The Energon Pub

There are some things that people just don't like about the Transformers live action movies, so I observed some of the complaints. I realized how a lot of people say that there was no soul or emotion in the movies. That the plot wasn't as driven, and I beg to differ. Let's think about this here, and I don't know if children as getting this message but I did.

The movies showed the importance of humans. It showed us about bullying which has become quite an epidemic in schools and neighborhoods the world over. It shows how important the weak and small are and that we should look out for each other no matter where we are from. It also shows one person matters among the many.

Though one point of view with the Decepticons shows survival at any costs of their homeworld, Optimus and the autobots showed that you just can't achieve what you want at risk of other lives. He would not sacrifice the lives of others that were deemed younger, smaller, weaker for nothing not even his home. It showed how goodness and right always wins the day even when it gets rough if you stay the course the good outweighs the bad.

Love was an essential part of these films from the Autobots for humanity, how humans band together for the sake of all against Decepticons, it showed how you can be evil and bad and still change your ways and be accepted. It also showed that good people are not beyond evil concepts. There are both sides to us all, we just need that one moment to tip the scale (Sentinel Prime).

All in all there is a sense of empowerment there if you chose to see it. It is after all a child's plaything, and adult's collectors item, a homage to a generation fresh from the cold war, civil rights, and everything that goes along with it. Yeah there are bad things about the films as well sterotypes, lewd humor that is not suitable for children because in the end it is a child's plaything more than a collectors item. Tell me your thoughts on this post!

I really like what you have to say. I think I agree for the most part.

However, I wish you would make better use of paragraphs to break up your thoughts and ideas for the sake of those reading.

Thanks for the reply. I just didn't want to lose my thoughts!!!

Wasn't the moral: "If you have lost a war, you mustn't worry about your races' survival at all!"
- first movie: the autobots destroy the only thing that can bring life back to their homeworld
- second movie: the autobots destroy the only thing that can bring energy back to their homeworld
- third movie: the autobots destroy their homeworld

As a fellow fan from another board wrote: "Optimus Prime is a nihilist"

I'm seriously worried about Earths' fate once the remaining Decepticon forces take it over.

Well that is another way of looking at it as well!!!!

It's not just the current Autobots either...

The whole sun harvester thing had me scratching my head, as far as the Transformers' motivations were concerned. Okay so the Earth wasn't a viable option... Move on to the next solar system...? No! The Fallen and the Primes are so idiotic they start infighting, destroy themselves, and leave their planet to expire just to stop one undeveloped planet from being explod0rsized.

I try but I really do struggle to see any merit to the writing in that movie.

The more I think about it, the less it seems a problem of morality but the Transformers themselves being totally insane.

It really all is 'spur of the moment' and 'what looks cool and righteous' storytelling. But the problem with the films is that there was no real character development. No 'soul'. When OP died in the second film, i could have really given a rat's ass because of all i knew about Prime is from the first film, well....pssh...

In the 80s flick, man....i still cry like a bitch everytime OP dies.

And this is just one example amongst a million.

But the bayformer fans don't get that because 99.9% of'm didn't grow up in the 80s, so as long you take an idea, add sex appeal, pot humor, fart humor, and tons of action they'll love the **** out of it and then flame you til they're retarded with no facts or experience to back it up....at least this, has been my experience posting on these forums in the last 5 days or so.

My point is, its nice to speculate about what kind of morals the movies were trying to provide, but ultimately, without the proper writing and directing to tell the story it was all "lost in translation".

Just show me titties and robots blowin **** up and we're good. rofl

The first movie's moral was that you can't expect a victory without sacrifice. Even though the movie never really went out of it's way to show you that.

ROTF had kind of a moral that nothing can stop you from fulfilling your destiny (even death). Even if you do die, it was still your destiny to do so and nothing can stop it.

And DOTM had one of "How far is too far?" It showed both humans and Cybertronians taking drastic measures to save their worlds from extinction. It was really a reflection of the two civilizations.

I really think these movies are deep to an extent.

SlyTF1 wrote:The first movie's moral was that you can't expect a victory without sacrifice. Even though the movie never really went out of it's way to show you that.

ROTF had kind of a moral that nothing can stop you from fulfilling your destiny (even death). Even if you do die, it was still your destiny to do so and nothing can stop it.

