he's "just a producer", it's also true that he's been a producer on the franchise for almost 20 years now. You'd think that, by this point, either he would have gotten a clue or we would have learned not to treat whatever corporate hype-speak he spouts on the latest project as being in any way significant.

[Solrac333]

"Di Bonaventura Doesn't Understand". That's the problem. He needs to go.

[Burn]

Kind of a clickbait-y title

Clickbait?!?
On Seibertron!?!
Surely you jest.

I thought I was on CBR for a second ...

[Rodimus Prime]

As of now, the best movie is Bumblebee, even without the GEEWUN-ness of the opening Cybertron scene.

Co-signed, literally the only one of the live action movies I enjoyed and the only one I'd recommend to other people. But '86 will always have the exception for pure nostalgia. (Opinion pending on ROTB for when I get around to watching it)

"Best" is a matter of opinion. You may think it to be the best, maybe even the majority of the fandom does as well, doesn't mean it is for everyone. I've seen the Bumblebee movie once. Haven't had the urge to see it again in the last 5 years, whereas the 07 movie I've watched 6-8 times. The sequels less frequently, but still more than Bee. RoTB I saw once on streaming, and it was about as bad as I expected. TF:TM, on the other hand, I watch once a year on January 1st. Never get tired of it. And it's not nostalgia, I really enjoy watching the movie.

Didn't we already know that this guy has no real frame of reference when it comes to the franchise?

We did, and while it's true that he's "just a producer", it's also true that he's been a producer on the franchise for almost 20 years now. You'd think that, by this point, either he would have gotten a clue or we would have learned not to treat whatever corporate hype-speak he spouts on the latest project as being in any way significant.

My point exactly. And I don't begrudge him for not being favorable towards TF:TM. At least he says *he* doesn't get it, not that it's outright a bad movie.

[SpaceEagle]

My point exactly. And I don't begrudge him for not being favorable towards TF:TM. At least he says *he* doesn't get it, not that it's outright a bad movie.

Yeah, that's all the statement really rings to me, aside from it being just typical business guy talk, it still isn't like he said the old film sucks and his movie will be so much better, just that he didn't get it and that's about it.

[chuckdawg1999]

That's really cool. I hope if we get to see Megatron's downfall we hear Instruments of Destruction like on a montage

But the news post said there are no pop songs in the movie.

Then you know what we have to do!

The 86 movie will always have a special place in my heart. Over time it's become one of my favorite films ever. I think knowing Optimus returns makes watching and enjoying it easier. Also, the music is on point.

[TOO MUCH ENERGON!]

Grace Randolph is a hack who has been caught completely making stuff up. So take what she's saying with a grain of salt.

[Glyph]

"Best" is a matter of opinion. You may think it to be the best, maybe even the majority of the fandom does as well, doesn't mean it is for everyone. I've seen the Bumblebee movie once. Haven't had the urge to see it again in the last 5 years, whereas the 07 movie I've watched 6-8 times. ... TF:TM, on the other hand, I watch once a year on January 1st. Never get tired of it. And it's not nostalgia, I really enjoy watching the movie.

On the one hand: well, obviously. I thought we could take it as read that statements of preference are opinion and not universal truths, without spelling that out every time.

But on the other hand: actual quality - of writing, of direction, of acting - is a thing. People often say "best" when they mean "favourite", but that doesn't mean that the level of craft on display is just a matter of taste. (I don't much like rap, as a matter of preference, but I can appreciate the technical skill involved in a good rapper's flow, wordplay and speed.) At the production level, BB is pretty much universally judged to be a better movie than its predecessors, as I understand it.

Obviously TF:TM is an absolute touchstone for TF fans of a certain age. It's also sorta janky, has massively variable animation quality and plenty of production errors, and kinda feels like two separate movies glued together at the point of OP's death. I love it. It's a comfort watch for me in the way that no other TF film is - nostalgia and enjoyment are not mutually exclusive things! - but I can also accept that it's hardly the greatest piece of cinema ever made. It's a "cult classic" now, but let's not forget that it bombed hard and was panned by reviewers when it was originally released - I think it's fair to say that most of its fans first came to it as kids (and already TF fans), not adults.

In a vain effort to drag this thread back on course: I see a lot of parallels in TF:One, honestly. I'm expecting it to largely underperform (would be nice to be wrong though) but hope it can be a similar touchstone for the next generation of fans. Would be even nicer if it can be an underappreciated gem and not a "cult classic" for them!

