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Burn wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:Burn wrote:Have you considered asking the advice from others who have done this before?
There are at least two published authors on this website alone.
I've tried, but I can't find any.
I believe Va'al may be able to help with editing as well. He's some fancy smancy University educated literature person thingy.
Me, Grimlock! wrote:SOMEONE DOTH SPOKETH MY NAME!!! I AWAKEN FROM MY SLUMBER!!!
Just kidding.
Okay, from the previous five pages, I gather, SyTF1, you've written either a collection of short stories you want people to read or a single short story that showcases the rest of the collection? Do I have that right? And this particular short story--which is...18,000 words, if I remember out of the whole five pages of this thread--is technically a novella or a novelette, depending on where you go for your answer.
So to address some of the stuff going on in this thread--and take this with a grain of salt cuz a lot of this is just one man's opinion, though I've got a fair amount of logic and experience going into this response:
SlyTF1, you want to be self-published. First of all, kudos, cuz it's hard. Really hard. Self-publishing is generally the trend nowadays, but the problem is that 99% of the world doesn't know how to string together a sentence to save their lives. It's all OMG ROLF Internet speak nowadays, which, hey, is great for me because it weeds out the competition. A lot of self-published authors are self-published because no agent or publisher will touch them, mostly because of the Internet speak. (Internet speak is to prose the same as valley girl speak is to conversation.)
That means if you want to set yourself above the rest, you need to know every single thing you can about the English language. Otherwise, you look like--guess what?--a self-published author, which still has a great big stigma attached to it because of the Internet speak. You want to showcase your talent. You have to use perfect English everywhere you go, Seibertron.com included, or else no one is going to want to read what you've got, even if the story itself is absolutely perfect. You're your own publicist, and even a single "their vs. there" mistake could cost you a reader, or a publisher (since publishers know how to Google you).
And learn your craft. Learn the three-act structure, what keeps a reader enticed, what suspense is, how to create a character, etc. This is the reason why, of that 1% who can string together a sentence, 99% of them fail: they don't know how to craft a story.
Writing for money? Meh. I hate to sound like a cliche, but it's not a great way to start. Sure, it's a start, but what happens when the boredom outweighs the money. Your writing flattens. My reasons are because I love to write and I love to create. I love what I do. Proof? I have a series in which I'm seventeen stories deep, called In a Galaxy Far, Far Awry (shameless plug, not out yet, coming soon, I'll post a link when it does if you want to see it, blah blah blah), and that series has, so far, enjoyed a readership of two and a net profit of zero. And I'm just now starting to publish that series. I'm not in it for the money. I'd love to make money off it, sure, but only to quit my job and write for a living. (Also to afford that European vacation, but sssshhhhh.) What's your reason? Money won't get you through the day. It's the same soulless garbage you'd pick up from a musician who's in it only for the money.
You don't have a hook. You need a hook. It's called a logline. Mine is "Spaceballs vs. X-Men." My short blurb is "Nothing is more dangerous than a halfwit who controls all of crime." Every movie or book has it, and train yourself on how to write one by checking the blurbs on the backs of books or listening (not viewing) to movie trailers. It's as easy as that. But if you have no hook, what sets your evil government story above every other evil government story, including V for Vendetta, The Lego Movie, Resident Evil, Soylent Green, District 9, Beast Machines (yes, boo, hiss, I know), and countless other movies (or books, or what-have-yous) with an evil government or corporation bent on world domination? Why should I plunk down ten bucks on your story when I'm already a fan of Resident Evil or Ready Player One? It's part of your marketing. Show me why I should spend money on yours specifically. I spent money on a marketer who can write an enticing back blurb. If you know a guy, great. If you can educate yourself, even better. But get that hook.
Speaking of marketing. Ahem. Yeah, self-publishers are their own marketers. You gotta learn to market. Have a plan. Budget for it. What do I do? Gotta admit my "Spaceballs vs. X-Men" series is my first foray into self-publishing so I'm kind of learning the ropes. I've got a few schemes, but they all involve hiring a publicist. So you have to have some spare money or really educate yourself on what you're doing. Facebook and Twitter are steps, but they're not the end. I'll get back to you when I've got this one figured out.