And DOTM had one of "How far is too far?" It showed both humans and Cybertronians taking drastic measures to save their worlds from extinction. It was really a reflection of the two civilizations.

I really think these movies are deep to an extent.

Very well looked into, Sly.

SlyTF1 wrote:The first movie's moral was that you can't expect a victory without sacrifice. Even though the movie never really went out of it's way to show you that.

ROTF had kind of a moral that nothing can stop you from fulfilling your destiny (even death). Even if you do die, it was still your destiny to do so and nothing can stop it.

And DOTM had one of "How far is too far?" It showed both humans and Cybertronians taking drastic measures to save their worlds from extinction. It was really a reflection of the two civilizations.

I really think these movies are deep to an extent.

Good stuff.

Chaoslock wrote:Wasn't the moral: "If you have lost a war, you mustn't worry about your races' survival at all!"
- first movie: the autobots destroy the only thing that can bring life back to their homeworld
- second movie: the autobots destroy the only thing that can bring energy back to their homeworld
- third movie: the autobots destroy their homeworld

As a fellow fan from another board wrote: "Optimus Prime is a nihilist"

I'm seriously worried about Earths' fate once the remaining Decepticon forces take it over.

1. Sam destroyed the Allspark, and it was either that or Megatron would use it to create an army to conquer the galaxy.

2. The Fallen was mere moments from activating the sun harvester, which would've destroyed the sun and our solar system. The solar system the Autobots were in. Either destroy it or die.

3. Can't comment since I haven't seen it yet.

Chaoslock wrote:Wasn't the moral: "If you have lost a war, you mustn't worry about your races' survival at all!"
- first movie: the autobots destroy the only thing that can bring life back to their homeworld
- second movie: the autobots destroy the only thing that can bring energy back to their homeworld
- third movie: the autobots destroy their homeworld

As a fellow fan from another board wrote: "Optimus Prime is a nihilist"

I'm seriously worried about Earths' fate once the remaining Decepticon forces take it over.

The problem with this outlook is pretty simple. The Transformers as a race have made mistakes that have reduced their homeworld to a lifeless husk and doomed them as a species. Optimus rightfully believes that another species should not pay for their mistakes, even if it would mean a slim chance at restoring their homeworld. It is not their place to let us pay for their sins.

Could they have moved the Sun Harvester? Sure if it wasn't for the omnicidal maniac who was about to set the thing off on Earth. Could they have used the AllSpark in a benevolent way? Sure if Megatron wasn't moments from taking it and using it as a weapon of mass destruction. Could they have used the Space Bridge network to use another world's resources to restore Cybertron? Sure if Sentinel Prime and Megatron wasn't hellbent on enslaving mankind, a "lesser race," to do the hard labor for them.

It helps when you view the events in context to understand that the Decepticons care nothing for the fact that mankind would pay for their mistakes.

SlyTF1 wrote:The first movie's moral was that you can't expect a victory without sacrifice. Even though the movie never really went out of it's way to show you that.

ROTF had kind of a moral that nothing can stop you from fulfilling your destiny (even death). Even if you do die, it was still your destiny to do so and nothing can stop it.

And DOTM had one of "How far is too far?" It showed both humans and Cybertronians taking drastic measures to save their worlds from extinction. It was really a reflection of the two civilizations.

I really think these movies are deep to an extent.

CLAPPITY CLAP CLAP.

SlyTF1 wrote:The first movie's moral was that you can't expect a victory without sacrifice. Even though the movie never really went out of it's way to show you that.

ROTF had kind of a moral that nothing can stop you from fulfilling your destiny (even death). Even if you do die, it was still your destiny to do so and nothing can stop it.

And DOTM had one of "How far is too far?" It showed both humans and Cybertronians taking drastic measures to save their worlds from extinction. It was really a reflection of the two civilizations.

I really think these movies are deep to an extent.

SlyTF1 wrote:And DOTM had one of "How far is too far?" It showed both humans and Cybertronians taking drastic measures to save their worlds from extinction. It was really a reflection of the two civilizations.

That makes sense, but it's a little troubling.

The Decepticons want to wipe out a race and destroy a planet to save their own race and their own planet. Thus they are the bad guys.

The humans/Autobots want to wipe out a race and destroy a planet to save their own race and their own planet. Thus they are the heroes.

