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Yotsuyasan wrote:

Agamemnon wrote:I think it will be the Deluxe Prime. I took some pics a while back for size with Nemesis Prime:



Might be a bit big. I'll see if I can take some pics with Deluxe Prime over the weekend.

daimchoc wrote:

Hmm... While he still looks somewhat bigger then Motormaster, Voyager Prime could be closer in size then I'd suspected he would be. A bit hard to tell, as Agamemnon's photos are from straight-on, where as the FansProject promo shots Daimchoc shared were from angles.

Agamemnon, you kept saying Deluxe Prime, but pictured a Voyager Classics (Nemesis) Prime. Was that an error on your part? Or did you just mean that those were the photos you had, but you thought Motormaster would scale well with this figure? He may indeed scale well with the Classics Deluxe Prime, but since Motormater has a trailer, he needs to be paired off against an Optimus who has one, too.

Still, Motormaster is going to be a big truck! I wonder how he will compare with Voyager Classic Prime in robot mode? Even with a good chunk of his trailer becoming weapons and/or back kibble, that is still a robot whose truck cab becomes his legs compared with a robot made entirely from a truck cab...

That was correct. I haven't yet taken pics with the Deluxe Prime you linked to and any of the Stunticons. I'm on vacation (as soon as I get my grading done this weekend.) Let me see if I can take some pics. I have Voyager Prime, Deluxe Prime, FP Trailer, The trailer for Nemesis Prime. I'll see what I can come up with.

Well, on a whim, to match this photo:



I took this photo:



(I originally wanted to use one of the Lamborghini based cars, probably Sideswipe. But Smokescreen ended up in there instead when it occurred to me it might be neat to use four race cars.)

In that photo, Optimus's scale to the cars with him looks pretty close to Motormaster's scale to the cars with him. Of course, the Autobot cars used are Deluxe size, where as although, as previously stated, I don't have any of the Stunticons in hand, I understand they are closer to Scout size?

So, I suppose, if Voyager Optimus goes with Deluxe cars, then we can expect Motormaster's cab area to be Deluxe size? Of course, if we include his trailer since it incorporates into his robot mode, his robot should be larger then a Deluxe... So as a robot he'll hopefully face off well against Classics Voyager Prime. But as a vehicle, he'll probably look small next to him.

Of course, this problem is nothing new, and dates all the way back to G1. How was a robot that transformes from a whole truck including the trailer (Motormaster) ever supposed to work well with one who is only the truck's cab (Optimus)? Hopefully this toy manages to find some balance somewhere in the middle, perhaps being a bit small as a truck, but a bit tall as a robot?

Okay, I pulled some figures off of my shelves to try to do some comparison pics trying to match the promo photo.

First, I pulled out my voyager OP and Fansproject Trailer. (If you think OP doesn't look quite right, it's because I swapped the smokestack gun with Ultra Magnus. I preferred OP to have an all black gun.)




Then I used voyager Nemesis Prime and the BTS trailer.




Finally I used the deluxe OP and the black G2 trailer. I didn't use a silver trailer as I don't have a G1 OP and my anniversary is still MISB.




In my opinion, the voyager mold is a tad too big, and the deluxe is a tad too small. The deluxe might be more in scale if we look at a simple cab-over (OP) against a cab-over with full sleeper (MM). (However, the deluxe OP is one fugly semi tractor.)

Agamemnon wrote:

Although he will obviously still be small compared to Voyager Prime with the Fansproject trailer, that photo has me feeling a lot better that he won't be ridiculously small in comparison.

And hey... completely off topic here, but I couldn't help but notice you have both the Fansproject G3 trailer and at least one version of the BTS trailer.

Something I've always wondered, and never was able to get an answer on... If you fold out the extra trailer hitch under the G3 trailer (designed with the intent of towing one of the Optimus recolours of the City Commander trailer) will the BTS trailer fit on it and be able to be towed as a tandem trailer? And if yes, what might that look like?

Yotsuyasan wrote:I took this photo:

Should've been Jazz, Mirage, Sideswipe, and Windcharger.

Yotsuyasan wrote:And hey... completely off topic here, but I couldn't help but notice you have both the Fansproject G3 trailer and at least one version of the BTS trailer.

Something I've always wondered, and never was able to get an answer on... If you fold out the extra trailer hitch under the G3 trailer (designed with the intent of towing one of the Optimus recolours of the City Commander trailer) will the BTS trailer fit on it and be able to be towed as a tandem trailer? And if yes, what might that look like?

Ask and ye shall receive.




It works fine, but might look better with the G1 paint scheme rather than this Nemesis paint.

Back on topic...I can't wait to get MM in a pic with all four Semi Trucks!

I think people should be taking robot mode pics with Voyager prime & one of the FP Stunticons.

The pic here portrays MM as about voyager sized - he's too tall to be a deluxe, IMO.

megatronus wrote:The pic here portrays MM as about voyager sized - he's too tall to be a deluxe, IMO.