And finally, should I like the personality or beliefs of the author, actor, director, etc. whose stuff I'm entertaining myself with? Maybe or maybe not. I don't know. It's up to each person. My general way of thinking is I'll more than likely watch a movie where the star is someone I could see myself hanging out with. I think I'd get along with Samuel L. Jackson, Chris Evans, Jack Black and Kyle Gass, Seth Rogen, Simon Pegg, and a slew of others. Even Tom Cruise, for all his crazy assness, went up a couple of notches in my estimation when I found out he's saved some lives. Actual human lives. (I still watch the M:I movies for Ving Rhames, though.) So go figure. But I'm more likely to enjoy their wares. These people shouldn't have any consequence on if I enjoy a movie if that movie itself is good, but I'm a stupid human and this is one of my stupid human tricks. Oprah Winfrey hasn't done anything wrong per se, but I can't stand anything with her name on it because I find her preachy and artificial. So anything off the Oprah Network is an instant miss for me, even if she doesn't appear in something or wrote the articles in her magazine.
But here's the final word. Do I want to check over your stuff? Sure. Send it over to stevegershwin at hotmail dot com (my spam address). But never fall into the trap of thinking something is perfect. That's a bad place to be. And if you want me to post the feedback here, I'll be more than happy to.
Burn wrote:wow ... someone who has experience doing what he's attempting to do ... and he just throws it back in his face.
You really are a piece of work SlyTF1.
SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Burn wrote:wow ... someone who has experience doing what he's attempting to do ... and he just throws it back in his face.
You really are a piece of work SlyTF1.
I'm actually surprised that you're surprised.
Burn wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Burn wrote:wow ... someone who has experience doing what he's attempting to do ... and he just throws it back in his face.
You really are a piece of work SlyTF1.
I'm actually surprised that you're surprised.
Wasn't really. I have no idea if SlyTF1 is really like this or it's just his internet persona ... at least you knew duragrip was just taking the piss. This guy? I sometimes think we should alert his local Police in case there's any unsolved murders near by.
SlyTF1 wrote:I know lots of **** about English.
Wigglez wrote:Just remember. The sword is an extension of your arm. Use it as if you're going to karate chop someone with your really long sharp ass hand.
Shadowman wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:I know lots of **** about English.
Anyone else want to talk about how amazingly ironic this sentence is?
Burn wrote:wow ... someone who has experience doing what he's attempting to do ... and he just throws it back in his face.
You really are a piece of work SlyTF1.
Va'al wrote:To be fair, I don't agree with all the points Me, Grimlock! makes about self-publishing, and style, and bits, but it's some good solid advice - and that is not the way to react to it, Sly.
I have read your story and we've discussed feedback, and you have a much different demeanour when talking via email than you have on here. You're actually bordering on being insulting towards other users, and a very short throw away from crossing a Seibertron.com rule.
Learn to communicate in a civil manner, or expect a board warning soon.
Everyone else, criticism is fine, and I understand the reactions so far, but let's keep personal insults to a minimum. Thanks.
SlyTF1 wrote:Me, Grimlock! wrote:Writing for money? Meh. I hate to sound like a cliche, but it's not a great way to start. Sure, it's a start, but what happens when the boredom outweighs the money. Your writing flattens. My reasons are because I love to write and I love to create. I love what I do. Proof? I have a series in which I'm seventeen stories deep, called In a Galaxy Far, Far Awry (shameless plug, not out yet, coming soon, I'll post a link when it does if you want to see it, blah blah blah), and that series has, so far, enjoyed a readership of two and a net profit of zero. And I'm just now starting to publish that series. I'm not in it for the money. I'd love to make money off it, sure, but only to quit my job and write for a living. (Also to afford that European vacation, but sssshhhhh.) What's your reason? Money won't get you through the day. It's the same soulless garbage you'd pick up from a musician who's in it only for the money.
The only reason I want money is so I can make a living. If I were making any money any other way, I wouldn't mind writing for free, I really wouldn't. But since there isn't anything else on the planet I feel like doing right now, I might as well try writing for money.
Wigglez wrote:Just remember. The sword is an extension of your arm. Use it as if you're going to karate chop someone with your really long sharp ass hand.
