Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

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Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Tigertrack » Sun May 04, 2008 6:14 am

Motto: "A good head and a good heart are always a formidable combination."
Weapon: Sniper Rifle
*edited with a list of sellers who are suspect-

The Knockoffs: Who wants one anyway ("I do I do," some say.) The very tempting toys...
I know that the thought of a KO 'transformer' making it in to someone's collection would turn them ill. Others buy them to have as part of their collection to kitbash, fill a void until an
original can be found, or (insert reason here).

I have to say, I am guilty of buying some of the newest G1 accurate KO's (sorry HASBRO, I promise never to do it again). I did this because I knew there would never be a NEMESIS MIRAGE made, and also because I knew getting my hands on the red version of the G1 Mirage mold was as likely to happen as me winning the lottery to be able to afford it. So I justified the purchases to myself. However you justify buying or not buying them though, the fact is these are out there, and they are taking the money of loyal TF brand buyers and in some cases deceiving them into believing they are buying an officially licensed re-issue (Deceptive seller title to avoid the HASBRO hammer of truth). Or in some other cases, buying a vintage piece (outrageous seller claim!). HASBRO has taken notice, and seem to be slowly but surely attempting to take action, but based on their blanket statement made at Botcon it seems they are more concerned with warning their purchasing public, and less worried about stopping this (and the lunchtime specials).

KO Transformers have been out forever. As long as there have been toys, there have been cheaply made KO's sold and bought (just ask ol' Spidey), and since Transformers are very popular, well, cash called and asked if you wanted to make some...but none have been this accurate, this spot on, which is what makes them so tempting.

Spotting A G1 'Vintage' Re-issue KO:
Yes, I know the title seems obvious, but some people may not know that sellers often replace 'Knock Off' with 'Re-Issue' because well, they are smart and want to sell product. Which sounds like a nicer, friendlier name to you, KNOCK OFF, or RE-ISSUE?

#1) So be leery when you see the name 'Re-issue!' in an auction title. You may be purchasing a product that you are not intending. 'KO reissue' means just that-- it's a Knock Off--!

#2) Price-- It seems obvious to collectors that have been around the block that getting a MINT IN SEALED BOX VINTAGE G1 Optimus Prime for $80.00 is outrageously cheap, and will never happen these days. But to the naive grandmother shopping for her grandson/daughter that may seem about right--even too much. Poor HASBRO, you lost another, and worse, you may have lost a potential money maker because this mistake was made. Poor quality in the KO, it breaks, "I'm not buying any more of those for my grandchildren" and BAM! a customer may be lost to the market or brand. I know this is extreme, and I also know seniors are not the only naive buyers out there, it was simply to make a point. The poor quality will win out, and may cause some to change their favorites because there was no reliability in a supposedly quality product (Mattel is feeling this wrath right now). HASBRO gets screwed but really had nothing to do with it. Let's not forget also that Prime is also tripley caution worthy because he has been re-issued a few times, and his ENCORE version is worth about $80 in some places.

The List of Vintage G1 Knock Offs that 'Look' and 'Feel' just like 1984-1989:

Yes, it's true they do, and they do. My Mirages feel and look just like my original--minus the dirtiness (of course, my new ones have the variant colors...).

How can one avoid them? The best way, be armed with knowledge, and ask questions. To help with the knowledge part, I am attempting to create a list of these accurate phonies with their respective repaints in hopes that it will help someone along the way make an informed choice whether to buy or not. I don't care either way, but you need to know what you are getting, or what you are not getting. There are a lot of good people on this site that can give you their thoughts about the item, thus, there is no reason for you to get taken out of your hard earned money, use it on what you intend to, not on something that was a mistake!

This is the list of Transformers marketed as possible re-issues that are not licensed re-issues that have boxart, box, specs, bubble, weapons--everything accurate to the original--even the quality SOMETIMES.


