The Energon Pub

[no-one]

I forget, what size class is the rumored Apeface? And more importantly, what is the preferred/desired size class?

Voyager. But traditionally, I think they were a tad bigger than the other HMs.

Yeah, I think you're right about the original size of the toys. So do "we" have a conservatist view point on their proper size as bigger than the TR headmasters (proper)?

[Cobotron]

I forget, what size class is the rumored Apeface? And more importantly, what is the preferred/desired size class?

Voyager. But traditionally, I think they were a tad bigger than the other HMs.

Yeah, I think you're right about the original size of the toys. So do "we" have a conservatist view point on their proper size as bigger than the TR headmasters (proper)?

Yes. Voyager seems apropos to me.

[o.supreme]

I really don't have any strong feelings one way or the other, the Headmaster Horrorcons would be neat to see at either scale. I just think that many fans got their hopes up with TR seeing as how all the voyagers sported triple changer function that was well suited to them. But IIRC the originals were pretty much the same size and price point as all the other headmasters.

If they were deluxe however, this amazing combination would be more feasible

[TulioDude]

We all know the most important Soundwave mode is the cybertronian lamp-post one.

[Hellscream9999]

We all know the most important Soundwave mode is the cybertronian lamp-post one.

I mean as an easter egg mode, its kinda funny, but I think a lot may have been sacrificed in order to do that, as I think if there is any line where he could be a satellite, aerial drone, or stealth bomber, this would be it. And, I mean, think about it, being a cybertronian satellite would actually make a lot of sense

[Cobotron]

We all know the most important Soundwave mode is the cybertronian lamp-post one.

I mean as an easter egg mode, its kinda funny, but I think a lot may have been sacrificed in order to do that, as I think if there is any line where he could be a satellite, aerial drone, or stealth bomber, this would be it. And, I mean, think about it, being a cybertronian satellite would actually make a lot of sense

Who's to say that space log mode isn't a satellite?

[Skritz]

We all know the most important Soundwave mode is the cybertronian lamp-post one.

I mean as an easter egg mode, its kinda funny, but I think a lot may have been sacrificed in order to do that, as I think if there is any line where he could be a satellite, aerial drone, or stealth bomber, this would be it. And, I mean, think about it, being a cybertronian satellite would actually make a lot of sense

Who's to say that space log mode isn't a satellite?

Being a space turd log worked fine for Optimus Primal! Okay, I joke, actually I absolutely adore POTP Primal but his smaller robot altmode is totally a space turd when taken alone and not as a surfboard.

[no-one]

We all know the most important Soundwave mode is the cybertronian lamp-post one.

I mean as an easter egg mode, its kinda funny, but I think a lot may have been sacrificed in order to do that, as I think if there is any line where he could be a satellite, aerial drone, or stealth bomber, this would be it. And, I mean, think about it, being a cybertronian satellite would actually make a lot of sense

Who's to say that space log mode isn't a satellite?

Some of my favorite satellites are logs.

[o.supreme]

Some of my favorite satellites are logs.

I always thought it was supposed to be a dog bone?

[Cobotron]

We all know the most important Soundwave mode is the cybertronian lamp-post one.

I mean as an easter egg mode, its kinda funny, but I think a lot may have been sacrificed in order to do that, as I think if there is any line where he could be a satellite, aerial drone, or stealth bomber, this would be it. And, I mean, think about it, being a cybertronian satellite would actually make a lot of sense

Who's to say that space log mode isn't a satellite?

Being a space turd log worked fine for Optimus Primal! Okay, I joke, actually I absolutely adore POTP Primal but his smaller robot altmode is totally a space turd when taken alone and not as a surfboard.

Historically, Transformers is riddled with space logs.
Poor, poor Shockwave.
At least this Siege Shockwave got some due justice.

@Cary- I got a bone to pick with you.

[Hellscream9999]

We all know the most important Soundwave mode is the cybertronian lamp-post one.

I mean as an easter egg mode, its kinda funny, but I think a lot may have been sacrificed in order to do that, as I think if there is any line where he could be a satellite, aerial drone, or stealth bomber, this would be it. And, I mean, think about it, being a cybertronian satellite would actually make a lot of sense

Who's to say that space log mode isn't a satellite?

I mean they can call his alt mode a satellite, just like they can say that strika's a female, but that doesn't mean anything if they don't give any visual cues to indicate it (though strika had a v.a. to support that, but my point still stands)

[Hellscream9999]

Poor, poor Shockwave.

That's pure nonsense, shockwave has always been a submarine

[-Kanrabat-]

Apeface and most likely Snapdragon coming. And as voyagers!
Now that's just perfect. Only thing left is to wait a year.

[Flashwave]

Just spitballing here, but I wonder if these Horrorcons might be legacy holdovers? How long does a toy linger in a design process? I ask, because we have heard a rumor of the Horrorcons for a while. I thibk tvat was the great big leak thst gave us the Combiners and really most of of Prime Wars, but anyway most of the leak that said "Horrorcons" ended up being true. Could these be those Horrorcons, just now findidng their way out of the design stage and maybe tweaked to by Titans Return compatible?

