The Energon Pub

First, my rant. Remember, spoilers:

I didn't like the ending to ROTF.
Y'know how sometimes you just feel like a scene was just tacked on in the last minute?
That's how I feel about this ending.

Here's a quick recap of what happened: Optimus is brought back online by the Matrix, which is then stolen by the Fallen. Jetfire is fatally wounded by Scorponok. He tells Optimus to take his parts, then he dies. Ratchet and Jolt attach Jetfire's pieces to Optimus. Optimus blows up the sun destroyer, and kills the Fallen.
THE END.

Doesn't it seem odd how Optimus just slaughters the Fallen. I mean, the movie title is Revenge of the Fallen! He's the most important guy! You'd expect a big climactic battle between two Primes, but no. It's just the good guy slaughtering the bad guy.
Seriously, how may movies can you name where the good guy has the upper hand? I mean, even in the first movie, Optimus couldn't even beat Megatron alone. So what, he gets a new jetpack and now he can destroy some one more powerful than Megatron?
Logically, this doesn't make sense.
It feels cheap. I feel ripped off.
I sat through 2 hours of mostly unessesary jokes and useless desert scenes and all I get is an ending that I can actually miss if I blick?

If they had gotten rid of some of the unnessesary crud and focused on the more important things, such as the point of this topic, the ending, they could've had a better movie in my opinion.
I don't need to see humping dogs. I don't need to see Simmon's ass.
I want my epic ending!


So that's how I feel.
What do you guys think?
Do you like it? Hate it?
Post your thoughts.

this is absolutely the by-product of a rushed script/screenplay and rushed production. The writers knocked it out of the park for Star Trek (of course Abrams directed), but they can't nail TF2? That sux. I said in another thread --if there is a trilogy, ROTF will be the weakest, unless they absolutely do a piss poor job on the third.

The whole title is all wrong; if the Fallen was the one supposedly getting revenge. The title is only correct if it was Megatron getting this revenge. Megatron did get some revenge when he impaled Optimus Prime and killed him in the forest. But the Fallen never did get any "revenge". He was helpless against Optimus and was destroyed so quickly. We should have at least come away feeling like the Fallen was truly the scariest bad guy of them all. And there should have been more Autobot casualties.

I hear yah. The only thing I like about the ending is Starscream and Megatron cowardly esscaping and Megatron saying "This isn't over". But I was 100% dissapointed in the Fallen's character. I had never read the comics, but my understanding is he's supposed to be the Satan of the TF universe, he corrupted Megatron, caused him to form the decepticons, and the Decepticon logo is based off the distorted image of his face in another universe. For the movie however, the Fallen wasn't even really a character, just a cheap plot device. He had 3 freakin scenes, and one of them he was crying like a little bitch while Prime beat the ever lovin **** out of him! And yeah what was with Megatron's "yes my master" thing?

I honestly think what they should of done was have the Fallen break out of the dimension he was stuck in, have him revive Megatron, and give Megatron and The Fallen a similar relationship to Galvatron and Unicron in TFTM, where The Fallen has some sort of mental Control over Megatron. Megatron is reluctant to listen but has to because he has no choice, but at the same time he's anxiously waiting to take the power back.

Why does every plot point involving Megs and fallen have to revert back to "it should've been how it was in the 86 movie"?


Just because the title of the movie was "Revenge of the Fallen" doesnt mean that the "Fallen" character would actually get that revenge.

My only problem was that the batles were to short, infact, most if not all the battles were pretty short. They had way to much to focus on.

Robinson wrote:Why does every plot point involving Megs and fallen have to revert back to "it should've been how it was in the 86 movie"?


Just because the title of the movie was "Revenge of the Fallen" doesnt mean that the "Fallen" character would actually get that revenge.

I compared it to the 86 movie, I didn't say it should be like the 1986 movie. I had to compare it to something. Anyway my point is the Fallen Character sucked, and was lame, and was only in the movie as a plot device. He's supposed to be the Satan of the Transformers universe yet he is not scary at all, hell even his voice sucks!

I hear people keep saying that there really wasn't any revenge to be had because Fallen was killed by Prime. And since Megatron comes back, people were assuming he'd have some revenge as well, and he gets an early blow in against Prime, which ordinarily would be devastating if not for Prime coming back. But that's the rub, Prime... who also fell early in the movie, comes back and gets revenge of the two responsible for his death. So after seeing the movie, I took the title, which was already a double entendre because of Fallen and Megatron to mean it was actually more of a triple entendre with Prime rising and pretty much stopping both. So that's my theory.