Beachcomber
Bluestreak (blue)
Bombshell
Brawn
Bumblebee
Buzzsaw/Lazerbeak (Normal, clear, clear orange, clear blue, white, and black)
Cliffjumper
Constructicon Boxed Set (G1 colored)
Constructicons Boxex Set (G1 box, G2 orange/purple colored)
Cosmos
Cyclonus
Frenzy/Rumble (Normal, clear, clear orange, clear blue, white, black)
Gnaw (Sharkticon)
Grimlock (Normal, Clear)
Hubcap
Kickback
Lazerbeak/Buzzsaw (Normal, clear, clear orange, clear blue, white, and black)
Metroplex (Normal, Metrotitan variant colors)
Mirage (Normal, Black, Clear, Red)
Optimus Prime (Normal, Normal/gold chrome**, Black***, Clear, Tan)
Outback
Powerglide*
Prowl (no POLICE sticker on doors in package)
Reflector (Updated 5/15)
Ratbat
Ravage
Rumble/Frenzy (Normal, clear, clear orange, clear blue, white, and black)
Seaspray
Scourge
Shrapnel
Slag (Normal, Clear)
Sludge (Normal, Clear)
Snarl
Sunstreaker
Swoop
Warpath
Wheeljack
Windcharger

*Image


--NEW--Here's a list of sellers who don't state their Transformers items (figures, accessories, stickers, instructions, packaging) are bootlegs or even 'reissues':
yc-collection
mecharsi
akara32
trainee007
linanma
zoe_jj1984
doufaceb (some items)



I hope someone finds this useful and makes an informed decision because of it. If there are missing TF's on the KO list let me know and I will add them. If there are more ways/tricks to spotting them, I will be glad to add them in.

Remember, be forewarned, and go shopping with knowledge!

Image
*nope not mine, but a cool picture, nonetheless

**Image

***Image

The saying goes "If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it must be a duck!" does not apply to Transformers. Transformers is a brand name that applies to a product owned by HASBRO and TAKARA/TOMY. If it has the name TRANSFORMERS it is an approved product--until now, at least--. But just because it is a transforming toy, does not put it in the category of being the official TRANSFORMERS that HASBRO and TAKARA/TOMY intend and approve to put on the market. Be careful in your shopping, be cautious, be wise, and know what you are buying.
Last edited by Tigertrack on Thu Oct 02, 2008 6:18 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Counterpunch » Sun May 04, 2008 11:31 am

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This is good stuff.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Tigertrack » Sun May 04, 2008 2:53 pm

Motto: "A good head and a good heart are always a formidable combination."
Weapon: Sniper Rifle
Counterpunch wrote:This is good stuff.



Thanks, a solid compliment from an accomplished writer. I updated with the KO cassettes...sold in two packs in so many deliciously cool new 'flavors'! Yes, I do have those as well (how could I forget?). 8)
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Zeds » Sun May 04, 2008 3:12 pm

Motto: "I once lost a battle. So long ago I can barely remember it."
Weapon: Thermal Melters
Well done. Can you keep this thread actively showing up and updated as more are released?
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Tigertrack » Sun May 04, 2008 3:41 pm

Motto: "A good head and a good heart are always a formidable combination."
Weapon: Sniper Rifle
That was my intent.

If I can get someone with powers beyond mine to sticky it, we'll be all set.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Liege Evilmus » Sun May 04, 2008 4:41 pm

I am real happy that someone went ahead with starting this!

And yes, it should be stickied, as well as updated with future KO Alerts.

This type of article is a very useful tool for unsure buyers.

2 more pics of fakes for you...
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Tigertrack » Sun May 04, 2008 5:53 pm

Motto: "A good head and a good heart are always a formidable combination."
Weapon: Sniper Rifle
Thanks, those are helpful! :D
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Liege Evilmus » Sun May 04, 2008 6:36 pm

tigertracks 24 wrote:Thanks, those are helpful! :D


I bookmarked this thread. I hate KOs being passed for the real thing, so whatever information I can add, well known or obscure, I plan on doing so.

See it's not so much that I hate KOs, it's more that I hate seeing people getting screwed out of a hard earned dollar.

If buyers need be wary, let those of us with more than plenty help the wary out!
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Maxuz Prime » Sun May 04, 2008 9:57 pm

this thread is a great ideal. i have been tring for as long as i can remember to get g1 optimus prime for my older brother and if i ever do and find out its a KO im going to be super pissed.

i only buy from stores like wal-mart, toys r us, ect. i hope that means im not buing KO.


again great thread.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby muswp1 » Sun May 04, 2008 10:04 pm

Weapon: Double-Barreled Assault Missile Launcher
I'm starting to get fed up with the KO's too. I consider myself reasonably informed about what's geniune and what's not and I'm having a hard time telling between what's a KO and what's not. Aside from the obvious (minibot KO's packaged in robot mode, the Metrotitan KO in the wrong box, etc...), it can be hard for the uninformed to spot these fakes.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby muswp1 » Sun May 04, 2008 10:05 pm

Weapon: Double-Barreled Assault Missile Launcher
tigertracks 24 wrote:That was my intent.