I could be way off base, but it will be interesting to see if the design asthetic for these matches older figures.

[D-Maximal_Primal]

I'm more surprised by the fact that there is the chance for a Wave 4 of voyagers or even a wave 5. Unless the Horrorcons are supposed to be exclusives or even part of the next line, or Siege is lasting past 4 waves

[Nathaniel Prime]

We all know the most important Soundwave mode is the cybertronian lamp-post one.

I mean as an easter egg mode, its kinda funny, but I think a lot may have been sacrificed in order to do that, as I think if there is any line where he could be a satellite, aerial drone, or stealth bomber, this would be it. And, I mean, think about it, being a cybertronian satellite would actually make a lot of sense

Who's to say that space log mode isn't a satellite?

Some of my favorite satellites are logs.

I thought it was... something else

[Wolfman Jake]

Just spitballing here, but I wonder if these Horrorcons might be legacy holdovers? How long does a toy linger in a design process? I ask, because we have heard a rumor of the Horrorcons for a while. I thibk tvat was the great big leak thst gave us the Combiners and really most of of Prime Wars, but anyway most of the leak that said "Horrorcons" ended up being true. Could these be those Horrorcons, just now findidng their way out of the design stage and maybe tweaked to by Titans Return compatible?

I could be way off base, but it will be interesting to see if the design asthetic for these matches older figures.

It's possible Apeface and Snapdragon were originally conceived as being part of Titans Return, but plans were changed around the time the decision was made to shorten subline imprints to one year only, like with Power of the Primes, instead of approximately 18 months like with Combiner Wars and Titans Return. In that case, I could see it being easy for Hasbro to finally put those molds out at the tail end of SIEGE, with TR compatibility intact, adding a bit of "battle damage" paint to the original designs to make them fit the "SIEGE" motif. It's also entirely possible that these are designs that began with fans asking "WTF?" when we didn't get Apeface and Snapdragon as triple changing Voyager Class figures in Titans Return.

Thinking about it now, Titans Return probably could have lasted two full years if Hasbro had so chosen. There was enough "unused" content left over to pull it off. We know already that some Titan Masters were scrapped. A few more waves of Legends figures might have given us most of the Throttlebots. The Deluxe Class could have included the Autobot Targetmasters to parallel the Decepticon Targetmasters we did get. Some later exclusives like Arcee, Grotusque, and Repugnus would have seen regular retail release instead. The Voyagers could have been filled out with the remaining triple changers (Springer, Sandstorm, Apeface, and Snapdragon) to give us a complete set of G1 triple changers reimagined with Headmaster compatibility. The sheer number of Leader Class figures that were pushed out was almost unprecedented, particularly when thinking about the number of unique and heavily retooled molds. That size class could have originally been planned to span two years of shelf life instead of just one with just the addition of a few easy repaints like Soundwave into Soundblaster or Blaster into Twincast. Then, there's the mysterious case of why we only got two box sets when the theme seemed to indicate four would have been better. Maybe a two year deal was the original idea before it was decided to keep refreshing the Generations brand yearly to keep up retailer interest. In other words, it might not be Power of the Primes that was cut short abruptly so much as it was Titans Return.

I'm eager to get my paws on SIEGE Springer. Looking at pictures of him, that looks like a very Titan Master friendly clear blue cockpit on both of his alt modes. I can almost see how his transformation would have worked without a fully integrated (non-removable) head.

I'm more surprised by the fact that there is the chance for a Wave 4 of voyagers or even a wave 5. Unless the Horrorcons are supposed to be exclusives or even part of the next line, or Siege is lasting past 4 waves

More than likely Apeface (and presumably Snapdragon) are the Wave 4 offerings. Springer and Thundercracker are only Wave 3, after all. We know we're getting four waves of Deluxe figures. Having 8 Voyagers across four waves still fits within Hasbro's 12-month per subline plan.

[Wireless_Phantom]

It definitely seems like they had to take Soundwave's arms off for that tape deck mode. Luckily I'm one of very few who like his cargo ship mode.

[Nemesis Primal]

I'm more surprised by the fact that there is the chance for a Wave 4 of voyagers or even a wave 5. Unless the Horrorcons are supposed to be exclusives or even part of the next line, or Siege is lasting past 4 waves

This is what excites me most about this as well, even more so than more new Cons. When Siege was going to be the same length as PotP (which I thought we heard for sure at some point, but maybe not?), I expected the last wave to be just as anticlimactic, but I guess Wave 4 of Studio Series doing well with more than just 1 figure made them change their minds? Either way, yay more Cons, and yay finishing incomplete group updates.

