The Energon Pub

by **JohnnyZero** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 1:10 pm

Maybe I'm mistaken or missed some dialogue but, was it not explained in ROTF that Optimus was the last living Prime? Because Sentinel Prime would make that invalid...

Could someone clear this up for me? Thanks in advance!

(Sorry if this is a thread already, I did a quick look and didnt see one)

News Credits: 2 · by **Shadowman** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 1:23 pm

Yeah, but in Transformers, as with comics, death isn't permanent.

by **JohnnyZero** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 1:27 pm

Right I understand that... I was just pointing out the fact that the first spoiler showed Sentinel Prime very much alive on the moon in the 60's... so, unless the Government shut him down or something, he would still be alive during the events of ROTF since he is in DOTM... The Fallen, IIRC, says that Optimus was the last living Prime... so is this a huge plot hole or am I missing something, or do you think it will be explained in the upcoming film?

by **BeastWarsFTW** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 1:35 pm

The only thing I can figure on this is when sentinel prime was on the moon he is 'off-line' or in stasis so he cannot be detected. Same thing with megatron in the first movie. He was in stasis and could not detect him and thats why they hacked the internet to find him. So this would fit in with the fallen's statement of optimus being the last prime at that moment in time..

by **Red 50** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 3:03 pm

BeastWarsFTW wrote:The only thing I can figure on this is when sentinel prime was on the moon he is 'off-line' or in stasis so he cannot be detected. Same thing with megatron in the first movie. He was in stasis and could not detect him and thats why they hacked the internet to find him. So this would fit in with the fallen's statement of optimus being the last prime at that moment in time..

But he came online in what... 60's, while the action in ROTF is pretty much in the 21st century's first decade, so he should have been alive at then.

My theory still is that he might be a forgotten Prime. Like he's officially declared dead or was another Prime's secret child.

Nah, actually the first is more likely. And I believe that it can happen in REAL life.

by **BeastWarsFTW** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 3:18 pm

Red 50 wrote:
BeastWarsFTW wrote:The only thing I can figure on this is when sentinel prime was on the moon he is 'off-line' or in stasis so he cannot be detected. Same thing with megatron in the first movie. He was in stasis and could not detect him and thats why they hacked the internet to find him. So this would fit in with the fallen's statement of optimus being the last prime at that moment in time..

But he came online in what... 60's, while the action in ROTF is pretty much in the 21st century's first decade, so he should have been alive at then.

My theory still is that he might be a forgotten Prime. Like he's officially declared dead or was another Prime's secret child.

Nah, actually the first is more likely. And I believe that it can happen in REAL life.

But can we be sure he came online in the 60's and when it showed him activating wasn't just part of the teaser with no actual time line? I'm saying yes they found him in the 60's but maybe the part of teaser that showed him activating didn't have any relevance to the astronauts seeing as they only had a small amount of time to explore the ship. Maybe Sentinel activating happens later like when Optimus finds out about the ship on the moon. Kinda seems like Bay is screwing with us again.

by **Red 50** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 3:21 pm

BeastWarsFTW wrote:
Red 50 wrote:
BeastWarsFTW wrote:The only thing I can figure on this is when sentinel prime was on the moon he is 'off-line' or in stasis so he cannot be detected. Same thing with megatron in the first movie. He was in stasis and could not detect him and thats why they hacked the internet to find him. So this would fit in with the fallen's statement of optimus being the last prime at that moment in time..

But he came online in what... 60's, while the action in ROTF is pretty much in the 21st century's first decade, so he should have been alive at then.

My theory still is that he might be a forgotten Prime. Like he's officially declared dead or was another Prime's secret child.

Nah, actually the first is more likely. And I believe that it can happen in REAL life.

But can we be sure he came online in the 60's and when it showed him activating wasn't just part of the teaser with no actual time line? I'm saying yes they found him in the 60's but maybe the part of teaser that showed him activating didn't have any relevance to the astronauts seeing as they only had a small amount of time to explore the ship. Maybe Sentinel activating happens later like when Optimus finds out about the ship on the moon. Kinda seems like Bay is screwing with us again.