If I can get someone with powers beyond mine to sticky it, we'll be all set.


Someone did. It's now stuck to the top of the Toys forum.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby timothyVritchey » Sun May 04, 2008 10:30 pm

are there any noticeable packaging differences, if so could you post visual comparison photographs.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Editor » Sun May 04, 2008 11:01 pm

Motto: ""I'm not even supposed to be here today!""
Weapon: Shotgun
I really am of 2 minds on this debate.

1 side:
I have bought(knowingly) a number of the KO's made recently, mostly cassettes, and the all black Prime shown in the first post. And with some the drop in quality is there, (Ratbat is really loose, and I had to take hobby tools to Primes tyres to try and fix them).

Knowing that these were fakes and that it gave me a chance to pick up some pieces that just weren't available previously I really don't mind who or how they were made, has given my collection aboost that i'm happy with.

And yes they are good for custom jobs. Clear plastic Buzzsaw + Gold weapons + Reprolabel show upgrade wing stickers = Crystal Buzzsaw full of win.

Other side:
As cool as I think it is to see fairly accurate G1 packaging on KO's, I believe this to be deceptive and cruel in the way some dealers will pass them off as originals. I tend to be rather paranoid in the first place whether pieces I'm looking at that are in good condition may be KO's regardless if they are genuine or not, and the place I buy KO's from is up front with everyone that the KO's he has are not originals. But as a fan it makes me sick to hear of some dealers or online sellers tricking/conning/lying to buyers about the pieces they are selling.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby fenrir72 » Mon May 05, 2008 12:37 am

Motto: "Power to the strong and the right!"
Weapon: Plasma Cannon
Buyer beware, especially via Ebay. I'd hope the sellers will label them as "near accurate" copies of the originals instead of the real thing.

I recently purchased a devastator set and Grimlock Dinobot Bommander and I am astounded by the quality. It will "almost" pass of like the real thing.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Miguelangel » Mon May 05, 2008 6:06 am

It would be useful if a list of those sellers on Ebay who list KO's is made public, in order to avoid them.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Kryptikore » Mon May 05, 2008 7:29 am

I don't know about you guys, but knock off or not! I want one of those Optimus Pimp Primes! Bling Bling!
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby TFBuyer » Mon May 05, 2008 7:36 am

Weapon: Sniper Rifle
tigertracks 24 wrote:[
I have to say, I am guilty of buying some of the newest G1 accurate KO's (sorry HASBRO, I promise never to do it again). I did this because I knew there would never be a NEMESIS MIRAGE made, and also because I knew getting my hands on the red version of the G1 Mirage mold was as likely to happen as me winning the lottery to be able to afford it.


I've been eyeing these KOs for a while now...exactly how close to the original quality are these? I'm most interested in the clear version, as I think it would be an interesting piece to display with my G1s... I've heard they're some of the best quality KOs out there, but I've yet to take the plunge and drop $50 on one.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby dragons » Mon May 05, 2008 8:04 am

are there any noticeable packaging differences, if so could you post visual comparison photographs.


good question wandering about that my self

well worth the advice and information.

ebay i wouldnt count on ebay information to much when it comes to a seller some sellers will just say anything and just take your money and not ship the itme to you and there are other sellers that are honest and loyal to the sellers.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby capellamusic » Mon May 05, 2008 8:25 am

Motto: "Sex, food and rock'n'roll"
Weapon: Cerebro-Shell Launcher
I had noticed on Grimlock KO eBay auctions that from the pictures its box has a typo, it says "Bommander" instead of "Commander" in his function section.

Other than that I'd really look forward to a dedicated section on this site, easily found by everyone, where all the "accurate" KOs were listed, with photos, comparison photos (to show the give-aways), and the known sellers on eBay that pass them as originals. It would be for the benefit of everyone.

I had bought a Superion and Devastator KO before but then I regreted it and want to get rid of them and buy the originals. I already have 3 original aerialbots. About Devastator I'm hoping for an Encore giftset... And I really got angry about the KOs after being sold a loose Buzzsaw being passed as an original on eBay. These are the KOs I have, and I want to switch them by their originals... what a waste of money it was, and my Devastator KO is one of the old ones, which weren't that good. I was deceived only on Buzzsaw though.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby LuckytheWonderLlama » Mon May 05, 2008 9:27 am

So is it easier and cheaper to get KOs than endlessly struggle to find the real thing?

