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JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:An interesting case he is, Hun-Gurrr is not a retool in the traditional sense.
william-james88 wrote:Does one believe Hun Gurr to be based on the Silverbolt mold? Its a yes or no question.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Sabrblade wrote:It's basically the same case as how Energon Starscream, 2010 Terradive, and FOC Starscream are all physically unique molds whose transformation engineering is all based directly on that of G2 Smokescreen.
John Warden wrote:When we were launching "Combiner Wars" it was actually a very different time in Transformers. The system was largely unproven and we were actually trying to sell...we were coming off the Thrilling 30 and people that fans were, you know, there was a niche group of an audience. What wound up happening was when we built that line we had to try to...I planned the entire line out in advance and I had to figure out 'Ok, I'm going to reuse these, I only have this much tooling to do this many items', I was trying to spread things out to get the most robust line possible
william-james88 wrote:But I am pretty certain that someone totally dug up the CW Silverbolt CAD mold designs and altered them to obtain Hun Gurrr.
Stuartmaximus wrote:Look! all I know is that Jazz(& probably 3 other limb bots too) & Starscream use the same combiner system as CW
+ I'm sure that this has been retooled & repainted from one of the CW Arielbots
Delta Magnus wrote:This is because you are a hamhanded idiot.
steals_your_goats wrote:Stuartmaximus wrote:Look! all I know is that Jazz(& probably 3 other limb bots too) & Starscream use the same combiner system as CW
+ I'm sure that this has been retooled & repainted from one of the CW Arielbots
Yeah Stu, that was never up for debate. Everyone knew that from the instant we saw these figures at SDCC.
Are... Are you under the misbelief that I think of Hun-Gurrr as a retool of Silverbolt?william-james88 wrote:Sabrblade wrote:It's basically the same case as how Energon Starscream, 2010 Terradive, and FOC Starscream are all physically unique molds whose transformation engineering is all based directly on that of G2 Smokescreen.
Its really not. the toys you mention dont have the same dimensions and there is 0 proof that a designer based one off the other's actual mold. There are only so many ways to transform a jet that recurring transformations can happen. Its not different than saying that CW Dragstrip is a retool of Cybertron HotShot when their transformation is very similar. But we dont say that, because we know better. So I dont know why we say it about other non related toys. MP Grimlock shares the same transformation to G1 Grimlock and does so directly, but is he a retool? Similar transformations dont mean anything in this scenario.
Where in my post did I say that they were?william-james88 wrote:I do not believe Energon Starscream, 2010 Terradive or FOC Starscream to be made based on the molding design of G2 Smokescreen. And as far as I know, no designer has come out and said they are. So they are not retools to me.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Skritz wrote:
I do believe it is those cases which make people turn their nose at retools.
Skritz wrote:I do think people worry about retooling because it often seem like they end up buying the same toy several times, which is a fair criticism. However in lines meant to more heavily interact with each others, especially as mix-and-match combiner limbs such level of similarity is not only a necessary evil but flat out required. One could argue that the issue is more that they didn't change some of these figures enough, as Combiner Wars had quite a few who were just flat recolors. Those who come to mind as 'cheap retools' would be Hasbro's Blastoff, Scattershot and Nosecone.
But then again that line also had some more impressive retooling such as Onslaught into Hot Spot (or was it the other way around?) or the Rook and Swindle/Hound designs. A 'reshelling' into a completely different visual design will certainly alleviate some concerns, but it doesn't change the fact CW certainly had a few figures where they simply didn't bother to even try to make it look remotely like the original figure, prefering to just recolor and maybe slap on a new head. I'd say the most obvious and overused of such mold was the Alpha Bravo mold where they flat out didn't even bother slightly reshelling the chopper, resulting in a rescue helicopter and military choppers look identical except for color.
I do believe it is those cases which make people turn their nose at retools.
ExciKaiser wrote:Yes, in fact there's 3 cases :
- Good retool
- Lazy retool
- bad retool
[lots of good stuff]
There's less debate about Dreadwing and Darkwing, because there's effort, good retooling.. and in the end it works.
Skritz wrote:Well, not every retool is going to 'work' and, for some, it can be down to subjective taste. For example, while I don't own it I quite like the Cyclonus retool of CW Silverbolt but there are people who don't like it. Not to mention some people who think Cyclonus as a combiner is pants-on-head stupid.
Stuartmaximus wrote:so it's also concerning as to what Scorponok and Omega Supreme WON'T have with it? will Scorponok NOT come with Fasttrack? will there be accessories that also WON'T come with the figure as standard? that came with the original
william-james88 wrote:I am curious of something ExciKaiser, would you personally label TR Fort Max as a bad retool or a lazy one? I feel its a bit of both, but probably more towards "bad".
Burn wrote:I can't see them leaving anything out of Omega Supreme given that every one of his base parts were used in his robot mode. He had no extras.
Kurona wrote:Every Wave 1 figure is up for pre-order on Kapow (UK) right now as bundles, though those prices are scaring the s*it out of me. £100 for all four deluxes; does that mean deluxes are gonna be £25 each from now on?
https://www.kapowtoys.co.uk/transformer ... rimes.html
Tekka wrote:What she doesn't realize is that Springer actually loves Rodimus.
o.supreme wrote:I'm also not certain we will get another Titan Class figure to finish POTP. If we do however, I'm not sure how Scorponok or Omega Supreme could fit into the line.
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