When people say the movie had little plot, I happen to think that whatever plot was forming to the point that Prime was killed ceased and we got a completely new plot and the movie eccentially became 100% about Prime, even if he wasn't on screen.

I thought it was rushed. I thought it was good untill the ending. Just like I Am Legend. It was far to short and I think if they would have got rid of the boring college scenes and replaced them with the last fight, we could have received the ending we deserve. But then again, the writers strike happened and Bay had to take had to take the story into his own hands(unprofessionally). That's why I don't blame Bay for this one. He did something that he shouldn't have done.

your last sentence is hard to understand dude.....

i would have liked a scene either at the end or during the credits where starscream and megatron return to the nemesis and state that it is not over then soundwave walks in, ''orders?'' megatron grins (evil style)....

AWESOME

I am glad I'm the only one who was less than impressed by the Fallen as villain. In fact, the Decepticons were so weak (physically, and, y'know, like lame) that half the time it seemed that the Autobots could very easily be seen as bullies. I mean, could someone explain exactly what Sideways and Demolishor did in Shanghai that merited death? EXIST?! Jeez, for all the crap Prime spouts about coexisting peaceably, he doesn't seem to practice it much.

For a second in a trilogy, it should have been darker. Not necessarily *bigger*, but it should have had some lingering threat. We should be seeing the GOOD GUYS recuperate and gather themselves for the third movie at the end. Think of the gold standard in movie trilogies--Star Wars. The Empire Strikes Back had Luke, Han and the others winning, but we had a real sense of biiiiiig menace out there. I completely did not get that feeling here.

And this leaves whoever writes #3 kinda screwed. How do you get BIGGER than the Fallen (okay, other than Unicron)? The thing that kept people PILING into theaters to see the Star Wars trilogy was the looming threat of the Empire. The package was waaaay too tidily tied off here for me to feel the Decepticons are any real threat to anyone other than themselves. (While they seem on the verge of a critical energon shortage, the Autobots sure look fat and happy).

HK, fat, not happy.

hellkitty wrote:I am glad I'm the only one who was less than impressed by the Fallen as villain. In fact, the Decepticons were so weak (physically, and, y'know, like lame) that half the time it seemed that the Autobots could very easily be seen as bullies. I mean, could someone explain exactly what Sideways and Demolishor did in Shanghai that merited death? EXIST?! Jeez, for all the crap Prime spouts about coexisting peaceably, he doesn't seem to practice it much.

For a second in a trilogy, it should have been darker. Not necessarily *bigger*, but it should have had some lingering threat. We should be seeing the GOOD GUYS recuperate and gather themselves for the third movie at the end. Think of the gold standard in movie trilogies--Star Wars. The Empire Strikes Back had Luke, Han and the others winning, but we had a real sense of biiiiiig menace out there. I completely did not get that feeling here.

And this leaves whoever writes #3 kinda screwed. How do you get BIGGER than the Fallen (okay, other than Unicron)? The thing that kept people PILING into theaters to see the Star Wars trilogy was the looming threat of the Empire. The package was waaaay too tidily tied off here for me to feel the Decepticons are any real threat to anyone other than themselves. (While they seem on the verge of a critical energon shortage, the Autobots sure look fat and happy).

HK, fat, not happy.

demolisher killed people in the helecopter and multiple cars. Sideways would have killed people givin the chance if they got in his way.

Pontimax 01 wrote:I hear people keep saying that there really wasn't any revenge to be had because Fallen was killed by Prime. And since Megatron comes back, people were assuming he'd have some revenge as well, and he gets an early blow in against Prime, which ordinarily would be devastating if not for Prime coming back. But that's the rub, Prime... who also fell early in the movie, comes back and gets revenge of the two responsible for his death. So after seeing the movie, I took the title, which was already a double entendre because of Fallen and Megatron to mean it was actually more of a triple entendre with Prime rising and pretty much stopping both. So that's my theory.

When people say the movie had little plot, I happen to think that whatever plot was forming to the point that Prime was killed ceased and we got a completely new plot and the movie eccentially became 100% about Prime, even if he wasn't on screen.

That's what I see. Yeah, I would have changed things here and there. I'd prefer that Optimus Prime be killed in the end battle and leave a cliff hanger. This would assure the third movie massive box office because people are going to want to see what happens.

But with this plot, I found it no different than a real life war plot, well known as the Battle of Mogadishu, or Black Hawk Down. The first plot, was that the soldiers were supposed to go into enemy territory, capture several militia leaders and bring them back to the base. They managed the first part. But then, the plot drastically takes a change when one of the helicopters gets shot down, and the men now have to get to the down aircraft, against all odds, to secure it. I don't understand how real life shows you that there is no clear cut plots in life, but if a movie like ROTF uses multiple directions, it's a plotless movie?