[Skritz]

I'm more surprised by the fact that there is the chance for a Wave 4 of voyagers or even a wave 5. Unless the Horrorcons are supposed to be exclusives or even part of the next line, or Siege is lasting past 4 waves

This is what excites me most about this as well, even more so than more new Cons. When Siege was going to be the same length as PotP (which I thought we heard for sure at some point, but maybe not?), I expected the last wave to be just as anticlimactic, but I guess Wave 4 of Studio Series doing well with more than just 1 figure made them change their minds? Either way, yay more Cons, and yay finishing incomplete group updates.

Not just more Decepticons, but Decepticons which are from the era of The Rebirth. In a line where most stuff is '84+The Movie.

[Wolfman Jake]

When Siege was going to be the same length as PotP (which I thought we heard for sure at some point, but maybe not?), I expected the last wave to be just as anticlimactic, but I guess Wave 4 of Studio Series doing well with more than just 1 figure made them change their minds? Either way, yay more Cons, and yay finishing incomplete group updates.

Keep in mind, though, that the Studio Series is meant to span multiple years. Right now, we know at least that it will be going through 2020, given that we've now seen Hasbro and Takara Tomy's road-map for the components to Devastator between 2019 and 2020. It doesn't make sense to have a "throw away" wave at the end of the year if the subline will be continuing as is into the next.

[Skritz]

Pretty sure Studio Series is basically a second Generations line at this point.

[Jeddostotle7]

Studio Series is something I can see being more like Marvel Legends or Star Wars: The Black Series, in that it just continues indefinitely with no big overarching theme, while the main Generations line continues with its constant finite sublines.

[Hellscream9999]

Pretty sure Studio Series is basically a second Generations line at this point.

I mean there's nothing wrong with that, the movies have been a thing for over a decade, and most of the original figures didn't really hold up when they came out, so the studio series - giving the movie characters the love and great figures they definitely needed - seems way more necessary than another line of seesunwun of geewun

[mordhelm]

So I was curious about who we are missing. I organized the list by number and this is what we have known right now:

BAT Battle Master
MIC Micro Master
DLX Deluxe
VOY Voyager
LDR Leader
CMD Commander
TTN Titan
EXC Exclusive

WFC-S01 BAT Firedrive
WFC-S02 BAT Lionizer
WFC-S03 BAT Blowpipe
WFC-S04 MIC Roadhandler & Swindler (Race Patrol)
WFC-S05 MIC Storm Cloud & Visper (Air Strike Patrol)
WFC-S06 MIC Autobot Topshot & Flak(Battle Patrol)
WFC-S07 DLX Sideswipe
WFC-S08 DLX Cog(Weaponizer)
WFC-S09 DLX Autobot Hound
WFC-S10 DLX Skytread
WFC-S11 VOY Optimus Prime
WFC-S12 VOY Megatron
WFC-S13 LDR Ultra Magnus
WFC-S14 VOY Decepticon Shockwave
WFC-S15 EXC Autobot Greenlight & Dazlestrike
WFC-S16 BAT Pteraxadon
WFC-S17 BAT Aimless
WFC-S18 MIC Laserbeak& Ravage(Spy Patrol)
WFC-S19 MIC Red Heat& Stakeout (Rescue Patrol)
WFC-S20 DLX Chromia
WFC-S21 DLX Ironhide
WFC-S22 DLX Autobot Sixgun(Weaponizer)
WFC-S23 DLX Prowl
WFC-S24 VOY Starscream
WFC-S25 VOY Soundwave
WFC-S26 ???
WFC-S27 ???
WFC-S28 CMD Jetfire
WFC-S29 TTN Omega Supreme (w/ Countdown)
WFC-S30 BAT Caliburst
WFC-S31 BAT Smashdown
WFC-S32 ???
WFC-S33 ???
WFC-S34 ???
WFC-S35 DLX Red Alert
WFC-S36 ???
WFC-S37 ???
WFC-S38 VOY Autobot Springer
WFC-S39 VOY Thundercracker
WFC-S40 LDR Galaxy Upgrade Optimus Prime
WFC-S41 DLX Barricade
WFC-S42 DLX Autobot Impactor
WFC-S43 DLX Autobot Mirage

WFC-S3? DLX Brunt(Weaponizer)
WFC-S3? DLX Refracktor
WFC-S?? EXC Skywarp
WFC-S?? EXC Firestormer pack
WFC-S?? DLX Ratchet

So we have at least 2 figures totally unaccounted for. Based on this being a 1yr line and the astrotrain rumor being december I am going to say that Astrotrain and Apeface are WFC Pt2 not Siege.

I am going to throw a guess out there that following are going to happen:
Rumble and Frenzy (S32 or 33)
Exclusive Lancer
Exclusive Ratchet

So S32 is Rumble and Frenzy
S34 S36 are Brunt and Refracktor

S26 S27 and S37 are Skywarp, Firestormer, Lancer, and Ratchet.

The only thing that gives me some pause on this theory is that Ratchet is a pretty late release, almost makes sense for him to be in the 40s.

Anyone else wanna share thoughts?