Shadowman wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:Me, Grimlock! wrote:Writing for money? Meh. I hate to sound like a cliche, but it's not a great way to start. Sure, it's a start, but what happens when the boredom outweighs the money. Your writing flattens. My reasons are because I love to write and I love to create. I love what I do. Proof? I have a series in which I'm seventeen stories deep, called In a Galaxy Far, Far Awry (shameless plug, not out yet, coming soon, I'll post a link when it does if you want to see it, blah blah blah), and that series has, so far, enjoyed a readership of two and a net profit of zero. And I'm just now starting to publish that series. I'm not in it for the money. I'd love to make money off it, sure, but only to quit my job and write for a living. (Also to afford that European vacation, but sssshhhhh.) What's your reason? Money won't get you through the day. It's the same soulless garbage you'd pick up from a musician who's in it only for the money.
The only reason I want money is so I can make a living. If I were making any money any other way, I wouldn't mind writing for free, I really wouldn't. But since there isn't anything else on the planet I feel like doing right now, I might as well try writing for money.
He never said anything about "writing for free." He's talking about writing for the love of it, not because you want to get paid, because if you're only in it for the money, you're not going to get anywhere. And then you told him you're only in it for the money.
Which means you either only skimmed this part of his post, or you threw it back in his face. Or, third option, you really couldn't comprehend the simply "Don't be in it for the money" message he was trying to convey. (IE, the reason people pirate Metallica out of principle)
SlyTF1 wrote:Writing "for the love of it," I assume would mean for free.
Wigglez wrote:Just remember. The sword is an extension of your arm. Use it as if you're going to karate chop someone with your really long sharp ass hand.
Shadowman wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:Writing "for the love of it," I assume would mean for free.
You assume wrong. You know, for someone who claims to be above us "mortals" you really do fail to comprehend very simple concepts.
SlyTF1 wrote:Shadowman wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:Writing "for the love of it," I assume would mean for free.
You assume wrong. You know, for someone who claims to be above us "mortals" you really do fail to comprehend very simple concepts.
Every other time I've heard someone say they do something "for the love of it," they generally mean for free.
Wigglez wrote:Just remember. The sword is an extension of your arm. Use it as if you're going to karate chop someone with your really long sharp ass hand.
Va'al wrote:To be fair, I don't agree with all the points Me, Grimlock! makes about self-publishing, and style, and bits, but it's some good solid advice - and that is not the way to react to it, Sly.
SlyTF1 wrote:The only reason I want money is so I can make a living. If I were making any money any other way, I wouldn't mind writing for free, I really wouldn't. But since there isn't anything else on the planet I feel like doing right now, I might as well try writing for money.
Shadowman wrote:Just because you're writing just for the sake of writing, doesn't mean you can't also make money off of it. It's just, when you put "getting paid" ahead of everything else, all you produce is, as Me Grimlock stated, "soulless garbage." And if all you produce is soulless garbage, no one is going to want to buy your writing and the whole plan collapses on itself.
SlyTF1 wrote:Like I said, I wasn't trying to be insulting or defensive or anything. I didn't know I even said anything out of the way. I don't know how you'd want me to react. But I was just simply explaining my position.
Me, Grimlock! wrote:For the record, I didn't take the "mortal" thing in your first post seriously. I took more in the same vein as Jack Black and Kyle Gass call Tenacious D the greatest band in the world: they're just having fun with a joke out of a conceit that really isn't there.
SlyTF1 wrote:Well, what do you want me to do? Lie? I don't lie, and I don't do facades.
SlyTF1 wrote:And this, more or less, is how I am in real life. The only difference being, is that people in real life actually like me, because I'm an "*******."
SlyTF1 wrote:I'm not trying to convince anyone. I couldn't give a **** what you believe. But I know who and what I am, and if you don't believe me, that's your fault, not mine.
SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Me, Grimlock! wrote:For the record, I didn't take the "mortal" thing in your first post seriously. I took more in the same vein as Jack Black and Kyle Gass call Tenacious D the greatest band in the world: they're just having fun with a joke out of a conceit that really isn't there.
Nope, he meant it very seriously.
SlyTF1 wrote:Well, what do you want me to do? Lie? I don't lie, and I don't do facades.SlyTF1 wrote:And this, more or less, is how I am in real life. The only difference being, is that people in real life actually like me, because I'm an "*******."SlyTF1 wrote:I'm not trying to convince anyone. I couldn't give a **** what you believe. But I know who and what I am, and if you don't believe me, that's your fault, not mine.
SlyTF1 wrote:To just about every joke, therein lies a hint of truth. Some jokes encompass more truth than others, though. Just saying.
