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william-james88 wrote:Sabrblade wrote:Bit of an odd request but here you go.Ultra Markus wrote:i want see a comparison with the original beastwars and 10th anniversary megatron
Transformers Beast Wars Reborn Megatron (Reissue) Gallery
Pretty sure they meant they want to see this new one compared to both those toys.
Are you saying that design doesn't translate well to toy form?DeathReviews wrote:I know Beast Wars has devoted fans - but to me, all the figures and characters just seemed - sloppy. Sure, having a full blown Tyrannosaur HEAD for a hand sounds cool, but in practical application, not so much. Hard pass on all of these....
He's saying a head for a hand is impractical.Rodimus Prime wrote:Are you saying that design doesn't translate well to toy form?DeathReviews wrote:I know Beast Wars has devoted fans - but to me, all the figures and characters just seemed - sloppy. Sure, having a full blown Tyrannosaur HEAD for a hand sounds cool, but in practical application, not so much. Hard pass on all of these....
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Sabrblade wrote:He's saying a head for a hand is impractical.Rodimus Prime wrote:Are you saying that design doesn't translate well to toy form?DeathReviews wrote:I know Beast Wars has devoted fans - but to me, all the figures and characters just seemed - sloppy. Sure, having a full blown Tyrannosaur HEAD for a hand sounds cool, but in practical application, not so much. Hard pass on all of these....
DeathReviews wrote:For almost all the original Beast Wars characters and figures, there were just so many of the beast parts that didn't integrate convincingly into a robot mode (without coming across as animal part kibble), while the beast modes had too many seams and gaps to really pull off a successful animal mode.
I'm not saying that was wrong - it was a design angle they wanted to run with for a while. But it's just not my 'thing'. I won't take away from the people who DO like these - my not collecting them will just mean more for them
william-james88 wrote:o.supreme wrote:Seems like a lot of early reviews are popping up fore core class. ( Normal reviewts though not sample swipers) Have these been spotted in store yet, or does a particular online retailer have them in stock?
They are readily available on Ebay from international sellers
chuckdawg1999 wrote:DeathReviews wrote:For almost all the original Beast Wars characters and figures, there were just so many of the beast parts that didn't integrate convincingly into a robot mode (without coming across as animal part kibble), while the beast modes had too many seams and gaps to really pull off a successful animal mode.
I'm not saying that was wrong - it was a design angle they wanted to run with for a while. But it's just not my 'thing'. I won't take away from the people who DO like these - my not collecting them will just mean more for them
That's my big issue with Beast Wars, that and no real limbs in robot mode, odd proportions, chicken legs, etc. Obviously, people who grew up with Beast Wars designed the live-action movie bots.william-james88 wrote:o.supreme wrote:Seems like a lot of early reviews are popping up fore core class. ( Normal reviewts though not sample swipers) Have these been spotted in store yet, or does a particular online retailer have them in stock?
They are readily available on Ebay from international sellers
Mine came from a domestic seller, in my state even.
Rtron wrote:chuckdawg1999 wrote:DeathReviews wrote:For almost all the original Beast Wars characters and figures, there were just so many of the beast parts that didn't integrate convincingly into a robot mode (without coming across as animal part kibble), while the beast modes had too many seams and gaps to really pull off a successful animal mode.
I'm not saying that was wrong - it was a design angle they wanted to run with for a while. But it's just not my 'thing'. I won't take away from the people who DO like these - my not collecting them will just mean more for them
That's my big issue with Beast Wars, that and no real limbs in robot mode, odd proportions, chicken legs, etc. Obviously, people who grew up with Beast Wars designed the live-action movie bots.william-james88 wrote:o.supreme wrote:Seems like a lot of early reviews are popping up fore core class. ( Normal reviewts though not sample swipers) Have these been spotted in store yet, or does a particular online retailer have them in stock?
They are readily available on Ebay from international sellers
Mine came from a domestic seller, in my state even.
The movies came only ten years after Beast Wars. So people who grew up with Beast Wars would be in their late teens at most when the movies entered preproduction. So your maths don't check out. All of those things you say are just design cues that say "This guy is an alien.". Which the Transformers are.
It does seem to be true that, in general, people who like Beast Wars designs also like Movie designs. But given than most people who watched Beast Wars as little kids were teens when the Bay movies came out, and thus the prime audience for the films, it's not surprising.
chuckdawg1999 wrote:Rtron wrote:chuckdawg1999 wrote:DeathReviews wrote:For almost all the original Beast Wars characters and figures, there were just so many of the beast parts that didn't integrate convincingly into a robot mode (without coming across as animal part kibble), while the beast modes had too many seams and gaps to really pull off a successful animal mode.
I'm not saying that was wrong - it was a design angle they wanted to run with for a while. But it's just not my 'thing'. I won't take away from the people who DO like these - my not collecting them will just mean more for them
That's my big issue with Beast Wars, that and no real limbs in robot mode, odd proportions, chicken legs, etc. Obviously, people who grew up with Beast Wars designed the live-action movie bots.william-james88 wrote:o.supreme wrote:Seems like a lot of early reviews are popping up fore core class. ( Normal reviewts though not sample swipers) Have these been spotted in store yet, or does a particular online retailer have them in stock?