Okay, fair enough.

by **ebilly99** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 3:39 pm

What if sential did something to get his prime status revoked? What if he is behind megatrons fall?

by **G1 Smoketreader** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 3:40 pm

If I remember correctly, the declaration about the last Prime is delivered by Jetfire. If so, then the information may have been legitimate before Jetfire had gone into torpor. By that time, Sentinels expedition may have already been declared long lost.

by **JohnnyZero** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 4:50 pm

BeastWarsFTW wrote:
Red 50 wrote:
BeastWarsFTW wrote:The only thing I can figure on this is when sentinel prime was on the moon he is 'off-line' or in stasis so he cannot be detected. Same thing with megatron in the first movie. He was in stasis and could not detect him and thats why they hacked the internet to find him. So this would fit in with the fallen's statement of optimus being the last prime at that moment in time..

But he came online in what... 60's, while the action in ROTF is pretty much in the 21st century's first decade, so he should have been alive at then.

My theory still is that he might be a forgotten Prime. Like he's officially declared dead or was another Prime's secret child.

Nah, actually the first is more likely. And I believe that it can happen in REAL life.

But can we be sure he came online in the 60's and when it showed him activating wasn't just part of the teaser with no actual time line? I'm saying yes they found him in the 60's but maybe the part of teaser that showed him activating didn't have any relevance to the astronauts seeing as they only had a small amount of time to explore the ship. Maybe Sentinel activating happens later like when Optimus finds out about the ship on the moon. Kinda seems like Bay is screwing with us again.

Yea I can see that. It's the best I've heard so far.

My theory: Sentinel does activate on the moon, but is "disabled" then brought back to earth somehow (apollo 18?) and is de-activated or frozen like Megs was and then during the course of this movie is brought back... total speculation and it could be neither... just my idea as of now

Thanks for the discussion to let me know i didnt miss anything vital tho

by **BeastWarsFTW** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 7:23 pm

Autobot Smoketreader wrote:If I remember correctly, the declaration about the last Prime is delivered by Jetfire. If so, then the information may have been legitimate before Jetfire had gone into torpor. By that time, Sentinels expedition may have already been declared long lost.

Good idea. Jetfire did say Optimus was the last living prime. So this means Sentinel was either another prime or the prime before Optimus (If there is only one prime at a time). So his expedition has to be very old and he crashed landed on the moon (possibly chasing Megatron or Shockwave?) But I think since Sentinel crashed he was presumed dead and Optimus was named the next prime (or last prime) but now Sentinel gets reactivated somehow.

News Credits: 37 · by **SlyTF1** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 8:42 pm

You're all thinking too narrowly. You have to think wider. What if no one knew Sentinel was alive? What if Primus or the Allspark brought him back? What if he was programmed to come back online when The Fallen was killed, just like The Fallen did when Optimus died?

by **BeastWarsFTW** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 9:04 pm

SlyTF1 wrote:You're all thinking too narrowly. You have to think wider. What if no one knew Sentinel was alive? What if Primus or the Allspark brought him back? What if he was programmed to come back online when The Fallen was killed, just like The Fallen did when Optimus died?

First I stated that maybe no one knew Sentinel and was presumed dead. Secondly The fallen never was offline to begin with because he was instructing megatron what to do. He decided to wait to return to earth after prime was dead because he knew Prime could defeat him.

News Credits: 2 · by **Shadowman** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 9:11 pm

Plus, the Fallen could actually sense Optimus dying. If Sentinel was still alive, he'd be able to sense that as well.

by **BeastWarsFTW** » Tue Mar 01, 2011 9:14 pm

Shadowman wrote:Plus, the Fallen could actually sense Optimus dying. If Sentinel was still alive, he'd be able to sense that as well.

This may be getting a little to technical but can the Fallen sense when Sentinel is in stasis/offline or just when he is online? I believe only online or The Fallen would have said go destroy Sentinel Prime too.

News Credits: 1 · by **sto_vo_kor_2000** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 12:11 am

Autobot Smoketreader wrote:If I remember correctly, the declaration about the last Prime is delivered by Jetfire.

