Roberto Orci and Alex Kurtzman NOT to write TF3

I'm glad they're not coming back... they're good writers but micheal bay crapped all over their script for the second one... I'd be pretty pissed too... It's one thing to say once it's out of the writer's hands the director can do whatever he wants but what bay did was just awful... EVERYthing the critics and fans complained about was added after the fact by Bay, turning the movie into crotch jokes and racial stereotypes. I'd be pretty embarassed to say I wrote the movie too and be blamed for that crap that i didn't write. It doesn't matter who writes the third one because Bay is gonna do what he wants anyway. "oh we have a serious scene where someone dies? Throw in a garbage truck that farts a lot! it'll be hilarious!" UGH! ok that was a long pent up rant... sorry

Well thats part of the problem solved. Now we need to fix the rest. I still say we nuke bay. Without him there will be no TF3. No wait he'll probably live through it and use the explosion in TF3. We want him and his staff gone not to make their jobs (i use that word lightly here) easier.

I'm glad they are gone. I have a feeling that Ehren Kruger knows more about TF's than these two. I have no interest in their Star Trek movies. I'll just watch Next Generation, DS9, Voyager, and Enterprise reruns.

I'd like to hear both sides of the story before making a final judgment, either way, I believe everyone involved should share the blame.

I don't think any of them are perfect, nor do I expect them to be, but there's an awful lot of finger pointing going on here, and we're only hearing one side of it.

Maybe they had better intentions for the film than what was presented to us as the final product, but I still think the story could've been stronger on their end as well.

Past a certain point, a director can only screw up so much of the material he's handed, the rest is tinkered with by producers and the writing staff.

Again, I say, Bay's no hero of mine, but I think making him the only scapegoat in all of this is unfair. If it really was as bad as they claim, why didn't they walk away? Why didn't they fight for more creative control, etc?

D-340 wrote:

Megatron Wolf wrote:Well thats part of the problem solved. Now we need to fix the rest. I still say we nuke bay. Without him there will be no TF3. No wait he'll probably live through it and use the explosion in TF3. We want him and his staff gone not to make their jobs (i use that word lightly here) easier.

Very well put sir. If we got Spielberg to remove his head from his money cushioned rear end and realize Bay is the other half of the problem, TF 3 may have a chance of being somewhat worthwhile.

@ Orci and Kurtzman:

"Nah nah nah nah, Nah nah nah nah, Hey Hey Hey, GOOD BYE!"

**does a happy dance**

Unless you actually have Spielberg behind the camera, you're not going to see the movie you have envisioned.

You can get rid of Bay, you can bring in another director, but unless the material is really good, and there's someone to step in and say "Hey, whoa. Do not cross that line!" we're back to square one.

Now, if the 3rd movie turns out to be even worse than the first two (though I thoroughly enjoyed ROTF...) and Ehren Kruger can prove he wasn't the one dropping the ball, then we can fully say Bay's at fault. I'll admit Bay's not helping matters much, but seriously he ain't the only one behind the scenes.

Why doesn't Goldner come down off of his throne of money and say "We here at Hasbro would like more of this, less of that"? He doesn't. He sits there and counts his company's billions.

Paramount's not going to step in because they don't give a damn about the mythos and they too are counting the billions.

I think it's unfair to put all of the mistakes on one man. Unless he's Uwe Boll, who revels in making trash. Defends it, even.

Bay ain't Boll.

Mixed feelings about this. I hope that they get a writer that knows TF lore for TF3!

RiddlerJ wrote:These movies have writers?

I lol'd at that.

Yeah, I'm glad. I mean Star Trek was awesome, but ROTF...

Autobot032 wrote:I'd like to hear both sides of the story before making a final judgment, either way, I believe everyone involved should share the blame.

I don't think any of them are perfect, nor do I expect them to be, but there's an awful lot of finger pointing going on here, and we're only hearing one side of it.

Maybe they had better intentions for the film than what was presented to us as the final product, but I still think the story could've been stronger on their end as well.

Past a certain point, a director can only screw up so much of the material he's handed, the rest is tinkered with by producers and the writing staff.

Again, I say, Bay's no hero of mine, but I think making him the only scapegoat in all of this is unfair. If it really was as bad as they claim, why didn't they walk away? Why didn't they fight for more creative control, etc?

They can't fight for creative control. Once their original script is submitted, it then becomes property of Paramount, allowing Bay to pretty much rip it up and do what he likes with it.

I do think that, although not perfect, Kurtzman and Orci are excellent writers. The Star Trek film was almost universally praised, and their work on Fringe is also great.

I know we've only heard one half of the story, but if you look at Alex and Roberto's past history, you can see that none of it is quite as inane as what ended up on screen in ROTF.

As such, I tend to believe their side of events - they wrote a script, submitted it, got paid for it... then Bay and Kruger pissed all over it.

The story in ROTF isn't all that bad on paper - you can kinda see that, deep down, AK and RO's original storyline was pretty good. We have Sam again at the human heart of the story, dealing with his new life at college and his long-distance relationship with Michaela.

We also have the tried-and-trusted storyline of the Epic Quest, as Sam and the Autobots go on a hunt for the Matrix with which to stop the Decepticons and revive Prime.

We have the Decepticons' plan, which - true to their G1 roots - entails them stealing energy at the expence of the Earth's very existence.

All of that was in Orci and Kurtzman's original script, and none of it is intrinsically terrible. It's just that, having been rewritten to buggery by Bay and Kruger, only the basics of their original outline actually made it to the screen. And any of their storyline we did see was interspersed with leg-humping, dog sex, scrotum jokes and 'I'll pop a cap in yo' ass, brother!'

The fact that Michael Bay and Ehren Kruger have gained sole control over the writing (without any input - or indeed intelligence, sanity and true wit - from Kurtzman and Orci) is something to be worried about, not to be applauded.

I do not recall where I read this (so don't shoot!) but I thought I had read somewhere that part of Kruger's 'contribution' to ROTF was the humor. If that is the case, gentlemen, we are in for a very robo-flatulent sequel.

I'm actually not down with Furman hopping on board this one. Furman does great stories, but he's a talking head/pontificational kind of guy. Lots of robo-angst and speechifyin'. That's what fanfic is for. And comics. A movie needs to keep hopping, and I don't see any chops Furman has for writing an action-movie formula script.

Now, I give Furman full credit--his comic 'adaptation' of ROTF hung together WAY better than the actual movie, with nice little touches (explanation of Alice's alt-mode, nice coda bit) but the part he kind of went off the rails on was precisely what we want to see the moving pictures for--the ACTION.

HK, I vote for Chris Mowry. At least he does Screamer right.

Question:

Has Ehren Kruger written any good movies?

When will he address concerns from the fans?

I'm glad Orci and Kurtzman have faith in him, but will he be capable enough to write a movie as entertaining as the first one?