The Energon Pub

if the transformers movie turns out to be a really really big stinking pile of crap will all the transformers fans pretend it never existed

also if it is crap will the name be changed to micheal bays transformers or as i have seen on this forum before bayformers?

1) I don't think anyone will pretend it never existed, given that it blatantly does. That would be just odd. They won't take it as canon, though.

2) People are, as you say, already calling it Bayformers, regardless of whether or not it's good. So, yes is the answer to that question, because it's already happened.

Unless the movie is surprisingly better than anyone imagined, I feel 'infamous' would be more the case than forgetable; something that is already this controversial won't be forgotten any time soon.

Leonardo wrote:They won't take it as canon, though.

Not that there's anything really canon in existance anymore. So many different continuities. And how many takes have there been on G1?

Burn wrote:

Leonardo wrote:They won't take it as canon, though.

Not that there's anything really canon in existance anymore. So many different continuities. And how many takes have there been on G1?

A good point.

Which is something that all of the haters out there continue to forget. It is a different continuity. A different universe if you will.

Just like Armada is different from G1. Just like RiD is different from Armada. Just like the Armada Cartoon is different than the Comic Armada. The Marvel G1 Comic was different than the G1 Cartoon. The G1 Dreamwave is different than IDW. It goes on and on.

Every single time a new series starts up it is different than the one before it. It has... "Transformed".

Embrace the Transformation. It is inherent in the Franchise.

LuckytheWonderLlama wrote:Which is something that all of the haters out there continue to forget. It is a different continuity. A different universe if you will.

Just like Armada is different from G1. Just like RiD is different from Armada. Just like the Armada Cartoon is different than the Comic Armada. The Marvel G1 Comic was different than the G1 Cartoon. The G1 Dreamwave is different than IDW. It goes on and on.

Every single time a new series starts up it is different than the one before it. It has... "Transformed".

Embrace the Transformation. It is inherent in the Franchise.

Here here!

LuckytheWonderLlama wrote:Which is something that all of the haters out there continue to forget. It is a different continuity. A different universe if you will.

Just like Armada is different from G1. Just like RiD is different from Armada. Just like the Armada Cartoon is different than the Comic Armada. The Marvel G1 Comic was different than the G1 Cartoon. The G1 Dreamwave is different than IDW. It goes on and on.

Every single time a new series starts up it is different than the one before it. It has... "Transformed".

Embrace the Transformation. It is inherent in the Franchise.

"Embrace the Transformation". Sounds like a good line for us pro-movie fans.

Brakethrough wrote:"Embrace the Transformation". Sounds like a good line for us pro-movie fans.

Indeed it does!

We gotta make sigs for this. It has our favorite movie design, along with the words "Embrace the Transformation."

It's like Civil War, but this time, Ironman isn't going to be a total douche.

Shadowman wrote:It's like Civil War, but this time, Ironman isn't going to be a total douche.

Then I guess it's up to you to be the douche then seeing as Bluebullet "vanished".

A good idea, except it won't change anything. A lot of people are stuck in their ways, and not only do people hate this movie, they seem to want to hate, or even enjoy hating, this movie.

Leonardo wrote:A good idea, except it won't change anything. A lot of people are stuck in their ways, and not only do people hate this movie, they seem to want to hate, or even enjoy hating, this movie.

Nonsense. The loudest complainers, myself included, wanted nothing more than to love this movie to bits... to get the same excitement as when first seeing the 1987 movie.

We waited decades, wanted our favorite heroes and villains to get a giant financial shot in the arm, and use that money to come alive on the big screen in live-action goodness.
Batman got it (at first).
Spiderman got it.

You have to be joking if you think that's what's looming here right before our eyes.

All those yearly, annoying Japanese retellings in manga and anime are low-budget, throw-away silliness.
But it's sad when millions of dollars result in a similarly uncreative product. You get one chance with money like that, and it appears to have been blown.