I guess, next time, we need to follow the plot line of The Dark Knight. Optimus Prime hunts down and fights Megatron, because Megatron wants to see the world burn, and in the mean time,Megatron takes Optimus Prime's second in command, Ironhide, and turns him into an evil Decepticon. Hell, Ironhide already showed he didn't like humans much in the first one, so it wouldn't be much of a stretch.

Iamwarhorse wrote:Hell, Ironhide already showed he didn't like humans much in the first one, so it wouldn't be much of a stretch.

According to Defiance, he was almost a Decepticon anyway.

I was actually hoping that Megatron would somehow backstab the Fallen, perhaps if Optimus just mortally wounded him instead of killing him, then Megatron takes the Matrix and kills The Fallen. Something like that. Just not in the way Vader, betrays Palpatine in Return of the Jedi. More like Megatron was only calling him "Master" and following his orders because The Fallen was stronger than him. Megatron seems more like the kinda character who would do something like that. Only follow the Fallen's orders for so long, before he took advantage of a situation and secured power for himself. Like he said "even in death there is no leadership but my own."

The ending seemed akin to a typical 90s cartoon episode. I'll use Beast Wars as an example. Whenever a Maximal got an upgrade he was Incredibly powerful and could take on the entire Predacon team easily, but the next episode he gets shot down or wounded easily. Optimus gets Jetfire's parts and Spark and kicks ass, when he struggled to defeat Megs alone last time. So in the third movie should I assume that him using Jetfire's parts won't be enough for him to stop some new big bad Decipticon?

Just seemed rushed and bothered me. I did like the movie though. Alot actually.

Tyrannotaur wrote:More like Megatron was only calling him "Master" and following his orders because The Fallen was stronger than him. Megatron seems more like the kinda character who would do something like that. Only follow the Fallen's orders for so long, before he took advantage of a situation and secured power for himself.

That would make him Starscream.

I actually liked the ending. I hated the fallen and thought he was useless to the story, so I was glad to see his face get ripped off his robo skull. I loved the part where megatron gets half his face blown off and yells for starscream through robo tears. Starscream then shows up and then they fly away.

Well the positive points of the ending were the in-character Megatron and Starscream retreating, I kind of loved that. And the Fallen dying. Yup that's a plus point because that way I can forget all about that character as IMO it was completely pointless to introduce him.
I hate it how they turned Megatron into a knock-off neutered Darth Vader; the Decepticons should be his thing.

I honestly think what they should of done was have the Fallen break out of the dimension he was stuck in, have him revive Megatron, and give Megatron and The Fallen a similar relationship to Galvatron and Unicron in TFTM, where The Fallen has some sort of mental Control over Megatron. Megatron is reluctant to listen but has to because he has no choice, but at the same time he's anxiously waiting to take the power back.

Now that would have made me so much happier.

I really fear for the third movie because if it will only be a little like this one we got Decepticons being killed off by the dozens until only three or something are left who will get killed by Optimus and Sam armed with chopsticks...

Agent 007 wrote:demolisher killed people in the helecopter and multiple cars. Sideways would have killed people givin the chance if they got in his way.

But, with all due respect, that's only HALF the story, and really only the second half. Sideways and Demolisher may have killed people who were, as you indicated a)IN THEIR WAY as they were trying to escape being attacked by Autobots, or b) ATTACKING THEM. The second is what we like to call 'self-defense', and the first, well, it's not very nice, I agree, but if the Autobots hadn't attacked them first, they wouldn't have run and then had people get in their way. In legal terms, they could easily argue (and win) that the Autobots INSTIGATED the incident entirely.

There they were just sittin' around, and out of nowhere comes a group of bots and humans trying to kill them. What would you do in a similar situation? Quite possibly, like Sideways, run like hell.

Remember even according to Optimus, though there had been six "Decepticon incursions" in the last (however long), they weren't described as attacking anyone. We're told that it's almost like 'they're looking for something'. Now, last time I checked, looking for something was not a capital crime. If so, shoot me, because I spent 20 minutes yesterday trying to find my valet key.

HK, I want to live in your simple little black and white world....

hellkitty wrote:For a second in a trilogy, it should have been darker. Not necessarily *bigger*, but it should have had some lingering threat. We should be seeing the GOOD GUYS recuperate and gather themselves for the third movie at the end. Think of the gold standard in movie trilogies--Star Wars. The Empire Strikes Back had Luke, Han and the others winning, but we had a real sense of biiiiiig menace out there. I completely did not get that feeling here.