SlyTF1 wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Me, Grimlock! wrote:For the record, I didn't take the "mortal" thing in your first post seriously. I took more in the same vein as Jack Black and Kyle Gass call Tenacious D the greatest band in the world: they're just having fun with a joke out of a conceit that really isn't there.
Nope, he meant it very seriously.
SlyTF1 wrote:Well, what do you want me to do? Lie? I don't lie, and I don't do facades.SlyTF1 wrote:And this, more or less, is how I am in real life. The only difference being, is that people in real life actually like me, because I'm an "*******."SlyTF1 wrote:I'm not trying to convince anyone. I couldn't give a **** what you believe. But I know who and what I am, and if you don't believe me, that's your fault, not mine.
To just about every joke, therein lies a hint of truth. Some jokes encompass more truth than others, though. Just saying.
SKYWARPED_128 wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Me, Grimlock! wrote:For the record, I didn't take the "mortal" thing in your first post seriously. I took more in the same vein as Jack Black and Kyle Gass call Tenacious D the greatest band in the world: they're just having fun with a joke out of a conceit that really isn't there.
Nope, he meant it very seriously.
SlyTF1 wrote:Well, what do you want me to do? Lie? I don't lie, and I don't do facades.SlyTF1 wrote:And this, more or less, is how I am in real life. The only difference being, is that people in real life actually like me, because I'm an "*******."SlyTF1 wrote:I'm not trying to convince anyone. I couldn't give a **** what you believe. But I know who and what I am, and if you don't believe me, that's your fault, not mine.
To just about every joke, therein lies a hint of truth. Some jokes encompass more truth than others, though. Just saying.
Which I'm guessing is Sly's typical roundabout way of saying, "SKYWARPED_128 is essentially right, except I exaggerated more than I should have for comedic effect, and now Burn thinks I'm delusional."![]()
And Sly, you still haven't answered why you chose to ask for critiques in a TF forum, instead of an actual writer's forum where you can get proper professional feedback for your stories. People there are all writers like you, and actually know the technical side of story telling and prose, and can be of more help (no offense to those who critiqued his story).
SlyTF1 wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Me, Grimlock! wrote:For the record, I didn't take the "mortal" thing in your first post seriously. I took more in the same vein as Jack Black and Kyle Gass call Tenacious D the greatest band in the world: they're just having fun with a joke out of a conceit that really isn't there.
Nope, he meant it very seriously.
SlyTF1 wrote:Well, what do you want me to do? Lie? I don't lie, and I don't do facades.SlyTF1 wrote:And this, more or less, is how I am in real life. The only difference being, is that people in real life actually like me, because I'm an "*******."SlyTF1 wrote:I'm not trying to convince anyone. I couldn't give a **** what you believe. But I know who and what I am, and if you don't believe me, that's your fault, not mine.
To just about every joke, therein lies a hint of truth. Some jokes encompass more truth than others, though. Just saying.
Which I'm guessing is Sly's typical roundabout way of saying, "SKYWARPED_128 is essentially right, except I exaggerated more than I should have for comedic effect, and now Burn thinks I'm delusional."![]()
And Sly, you still haven't answered why you chose to ask for critiques in a TF forum, instead of an actual writer's forum where you can get proper professional feedback for your stories. People there are all writers like you, and actually know the technical side of story telling and prose, and can be of more help (no offense to those who critiqued his story).
Because I couldn't find any of those websites. If I can't find something in less than 5 minutes, I get bored and conclude it isn't worth my time. I found one site, which has been seemingly dead for ages. I posted my story on it anyway.
SKYWARPED_128 wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Me, Grimlock! wrote:For the record, I didn't take the "mortal" thing in your first post seriously. I took more in the same vein as Jack Black and Kyle Gass call Tenacious D the greatest band in the world: they're just having fun with a joke out of a conceit that really isn't there.
Nope, he meant it very seriously.
SlyTF1 wrote:Well, what do you want me to do? Lie? I don't lie, and I don't do facades.SlyTF1 wrote:And this, more or less, is how I am in real life. The only difference being, is that people in real life actually like me, because I'm an "*******."SlyTF1 wrote:I'm not trying to convince anyone. I couldn't give a **** what you believe. But I know who and what I am, and if you don't believe me, that's your fault, not mine.
To just about every joke, therein lies a hint of truth. Some jokes encompass more truth than others, though. Just saying.