True, but the Ghost of the Primes also refereed to Optimus as their last decedent.

SlyTF1 wrote: What if no one knew Sentinel was alive?

The ghost of the other Primes should have known.

by **shadowynne** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 9:05 am

its a simple answer, it really is. bay doesnt care, thats it, nothing fancy, nothing complex just regular old carefree apathy...

News Credits: 37 · by **SlyTF1** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 1:22 pm

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:
Autobot Smoketreader wrote:If I remember correctly, the declaration about the last Prime is delivered by Jetfire.

True, but the Ghost of the Primes also refereed to Optimus as their last decedent.

SlyTF1 wrote: What if no one knew Sentinel was alive?

The ghost of the other Primes should have known.

They said he was their last DECENDANT. It doesn't mean that he's the only one alive.

by **OptiMagnus** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 1:42 pm

You all just assume Michael Bay doesn't give a slag and is putting a random Prime in this movie for the hell of it. I mean, we barely know crap about this film yet. How can you go around saying Bay is just stupid and doesn't care when you can't let him explain the story to you yet? They can't just ignore the entire plot and story of ROTF which was mostly about the Fallen trying to kill the so-called last Prime so he could unleash his wrath. It's a little too obvious to ignore.

Anyway, when Sam goes loco in class in ROTF and starts writing symbols on the board, doesn't he say something about "the Sentinel Prime expedition"? And how long have we known about this third movie? Is it possible that Sentinel's story has been planned since ROTF?

Can we all just settle down and let DOTM explain this to us when the time comes?

News Credits: 37 · by **SlyTF1** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 1:44 pm

OptiMagnus10 wrote:You Bay Haters are so immature. You all just assume Michael Bay doesn't give a slag and is putting a random Prime in this movie for the hell of it. I mean, we barely know crap about this film yet. How can you go around saying Bay is just stupid and doesn't care when you can't let him explain the story to you yet? They can't just ignore the entire plot and story of ROTF which was mostly about the Fallen trying to kill the so-called last Prime so he could unleash his wrath. It's a little too obvious to ignore.

Anyway, when Sam goes loco in class in ROTF and starts writing symbols on the board, doesn't he say something about "the Sentinel Prime expedition"? And how long have we known about this third movie? Is it possible that Sentinel's story has been planned since ROTF?

Can we all just settle down and let DOTM explain this to us when the time comes?

Exactly, this is what I was thinking the whole time. And they did plan Sentinel Prime. They said they wanted him to save Sam from falling off the building in the first movie, but it would make no sense, so they hinted to him in ROTF, and here he finally is.

by **OptiMagnus** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 1:57 pm

SlyTF1 wrote:
OptiMagnus10 wrote:You Bay Haters are so immature. You all just assume Michael Bay doesn't give a slag and is putting a random Prime in this movie for the hell of it. I mean, we barely know crap about this film yet. How can you go around saying Bay is just stupid and doesn't care when you can't let him explain the story to you yet? They can't just ignore the entire plot and story of ROTF which was mostly about the Fallen trying to kill the so-called last Prime so he could unleash his wrath. It's a little too obvious to ignore.

Anyway, when Sam goes loco in class in ROTF and starts writing symbols on the board, doesn't he say something about "the Sentinel Prime expedition"? And how long have we known about this third movie? Is it possible that Sentinel's story has been planned since ROTF?

Can we all just settle down and let DOTM explain this to us when the time comes?

Exactly, this is what I was thinking the whole time. And they did plan Sentinel Prime. They said they wanted him to save Sam from falling off the building in the first movie, but it would make no sense, so they hinted to him in ROTF, and here he finally is.

Contrary to what some people say, I do believe Bay and his writers plan some characters farther ahead than we may know. It's kind of obvious that Sentinel Prime has been planned at least since ROTF. I mean Sam mentions something about an expedition involving him, which adds up to the spacecraft on the moon where he lies "dead" in the teaser, and plus he's mentioned in a movie about Primes. It's obvious Sentinel Prime isn't another Jolt.