I'm glad you brought this up HK,'cause I was already thinking it by the time I got to your post.
"Empire" left us with one hero injured, one lost to a bounty hunter and a rebel base destroyed and the fleet scrambling in space to try to reunite. There was a definite sense of foreboding at the end of the movie which left the fans anxiously awaiting the 3rd installment to see how Luke and Leia were going to pull everyones butts out of the fire.
Like I've said before, they tried to cram too much crap into a self contained feature for RotF. As short as the book was they cut stuff out from the film that the book had that would have helped make the story better and I felt that the book could have been expanded on. The Autobots should have been deaslt a near crippling blow with maybe the chance of destroying the Sun Harvester but not the Fallen himself and let him and the Autobots run in opposite directions to lick their wounds and let Prime be resurrected and the final fight occur in TF3. Maybe if Jetfire had been spared in RotF his advice and wisdom would have been useful in leading the Autobots, in conjunction with Ironhide and Lennox, until Prime could be brought back. The Government would have been shown that Prime was right and their presence was needed and was not the cause of the Decepticons coming to Earth and the United Military forces along with the Autobots could have made for an Epic "Return of the Jedi" style final battle against the Fallen and his army.

Yeah, I can really see where THAT would have been too much to ask from the creative team behind this franchise. Not like George Lucas was on to anything solid with HIS franchise...

007 - i don't believe Sideswipe would hurt humans. (E.g. if it meant letting the bad guy escape) This had been established in the first film.

I, personally, would have loved to see The Fallen put up more of a fight, but I can kind of see how Prime could be really strong after being revived and upgraded with Jetfire's parts. Megatron managed to shoot out of the Ocean and fly to Cybertron right after being resurrected, why not Prime? I thought the Sun Harvester was a cool idea, but was a bit downplayed, but it kind of reminded me of the drill in Star Trek, so I was glad it wasn't played too much. The movie was really big and epic and unfortunately stuff had to be trimmed, but maybe they will do an extended cut for DVD/Blu-ray. Also, moviegoing audiences nowadays aren't satisfied with big cliffhanger endings. General audiences go to see a self-contained movie. I went with someone yesterday who hadn't even seen the first one. She still enjoyed it. The first one did a very well done self-contained story, but left enough elements to make you interested in a sequel. After this one, you have Megatron and Starscream retreating, and Soundwave still undetected in space. I thought Soundwave was a little downplayed, but he is a communications officer and master of espionage, so why put one of your most important assets in unnecessary danger? In the third, he could be out for revenge for Ravage. Hmm? To mention Star Trek again, it was a self-contained movie that, if successful, was going to spawn a couple of sequels. It was very satisfying and successful, but number 2 might rub some people the wrong way just like this one did. Sequels are usually inferior anyway. People aren't sure when they do the first and when it becomes a a hit, the second one usually falters because the mysticism of seeing something new is now gone. I wasn't sure how Transformers would translate to the screen, but the first blew my mind. Two years later, I didn't expect that same feeling of being wowed because it was going to be more robots killing eachother. Just like with Friday The 13th, there are so many sequels that serve as nothing more than body count builders. It's a matter of trying to give the audience something they haven't seen or expected. I think this one did that well. I still don't know which one I liked better.

P.S. Instead of big robotic action and explosions, this series boils down to just being a love story between Sam and Mikaela. That's what I really care most about. Everything else is just icing on the cake. I hope the third expands more on their relationship. They both said they love eachother, so we'll see.

T-Macksimus wrote:
The Autobots should have been deaslt a near crippling blow with maybe the chance of destroying the Sun Harvester but not the Fallen himself and let him and the Autobots run in opposite directions to lick their wounds and let Prime be resurrected and the final fight occur in TF3. Maybe if Jetfire had been spared in RotF his advice and wisdom would have been useful in leading the Autobots, in conjunction with Ironhide and Lennox, until Prime could be brought back. The Government would have been shown that Prime was right and their presence was needed and was not the cause of the Decepticons coming to Earth and the United Military forces along with the Autobots could have made for an Epic "Return of the Jedi" style final battle against the Fallen and his army.

That would have worked really well ... now instead, they will have to introduce another enemy, try to build him up as an even bigger threat than The Fallen and defeat him all in one movie ... so basically RTOF all over again just with more of everything.

What i didn't like about the ending is that they didn't really give you a clue to as who survived and who died in the way of Autobots. I mean you could obviously deduct who died on your own.... but it's nice to see the autobots gather together and congratulate and morn those who were lost.