[o.supreme]

As of now, the best live action movie is Bumblebee, because of the opening Cybertron scene.

Fixed for ya. . Seriously though. Yeah BB is definitely the Best Live Action TF film, the Opening Scene & Flashback to Cybertron weren't necessary, but it definitely catapulted the films' status to a whole other level. A 90 minute version of those events; in that style, is what I want; NOT TF One. I'm not saying TF One will be a failure. I don't look forward to it, but I don't encourage anything to fail, unless its completely utter unredeemable trash like where Star Wars is right now.

[Sabrblade]

As of now, the best live action movie is Bumblebee, because of the opening Cybertron scene.

Fixed for ya. .

Bad form!

The Bumblebee movie proved its worth in spite of the GEEWUN pandering of the opening scene. If everyone in that scene had been in forms based on Armada instead, the movie would have still been exactly as strong a film as it already is as-is.

[Quantum Surge]

At least the article isn't titled "BONAVENTURA HATES THE 1986 MOVIE THEREFORE WE ARE ENEMIES!!!!!"

[o.supreme]

Bad form!

The Bumblebee movie proved its worth in spite of the GEEWUN pandering of the opening scene. If everyone in that scene had been in forms based on Armada instead, the movie would have still been exactly as strong a film as it already is as-is.

Agree to disagree in that... Objectively, yes the movie would still have been just as good, but naming a random Transformers film "Hotshot" (not a household name) would definitely have raised some eyebrows at the executive level, and probably would not have put buts in seats.

[Sabrblade]

Bad form!

The Bumblebee movie proved its worth in spite of the GEEWUN pandering of the opening scene. If everyone in that scene had been in forms based on Armada instead, the movie would have still been exactly as strong a film as it already is as-is.

Agree to disagree in that... Objectively, yes the movie would still have been just as good, but naming a random Transformers film "Hotshot" (not a household name) would definitely have raised some eyebrows at the executive level, and probably would not have put buts in seats.

I said "forms" as in "designs", not "names".

And Bumblebee himself is, like, the only one in that flashback to not have a G1-based design, since they had to keep his Movieverse aesthetic. He may end up turning into an old VW Bug when he gets to Earth later, but that Earth robot mode of his is nothing like G1 Bee's robot mode design. So even if everyone else in the flashback had had Armada-based designs, Bumblebee would have still been Bumblebee (or, I guess, "B-127", at that point in his life).

[sol magnus]

Didn't we already know that this guy has no real frame of reference when it comes to the franchise? He looks at it as a producer who wants another studio property to make money, not as a fan of the franchise who wants to contribute a memorable addition to it.

Yes.

Or "speaking for myself". I did.

And Bumblebee is good, except for the jettisoning of prior continuity and double-speak regarding same. The 'fan-service' scene in the beginning is honestly just that in my opinion. As has been said, they could have put any designs there and it wouldn't really change how 'good' the movie is.

[TFMSGDerek]

Why are people saying TF one is the first animated TF movie since 86? Does predicons rising not count?

[william-james88]

Why are people saying TF one is the first animated TF movie since 86? Does predicons rising not count?

It's because when that's said, people are referring to theatrical releases in the west. So in that sense, no Predacon Rising does not count.

[Sabrblade]

Why are people saying TF one is the first animated TF movie since 86? Does predicons rising not count?

It's because when that's said, people are referring to theatrical releases in the west. So in that sense, no Predacon Rising does not count.

And Predacons Rising was later added to the proper episode count of TF: Prime, becoming its 66th, 67th, and 68th episodes.

[D-Maximal_Primal]

He "doesn't get it" because he's not really a fan.

I'm a fan, and I don't get why people like this movie either. It's really not good. The best parts are in the first 3rd of the film, it's a dull slog after that. And even the "good" parts are pretty depressing, and basically just an excuse for toy execs to kill off their customer's action figures so they have to buy more toys. It's an incredibly cynical film.

Agreed. 86 is still my least favorite TF film.

As of now, the best movie is Bumblebee, even without the GEEWUN-ness of the opening Cybertron scene.

How the fandom treats that first 3 minutes is why Bee is my 2nd least favorite movie. It is really good, and i love Shatter and Dropkick, but the first 3 minutes ruined the fandom, and after a couple years the fandom finally ruined that movie for me thanks to that.

[blackeyedprime]

When the animation for the overwatch crossover looks better than the animated film :/

https://www.ign.com/videos/overwatch-2- ... on-trailer