News Credits: 2 · by **Shadowman** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 1:59 pm

OptiMagnus10 wrote:You Bay Haters are so immature. You all just assume Michael Bay doesn't give a slag and is putting a random Prime in this movie for the hell of it. I mean, we barely know crap about this film yet. How can you go around saying Bay is just stupid and doesn't care when you can't let him explain the story to you yet? They can't just ignore the entire plot and story of ROTF which was mostly about the Fallen trying to kill the so-called last Prime so he could unleash his wrath. It's a little too obvious to ignore.

Anyway, when Sam goes loco in class in ROTF and starts writing symbols on the board, doesn't he say something about "the Sentinel Prime expedition"? And how long have we known about this third movie? Is it possible that Sentinel's story has been planned since ROTF?

Can we all just settle down and let DOTM explain this to us when the time comes?

If the Bay Haters are immature, what are we supposed to call the Bay Lovers, who quickly jump at anyone who deals a (perceived) insult towards Bay? Why don't you settle down and let other people have their opinions and arguments?

Everyone said Optimus was the Last Prime. Suddenly, he's NOT the Last Prime, because it turns out Sentinel Prime was alive all along. This is what we in the writing business call a Plot Hole. And we can argue about how it can or cannot be filled until it is, and then we're probably going to argue about the sediment used to fill it. Welcome to the Transformers Fandom: You cannot possibly hope to please us.

by **OptiMagnus** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 2:09 pm

Shadowman wrote:
OptiMagnus10 wrote:You Bay Haters are so immature. You all just assume Michael Bay doesn't give a slag and is putting a random Prime in this movie for the hell of it. I mean, we barely know crap about this film yet. How can you go around saying Bay is just stupid and doesn't care when you can't let him explain the story to you yet? They can't just ignore the entire plot and story of ROTF which was mostly about the Fallen trying to kill the so-called last Prime so he could unleash his wrath. It's a little too obvious to ignore.

Anyway, when Sam goes loco in class in ROTF and starts writing symbols on the board, doesn't he say something about "the Sentinel Prime expedition"? And how long have we known about this third movie? Is it possible that Sentinel's story has been planned since ROTF?

Can we all just settle down and let DOTM explain this to us when the time comes?

If the Bay Haters are immature, what are we supposed to call the Bay Lovers, who quickly jump at anyone who deals a (perceived) insult towards Bay? Why don't you settle down and let other people have their opinions and arguments?

Everyone said Optimus was the Last Prime. Suddenly, he's NOT the Last Prime, because it turns out Sentinel Prime was alive all along. This is what we in the writing business call a Plot Hole. And we can argue about how it can or cannot be filled until it is, and then we're probably going to argue about the sediment used to fill it. Welcome to the Transformers Fandom: You cannot possibly hope to please us.

So, you're still yelling "PLOT HOLE!" before the movie is even out? This is exactly what I'm talking about. You're jumping to conclusions before you even know anything.

And I apologize for the Bay Hater comment. I'll go back and edit that so no one tries to kill me.

News Credits: 2 · by **Shadowman** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 2:24 pm

OptiMagnus10 wrote:So, you're still yelling "PLOT HOLE!" before the movie is even out? This is exactly what I'm talking about. You're jumping to conclusions before you even know anything.

Yes, but at least I'm using logic, and not telling people they aren't allowed to discuss it until we see it. It's a plot hole, and when the movie comes out, we'll see how they fill it.

by **SkySeige** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 2:28 pm

I just had a very intresting thought. In ROTF we see use of the Matrix of leadership but it wasent mentioned as the "AUTOBOT" matrix of leadership, what if after the civil war broke out the first "Primes" ancestors created the "AUTOBOT" matrix of leadership ?, if thats the case wouldnt Sentinel Prime of been the last one to have it? If we asssume that, by the time Sentinel was lost they may have lost the ability to create another so Optimus never used one. We may actually get to see a handing down of the REAL Autobot matrix in this movie. Saying that its a "Bay" movie and he doesnt like giving the fans what we would love to see....oh well its atleast a good thought.