Definitely Voyager(ish). The cars are between Scout and Deluxe height in robot mode.

Edit: Sorry for the phone pics. Looks like somewhere between OP and City/Shadow Commander in height.





Hard to get an accurate size on him, but he may actually be taller than OP(they come up almost to MM's waist but only to OP's abdomen, whilst they come lower on Shadow Commander's crotch than to MM's).

megatronus wrote:
I think people should be taking robot mode pics with Voyager prime & one of the FP Stunticons.

The pic here portrays MM as about voyager sized - he's too tall to be a deluxe, IMO.

That means I have to transform my cars into bots.

Agamemnon wrote:That means I have to transform my cars into bots.

Oh, the humanity!!

Midnight_Fox wrote:

Yotsuyasan wrote:I took this photo:

Should've been Jazz, Mirage, Sideswipe, and Windcharger.

Well, Jazz and Mirage are there! As for the other two, Windcharger never entered into it, as I wanted to stick with Deluxe cars and he was Scout class. As for Sideswipe, as I said I had intended to include one of the Lamborghinis, probably him. But already having Jazz, Mirage, and Wheeljack, I decided to use Smokescreen instead so it could be a quartet of cars with race decos. Autobot Racing Team!

Agamemnon wrote:Ask and ye shall receive.

Thanks! Cool to know that could work. Almost makes me want the BTS trailer (in Optimus Prime colours) if I ever see it cheap enough.

megatronus wrote:
I think people should be taking robot mode pics with Voyager prime & one of the FP Stunticons.

The pic here portrays MM as about voyager sized - he's too tall to be a deluxe, IMO.

Recently I had Last Chance, Voyager OP, TFC Blackbird and Hegemon lined up in bot mode and got the impression that MM will be between OP and Blackbird height wise.

Yotsuyasan wrote:

Agamemnon wrote:Ask and ye shall receive.

Thanks! Cool to know that could work. Almost makes me want the BTS trailer (in Optimus Prime colours) if I ever see it cheap enough.

Yeah, I picked up Nemesis Prime and the BTS trailer on clearance so got them for really cheap. I don't remember if the Prime colored trailer had chrome wheels or not, but that would make a big difference. I like FP's for the boxy G1 feel, but BTS feels more like a "Classics" revival of the trailer.

In both cases, I can't wait to get them side by side on MM. With color renders, we're close, right FP?

Agamemnon wrote:

Doesn't this show that MM is more undersized than we thought? Isn't he a tandem trailer?

hpfabe wrote:

Agamemnon wrote:

Doesn't this show that MM is more undersized than we thought? Isn't he a tandem trailer?

Maybe he was intended to be originally (though I don't think so.) FP's proportions don't look quite right for any plausible real world setup. I assume that has to do with compromises made for transforming purposes.



If you look here, there are only 5 axels, which would be typical of an 18-wheeler. (By axle from front to back, the literal wheels are: Tractor 2, 4, 4, and the trailer 4 and 4, though some modern trucks are going to extra wide tires instead of the dualie setup in the rear of the tractor.)

If we look at MM in the pic above, you'll notice that he has a front axle, twin axles in the middle, and twin axles at the end. This would not be possible as a tandem trailer. It seems that he is intended to be a semi with box trailer (though the rear semi wheels are set very far back.) I have heard that the rear section of the trailer can be disconnected, turning MM into more of a straight truck. Plus, the trailer is butt up against the cab, which is not possible for a semi-truck as the trailer needs to be able to pivot. So, ultimately, there are compromises all over the place here.

(I was a truck driver in college. Paid part of my way through by working summers.)

[Edit] I found some other pictures that might help explain what I am talking about. Here's a FedEx truck with sleeper that looks a lot like MM would look without that rear most trailer section:



According to TFWiki, Motormaster transforms into a "Kenworth K100 Aerodyne sleeper truck pulling a long, dark-silver trailer." This is most like this semi:



Which led me to find this:

Agamemnon wrote:

hpfabe wrote:

Agamemnon wrote:

Doesn't this show that MM is more undersized than we thought? Isn't he a tandem trailer?

Maybe he was intended to be originally (though I don't think so.) FP's proportions don't look quite right for any plausible real world setup. I assume that has to do with compromises made for transforming purposes.

If you look here, there are only 5 axels, which would be typical of an 18-wheeler. (By axle from front to back, the literal wheels are: Tractor 2, 4, 4, and the trailer 4 and 4, though some modern trucks are going to extra wide tires instead of the dualie setup in the rear of the tractor.)

If we look at MM in the pic above, you'll notice that he has a front axle, twin axles in the middle, and twin axles at the end. This would not be possible as a tandem trailer. It seems that he is intended to be a semi with box trailer (though the rear semi wheels are set very far back.) I have heard that the rear section of the trailer can be disconnected, turning MM into more of a straight truck. Plus, the trailer is butt up against the cab, which is not possible for a semi-truck as the trailer needs to be able to pivot. So, ultimately, there are compromises all over the place here.