Which I'm guessing is Sly's typical roundabout way of saying, "SKYWARPED_128 is essentially right, except I exaggerated more than I should have for comedic effect, and now Burn thinks I'm delusional."![]()
And Sly, you still haven't answered why you chose to ask for critiques in a TF forum, instead of an actual writer's forum where you can get proper professional feedback for your stories. People there are all writers like you, and actually know the technical side of story telling and prose, and can be of more help (no offense to those who critiqued his story).
Because I couldn't find any of those websites. If I can't find something in less than 5 minutes, I get bored and conclude it isn't worth my time. I found one site, which has been seemingly dead for ages. I posted my story on it anyway.
Holy sh!t, I think even Google hates you. I just Googled "writing forums", and (GASP!) guess what I found:
http://www.writingforums.com/
http://www.writingforums.org/
http://www.writersdigest.com/forum/
All of them are active. Try them out.
SlyTF1 wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Me, Grimlock! wrote:For the record, I didn't take the "mortal" thing in your first post seriously. I took more in the same vein as Jack Black and Kyle Gass call Tenacious D the greatest band in the world: they're just having fun with a joke out of a conceit that really isn't there.
Nope, he meant it very seriously.
SlyTF1 wrote:Well, what do you want me to do? Lie? I don't lie, and I don't do facades.SlyTF1 wrote:And this, more or less, is how I am in real life. The only difference being, is that people in real life actually like me, because I'm an "*******."SlyTF1 wrote:I'm not trying to convince anyone. I couldn't give a **** what you believe. But I know who and what I am, and if you don't believe me, that's your fault, not mine.
To just about every joke, therein lies a hint of truth. Some jokes encompass more truth than others, though. Just saying.
Which I'm guessing is Sly's typical roundabout way of saying, "SKYWARPED_128 is essentially right, except I exaggerated more than I should have for comedic effect, and now Burn thinks I'm delusional."![]()
And Sly, you still haven't answered why you chose to ask for critiques in a TF forum, instead of an actual writer's forum where you can get proper professional feedback for your stories. People there are all writers like you, and actually know the technical side of story telling and prose, and can be of more help (no offense to those who critiqued his story).
Because I couldn't find any of those websites. If I can't find something in less than 5 minutes, I get bored and conclude it isn't worth my time. I found one site, which has been seemingly dead for ages. I posted my story on it anyway.
Holy sh!t, I think even Google hates you. I just Googled "writing forums", and (GASP!) guess what I found:
http://www.writingforums.com/
http://www.writingforums.org/
http://www.writersdigest.com/forum/
All of them are active. Try them out.
Wow. Even Google's involved in the ploy to try to steal my planet from me.
Burn wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:SlyTF1 wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Me, Grimlock! wrote:For the record, I didn't take the "mortal" thing in your first post seriously. I took more in the same vein as Jack Black and Kyle Gass call Tenacious D the greatest band in the world: they're just having fun with a joke out of a conceit that really isn't there.
Nope, he meant it very seriously.
SlyTF1 wrote:Well, what do you want me to do? Lie? I don't lie, and I don't do facades.SlyTF1 wrote:And this, more or less, is how I am in real life. The only difference being, is that people in real life actually like me, because I'm an "*******."SlyTF1 wrote:I'm not trying to convince anyone. I couldn't give a **** what you believe. But I know who and what I am, and if you don't believe me, that's your fault, not mine.
To just about every joke, therein lies a hint of truth. Some jokes encompass more truth than others, though. Just saying.
Which I'm guessing is Sly's typical roundabout way of saying, "SKYWARPED_128 is essentially right, except I exaggerated more than I should have for comedic effect, and now Burn thinks I'm delusional."![]()
And Sly, you still haven't answered why you chose to ask for critiques in a TF forum, instead of an actual writer's forum where you can get proper professional feedback for your stories. People there are all writers like you, and actually know the technical side of story telling and prose, and can be of more help (no offense to those who critiqued his story).
Because I couldn't find any of those websites. If I can't find something in less than 5 minutes, I get bored and conclude it isn't worth my time. I found one site, which has been seemingly dead for ages. I posted my story on it anyway.
Holy sh!t, I think even Google hates you. I just Googled "writing forums", and (GASP!) guess what I found:
http://www.writingforums.com/
http://www.writingforums.org/
http://www.writersdigest.com/forum/
All of them are active. Try them out.
Wow. Even Google's involved in the ploy to try to steal my planet from me.
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