If anything, I'd have thought the moral of DOTM is that you can't try and kid yourself into always thinking you're a 'good guy'. You just have to stick to your principles, regardless of anything else.

Cheesinator wrote:

SlyTF1 wrote:And DOTM had one of "How far is too far?" It showed both humans and Cybertronians taking drastic measures to save their worlds from extinction. It was really a reflection of the two civilizations.

That makes sense, but it's a little troubling.

The Decepticons want to wipe out a race and destroy a planet to save their own race and their own planet. Thus they are the bad guys.

The humans/Autobots want to wipe out a race and destroy a planet to save their own race and their own planet. Thus they are the heroes.

If anything, I'd have thought the moral of DOTM is that you can't try and kid yourself into always thinking you're a 'good guy'. You just have to stick to your principles, regardless of anything else.

If you're talking about Cybertron, just because it's there doesn't make it any less destroyed. Destruction of a planet doesn't necessarily mean to shatter it completely. To steralize the surface until it can't support life also qualifies, much like a massive meteorite could do to Earth in reality. Cybertron was the latter, steralized and uninhabitable even by Transformers. Defending a living world from people who want to fix a dead one, thus killing and enslaving everyone on the living world is not a malignant goal.

I get the feeling that the twisting of events by Decepticon apologists is gonna be a common thing from here on out.

That's sort of besides the point, but okay.

Decepticons are the aggressors, sure. From the human perspective, they definitely deserved to be wiped out. Point is, both sides are fighting for near-identical reasons (Decepticons, for the restoration of their planet, while for humans it's the preservation of theirs). They are both trying to utterly wipe each other out. From a totally objective standpoint, it's harder to judge which race deserves to live and which deserves a death sentence.

In TFM, Megatron wanted the Allspark to make an army. In ROTF, The Fallen was just just acting on a grudge. It's much less clear-cut in DOTM, where it's two races desperate for survival.

morals hell thats simple
mv 1...."why the hell is this cube only making decepticons???"
mv 2....if you have a key to a planet shattering device dont protect it destroy it
mv 3....dont screw with either prime or his peeps or he will freakin wreck you take your head off with either a sword,shotgun,or battle axe. youve been warned.

the morals i learnt were

- american military and might can do what it wants, where it wants, and is always right

- women, especially attractive women are there to be ogled and leered at, as long as they are being paid

- if you are the "good guys" you can do whatever you want and its ok, however if your enemies do similar its evil - american foreign policy essentially

- Advanced robot civilisation can look at humans as a primitive and violent race, where there conflict resolutions revolve around, rip its face off

- autobots will kill humans, if the americans say they are terrorists. assuming that the humans at the start in the middle east died, which it looked like they did

Capt.Failure wrote:

Cheesinator wrote:

SlyTF1 wrote:And DOTM had one of "How far is too far?" It showed both humans and Cybertronians taking drastic measures to save their worlds from extinction. It was really a reflection of the two civilizations.

That makes sense, but it's a little troubling.

The Decepticons want to wipe out a race and destroy a planet to save their own race and their own planet. Thus they are the bad guys.

The humans/Autobots want to wipe out a race and destroy a planet to save their own race and their own planet. Thus they are the heroes.

If anything, I'd have thought the moral of DOTM is that you can't try and kid yourself into always thinking you're a 'good guy'. You just have to stick to your principles, regardless of anything else.

If you're talking about Cybertron, just because it's there doesn't make it any less destroyed. Destruction of a planet doesn't necessarily mean to shatter it completely. To steralize the surface until it can't support life also qualifies, much like a massive meteorite could do to Earth in reality. Cybertron was the latter, steralized and uninhabitable even by Transformers. Defending a living world from people who want to fix a dead one, thus killing and enslaving everyone on the living world is not a malignant goal.

I get the feeling that the twisting of events by Decepticon apologists is gonna be a common thing from here on out.

no apologist here.

But i will say one thing. In Human history who do you think best represents us, cons or bots.

For my two cents, its the decepticons. has the Human race looked upon "lessers" as insignificants to be crushed or thrown aside for advancement. Ask the native american, the maori or the australian aborigine for that answer.

Do we look at our planet as a means to exploit for profit and gain. look at rain forests. We treat everything that is not human (and some humans) as merely tools for our own betterment.