I would love to get my hands on a G1 Mirage since the one that I have is in two parts, broken at the waist and the screws are all striped so I can't open him up and replace the part.

I'd settle for a KO.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby T-Macksimus » Mon May 05, 2008 9:36 am

Such info is of great use to someone like myself who frequents Thrift Stores, Swap Meets and garage sales in search of older figures and "parts bots". I have come across some great finds but have also picked up a few that I thought were kind of suspicious and after a lot of online digging, my suspicions were confirmed and those toys were tossed into the "parts and kitbash" tub. It took a lot of time to track down the right info since the copyright mark on 2 of the toys was worn down so badly they were unreadable. Having a list takes a lot of the guesswork out of it. (Seibertrons imense, detailed photo gallery helps a lot, too. I used it to double check on some subtle variations of G1 figures.)
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby capellamusic » Mon May 05, 2008 10:01 am

Motto: "Sex, food and rock'n'roll"
Weapon: Cerebro-Shell Launcher
LuckytheWonderLlama wrote:So is it easier and cheaper to get KOs than endlessly struggle to find the real thing?

I would love to get my hands on a G1 Mirage since the one that I have is in two parts, broken at the waist and the screws are all striped so I can't open him up and replace the part.

I'd settle for a KO.


Striped screws? Try the following:

http://alsnetbiz.com/homeimprovement/damaged_screw.html

http://www.aldn.com/xout/

I still haven't tried that, but I will on my Hot Spot in order to completely restore it.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Tigertrack » Mon May 05, 2008 10:24 am

Motto: "A good head and a good heart are always a formidable combination."
Weapon: Sniper Rifle
dragons wrote:
are there any noticeable packaging differences, if so could you post visual comparison photographs.


good question wandering about that my self

well worth the advice and information.

ebay i wouldnt count on ebay information to much when it comes to a seller some sellers will just say anything and just take your money and not ship the itme to you and there are other sellers that are honest and loyal to the sellers.


That's part of the problem, the packages are not different enough without any close handling to say it is not vintage. Unless you count the misspelled Bommander mentioned earlier.

Image

I just typed in 'Transformers Grimlock Reissue' on Ebay and got 40 returns, 16 of which were for the KO Grimlock. :-x

Putting seller names on a list is not really the answer either. Many sell other quality goods, and are not trying to mislead, although I have noticed the phrase 'Reissue KO' in many auctions.
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby Tigertrack » Mon May 05, 2008 10:28 am

Motto: "A good head and a good heart are always a formidable combination."
Weapon: Sniper Rifle
capellamusic wrote:
LuckytheWonderLlama wrote:So is it easier and cheaper to get KOs than endlessly struggle to find the real thing?

I would love to get my hands on a G1 Mirage since the one that I have is in two parts, broken at the waist and the screws are all striped so I can't open him up and replace the part.

I'd settle for a KO.


Striped screws? Try the following:

http://alsnetbiz.com/homeimprovement/damaged_screw.html

http://www.aldn.com/xout/

I still haven't tried that, but I will on my Hot Spot in order to completely restore it.


BTW its stripped screws. Striped is like a zebra. Stripped in this case is like a screw that has been twisted so much and so hard that the metal has been cleaned out on the top, thus not allowing for resistance to the screwdriver's turn.

Pics of KO Boxes might help, might not. What do you guys think?
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Re: Accurate G1 KO's: How to identify them, and the list!

Postby fenrir72 » Mon May 05, 2008 10:36 am

Motto: "Power to the strong and the right!"
Weapon: Plasma Cannon
I own both Grimlock and the Constructicon Devastator set unofficial re-issue i.e KO.

First things first, the box and instruction manuals are replete with typos( not sure if it's intentional) but aside from some rough molding (Grimlock's case on his black parts and the energo sword) and the god@mn cheapo type of paper used on the labeling sheet, these products are near accurate recreations.

Devastator for instance( besides the paper based labels) is pretty solid and neatly molded. The chrome is thick and shiny, no blots (as compared with the G2 official orange re-issues which was pure cr@p.

Scavenger's right foot is kinda loose though....................

Why'd I buy one? Unless Takara'd re-issue an official one, I've just about given up on getting Grimlock second hand, same with the Constructicons.
Buy Official Hb/TakaraTitancityformers at retail price or else the 3rd party makers win!

"Shelfwarming"
Btw, its been nearly a year now and TR Soundwave and Blaster aren't moving in the shelve of TRU, is that shelfwarming or what?


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