Leonardo wrote:A good idea, except it won't change anything. A lot of people are stuck in their ways, and not only do people hate this movie, they seem to want to hate, or even enjoy hating, this movie.

i think its cause most of the fans of transformers have grown up watching G1 and they are expecting it to be a G1 centred movie

but they just have to accept the fact that it IS a different continuity like how beast wars was a extremely different from G1 yet people still accepted it as happening in the transformers universe (even though it was set before G1 on a prehistoric which im still confused with)

its like the marvel comics how theres multiple universes but still an earth in every universe with basically the same people except a different version of the people

Optimus Pepsi wrote:but they just have to accept the fact that it IS a different continuity like how beast wars was a extremely different from G1 yet people still accepted it as happening in the transformers universe (even though it was set before G1 on a prehistoric which im still confused with)

Hoo boy...

Um... it was the same continuity dude.
A large part WHY it was so loved.

Riotflea wrote:

Leonardo wrote:A good idea, except it won't change anything. A lot of people are stuck in their ways, and not only do people hate this movie, they seem to want to hate, or even enjoy hating, this movie.

Nonsense. The loudest complainers, myself included, wanted nothing more than to love this movie to bits... to get the same excitement as when first seeing the 1987 movie.

We waited decades, wanted our favorite heroes and villains to get a giant financial shot in the arm, and use that money to come alive on the big screen in live-action goodness.
Batman got it (at first).
Spiderman got it.

You have to be joking if you think that's what's looming here right before our eyes.

All those yearly, annoying Japanese retellings are low-budget, throw-away silliness.
But it's sad when millions of dollars result in a similarly uncreative product. You get one chance with money like that, and it appears to have been blown.

But, with the exception of the better comics, this movie is going to fit in nicely with other TF fiction that has come before it. The only real difference I see is the cosmetic change regarding the visual designs. Everything else will be pretty faithful. TF has never had very good storylines, it's never really been very well-written (apart from the aforementioned comics and BW/BM) and even the animated movie was pretty poor. So, in that respect, it's going to be faithful to its franchise. The only way it could be truer to its roots would be if they used maybe the G1 toy designs.

Yeah, those early Spiderman and Batman comics were well-written acts of genius, weren't they?

PFFFT...

And still... kickass movies that left noone new to the franchises confused, that left only a short few fans PISSED.

Transformers is impossible to get that treatment?

You're being short-sighted.

But the Spiderman and Batman movies weren't particularly well-written, either. They were pure comic book movies that fit in well with their source material.

In what way am I being short-sighted?

Leonardo wrote:But the Spiderman and Batman movies weren't particularly well-written, either.

Correct, all 3 franchises started off less than they were at their highest, most-loved points.
Not well-written or not, the superhero ones still managed to cram decades of history into an hour or two.

They were pure comic book movies that fit in well with their source material.

Correct.
Spiderman & his enemies were still instantly recognizable as Spiderman and his enemies.
Batman... pretty much as well. (Movie franchise began sucking when they drifted too far away).

The Transformers... HELL no.

In what way am I being short-sighted?

In thinking that Transformers has been handled with the same kind of care even REMOTELY resembling the other franchises listed.
In thinking that CGI shardformers are even a halfway acceptable reincarnation of big n' blocky.

I think a lot of these characters are recognisable as Transformers. Optimus, Ironhide, Blackout, Barricade...they all look like Transformers to me. What about the movie toys? Are the movie toys too much of a jump from previous lines?

And I didn't say that Transformers had been handled with the same care as other franchises.

Apparently, everything up until now doesn't count, only drastically retconned memories of one of the incarnations count.

G2, Cybertron, Armada, Rid, Galaxy Force, Beast Wars, Beast Machines don't count as Transformers because changes to the franchise since G1 don't count, therefore this movie is not part of the franchise because the look has changed since G1.

These guys believe post G1 incarnations of Prime are not valid, therefore this Prime is not valid either.

Spiderman has one look in the Spidey franchise, Prime is always evolving in the TF franchise. Same as it ever was.

If you look at the "franchise" as a whole - Leo is correct.

Milanion wrote:Apparently, everything up until now doesn't count, only drastically retconned memories of one of the incarnations count.

G2, Cybertron, Armada, Rid, Galaxy Force, Beast Wars, Beast Machines don't count as Transformers because changes to the franchise since G1 don't count, therefore this movie is not part of the franchise because the look has changed since G1.