Now look at how the decepticons look at us. We are no more to them than ants standing in the way of their survival and the rebirth of their homeworld.

If tables were turned, would I expect humans to act differently, sadly human history strongly suggests otherwise.

the autobots are an impossible ideal for humanity, the decepticons are the grim reality !

shamone wrote:

Capt.Failure wrote:

Cheesinator wrote:

SlyTF1 wrote:And DOTM had one of "How far is too far?" It showed both humans and Cybertronians taking drastic measures to save their worlds from extinction. It was really a reflection of the two civilizations.

That makes sense, but it's a little troubling.

The Decepticons want to wipe out a race and destroy a planet to save their own race and their own planet. Thus they are the bad guys.

The humans/Autobots want to wipe out a race and destroy a planet to save their own race and their own planet. Thus they are the heroes.

If anything, I'd have thought the moral of DOTM is that you can't try and kid yourself into always thinking you're a 'good guy'. You just have to stick to your principles, regardless of anything else.

If you're talking about Cybertron, just because it's there doesn't make it any less destroyed. Destruction of a planet doesn't necessarily mean to shatter it completely. To steralize the surface until it can't support life also qualifies, much like a massive meteorite could do to Earth in reality. Cybertron was the latter, steralized and uninhabitable even by Transformers. Defending a living world from people who want to fix a dead one, thus killing and enslaving everyone on the living world is not a malignant goal.

I get the feeling that the twisting of events by Decepticon apologists is gonna be a common thing from here on out.

no apologist here.

But i will say one thing. In Human history who do you think best represents us, cons or bots.

For my two cents, its the decepticons. As the Human race looked upon "lessers" as insignificants to be crushed or thrown aside for advancement. Ask the native american, the maori or the australian aborigine for that answer.

Do we look at our planet as a means to exploit for porfit and gain. look at rain forests. We treat everything that is not human (and some humans) as merely tools for our own betterment.

Now look at how the decepticons look at us. We are no more to them than ants standing in the way of their survival and the rebirth of their homeworld.

If tables were turne, would I expect humans to act differently, sadly human history strongly suggests otherwise.

the autobots are an impossible ideal for humanity, the decepticons are the grim reality !

Exactly.

SlyTF1 wrote:The first movie's moral was that you can't expect a victory without sacrifice. Even though the movie never really went out of it's way to show you that.

ROTF had kind of a moral that nothing can stop you from fulfilling your destiny (even death). Even if you do die, it was still your destiny to do so and nothing can stop it.

And DOTM had one of "How far is too far?" It showed both humans and Cybertronians taking drastic measures to save their worlds from extinction. It was really a reflection of the two civilizations.

I really think these movies are deep to an extent.

very nice! I like I like!

blades180 wrote:Love was an essential part of these films from the Autobots for humanity, how humans band together for the sake of all against Decepticons, it showed how you can be evil and bad and still change your ways and be accepted.

I'm not clear where you're getting this.

Transformers 1 : Megatron, Blackout, Brawl, Bonecrusher, and Frenzy are judged to be evil and are killed.

RotF: Devastator, the Fallen, Scorponok, Ravage, Demolishor, and Sideways are evil and they are killed.

DotM: The U.S. government tells the Autobots that there are evil people in the Middle East that must be killed; the Autobots comply. Sentinel, Megatron, Soundwave, Laserbeak, Shockwave, Crankcase, Crowbar, Hatchet, and Dylan Gould are judged to be evil and they are killed.

Please give me an example from the movies where an evil character changes his ways and is forgiven.

Cthulhunicron wrote:

blades180 wrote: Please give me an example from the movies where an evil character changes his ways and is forgiven.

Wheelie from ROTF but I don't really think that counts lol

SlyTF1 wrote:The first movie's moral was that you can't expect a victory without sacrifice. Even though the movie never really went out of it's way to show you that.

ROTF had kind of a moral that nothing can stop you from fulfilling your destiny (even death). Even if you do die, it was still your destiny to do so and nothing can stop it.

And DOTM had one of "How far is too far?" It showed both humans and Cybertronians taking drastic measures to save their worlds from extinction. It was really a reflection of the two civilizations.

I really think these movies are deep to an extent.

Wow... Sly, this post darn near makes up for all your conspiracy theory talk. All i can say is..



Impressive sir!!