They are readily available on Ebay from international sellers
Mine came from a domestic seller, in my state even.
The movies came only ten years after Beast Wars. So people who grew up with Beast Wars would be in their late teens at most when the movies entered preproduction. So your maths don't check out. All of those things you say are just design cues that say "This guy is an alien.". Which the Transformers are.
It does seem to be true that, in general, people who like Beast Wars designs also like Movie designs. But given than most people who watched Beast Wars as little kids were teens when the Bay movies came out, and thus the prime audience for the films, it's not surprising.
I believe Beast Wars had an older audience because of the early CGI tech
Indeed. And with the movies, Universal's bigwigs insisted on the designs going out of their way to look like life-forms rather than something somebody built. They would have been so extreme as to be unrecognizable as Transformers, but one of the toy designers was able to make a mockup that convinced them to back down. Honestly, I like that it re-expanded our design horizons - alien robots with reconfigurable mechanical bodies need not be bound to "humanoid but with short narrow thighs and long, broad calves" especially when that wasn't the established design for a particular universe's version of a character.Rtron wrote:chuckdawg1999 wrote:That's my big issue with Beast Wars, that and no real limbs in robot mode, odd proportions, chicken legs, etc. Obviously, people who grew up with Beast Wars designed the live-action movie bots.
The movies came only ten years after Beast Wars. So people who grew up with Beast Wars would be in their late teens at most when the movies entered preproduction. So your maths don't check out. All of those things you say are just design cues that say "This guy is an alien.". Which the Transformers are.
SS Grimlock is a head taller than SIEGE Ultra Magnus in robot mode, and appears to be close to that in dino mode as well. Just how freakin' big were you wanting him to be? Or were you assuming his height based on Megatron?blackeyedprime wrote:Think I'll wait for KO MP reissue or bite the bullet on MP at some point, Kingdoms good but if I'm just having one version of him on my shelves he loses out. Def confirms SS Grimlock is way too small for me so that is money saved on him and his team mates.
Dominus Prime wrote:I think because of this very debate among fans that they should have made it an option to remove the t-rex head to reveal a hand. Plus I don't see any ports on him for weaponizers, fossolizers etc
ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:SS Grimlock is a head taller than SIEGE Ultra Magnus in robot mode, and appears to be close to that in dino mode as well. Just how freakin' big were you wanting him to be? Or were you assuming his height based on Megatron?blackeyedprime wrote:Think I'll wait for KO MP reissue or bite the bullet on MP at some point, Kingdoms good but if I'm just having one version of him on my shelves he loses out. Def confirms SS Grimlock is way too small for me so that is money saved on him and his team mates.
Sabrblade wrote:He's saying a head for a hand is impractical.
1. That's only as far as the movie goes, in that the movie heavily bloated the Dinobots' dino mode size in half the shots (basically every shot of them on Quintessa, and some of the shuttle flight shots). You have to balance that out with the show size, where they still loomed over most of the cast but they weren't that huge. The Quintessa shots inflate them to damn near Skyfire size.blackeyedprime wrote:ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:SS Grimlock is a head taller than SIEGE Ultra Magnus in robot mode, and appears to be close to that in dino mode as well. Just how freakin' big were you wanting him to be? Or were you assuming his height based on Megatron?blackeyedprime wrote:Think I'll wait for KO MP reissue or bite the bullet on MP at some point, Kingdoms good but if I'm just having one version of him on my shelves he loses out. Def confirms SS Grimlock is way too small for me so that is money saved on him and his team mates.
Def wanted him to be old leader sized for bot mode but having seen Tontons video the oversized MP looks correct scale wise to the movie as deluxes would stand at head level with his dino legs. Oversize MP/MP with boots form Scoria/Fanstoys seems to be the correct scale dino wise.
1. Going by the cartoon scale chart, SIEGE Magnus (unlike SIEGE Optimus) actually has his correct height. It's not correct going by how tall a trailer big enough to carry 4 Deluxe-class Autobots in car mode would be as armor (Which would actually put him in Skyfire's height category, so it's not like CW Magnus is really any better), but it's at least right by the animation and the chart.blackeyedprime wrote:Siege Magnus really needs the DNA upgrade kit to give him his correct height (as well as complete vehicle mode) so for me Grimlock bot mode would have to be bigger than that or CW magnus -though I do prefer studio series shoulder line.
ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:1. That's only as far as the movie goes, in that the movie heavily bloated the Dinobots' dino mode size in half the shots (basically every shot of them on Quintessa, and some of the shuttle flight shots). You have to balance that out with the show size, where they still loomed over most of the cast but they weren't that huge. The Quintessa shots inflate them to damn near Skyfire size.
ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:2. At a head taller than SIEGE Magnus in robot mode, SS86 Grimlock pretty much is old leader size. That's the same margin by which TR and PotP Leaders are taller - I know this for certain because I have SIEGE Mags in front of PotP Roddy. Unless by old leader you meant RiD-DotM, in which case you were deluding yourself from the start because no Generations Leader has been that big; that size requires the Commander price point now.
ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:1. Going by the cartoon scale chart, SIEGE Magnus (unlike SIEGE Optimus) actually has his correct height. It's not correct going by how tall a trailer big enough to carry 4 Deluxe-class Autobots in car mode would be as armor (Which would actually put him in Skyfire's height category, so it's not like CW Magnus is really any better), but it's at least right by the animation and the chart.
ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:2. Unless DNA has produced a newer, far more expansive kit than DK-14 (and as far as I can tell, they have not)... the DNA kit gives Ultra Magnus neither of those things. First off, his vehicle mode was already complete since it's based off RiD Magnus; all DK-14 does is make the cab stick out further, it's not like it makes the trailer more G1 or expands the carrying capacity. That would basically require a whole new, larger trailer - and that seems to be more effort than the lazy 3P bozos are willing to expend these days.
Second, DK-14 makes the inner robot more like a CW Voyager in height (which is admittedly nice), and it makes the armored mode closer in height to CW Magnus... but see what I said about UM's height in item 1.
I had almost the exact same experience up until you said BW fans weren't in the theater for Bay's first movie. Seems all the people watching Bay movies around me were my either my age (round 17 at the time) or my parent's age (boomers). All the genx guys 10+ years older than me (G1 fans) that I talked to hated it and refused to go see it.King Kuuga wrote:I was six when it started and maybe six or seven when I discovered it. I'd guess probably 8 when I actually found a way to watch the cartoon. When the news about the live action movies dropped, I was 15 or so. I was a month shy of 17 when the first movie came out in 2007...Beast Wars kids, by and large, were not in the room for those movies. At least not the first one.
My dad was/is no where near a TF fan and he loved BW because of the CGI. LOVED IT. Lol.chuckdawg1999 wrote:I believe Beast Wars had an older audience because of the early CGI tech
I love the behind-the-scenes stuff. Very cool. I always find that understanding what went into decisions makes the decisions make a lot more sense. BTW movie Starscream looks freaking awesome regardless of "why" IMHO.ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:making [Starscream] both bow-legged and digitigrade was an explicit decision to reduce his height, and make any scale cheating less blatant because scale cheating is a lot more noticeable in live action.
Same for Jetfire being a digitigrade hunchback - it reduced his height and made it easier to bring his eyeline closer to the level of humans.
I would say Claw, Jaw, Armordillo, Rattrap, Tarantulas, Scorponok, Airrazor, Airhammer, Cidacadon, Ram Horn, Iguanus (shall I go on?) could be said to have 'chicken legs' when compared to almost any G1 character, Jazz, Prime, Megatron, Starscream, Grapple, Huffer, etc. I think 'chicken legs' is a pretty dumb way to describe it though, I mean in that case you could say a Spider Man or Batman figure have 'chicken legs'. But hey, G1 people seem committed to hating on other toylines, so I let them have it most of the time, lol...Emerje wrote:Chicken legs aren't really a thing in Beast Wars anyway, not even sure where that idea came from. There are a few figures that have unusual leg joints, but most of those are from Transmetals 2 like Cheetor and Scourge and that was just to emphasize their twisted appearance. Megatron doesn't have chicken legs since his robot knee sits back from the t-rex knee fixing his alignment to his foot.
I mean, I can agree and disagree with you. They are just toys and in that sense, should really only be purchased if they're actually going to be FUN and not just if they do / don't fit in with an overly airtight rule guide. But then again, there is an imagination element in it all that comes "into play" (lol) that does want to, for instance, have a toy of a Dinobot be larger than a toy of a Mustang, you know. I dunno. You know?AcademyofDrX wrote:Scale guides are to help animators do their jobs, they're not some kind of absolute or universal truth....There's something about the word "correct" in this context that I just can't accept.
When he said "in the room for", he meant "involved with the production of".Bone Age wrote:So many good discussions going on at the same time right now.I had almost the exact same experience up until you said BW fans weren't in the theater for Bay's first movie.King Kuuga wrote:I was six when it started and maybe six or seven when I discovered it. I'd guess probably 8 when I actually found a way to watch the cartoon. When the news about the live action movies dropped, I was 15 or so. I was a month shy of 17 when the first movie came out in 2007...Beast Wars kids, by and large, were not in the room for those movies. At least not the first one.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
That makes a lot more sense. I had a feeling I was misinterpreting what he'd said, I almost went back and edited to say that. Thank ya.Sabrblade wrote:When he said "in the room for", he meant "involved with the production of".Bone Age wrote:So many good discussions going on at the same time right now.I had almost the exact same experience up until you said BW fans weren't in the theater for Bay's first movie.King Kuuga wrote:I was six when it started and maybe six or seven when I discovered it. I'd guess probably 8 when I actually found a way to watch the cartoon. When the news about the live action movies dropped, I was 15 or so. I was a month shy of 17 when the first movie came out in 2007...Beast Wars kids, by and large, were not in the room for those movies. At least not the first one.
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