(I was a truck driver in college. Paid part of my way through by working summers.)

[Edit] I found some other pictures that might help explain what I am talking about. Here's a FedEx truck with sleeper that looks a lot like MM would look without that rear most trailer section:


According to TFWiki, Motormaster transforms into a "Kenworth K100 Aerodyne sleeper truck pulling a long, dark-silver trailer." This is most like this semi:


Which led me to find this:

Hope you don't mind, I cut out your pics to not overfill my reply.

Thanks for the response. This is really helpful, and I feel silly for not realizing previously.

Looking at the pics and everything, both animation and toys, you're totally right: The wheel count makes it clear that it is not a tandem trailer. I guess I just remembered MM from my childhood as a tandem trailer because of moments in the animation like this, even though, as you pointed out, the wheels make it clear he isn't.



Thanks.

hpfabe wrote:

Agamemnon wrote:

hpfabe wrote:

Agamemnon wrote:

Doesn't this show that MM is more undersized than we thought? Isn't he a tandem trailer?

Maybe he was intended to be originally (though I don't think so.) FP's proportions don't look quite right for any plausible real world setup. I assume that has to do with compromises made for transforming purposes.

If you look here, there are only 5 axels, which would be typical of an 18-wheeler. (By axle from front to back, the literal wheels are: Tractor 2, 4, 4, and the trailer 4 and 4, though some modern trucks are going to extra wide tires instead of the dualie setup in the rear of the tractor.)

If we look at MM in the pic above, you'll notice that he has a front axle, twin axles in the middle, and twin axles at the end. This would not be possible as a tandem trailer. It seems that he is intended to be a semi with box trailer (though the rear semi wheels are set very far back.) I have heard that the rear section of the trailer can be disconnected, turning MM into more of a straight truck. Plus, the trailer is butt up against the cab, which is not possible for a semi-truck as the trailer needs to be able to pivot. So, ultimately, there are compromises all over the place here.

(I was a truck driver in college. Paid part of my way through by working summers.)

[Edit] I found some other pictures that might help explain what I am talking about. Here's a FedEx truck with sleeper that looks a lot like MM would look without that rear most trailer section:


According to TFWiki, Motormaster transforms into a "Kenworth K100 Aerodyne sleeper truck pulling a long, dark-silver trailer." This is most like this semi:


Which led me to find this:

Hope you don't mind, I cut out your pics to not overfill my reply.

Thanks for the response. This is really helpful, and I feel silly for not realizing previously.

Looking at the pics and everything, both animation and toys, you're totally right: The wheel count makes it clear that it is not a tandem trailer. I guess I just remembered MM from my childhood as a tandem trailer because of moments in the animation like this, even though, as you pointed out, the wheels make it clear he isn't.



Thanks.

Yeah, I remember that too. I suppose the argument could be made for MM to be a straight truck with additional trailer.

But, for sure, the animators never made any mistakes or goofy animations decisions. #StillLoveTheG1Episodes

(Plus, it was worth it to come across the real life MM semi tractor paint job again.)

Yotsuyasan wrote:Although he will obviously still be small compared to Voyager Prime with the Fansproject trailer, that photo has me feeling a lot better that he won't be ridiculously small in comparison.

I'll agree with that conclusion. I'm feeling pretty good about the size of all of these figures now.

Bravo, FansProject.

I think he was never intended to be a tandem trailer, but since the animation model included panel lines from the toy (including a split down the middle of the trailer's sides) I think the animators (who, as Agamemnon pointed out never made any mistakes) sometimes got confused on that matter, such as in the screen shot presented of him flipping over.

Well, I had been hoping to wait until Diesel/Motormaster was in before shipping everyone, but Car Crash was coming up on the six-month limit TFSource has on the time they like stuff left on hold. So I got in the first four guys yesterday. I quite like 'em!

So I stuck them on my gestalt shelf, but since they can't form Menasor yet, I broke everyone else up for the time being so they wouldn't feel out of place.



(The Legends figures seem a bit out of place there... They fit in better when the gestalts are formed and tower over them. )

Boy, the Constructicons do look big compared to everyone else. Makes me amused when I think back to all of the Giant vs. Herc debates, where one of the things those in the Herc camp kept saying was, "The figures that make up Giant are too small!"

Yotsuyasan wrote:Boy, the Constructicons do look big compared to everyone else. Makes me amused when I think back to all of the Giant vs. Herc debates, where one of the things those in the Herc camp kept saying was, "The figures that make up Giant are too small!"

Hehe, yep, and I still feel that way (construction vehicles vs sports cars). But of course, I also think that FP's Stunticons are too small too .

Squeee!!?

Getting closer... my anticipation for a Menasor is rising.

Now I can get rid of my Generations Nemesis Prime, who for the longest of times has been my Motormaster.

I am surprised to say that I am disappointed with Motormaster. He seems very bland and not on a par with his limb-bots. He is obviously essential though and works better as a component of Menasor. Plus I think in vehicle mode he looks great.