These guys believe post G1 incarnations of Prime are not valid, therefore this Prime is not valid either.

Spiderman has one look in the Spidey franchise, Prime is always evolving in the TF franchise. Same as it ever was.

If you look at the "franchise" as a whole - Leo is correct.

Amen brotha! Thats what i keep saying. No one complained when they changed prime into a f i r e t r u c k (spaces because that word is censored on here for some reason), or a non cab-over semi design like in G2 and nearly everything else after that. Hell Beast wars is clear evidence of this.

So why cant they accept the new look TF's for the movie?

I persoanlly just think theres alot of bias, just because Micheal Bay is directing it, which is rather sad if you ask me.

Simply "embrace the transformation", and deal with it and stop whining for crying out loud!

Milanion wrote:Apparently, everything up until now doesn't count, only drastically retconned memories of one of the incarnations count.

G2, Cybertron, Armada, Rid, Galaxy Force, Beast Wars, Beast Machines don't count as Transformers because changes to the franchise since G1 don't count, therefore this movie is not part of the franchise because the look has changed since G1.

These guys believe post G1 incarnations of Prime are not valid, therefore this Prime is not valid either.

Spiderman has one look in the Spidey franchise, Prime is always evolving in the TF franchise. Same as it ever was.

If you look at the "franchise" as a whole - Leo is correct.

Exactly. It's impossible to compare Transformers to Spider-Man or Batman.

Yes, there's been different takes on Spidey and Bats, but however the core titles and core story have remained the same.

Transformers hasn't.

So it's much easier for the Spider-Man and Batman movies to remain true to the original mythology, because the original mythology has stayed pretty much the same from the beginning.

If prime was real and live in front of my face I don't eve think he would know his own damn origin.

Burn wrote:
Exactly. It's impossible to compare Transformers to Spider-Man or Batman.

Yes, there's been different takes on Spidey and Bats, but however the core titles and core story have remained the same.

Transformers hasn't.

How hasnt it?

Lets look at the facts:
We have TRANSFORMING cars and planes.
Optimus Prime is still a big red and blue truck. (with the original voice actor playing the character i might add)
We still have Megatron, yeah he doesnt shrink into a hand gun but that was just stupid to begin with anyway, but he still has an arm cannon and his alt mode makes sense an alien jet, he is so evil and powerful he doesnt care about blending in, why should he?

Starscream is still a fighter jet, bumblebee is still yellow and black and is only a stupid camaro because of VW and licensing troubles. Ironhide is in here, and his new alt mode makes more sense than his G1 original. We have Ratchet, who was always a resuce/ambulance in alt mode, and he is still. And Jazz, although not a bright white and glairing porsche look alike, his robot form looks like his G1 original when it comes to his face AND even his car mode suits the character.

To get these disguises they come to earth and scan our vehicles to blend in, just like in the original cartoon.

They are warring factions, bringing their war to our world, in search of something, just like in the cartoon we are caught in the crossfire.

As far as story goes, characters, and overall...whats the word...."Transformer-ness" (new word i made it up ) the movie seems pretty faithful to its source material.

If this is all about designs again, then that arguement is a moot point.

If all people care about are the cosmetics, then they are very superficial people and arent really fans.

If you are going to slam a new generation of Transformers just because they no longer look like boxes, morph and bend and shrink when they transform, and just because you dont like the director of the movie then your an.....whats a kind word for "idiot"?

Yes we would all have loved to have seen G1 optimus and the rest of these characters look like they used to (except for Megs in alt mode) but after all the other incarnations of Transformers that we have had, and accepted, why is such a big deal being made about ONE movie?

Besides, G1 designs would have looked too cartoony on the big screen, especially in live action. Those types of designs wouldnt have worked, at least they wouldnt have been as beleiveable on film.

Unlike some, i too understand WHY they have changed their designs like they have. I might not agree with them all 100%, but i accepted it and got the fudge over it and now i actually like many of the new designs.

If you would all stop whining about G1, open your mind a bit and accept some change then maybe you would too?

If not...then threads like this will continue to burn for as long as there are "fans" and fans.

And thats it im done with this arguement and this thread now.